The Reality of the Millennial Kingdom

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Trekson

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these shall hate the whore, and shall make her desolate and naked, and shall eat her flesh, and burn her with fire.

To me this is descriptive of Babylon in Rev.18, which I believe will be the USA shortly (the way it looks) in the future.
 

Trekson

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I desire mercy, not sacrifice
John 18:14
Caiaphas was the one who had advised the Jews that it would be better if one man died for the people.

Under the law almost everything requires blood

etc. It's everywhere, when you can see it imo
wadr
He came as a Redeemer. It's not like this caught God by surprise. Many times God uses the devil as an unwilling servant to accomplish whatever God desires. This was exactly God's plan from Genesis till then.
 
B

brakelite

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1 Thess. 5:23 - "And the very God of peace sanctify you wholly; and I pray God your whole spirit and soul and body be preserved blameless unto the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ."
Within this context, the body G4983 is obvious, the spirit G4151 is the rational and immortal soul and the soul G5590 is our vitality, also explained as our "animal" sentience that feels physical events like pain, suffering, pleasure, not to be confused with emotions. These three things (spirit and soul and body) correspond exactly and respectively with H5315, H7307 and H2416. Our body is the home of the spirit and is "alive" in the sense of G5590.
Uh huh. I'm waiting for the 'immortal' part. You know, that declaration that all humans are immortal, even the wicked?
 

Enoch111

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You know, that declaration that all humans are immortal, even the wicked?
Well the Bible tells us that there will be a resurrection of the unrighteous or the unjust or the wicked. Which means that they will have imperishable bodies in the Lake of Fire.
 

bbyrd009

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Does she see sorrow?
yes, in proportion to "How much she hath glorified herself, and lived deliciously" right?
So is it not God’s will for them to consume her flesh, to burn her with fire, to hate her and make her desolate.
hmm, I would say that that is how she gets all the sorrow myself, imo that is exactly what God's will is? "She" here being an institution that they have created, and also hate, hypocrites iow, and we are reading about a recurring theme too imo, not a specific occurrence
 
B

brakelite

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Well the Bible tells us that there will be a resurrection of the unrighteous or the unjust or the wicked. Which means that they will have imperishable bodies in the Lake of Fire.
You sure? Which came first. The belief that sinners are immortal and cannot die...or the need to invent a place to accommodate them? If we had believed God first, that the soul that sinneth, it shall die, (Ezek) and not believe the words of the serpent, thou shalt not surely die, (Gen) then we wouldn't have needed to invent eternal torment to give those immortal sinners somewhere to live. All those pesky texts that speak of the sinners ultimate destruction wouldn't have to be ignored. Just sayin.
 

bbyrd009

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He came as a Redeemer. It's not like this caught God by surprise. Many times God uses the devil as an unwilling servant to accomplish whatever God desires. This was exactly God's plan from Genesis till then.
ha, no i'm sure God knew exactly what would happen, but this does not mean that He desired or required it, as we are told to believe. God did not need a Sacrifice to make you acceptable to Him, also, as we are told to believe. This all starts with the bad literal notion "God cannot even be in the same room with sin" or however this might be expressed, I would Quote a couple but i'm presently hindered, but these are being taken way too literally and can be pretty easily disputed with other Scripture imo.
 

bbyrd009

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You sure? Which came first. The belief that sinners are immortal and cannot die...or the need to invent a place to accommodate them? If we had believed God first, that the soul that sinneth, it shall die, (Ezek) and not believe the words of the serpent, thou shalt not surely die, (Gen) then we wouldn't have needed to invent eternal torment to give those immortal sinners somewhere to live. All those pesky texts that speak of the sinners ultimate destruction wouldn't have to be ignored. Just sayin.
nice bl
 

VictoryinJesus

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these shall hate the whore, and shall make her desolate and naked, and shall eat her flesh, and burn her with fire.

To me this is descriptive of Babylon in Rev.18, which I believe will be the USA shortly (the way it looks) in the future.

Can’t be the US. It is bigger than us(imo). Revelation 14:10-12
[10] The same shall drink of the wine of the wrath of God, which is poured out without mixture into the cup of his indignation; and he shall be tormented with fire and brimstone in the presence of the holy angels, and in the presence of the Lamb: [11] And the smoke of their torment ascendeth up for ever and ever: and they have no rest day nor night, who worship the beast and his image, and whosoever receiveth the mark of his name. [12] Here is the patience of the saints: here are they that keep the commandments of God, and the faith of Jesus.

It is in their heart to Hate the whore. Revelation 17:16-17
[16] And the ten horns which thou sawest upon the beast, these shall hate the whore, and shall make her desolate and naked, and shall eat her flesh, and burn her with fire. [17] For God hath put in their hearts to fulfil his will, and to agree, and give their kingdom unto the beast, until the words of God shall be fulfilled.

the ten horns and beast hate her. All man’s power and kingdoms come against her.

It is the beast and kingdoms that rise that God puts in their heart to come upon her. To destroy her. To make her desolate. To waste her. To strip her of all the resources they use of her to live deliciously until there is nothing left. They (those made rich off her) wail that in one hour such riches have come to nothing. There is no pride in her, her own glory is stripped. (Devoured). —in the presence of the Lamb. (She comes to nothing).

The beast and ten horns hate her.
Cain hated. He was full of it.
What are the two commands of God, and the faith of Jesus? His word says ‘here are they’ who die for my name sake. They that do My commandments? I’m confused are we on the side of the ten horns and beast ...or are the ten horns and the beast that rides the whore, against those prepared for mercy?? If they are coming against the whore? Where are God’s children’s? Whose side are we on... That makes the ten horns and the beast dispise us and want to kill us too?

“—in the presence of the Lamb.”

John 8:3-7
[3] And the scribes and Pharisees brought unto him a woman taken in adultery; and when they had set her in the midst, [4] They say unto him, Master, this woman was taken in adultery, in the very act. [5] Now Moses in the law commanded us, that such should be stoned: but what sayest thou? [6] This they said, tempting him, that they might have to accuse him. But Jesus stooped down, and with his finger wrote on the ground, as though he heard them not . [7] So when they continued asking him, he lifted up himself, and said unto them, He that is without sin among you, let him first cast a stone at her.

1 John 4:18
[18] There is no fear in love; but perfect love casteth out fear: because fear hath torment. He that feareth is not made perfect in love.

“...who worship the beast and his image, and whosoever receiveth the mark of his name. [12] Here is the patience of the saints: here are they that keep the commandments of God, and the faith of Jesus.”
 

Enoch111

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God did not need a Sacrifice to make you acceptable to Him...
More nonsense from you. Where do you come up with these foolish ideas?

Professing themselves to be wise, they became fools (Rom 1:22)
 

Enoch111

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Where are God’s children’s? Whose side are we on... That makes the ten horns and the beast dispise us and want to kill us too?
Once again you are taking all kinds of unrelated passages and putting them together. God's children (the Church) will be in Heaven when Mystery Babylon is judged.
 

friend of

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To me this is descriptive of Babylon in Rev.18, which I believe will be the USA shortly (the way it looks) in the future.

Yeah it kinda seems like... most of the world wants USA to die
 

Davy

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Then you are right, I don’t understand.
Galatians 1:23-24 But they had heard only, That he which persecuted us in times past now preacheth the faith which once he destroyed. [24] And they glorified God in me.

Apostle Paul was a chosen elect (Acts 9). He was a Jew and a Pharisee also, and persecuted the Church, in ignorance. Not all Pharisees, scribes, or Jews represent the "synagogue of Satan". Even Paul's Hebrew teacher Gamaliel who was a Pharisee, held the other Pharisees back who wanted to slay Peter and the apostles (see Acts 5 & Acts 22 about Gamaliel). Those who were of the "synagogue of Satan" which our Lord Jesus pointed to represent the idea of false Jews, those who say they are Jews, but are not. Those like Paul and Gamaliel were Jews of the seed of Israel, those of the synagogue of Satan are not, but are the 'tares' of Matthew 13, the children of the devil, the devil's elect that crept in.

The reason why many brethren find this difficult to understand is because the seminaries tell preachers to stay away from such Bible subjects, but keep on with the 'milk' of God's Word instead. Just like with the parable of the tares, this is a 'strong meat' subject. It's what Paul was talking about with the "mystery of iniquity" idea in 2 Thess.2, which is also John's "many antichrists" idea. It's about Satan's workers here on earth God allows him to have serving him, and not in ignorance.
 

Davy

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Yeah it kinda seems like... most of the world wants USA to die

God spoke through His OT prophets about this time. He is allowing the coming one-world beast kingdom, and He reveals that when His people finally turn away from their 'things', and instead admit they need Him, and cry 'uncle' (my expression), because of their enemies having power over them, that is when He is going to step in and destroy our enemies. That will be the last day of this present world. We are to become so weak that it will tempt the nations to gather against us and seek to destroy us. Biblically, there are 2 Israels, the nation state in the middle east which represent the "house of Judah", and then the Christian west and their Christian allies which represent the lost ten tribed "house of Israel" joined with believing Gentiles, which represents spiritual Israel.
 

Davy

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For real? How do we glaze right over the two commandments (Love God and neighbor) as if they are not even there and say He is Lord? So Paul only loved certain people? A select few of his flesh?

How does Matthew 5:44-48 become void? “But I say unto you, Love your enemies, bless them that curse you, do good to them that hate you, and pray for them which despitefully use you, and persecute you; [45] That ye may be the children of your Father which is in heaven: for he maketh his sun to rise on the evil and on the good, and sendeth rain on the just and on the unjust. [46] For if ye love them which love you, what reward have ye? do not even the publicans the same? [47] And if ye salute your brethren only, what do ye more than others ? do not even the publicans so? [48] Be ye therefore perfect, even as your Father which is in heaven is perfect.”

John 14:15
[15] If ye love me, keep my commandments.

Romans 12:14
[14] Bless them which persecute you: bless, and curse not.

By understanding about Christ's enemies is not cursing them. If you think it is, then you have a very skewed understanding about those very verses you quote.

Now look at the parable of the tares Jesus gave in Matthew 13 and try to tell me those 'tares' represent God's children.
 

Davy

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Hi Davy, I think our difference lies in the often misconstrued belief that only sinners will be at the GWTJ. All human flesh that haven't known about or had the opportunity to hear about Christ will be judged at that time as well, also those good that died during the millennial era. The former will be judged by how they lived regarding the basic knowledge of good an evil that resides in all of us.

Many don't understand that at the start of Christ's Millennial reign He will judge the nations in order to separate them only, but that the GWT Judgment is a later judgement after the 1,000 years, and instead is to cast the unsaved into the lake of fire with death and hell.

The 'goats' on His left hand (Matt.25) are the nations of unsaved that He and His elect will reign over during the 1,000 years. It will include deceived brethren who fell away also. That is the "resurrection of damnation"; those are still in a liable to perish state. Christ's elect, the first resurrection (meaning first resurrection unto eternal Life through Jesus), will be teaching them the difference between the clean and unclean, etc. That goes on during the whole 1,000 years.

Then at the end of the 1,000, when the books are opened, and names are searched for in the book of Life, that is to separate those who believed on Jesus during the 1,000 years, and they become joined with the first resurrection. But those who still rejected Him during that 1,000 years are judged and sentence to perish in the lake of fire.
 

Davy

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Then it's simply a matter of semantics. We are guilty and deserving of eternal death, perhaps it would be better worded if you said that, "Many false teachers claim that the church is responsible for the "act" of His crucifixion. The statement that His "blood" is upon all living souls believer or not is true.

Of course death was assigned to all born in the flesh and we deserve to die, from the sin in God's Garden. But that's a lot different than a BELIEVING CHRISTIAN being told they crucified Jesus on His cross! That can be said to the unbelieving Jews still today, and that would still apply somewhat, but the existence of the "mystery of iniquity" shows that even those of true Judah in Jesus' day agreed in ignorance by the working of the "synagogue of Satan" who were the real murderers of our Lord Jesus.

But today some cat behind a pulpit that is Biblically ignorant decides to push the blood guilt of Christ's crucifixion upon the very ones who have believed on Him, i.e., us Christians??? A follower of Christ ought to know exactly... who that kind of idea is originating from, i.e., the devil himself.
 

bbyrd009

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Professing themselves to be wise, they became fools (Rom 1:22)
from a guy who calls himself "Enoch"
ok
pardon me if I missed an imo or something, but the parts you declined to Quote are not Koran either, ok.

If you believe that God needed Jesus to die to make you acceptable to Him it is bc you are still confused, still in the world, and still under the law, so help me God
 
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VictoryinJesus

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Apostle Paul was a chosen elect (Acts 9). He was a Jew and a Pharisee also, and persecuted the Church, in ignorance. Not all Pharisees, scribes, or Jews represent the "synagogue of Satan". Even Paul's Hebrew teacher Gamaliel who was a Pharisee, held the other Pharisees back who wanted to slay Peter and the apostles (see Acts 5 & Acts 22 about Gamaliel). Those who were of the "synagogue of Satan" which our Lord Jesus pointed to represent the idea of false Jews, those who say they are Jews, but are not. Those like Paul and Gamaliel were Jews of the seed of Israel, those of the synagogue of Satan are not, but are the 'tares' of Matthew 13, the children of the devil, the devil's elect that crept in.

The reason why many brethren find this difficult to understand is because the seminaries tell preachers to stay away from such Bible subjects, but keep on with the 'milk' of God's Word instead. Just like with the parable of the tares, this is a 'strong meat' subject. It's what Paul was talking about with the "mystery of iniquity" idea in 2 Thess.2, which is also John's "many antichrists" idea. It's about Satan's workers here on earth God allows him to have serving him, and not in ignorance.

Yes, and we are to not judge another man’s servant. Point is, you are right I don’t know who these workers of iniquity are. God’s Word says you will know them by their fruit. And tells us the works of the flesh and the fruit of the Spirit. Is anyone hopeless? That is all I meant. Whose to say someone will not see God and be as Paul...a testimony that glorifies God?