The Iran situation

[TLHKAJ]

I'm more annoyed than anything else. This government, and a significant portion of the population, is filled with people that think nuclear Armageddon will make Jesus happy.

It certainly seems that way, doesn't it?


Matthew 24:4-13
13 And Jesus answered and said unto them, Take heed that no man deceive you.
5 For many shall come in my name, saying, I am Christ; and shall deceive many.
6 And ye shall hear of wars and rumours of wars: see that ye be not troubled: for all these things must come to pass, but the end is not yet.
7 For nation shall rise against nation, and kingdom against kingdom: and there shall be famines, and pestilences, and earthquakes, in divers places.
8 All these are the beginning of sorrows.
9 Then shall they deliver you up to be afflicted, and shall kill you: and ye shall be hated of all nations for my name's sake.
10 And then shall many be offended, and shall betray one another, and shall hate one another.
11 And many false prophets shall rise, and shall deceive many.
12 And because iniquity shall abound, the love of many shall wax cold.
13 But he that shall endure unto the end, the same shall be saved.

This is why... iniquity abounds, and the love of many has grown cold. They've lost sight of the commandments of Christ ...love the Lord your God with all your heart, all your soul, and all your might ....and love your neighbor as yourself. Now, it's every man for himself and of you have what I want, I'll use force to take it. Trump is doing exactly that ...as is Netanyahu. Sad.

 

[Matthias]

“In everything, therefore, treat people the same way you want them to treat you, for this is the Law and the Prophets.“

(Matthew 7:12, NASB)

Jesus set and lived the standard as an example to his disciples.

My advice. Treat your enemies the same way that Jesus treated his. The apostles did.

Will you end up speaking a different language if you do?

 

[Big Boy Johnson]

I'm more annoyed than anything else. This government, and a significant portion of the population, is filled with people that think nuclear Armageddon will make Jesus happy.

Sadly you are misreading what's going on.

God's Word teaches there will be great tribulation than after that Jesus starts His 1000 reign on the earth

It's His taking over this world's affairs that has real Christians excited.

He knows full well that any air campaign alone will not defeat Iran. He knows it will require a significant ground invasion force. The IDF already has it's hands full with Gaza.

Thank you for that speculation

You'd think Christians would be calling for a ceasefire

Should Christians instead want Iran to get nukes and destroy Israel and the United States with nuclear holocaust

Is this what real Christians desire?

If Iran gets nukes they will use them on Israel and the US which makes them evil doers so they qualify for Romans 13:4 .

Romans 13:4
For he is the minister of God to thee for good. But if thou do that which is evil, be afraid; for he beareth not the sword in vain: for he is the minister of God, a revenger to execute wrath upon him that doeth evil.

Notice it says "the minister of God, a revenger to execute wrath upon him that doeth evil"?

Iran is getting the wrath the Lord desires for them to have right now.

You'd think Christians would be calling for a ceasefire, but they're not. Ironically, that call is coming from Russia and China. Lol.

Russia and China are in league with Iran as the axes of evil.

 

[Matthias]

Being wise and harmless doesn’t equal killing your enemies.

Being wise and harmless equals loving your enemies.

These peoples’ hearts are hardened.

 

[Matthias]

Good News from Iran: A Million New Christian Believers

What first comes into your mind when you see the word “Iran” in the headlines? Some of us immediately reflect on the Islamic Republic of Iran’s relentless efforts to develop a nuclear weapon, while their government-sponsored mobs chant, “Death to America!” and “Death to Israel!” For others, it’s...

www.hudson.org

“Meh. Let’s nuke ‘em.” There is, after all, precedent for it in Christian history.

The Messiah understands that sometimes his disciples must kill one another. Doesn’t he?

 

[Matthias]

“War may sometimes be a necessary evil. But no matter how necessary, it is always an evil, never a good. We will not learn to live together in peace by killing each other’s children.” - Jimmy Carter, The Nobel Peace Prize Lecture

”Do not repay evil with evil.”

(1 Peter 3:9)

The Messiah approved of his apostles / disciples repaying evil with evil when they are threatened by those who are evil?

No. This is the compromise a man makes when he attempts to serve two masters.

 

[Matthias]

“Take your share of suffering as a good soldier of Jesus Christ, just as I do; and as Christ’s soldier, do not let yourself become tied up in worldly affairs, for then you cannot satisfy the one who has enlisted you in his army. Follow the Lord’s rules for doing his work, just as an athlete either follows the rules or is disqualified and wins no prize.”

(2 Timothy 2:3-5, TLB)

What’s going on in the Middle East is a worldly affair. Paul, if he were alive today, wouldn’t become tied up with it. His service, and that of the sheep he shepherds, is to preach the gospel and make disciples, not to rid the world of evil nations / people.

Nations are going to war against nations in this present evil age.

A word to believers. Don’t get tangled up in worldly affairs. Watch and pray for the return of the Messiah.

 

[Big Boy Johnson]

Being wise and harmless doesn’t equal killing your enemies.

The wise part allows for self defense to prevent satan from slaughtering God's people like cattle.

Being wise and harmless equals loving your enemies.

We do love our enemies as we give them opportunity to NOT obtain nukes giving them opportunity to repent.

These peoples’ hearts are hardened.

Well then just lay down and let satan murder you and your family if you think it'll make you closer to the Lord.

“Meh. Let’s nuke ‘em.”

Where did you hear Christians are wanting to nuke Iran?

You got it backwards. Iran wants to nuke Israel and Christians and it's not a sin to support preventing Iran from getting nukes.

The Messiah understands that sometimes his disciples must kill one another. Doesn’t he?

The Messiah instructed His disciples to obtain a sword.

That's cannot be explained away.

Luke 22:36
Then said he unto them, But now, he that hath a purse, let him take it, and likewise his scrip: and he that hath no sword, let him sell his garment, and buy one.

Luke 22:36 is a verse where Jesus instructs His disciples to take provisions for their journey, emphasizing that if they do not have a sword, they should sell their cloak to buy one. This reflects a shift in their circumstances, indicating the need for preparedness in facing upcoming challenges including the need for self defense.

”Do not repay evil with evil.”

That's after the fact, after the evil has been done.

Preventing evil in the first place thru self defense is what Luke 22:36 is about

What’s going on in the Middle East is a worldly affair.

Yes which is why the Lord said this about rulers thru Paul:

Romans 13:4
For he is the minister of God to thee for good. But if thou do that which is evil, be afraid; for he beareth not the sword in vain: for he is the minister of God, a revenger to execute wrath upon him that doeth evil.

You gotta accept all the Lord says on these things to get the full picture.

If you want to lay down and get murdered refusing to engage in self defense to protect you and your family then you can do that if you'd like. Lots of guys don't provide for their family making themselves worse than infidels

1 Timothy 5:8
But if any provide not for his own, and specially for those of his own house, he hath denied the faith, and is worse than an infidel.

Unless one wants to claim safety from evil people is not something that would be beneficial for their family?

 

[Matthias]

The wise part allows for self defense to prevent satan from slaughtering God's people like cattle.

The wise part is listening to, believing, and obeying Jesus. His disciples are led to the slaughterhouse like sheep.

We do love our enemies as we give them opportunity to NOT obtain nukes giving them opportunity to repent.

That’s not love. That’s hope. You aren’t loving them as you’re killing them. If nuclear weapons are used against Iran, Christians will be killing fellow Christians.

Well then just lay down and let satan murder you and your family if you think it'll make you closer to the Lord.

I won’t and it wouldn’t. That’s something saber rattlers have a hard time understanding.

Where did you hear Christians are wanting to nuke Iran?

How have you not heard Christians wanting to nuke Iran?

You got it backwards. Iran wants to nuke Israel and Christians and it's not a sin to support preventing Iran from getting nukes.

You haven’t been keeping up with the news.

The Messiah instructed His disciples to obtain a sword.

That's cannot be explained away.

That’s right.

Luke 22:36
Then said he unto them, But now, he that hath a purse, let him take it, and likewise his scrip: and he that hath no sword, let him sell his garment, and buy one.

Luke 22:36 is a verse where Jesus instructs His disciples to take provisions for their journey, emphasizing that if they do not have a sword, they should sell their cloak to buy one. This reflects a shift in their circumstances, indicating the need for preparedness in facing upcoming challenges including the need for self defense.

How many enemies did his disciples kill with their swords on their journeys? Again, a rough estimate will suffice.

That's after the fact, after the evil has been done.

That’s right.

Preventing evil in the first place thru self defense is what Luke 22:36 is about

That’s wrong. Believers can’t prevent evil from happening.

Yes which is why the Lord said this about rulers thru Paul:

Romans 13:4
For he is the minister of God to thee for good. But if thou do that which is evil, be afraid; for he beareth not the sword in vain: for he is the minister of God, a revenger to execute wrath upon him that doeth evil.

You gotta accept all the Lord says on these things to get the full picture.

That’s right.

If you want to lay down and get murdered refusing to engage in self defense to protect you and your family then you can do that if you'd like.

See above. I’ve never said anything about laying down and doing nothing. What I have said is that I will not kill my enemies.

Lots of guys don't provide for their family making themselves worse than infidels

1 Timothy 5:8
But if any provide not for his own, and specially for those of his own house, he hath denied the faith, and is worse than an infidel.

That’s right.

Unless one wants to claim safety from evil people is not something that would be beneficial for their family?

Why don’t you believe God can protect you and your family without you killing your enemies?

 

[Matthias]

Huckabee Suggests Trump Should Nuke Iran, Follow Guidance From “Heaven”

The evangelical pastor and ambassador to Iran told Trump he “will hear from heaven” with guidance about the war.

truthout.org

Southern Baptist pastors aren’t Christians @Big Boy Johnson?

 

[Matthias]

@Riven. Does the spectacle of Christians killing fellow Christians give you a positive view of Christianity?

Would you be more receptive to Christianity if Christians would kill more of their enemies?

 

[Big Boy Johnson]

The wise part is listening to, believing, and obeying Jesus. His disciples are led to the slaughterhouse like sheep.

Well then the sooner you are slaughtered the happier you will be then right?

That’s not love. That’s hope. You aren’t loving them as you’re killing them. If nuclear weapons are used against Iran, Christians will be killing fellow Christians.

Nobody is saying Israel or the US is going to nuke Iran. Liberals spreading misinformation as usual.

Israel and the US are using conventional bombs to take out Iran's ability to produce nuclear weapons.

You are forgetting that the vast majority of people in Iran hate Jesus and support their nation building nukes to take out Israel and the US and of course the liberals are all in favor of the destruction of Israel and the United States.

I won’t and it wouldn’t.

So you do support self defense of yourself and your family?

But you do NOT support Israel and the US engaging in self defense to make sure Iran does not build nukes to destroy Israel and the US

You are contradicting yourself with confusion and we know who the author of confusion is, the devil.

saber rattlers

You must not be aware that for centuries the followers of islam have been threatening to murder all those that do not follow islam.

Too bad you don't understand what kind of people we are dealing with here.

How have you not heard Christians wanting to nuke Iran?

No, but I am aware that Israel and the US are using conventional bombs to take out Iran's ability to produce nuclear weapons.

Were you not aware that Christians are not in control of the governments of Israel and the United States and if there were any Christians wanting to nuke Iran it would be a moot point seeing they cannot make that happen?

You got this from the Department of Mole Hills to Mountains and it's a moot point.

There are some claiming to be Christians claiming Christian should take over the entire world, so what? Just ignore them as they don't know what's going on anyway and are very few in number unless you count the catholics and they aren't Christians so they don't count.

You haven’t been keeping up with the news.

It is you who are ignorant of Iran having been working on building nukes for years.

You gotta step up your game man and pay attention to what's really going on!

How many enemies did his disciples kill with their swords on their journeys? Again, a rough estimate will suffice.

Just having a weapon served as a deterrent which is the best outcome.

Actually using a weapon to kill someone in self defense is a last resort measure.

Anyone with weapons takes this view as it is part of responsible ownership of deadly weapons.

That’s wrong. Believers can’t prevent evil from happening.

OK, so maybe you think Jesus is an idiot for telling His disciples to obtain a deadly weapon.

And you obviously are ignorant of the authority of the believer as Jesus walked in as are to be walking in too.
Until He laid down His life willing to go to the Cross (His mission), the devil could not touch Him!

1 John 5:18
He that is begotten of God keepeth himself, and that wicked one toucheth him not.

No need for you to believe 1 John 5:18 seeing your mind is already made up that evil is welcome to come upon you.

You speak for yourself and not for those that are skillful in the Word of righteousness

I’ve never said anything about laying down and doing nothing. What I have said is that I will not kill my enemies.

OK so if some bad guys break in to your house to murder you and your family, be sure and do nothing and let them have their way.

These guys would be your enemies so be sure and let them do whatever they want to do since this is what some are calling love - which is the devil's definition of "love" designed to trick Christians in to laying down and let evil have it's way.

Why don’t you believe God can protect you and your family without you killing your enemies?

He can and does, but man does have free will and sometimes the only way to stop someone from doing evil is to put them out of their bodies especially those that enjoy evil and seek to murder people such as the followers of islam.

If you'll notice many times in God's Word the Lord required His people to engage in self defense and as they went forward in obedience He came along side of them and ensured victory

 

[Riven]

Sadly you are misreading what's going on.

God's Word teaches there will be great tribulation than after that Jesus starts His 1000 reign on the earth

It's His taking over this world's affairs that has real Christians excited.

Alright. But he has to actually come back first. That hasn't happened yet, and many people, myself included, wonder if it'll ever happen.

Thank you for that speculation

But it's based on facts. Israel's military is already stretched thin fighting Iran's proxies. Iran is the size of western Europe. It will take a significant force to conquer and occupy the country.

Should Christians instead want Iran to get nukes and destroy Israel and the United States with nuclear holocaust

No. In this case, I think Americans all agree that Iran shouldn't have nukes. However, Americans, especially us millennials, are very weary of the "regime change" wars.

How much of this is a result of Bibi's ambitions for the region, as opposed to Iran having a nuclear weapon? Remember, he's been saying this since the 80's.

Russia and China are in league with Iran as the axes of evil.

There is no "axis of evil" anymore. These are nations that rely on each other economically. Furthermore, both China and Russia are on bad terms right now. Russia discovered China hacked into their military systems and has been spying on them. Russia recently labeled China "the enemy". Strong words.

 

[Big Boy Johnson]

Southern Baptist pastors aren’t Christians @Big Boy Johnson?

Huckle Bee hangs out with a lot of false teachers and is very close to the fake hebrew roots movement so what he got from "heaven" was from the second heaven where the demonites and the devilites are floating around in

God is not telling Trump to nuke Iran and make it in to a nuclear wasteland, but for the purposes of protecting Israel from sure destruction the Lord is leading Israel and the US to dismantle Iran's ability to produce nukes using conventional bombs

This can easily be done with no boots on the ground and it is America first policy that Trump was elected on because Iran is not only trying to build nukes but they are also perfecting Intercontinental Ballistic Missiles to be able to deliver nukes to the United States which is in line with what Iran has been saying for year that they are going to destroy Israel and the US

The world failed to believe and act on what Adolf Hitler said he was going to do before he was able to do it so you'd think we would have learned our lesson and we should believe that Iran is very serious about doing what they have been sating they are going to do for years.

It's what islam does is kill, still, and destroy just as their father the devil has taught them.

 

[Big Boy Johnson]

many people, myself included, wonder if it'll ever happen.

Now why would you think the Lord told a lie about coming back?

The Lord spoke about these scoffers thru Peter

2 Peter 3:3
Knowing this first, that there shall come in the last days scoffers, walking after their own lusts,
And saying, Where is the promise of his coming? for since the fathers fell asleep, all things continue as they were from the beginning of the creation.

But it's based on facts. Israel's military is already stretched thin fighting Iran's proxies. Iran is the size of western Europe. It will take a significant force to conquer and occupy the country.

Israel's goal is to disable Iran's ability to make nukes and their ability to shoot missiles at them.

Israel and the US are not going to invade Iran and rick drawing China and Turkey in to aid Iran and start WW3 so you can relax.

especially us millennials, are very weary of the "regime change" wars.

Well "us millennials" need to learn how to trust the Lord casting their cares upon Him knowing He cares for "us millennials"

How much of this is a result of Bibi's ambitions for the region, as opposed to Iran having a nuclear weapon? Remember, he's been saying this since the 80's.

And Iran's islamic leaders have been saying since they took over Iran in 1979 they they SHALL destroy Israel and the US.

Reckon they are just kidding around? No, they are not so both Net and Yahoo is all for protecting Israel

There is no "axis of evil" anymore.

Ha ha, that's just what you think

The table is set already concerning which nations will all gang up on Israel and at some point they will assemble the largest military force ever known to mankind and will march on Israel

When they happens the Lord is going to supernaturally protect Israel and you'll be able to see it all live on TV as these events unfold.

 

[Matthias]

Well then the sooner you are slaughtered the happier you will be then right?

Me? No. For some, let‘s take Tertullian for example, it would have been. He yearned for martyrdom but didn’t experience. If you haven’t read him, you should. His reverence for the martyrs is spectacular. We also find it in the writings of other ECF’s.

You are lying about nukes being used against Iran.

Nukes haven’t been used against Iran. The option is under consideration.

Nobody is saying Israel or the US is going to nuke Iran. Liberals spreading misinformation as usual.

The public doesn’t know if they will be used by Israel or the US or not. I’m not a liberal and there is talk about it from both liberal and conservative commentators.

Israel and the US are using conventional bombs to take out Iran's ability to produce nuclear weapons.

If the US is bombing Israel then that is a new development. Where did you here that?

You are forgetting that the vast majority of people in Iran hate Jesus and support their nation building nukes to take out Israel and the US and of course the liberals are all in favor of the destruction of Israel and the United States.

No. I haven’t forgotten it. It’s plastered all over the internet. It’s been going on since 1979.

So you do support self defense of yourself and your family?

I do. What I don’t support is killing people who are threatening me, or threatening my family.

But you do NOT support Israel and the US engaging in self defense to make sure Iran does not build nukes to destroy Israel and the US

I’m staying out of it altogether. My business is preaching the gospel and making disciples, not advising the nations about how, when or if they should wage war against one another.

I asked @Riven earlier in the thread if he was surprised that I’m not calling for a cease fire. He didn’t say if he was or he wasn’t.

You are contradicting yourself with confusion and we know who the author of confusion is, the devil.

No. I’m attempting to address your confusion about what I believe and how I put it into practice.

You must not be aware that for centuries the followers of islam have been threatening to murder all those that do not follow islam.

Your being presumptuous, and that has caused you to jump to numerous false conclusions about me. As I’ve mentioned in passing in other threads, I’ve invested a considerable amount of time investigating Islam.

Too bad you don't understand what kind of people we are dealing with here.

See above.

No, but I am aware that Israel and the US are using conventional bombs to take out Iran's ability to produce nuclear weapons.

See above.

Were you not aware that Christians are not in control of the governments of Israel and the United States and if there were any Christians wanting to nuke Iran it would be a moot point seeing they cannot make that happen?

The US Ambassador to Israel is a Christian. The President of the US is a Christian. Most Senators and Congressmen are Christians. Most, if not all, of the military Chief of Staff are Christians. They will all have some input on the decision.

You got this from the Department of Mole Hills to Mountains and it's a moot point.

No.

There are some claiming to be Christians claiming Christian should take over the entire world, so what?

See above.

Just ignore them as they don't know what's going on anyway and are very few in number unless you count the catholics and they aren't Christians so they don't count.

Basic church history is a simple and more than adequate response to your ludicrous assertion.

It is you who are ignorant of Iran having been working on building nukes for years.

See above.

You gotta step up your game man and pay attention to what's really going on!

What I’ve got to do is remember what I said to myself I was going to do when I come across people like you.

Just having a weapon served as a deterrent which is the best outcome.

AFROTC.

Actually using a weapon to kill someone in self defense is a last resort measure.

It isn’t for me.

Anyone with weapons takes this view as it is part of responsible ownership of deadly weapons.

You provided no estimate because there is no record of it happening.

OK, so maybe you think Jesus is an idiot for telling His disciples to obtain a deadly weapon.

Certainly not.

And you obviously are ignorant of the authority of the believer as Jesus walked in as are to be walking in too.

I’m walking in that authority.

Until He laid down His life willing to go to the Cross (His mission), the devil could not touch Him!

1 John 5:18
He that is begotten of God keepeth himself, and that wicked one toucheth him not.

No need for you to believe 1 John 5:18 seeing your mind is already made up that evil is welcome to come upon you.

It is necessary for every disciple of Jesus to believe all that is written in scripture.

You speak for yourself and not for those that are skillful in the Word of righteousness

My abundant use of quotations - almost always of persons who are not Jewish monotheists - should be enough for people who are reasonable to evaluate your accusation.

OK so if some bad guys break in to your house to murder you and your family, be sure and do nothing and let them have their way.

If some bad guys break into my house with the intention of murdering me and my family, Imwon’t be doing nothing.

These guys would be your enemies so be sure and let them do whatever they want to do since this is what some are calling love - which is the devil's definition of "love" designed to trick Christians in to laying down and let evil have it's way.

See above.

He can and does, but man does have free will and sometimes the only way to stop someone from doing evil is to put them out of their bodies especially those that enjoy evil and seek to murder people such as the followers of islam.

You’re thinking like evil people think.

If you'll notice many times in God's Word the Lord required His people to engage in self defense and as they went forward in obedience He came along side of them and ensured victory

That’s right. The people whom he calls his people had hardened hearts. They had to learn the hard way.