The Iran situation

[Matthias]

No.

I thank God that you don’t.

Depends on the enemies.

The enemies are all who oppose the teaching and preaching done by the Messiah and the apostles.

To answer one of your previous questions, no I don't think killing our enemies always gives us the results we're looking for.

When you say “we” I take that to be you and others, not you and I.

The result I’m looking for - a change of heart - requires people to be alive.

However, sometimes it does. Like with ISIS. There is no other solution to that problem.

God might very well have temporarily addressed that problem through the use of lethal force. The world’s civil governments - all of them (the Roman Empire, Russia, China, United States, Iran, North Korea, Canada, Japan, Malawi, etc. Christians sometimes struggle with that concept) - are also identified in scripture as God’s ministers.

Also, I can't say I'm surprised that you're nor calling for a ceasefire.

That comes as good and welcome news to me.

Although I find your positron on this war to be a little confusing.

I don’t know that this will clear up any of the confusion or not but my position on this war is no different from my position on any other war.

Do you believe Christians should never fight under any circumstances?

Fight? I fight every day, using the armor of God.

I don’t think that’s what you had in mind though when you asked the question.

I’m not even sure if you’re asking me a military or non-military question. Maybe you’re asking me about both.

It might help if I rephrase your question:

A. Do I believe Christians should never enlist and serve in the militaries of the nations?

I do. There are, however, examples of conscientious objectors who have enlisted and served in certain non-combat roles in the militaries of the nations. I respect that decision but wouldn’t advise doing it.

B. Do I believe Christians should never be employed by civilian police departments?

I do. But just as with the military, there are examples of conscientious objectors being employed in roles that would not ever require them to use lethal force in caring out their duties. I respect that decision but wouldn’t advise doing it.

C. Do I believe that Christians should never defend themselves and / or others their family members or even total strangers if someone attacks them with a lethal weapon?

I don’t. I advocate using non-lethal means of defending self and others in those instances.

This is the scenario that those who advocate Christians killing their enemies really struggle with. (The other two scenarios they generally simply resort to alleging cowardice. What a slap in the face to the Christian martyrs / conscientious objectors.) It’s the rare conversation on this scenario when they don’t throw in the fiend who wants to rape my grandmother, my mother, my sisters, and my wife before murdering them … all while I sit in a chair and watch, rising only occasionally to retrieve refreshments from the refrigerator for myself and the fiend.

P.S.

Did that explanation clear up the matter for you or contribute further to your confusion about what I believe, practice, and counsel?

 

[shepherdsword]

Well, here we are again about to embark on yet another misadventure in this stupid desert that can never just be peaceful.

I think that President Trump should keep us out of the war. Netanyahu attacked the nation of Iran while negotiations between Iran and the US were still ongoing.

His intentions are obvious. He wishes to drag the United States into a wider conflict in the Middle East. And like clockwork, the Christian evangelicals are completely onboard for what could turn into another world war if other powers get involved, which they most likely will.

It's terribly disappointing to see this level of stupidity and ignorance. One would think you people would have learned from Afghanistan and Iraq, but no. No lessons were learned, and we're just gonna do it all again.

Would you rather Iran obtained nuclear weapons?

 

[Matthias]

Would you rather Iran obtained nuclear weapons?

Would you rather that no nation had ever obtained nuclear weapons?

 

[Riven]

Would you rather Iran obtained nuclear weapons?

No.

@Matthias it sounds like you're a pacifist.

 

[Matthias]

A nice introduction, for those who are interested, to the historical peace churches.

Peace Churches | Encyclopedia.com

Peace Churches"Peace churches" is the term commonly applied to the three oldest pacifist denominations in the United States—the Society of Friends or Quakers, the Church of the Brethren, and the Mennonites. None of these is a united body, embracing different and diverse organizational entities...

www.encyclopedia.com

I don’t agree with everything they believe but I do have a certain affinity with them. I am a conscientious objector.

 

[Matthias]

No.

@Matthias it sounds like you're a pacifist.

I am, but there are varying degrees of pacifism. In some ways it’s an unfortunate term. It has a connotation to it which causes many people to think that it describes a person who does absolutely nothing at all in the face of evil. There are some pacifists who are like that but, in my experience, the majority of us aren’t. It’s a sliding scale, not a fixed scale.

Thank you for sharing your observation. It gave me a nice opportunity to briefly address the subject.

 

[shepherdsword]

Would you rather that no nation had ever obtained nuclear weapons?

Of course, would you rather that Iran also go them?