The Problem With The Trinity

[justbyfaith]

It should have changed your view about the KJV. It seems faulty because you are trying to force the man made trinity doctrine into Scripture. So I ask you again, why didn't God preserve Tyndale's Bible? For hundreds of years, English speaking people back then had the "Word of God" saying "it". Put your self in their shoes who would have felt about Tyndale's Bible the same way you feel about the KJV. Either the KJV or Tyndale's Bible is corrupted which destroys your view that God preserved His Word perfectly in English translations. Translations are fallible, the originals are not.

So then, since we no longer have any access to the original autographs (they have been lost) there is no way of knowing what the word of God really says. And therefore the way of salvation is lost to us because every Bible is corrupted to some degree and there is no way of knowing what was originally said.

I don't believe that for a second. In Tyndale's Bible, God preserved for us the understanding that the Word is neither male nor female; but in the kjv, God cleared up the confusion that came from the Tyndale rendition which implied that God is an it rather than a Personal Being.

 

[bbyrd009]

This is one of the most absurd things anyone has ever written.

i could provide an example gadar, pretty sure the Good Samaritan could too?

Please cite the post # where I wrote such a thing so we can verify your false accusation. I don't even use the word "hell" in my vocabulary.

so let's avoid the semantics discussion ok, you condemned everyone who eats pork, and you put the judgement down to tomorrow, same diff ok

 

[gadar perets]

i could provide an example gadar, pretty sure the Good Samaritan could too?

Please do.

 

[bbyrd009]

Please do.

leaving him half dead.
31A priest happened to be going down that road. When he saw him, he passed by on the other side.
32In the same way, a Levite, when he arrived at the place and saw him, passed by on the other side.
33But a •Samaritan

 

[justbyfaith]

Are you saying Jewish believers have to keep the law, but Gentile believers don't? Matthew and Mark gave the same message. And your reference to Romans 14 is misapplied since it does not apply to eating unclean meat.

Yes, those who are circumcised and trusting in the law for their justification are required to keep every jot and tittle (Galatians 5:2-4, Galatians 3:10, James 2:10, Matthew 5:48, Matthew 5:17-20). I suppose there are some Jewish folk who have come to the understanding that they are forgiven through the blood of Christ and are therefore not under the law. Christians are not under the law and this will result in holiness in the long run (Romans 6:14).

Yes, nothing to be refused as long as it is sanctified by the Word (Leviticus 11 and Deuteronomy 14) and prayer.

nothing is to be refused because (for) it is sanctified by the word (Mark 7:15-19, Luke 11:41, Romans 14:14, 1 Timothy 4:1-6) and prayer.

Every creature of God is good and nothing to be refused.

 

[bbyrd009]

"Sabbath-day" is still reflected in the Latinate languages i guess

Ironic, they changed so much regarding times an dates but kept saturn day. Guess they didn't want people to question changing the day of worship.

kinda hard to transmit in short bites like this, but "Roman" is like "post-Latin," Latium was one of the pre-Italian opposing city-states of Rome, which is why "Latin" languages still say "Sabbath" for Saturn-day

 

[gadar perets]

So then, since we no longer have any access to the original autographs (they have been lost) there is no way of knowing what the word of God really says. And therefore the way of salvation is lost to us because every Bible is corrupted to some degree and there is no way of knowing what was originally said.

I don't believe that for a second.

I don't believe that either and I never said that. The copies we have preserved the Word quite well with a few exceptions. It is the translations of those copies that are in question.

 

[gadar perets]

so let's avoid the semantics discussion ok, you condemned everyone who eats pork, and you put the judgement down to tomorrow, same diff ok

I NEVER "condemned" anyone. You can provide a post # for that false accusation as well. Pointing out sin is not condemning people. It is assisting in restoring people who want to be restored as per Galatians 6:1.

 

[justbyfaith]

I don't believe that either and I never said that. The copies we have preserved the Word quite well with a few exceptions. It is the translations of those copies that are in question.

Evidently you are the one who determines what those exceptions are in scripture...

 

[justbyfaith]

I NEVER "condemned" anyone. You can provide a post # for that false accusation as well. Pointing out sin is not condemning people. It is assisting in restoring people who want to be restored as per Galatians 6:1.

You require us to be obedient to the whole of the law in order to be saved; therefore those of us who believe in hell understand that you are saying that if we don't obey the law we are going to hell; and that is condemnation.

Actually, those who subject themselves to the law and attempt to be justified by it are required to keep the whole of the law perfectly from conception into eternity (Galatians 3:10, James 2:10, Matthew 5:48, Matthew 5:18, Galatians 5:2-4).

But for those of us who enter in through faith in Jesus Christ, our justification does not come through the keeping of the law (Galatians 2:16).

 

[gadar perets]

leaving him half dead.
31A priest happened to be going down that road. When he saw him, he passed by on the other side.
32In the same way, a Levite, when he arrived at the place and saw him, passed by on the other side.
33But a •Samaritan

This parable was not given by Yeshua to show how the Jews feared touching a dead body. It was given to correct a Jewish scribes understanding of who is neighbor was; to teach what it means to love thy neighbor; to show that those who know the law do not always live by the law; to show that those who the Jews disdained have more compassion than they; to teach mercy; ...

It was primarily the first part of your absurd comment above that made me shake my head in disbelief; "yes, nothing you could put in your mouth could make one unclean before Jesus came either, ...". So what you are saying is that Moses, for example, could eat a centipede and not become unclean or defiled even though YHWH specifically said;

Lev 11:42 Whatsoever goeth upon the belly, and whatsoever goeth upon all four, or whatsoever hath more feet among all creeping things that creep upon the earth, them ye shall not eat; for they are an abomination.
Lev 11:43 Ye shall not make yourselves abominable with any creeping thing that creepeth, neither shall ye make yourselves unclean with them, that ye should be defiled thereby.
​

Your problem is you do not know Torah.

 

[justbyfaith]

How did we get off-topic? The topic of this thread is, The Problem with the Trinity.

I assume that since we have moved on, the problem has been resolved.

 

[justbyfaith]

Sorry, posted post #912 before I saw post #911.

 

[justbyfaith]

This parable was not given by Yeshua to show how the Jews feared touching a dead body. It was given to correct a Jewish scribes understanding of who is neighbor was; to teach what it means to love thy neighbor; to show that those who know the law do not always live by the law; to show that those who the Jews disdained have more compassion than they; to teach mercy; ...

It was primarily the first part of your absurd comment above that made me shake my head in disbelief; "yes, nothing you could put in your mouth could make one unclean before Jesus came either, ...". So what you are saying is that Moses, for example, could eat a centipede and not become unclean or defiled even though YHWH specifically said;

Lev 11:42 Whatsoever goeth upon the belly, and whatsoever goeth upon all four, or whatsoever hath more feet among all creeping things that creep upon the earth, them ye shall not eat; for they are an abomination.
Lev 11:43 Ye shall not make yourselves abominable with any creeping thing that creepeth, neither shall ye make yourselves unclean with them, that ye should be defiled thereby.
​

Your problem is you do not know Torah.

If I'm not mistaken, the food laws were given to Israel so that they would be separate from the other nations.

 

[gadar perets]

Yes, those who are circumcised and trusting in the law for their justification are required to keep every jot and tittle (Galatians 5:2-4, Galatians 3:10, James 2:10, Matthew 5:48, Matthew 5:17-20). I suppose there are some Jewish folk who have come to the understanding that they are forgiven through the blood of Christ and are therefore not under the law. Christians are not under the law and this will result in holiness in the long run (Romans 6:14).

i asked, "Are you saying Jewish believers have to keep the law, but Gentile believers don't?" and you replied "Yes" above. Then you go on to talk about Jews who aren't true believers, but are fallen from grace. Mark and Matthew were written for all believers, whether Jew or Gentile and both groups must obey YHWH's laws. To fail to do so is sin for sin is the transgression of the law (1 John 3:4).

 

[gadar perets]

Evidently you are the one who determines what those exceptions are in scripture...

No, it is Greek scholars who study such issues that decide. I merely accept their findings.

 

[gadar perets]

You require us to be obedient to the whole of the law in order to be saved; therefore those of us who believe in hell understand that you are saying that if we don't obey the law we are going to hell; and that is condemnation.

Yes, that would be condemnation if that is what I am saying, but you twist my words and misrepresent me in order to make yourself look correct.
I NEVER said one needs to obey the law in order to be saved. Another false accusation. Please provide a post # where is said that.

1) I do not require you to do anything. YHWH does. I merely hope to restore you out of love.
2) We are saved by grace through faith, not by law.

Actually, those who subject themselves to the law and attempt to be justified by it are required to keep the whole of the law perfectly from conception into eternity (Galatians 3:10, James 2:10, Matthew 5:48, Matthew 5:18, Galatians 5:2-4).

But for those of us who enter in through faith in Jesus Christ, our justification does not come through the keeping of the law (Galatians 2:16).

I agree that we are justified by faith, not by law, but you choose to falsely accuse me of seeking to be justified by the law because you love doing Satan's work of accusing the brethren.

 

[gadar perets]

If I'm not mistaken, the food laws were given to Israel so that they would be separate from the other nations.

That is one reason.

 

[justbyfaith]

i asked, "Are you saying Jewish believers have to keep the law, but Gentile believers don't?" and you replied "Yes" above. Then you go on to talk about Jews who aren't true believers, but are fallen from grace. Mark and Matthew were written for all believers, whether Jew or Gentile and both groups must obey YHWH's laws. To fail to do so is sin for sin is the transgression of the law (1 John 3:4).

Galatians 5:2-4 refers to those who are circumcised. Is that not referring to the Jews? 1 Corinthians 7:17-20 balances this out to a certain extent.

If you are justified by the law, then you are fallen from grace.

Sin is the transgression of the law; however, our entrance into the kingdom is through the forgiveness of sins: not through living a sinlessly perfect life.

 

[justbyfaith]

No, it is Greek scholars who study such issues that decide. I merely accept their findings.

I accept the findings of the scholars who translated the kjv. I hold His word to be authoritative. The devil seeks to destroy our trust in what we have in English and to make it a backbreaking proposition to get the real message of scripture.