The Half-Gospel.

[marks]

Numbers 32
10 And the Lord's anger was kindled the same time, and he sware, saying,
11 Surely none of the men that came up out of Egypt, from twenty years old and upward, shall see the land which I sware unto Abraham, unto Isaac, and unto Jacob; because they have not wholly followed me:
12 Save Caleb the son of Jephunneh the Kenezite, and Joshua the son of Nun: for they have wholly followed the Lord.
13 And the Lord's anger was kindled against Israel, and he made them wander in the wilderness forty years, until all the generation, that had done evil in the sight of the Lord, was consumed.

 

[marks]

Ugh... I'm too tired for this today, Lol.

A quality decision in light of Luke 14:31 would be Luke 14:33. A quality decision in light of Mark 4:14 would be Mark 4:20.

My apologies. Just not myself today.

Wish you the best.

Respond or not as you please, no need to weary yourself!

I seem to be asking the same question today from several who seem very reluctant to answer . . . are we talking regenerate, or unregenerate?

Do any really become regenerate, born from God, without the repentance that is the change of mind from serving ourselves to serving God?

Much love!

 

[amadeus]

I'm sorry, why would you say that?

Just the same, if we define one thing by something else when it already has it's own meaning, then are we really getting closer to the truth?

Much love!

You wrote off the idea of salvation and walking with God that I saw in those two examples. Was not much, if not all, of what Jesus said and did in parables? And where is the interpretation to be found? In our logical minds alone!

According to you my interpretation would be in error, but what if yours is? What might you miss from God?

"All these things spake Jesus unto the multitude in parables; and without a parable spake he not unto them:" Matt 13:34

"But if there be no interpreter, let him keep silence in the church; and let him speak to himself, and to God." I Cor 14:28

Where is the "church" and who is the Interpreter?

"But the Comforter, which is the Holy Ghost, whom the Father will send in my name, he shall teach you all things, and bring all things to your remembrance, whatsoever I have said unto you." John 14:26

 

[amadeus]

Neither do I condemn thee, go and sin no more.

Jesus released her from condemnation, and then instucted her to not sin anymore.

That works for me. We are released from condemnation, and we are told to not sin anymore.

The man paralysed . . . don't sin anymore lest something worse happen to you . . .

Despise not the chastening of the Lord . . . though grievous . . .

Much love!

Not saying your understanding is wrong, but be careful how absolute you are!

You can use different words and decide upon a interpretation as people do. How many denominations are there today based upon the same written scriptures? What do you suppose is the difference between them when they believe from the same Bible things that are diametrically opposed to each other? Could it be due to mixed message or a double-mindedness? How do we get past that?

 

[amadeus]

You sound like you think I'm reluctant to learn or grow.

Sigh!

I can tell you what I believe as you tell what you believe. I know what I did when my growth was stifled to the point where I back slid many years ago. I cannot speak for you.

I won't give you my point of view if you insist on not hearing it. Listening and considering does not make you wrong. I don't have all of the right answers, but on some things I can also be hard headed. This is why every day I ask God to help me with such things and ask Him to open my heart to receive any increase He has for me.

 

[Episkopos]

Neither do I condemn thee, go and sin no more.

Jesus released her from condemnation, and then instucted her to not sin anymore.

That works for me. We are released from condemnation, and we are told to not sin anymore.

The man paralysed . . . don't sin anymore lest something worse happen to you . . .

Despise not the chastening of the Lord . . . though grievous . . .

Much love!

Once forgiven always forgiven? That is totally unreasonable. We are warned...the wages of sin is death. Just because it's not death the very first time doesn't give any reasonable person cause to see the kingdom of God like it's Club Med.

You reap as you sow. Christians are not exempt from the truth....in fact we are more responsible for our sins.

So you are getting things exactly backwards.

 

[marks]

Not saying your understanding is wrong, but be careful how absolute you are!

You can use different words and decide upon a interpretation as people do. How denominations are there today based upon the same written scriptures? What do you suppose is the difference between them when they believe from the same Bible things that are diametrically opposed to each other? Could it be due to mixed message or a double-mindedness? How do we get past that?

I'm just offering some thoughts, as were you, I thought.

But if we can look in the Scripture to see an application, then we don't need to just trade our ideas back and forth.

Parables, yes, interpret in the light of the parable of the Sower. If you don't understand that one, how will you understand any of the parables?

The good thing is, Jesus interpreted that one for us. 4 responses to the Word, but only one is true and honest.

I'm not being absolute in applying the account of the woman caught in adultery.

But I am presenting that we can easily take these passages and assign a 'deeper meaning' according to what we think otherwise, but is that really what God is saying there?

Much love!

 

[marks]

I won't give you my point of view if you insist on not hearing it.

You keep giving me my point of view, but not accurately. That I insist on not hearing. That I don't think there are types and shadows.

These sorts of things.

You wrote off the idea of salvation and walking with God that I saw in those two examples.

If I wrote anything that lent this idea, I apologize!

Naturally we are 'saved' because God wants a family, and that's all about the relationship.

Much love!

 

[marks]

doesn't give any reasonable person cause to see the kingdom of God like it's Club Med.

Yeah, I don't think anyone who is spiritual will see God's kingdom like it's Club Med. Not that I've ever been there. Club Med, that is. I'm not interested, actually. But still, no one who has really met God, so far as it seems to me, thinks of God as the Great Candyman.

Much love!

 

[marks]

You reap as you sow. Christians are not exempt from the truth....in fact we are more responsible for our sins.

Yes, all will reap as they sow. We will all be judged for what we do in these bodies.

The gift and our cause of great rejoicing is in the truth of our redemption, that God reconciled us to Himself, so that we can now be His beloved family.

In this is the power to actually live for Him. Not words, not pretense, but actual life lived in love.

Much love!

 

[amadeus]

@marks

amadeus said:
I won't give you my point of view if you insist on not hearing it.

You keep giving me my point of view, but not accurately. That I insist on not hearing. That I don't think there are types and shadows.

Sorry, but communication as I have said before is always a problem. I understand what I mean, but sometimes I really miss what the other guy is saying even when I am trying to pay attention. My bad!

Amadeus said:
You wrote off the idea of salvation and walking with God that I saw in those two examples.

Marks said:
If I wrote anything that lent this idea, I apologize!

Apology not necessary! I don't expect you to believe what I do, but like most everyone else, I believe that I am right or I would hope that I would change.

Marks said:

Naturally we are 'saved' because God wants a family, and that's all about the relationship.

Not just any family! How can any of us qualify traveling any Way but His?

 

[mjrhealth]

Once forgiven always forgiven? That is totally unreasonable.

Are you saying that Jesus has to keep getting back on the cross every time those poor imperfect Christians goof up, and that the work is not really as He put it,

Joh_19:30 When Jesus therefore had received the vinegar, he said, It is finished: and he bowed his head, and gave up the ghost.

 

[marks]

Not just any family! How can any of us qualify traveling any Way but His?

Born from God. Then we're His family.

Much love!

 

[charity]

The gospel of today is but a half-gospel...taken from the bible...but not in complete form.

There is a saved from...and a saved to. Saved from the world (Egypt)...to be saved to the kingdom walk (the Promised land).

But people are taught that there is but one step into salvation...the saved FROM part. And this is to ignore the purpose of the gospel...salvation INTO the kingdom life of the Spirit.

Heb. 4:1 Let us therefore fear, lest, a promise being left us of entering into his rest, any of you should seem to come short of it. 2 For unto us was the gospel preached, as well as unto them: but the word preached did not profit them, not being mixed with faith in them that heard it.

Should we be smug about our initial salvation...or fear? What does the bible say? What do the modern churches teach?

Have we entered into a guarantee or a race? What do people WANT to believe? What is the truth?

'Be it known unto you all,
.. and to all the people of Israel,
.... that by the name of Jesus Christ of Nazareth,
...... whom ye crucified,
........ whom God raised from the dead,
.......... even by Him doth this man stand here before you whole.
............ This is the stone which was set at nought of you builders,
.............. which is become the head of the corner.
Neither is there salvation in any other:
for there is none other name under heaven
given among men,
whereby we must be saved.'
(Act 4:10-12)

Hello there Episkopos,

The reference above is quoted for no other reason than that I love it. The same could be said about what follows, except that it also tells me what I have been saved from, how, and what to:-

'And you hath He quickened, who were dead in trespasses and sins;
.. Wherein in time past ye walked according to the course of this world,
.... according to the prince of the power of the air,
...... the spirit that now worketh in the children of disobedience:
........ Among whom also we all had our conversation in times past in the lusts of our flesh,
.......... fulfilling the desires of the flesh and of the mind;
............ and were by nature the children of wrath, even as others.
But God, who is rich in mercy, for his great love wherewith he loved us,
.. Even when we were dead in sins,
.... hath quickened us together with Christ, (by grace ye are saved )
...... And hath raised us up together, and made us sit together in heavenly places in Christ Jesus:
........ That in the ages to come He might shew the exceeding riches of His grace
.......... in His kindness toward us through Christ Jesus.
For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God:
.. Not of works, lest any man should boast.
.... For we are His workmanship,
...... created in Christ Jesus unto good works,
........ which God hath before ordained that we should walk in them.'
(Ephesians 2:1-10)

* Is this what you would call 'a half-gospel?'

Thank you.
In Christ Jesus
Chris

 

[Episkopos]

'Be it known unto you all,
.. and to all the people of Israel,
.... that by the name of Jesus Christ of Nazareth,
...... whom ye crucified,
........ whom God raised from the dead,
.......... even by Him doth this man stand here before you whole.
............ This is the stone which was set at nought of you builders,
.............. which is become the head of the corner.
Neither is there salvation in any other:
for there is none other name under heaven
given among men,
whereby we must be saved.'
(Act 4:10-12)

Hello there Episkopos,

The reference above is quoted for no other reason than that I love it. The same could be said about what follows, except that it also tells me what I have been saved from, how, and what to:-

'And you hath He quickened, who were dead in trespasses and sins;
.. Wherein in time past ye walked according to the course of this world,
.... according to the prince of the power of the air,
...... the spirit that now worketh in the children of disobedience:
........ Among whom also we all had our conversation in times past in the lusts of our flesh,
.......... fulfilling the desires of the flesh and of the mind;
............ and were by nature the children of wrath, even as others.
But God, who is rich in mercy, for his great love wherewith he loved us,
.. Even when we were dead in sins,
.... hath quickened us together with Christ, (by grace ye are saved
...... And hath raised us up together, and made us sit together in heavenly places in Christ Jesus:
........ That in the ages to come He might shew the exceeding riches of His grace
.......... in His kindness toward us through Christ Jesus.
For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God:
.. Not of works, lest any man should boast.
.... For we are His workmanship,
...... created in Christ Jesus unto good works,
........ which God hath before ordained that we should walk in them.'
(Ephesians 2:1-10)

* Is this what you would call 'a half-gospel?'

Thank you.
In Christ Jesus
Chris

The problem doesn't lie with the wonderful provision of the true gospel. It's that people neglect so great a salvation because they are unwilling to pay the price. So people will settle for just the free and easy stuff....and ignore the full measure of grace. These will claim to have all the promises of God when they have very little indeed. Downgrading the gospel makes this seem right. But a sample of a product is not the same as having purchased the product itself.

So people are opportunists just looking for the free samples. And those samples are meant to taste and see that the Lord is good...so good that people forsake all things including their lives in order to enter into the kingdom life.

What we read about in the bible is the whole gospel...which is glorious.

But what we see in the modern churches is half a gospel. So unless people offer a false testimony you don't hear very much about the full victory over sin or the heavenly walk in Zion...to walk as Jesus walked. So then the faith that makes that possible is unacceptable to the free-loaders in the church. These function as unbelievers who claim to believe.

 

[Hidden In Him]

The problem doesn't lie with the wonderful provision of the true gospel. It's that people neglect so great a salvation because they are unwilling to pay the price. So people will settle for just the free and easy stuff....and ignore the full measure of grace. These will claim to have all the promises of God when they have very little indeed. Downgrading the gospel makes this seem right. But a sample of a product is not the same as having purchased the product itself.

So people are opportunists just looking for the free samples. And those samples are meant to taste and see that the Lord is good...so good that people forsake all things including their lives in order to enter into the kingdom life.

What we read about in the bible is the whole gospel...which is glorious.

But what we see in the modern churches is half a gospel. So unless people offer a false testimony you don't hear very much about the full victory over sin or the heavenly walk in Zion...to walk as Jesus walked. So then the faith that makes that possible is unacceptable to the free-loaders in the church. These function as unbelievers who claim to believe.

This post is very well put.

Let me ask you a question. I have my own views on it, but what in your opinion is it going to take for more Christians to wake up to it? By that, I mean not on their part. I mean what outside forces will have to be brought to bear to open their eyes? Whether from the Lord, his teachers, or from the world, as in the form of judgments.

 

[Episkopos]

This post is very well put.

Let me ask you a question. I have my own views on it, but what in your opinion is it going to take for more Christians to wake up to it? By that, I mean not on their part. I mean what outside forces will have to be brought to bear to open their eyes? Whether from the Lord, his teachers, or from the world, as in the form of judgments.

Persecution. But that's not going to happen unless at least part of the church comes to life. Otherwise why bother the dead and sleeping?

What causes the 10 virgins to awaken? And isn't it already too late for the foolish ones...who never purchased the whole product (just the free stuff) to remedy that enormous error?

 

[Hidden In Him]

Persecution. But that's not going to happen unless at least part of the church comes to life. Otherwise why bother the dead and sleeping?

I would agree. That's a major part of it. The other side is prayer, which I believe the church is going to be driven to by the hardships that are coming. This may partly solve the problem of the sleeping church. They will be forced awake out of fear of the things coming upon the world.

What causes the 10 virgins to awaken?

Yes. Although it won't just be persecution but the apparent fulfillment of end-time prophecy coming to pass, which makes it increasingly obvious that the Lord's return is approaching. I think that is still a long ways off yet, though. The immediate factor will be the hellish changes that take place in society, and the increasing need for the Lord to become our financial provision and protection against danger.

 

[Episkopos]

“That there has been over the last half a century a steady decline in the spiritual quality of Christian religion in America, no informed person will attempt to deny. I am not speaking of liberalism or modernism but of that evangelical wing of Christianity to which I myself belong by theological conviction and personal choice. I believe the situation has become so serious that the earnest observer is forced to wonder whether our popular evangelical religion today is indeed the true faith of our fathers or simply some form of paganism thinly disguised with a veneer of Christianity to make it acceptable to those who want to call themselves Christian.”

A.W. Tozer, “The Crucified Life”.

And he was speaking this 50 + years ago.

 

[mjrhealth]

“That there has been over the last half a century a steady decline in the spiritual quality of Christian religion in America, no informed person will attempt to deny. I am not speaking of liberalism or modernism but of that evangelical wing of Christianity to which I myself belong by theological conviction and personal choice. I believe the situation has become so serious that the earnest observer is forced to wonder whether our popular evangelical religion today is indeed the true faith of our fathers or simply some form of paganism thinly disguised with a veneer of Christianity to make it acceptable to those who want to call themselves Christian.”

A.W. Tozer, “The Crucified Life”.

And he was speaking this 50 + years ago.

Thats because "religion: is not of God, its all from men, and men love following men, few willing to walk away from It all to follow Him. Narrow is the way few there find it.