The soon coming rapture?

[n2thelight]

No, this is a description of the second coming coming not a false coming. You left most of the seal verses out:

Rev 6:14 And the heaven departed as a scroll when it is rolled together; and every mountain and island were moved out of their places.
Rev 6:15 And the kings of the earth, and the great men, and the rich men, and the chief captains, and the mighty men, and every bondman, and every free man, hid themselves in the dens and in the rocks of the mountains;
Rev 6:16 And said to the mountains and rocks, Fall on us, and hide us from the face of him that sitteth on the throne, and from the wrath of the Lamb:
Rev 6:17 For the great day of his wrath is come; and who shall be able to stand?

Verse 17 tells us it's the day of his wrath, the Lamb in verse 16.







Matching what the 6th seal says...the wrath of God and Christ happens at the second coming.

Revelation 11:19 And the Temple of God was opened in heaven, and there was seen in His Temple the ark of His testament:
and there were lightnings, and voices, and thunderings, and an earthquake, and great hail.

So we see at the 7th trump Jesus is returning and it's the time of judgement. Now the 7th trump contains the 7 vials, the wrath of God.





Not the second coming as you are claiming with the whole 777 thing.

Question , does not Christ return at the 7th trump ?

 

[ewq1938]

Question , does not Christ return at the 7th trump ?

Yes but he does not return at the timeframe of the 6th seal or the 7th vial. The one and only actual second coming is the 7th trump. The 6th seal describes the 7th trump coming but it's just info about what will happen at the 7th trump. I see the 7th vial as the official end of any second coming events.

 

[n2thelight]

Yes but he does not return at the timeframe of the 6th seal or the 7th vial. The one and only actual second coming is the 7th trump. The 6th seal describes the 7th trump coming but it's just info about what will happen at the 7th trump. I see the 7th vial as the official end of any second coming events.

I've pondered this for a while now and I know exactly where you stand . Let me talk to our Father for a second and I'll get back .

 

[n2thelight]

@n2thelight

Gen 1:
[10] And God called the dry land Earth; and the gathering together of the waters called he Seas: and God saw that it was good.

No one was UPON dry land......God was DESTROYING the DRY LAND, with WATER!

Dry land was not destroyed, it was flooded ,still under the water

 

[ewq1938]

Dry land was not destroyed, it was flooded ,still under the water

Some of the land was destroyed because of water erosion.

 

[n2thelight]

How do the very elect miss this rapture ?

 

[n2thelight]

Some of the land was destroyed because of water erosion.

Still on earth correct ?

 

[ewq1938]

Still on earth correct ?

Yes, land erosion happens on the planet.

 

[Taken]

But even i cannot say for sure which one is the correct doctrine in fact I suspect they all are understood incorrectly what I do know is what the spirirt has spoken to me and it seems to be saying that while it is a little ways off it is close enough he is nudging us to pay attention and when i say a little ways of i mean very little.

I know it is common for people to say soon to him is different than soon for us but this doesn't seem to be very scriptural to me God doesn't use the word soon very often and what if we say this and it really is soon but we just assumed it was a ways off because of this and end up missing the rapture because we assumed soon wasn't really soon?

There has been division since the beginning.
The Whole of Scripture is True.

Dividing the Word of Truth is individuals Hearing, Reading, Deciding, which Truth of God “they desire” will “apply” to them, “then DO”, what according to Gods WAY, will Effect/Cause, according to the individuals FREEWILL, that a particular passage of Gods Truth, SHALL apply to them.

Some shall:
Believe in God, Commit to God, believe in a god, or not.
Believe in Jesus, Commit to Jesus, or not.
Believe in the Messiah, Believe it is Christ, Believe it is Jesus, Commit , or not.

Some shall:
Believe in celestial spirits, evil spirits, planets, sun, moon, OTHER PERSONS, etc., as their god, or not.
Believe in crafted statues, trinkets, idols, etc., as their god, or not.

Facts Are: Scripture reveals the Knowledge OF specific things MEN shall choose to Believe, Commit, of Not.
And: Exactly “what shall Apply to them”, Because of their Freewill choice;
Believe, Disbelief, Commitment, Non-Commitment.

It matters Not, what individuals “call” their religion, their denomination, their doctrines....what “they say” and what “they do”, is a “reflection”, of what they have freely chosen.

Bottom Line IS:
Individuals Divide themselves, and God Shall “separate” the Divided, according TO His Order and Way;
* “With” (BELIEVING) in Him,
* “In” COMMITTED) in Him.
* “Without” (BELIEVING) in Him.
* “Without” (COMMITTED) in Him.
**AND ~ A “particular” separation and consequence FOR those WHO:
* Expressly Preached AGAINST Believing in the Lord God Almighty.
* Expressly Persecuted Others, FOR their Belief in God, the Lord, the Almighty.

Bottom Line IS:
SOON, is relative to the individual. Persons are naturally born, live, die.
What is SOON, “their END”, for one person may be 1 year, or 90 years for an other.

* God has already DECIDED, when enough IS enough.
* Mankind has ready available Knowledge, can Observe what the World of men are choosing, doing, Preparing, or not.
* Yes...Some men ARE Disappointed, Angry, at what THEY Observe in this World.
* Yes...Some men ARE Elated, Happy, at what THEY Observe in this World.
* Yes...God IS Elated what A FEW, in this World are Choosing.
* Yes...God IS Disappointed, Jealous, ANGRY, what He Observes in this World.

Pryor to Noah, we discover, Gods Anger...mild, waxing, increasing...HOT
As in the days of Noah~ (Gods First Great Tribulation)
* Gods Anger waxed Hot, to Destroy the Earth (dry Land), with water.
* Saving ONLY A FEW (8 Persons), BY rising them UP Above the Face of the earth.

Gods Anger is mild, waxing, increasing....AND as Prophecy Reveals....Once Again and for the LAST TIME...God SHALL:
* SAVE a FEW, By rising them UP Above the Face of the earth.
^ RAPTURE^
* SAVE Some, During the Tribulation.
* Destroy Many, During the Tribulation.
* A Remnant of Mortals, occupy the earth, 1,000 years, living, dying, establishing Nations, while Jesus Occupy’s His Throne, in His Kingdom (ie the Land Promised Abraham’s heirs), with His Servants.
1,000 yrs VOID of Satan and Evil Demonic spirits.
* During 1,000 years, again Mortals Divide themselves.
* End of 1,000 years, Gods FINAL Separation of:
Men with and without Him.
Spirit with and without Him.
* Final Destruction of the Earth, with FIRE, and a RENEWED Heaven and Earth ajoined as One Holy Kingdom of the Lord God Almighty and His People forever together in Peace and Harmony.

So
Yes, there is a Rapture, Only for Some.
Yes, there is a Tribulation that comes down from Heaven.
Yes, Some will Experience a portion (mild) of the Tribulation.
Yes, Some will Experience a portion (increase) of the Tribulation.
Yes, Some will Experience a portion (hot) of the Tribulation.
Yes, Some will Experience Gods VENGEANCE for their part in Persecuting People Believing and Committing TO God.

So effectively, What Scripture Reveals SHALL apply to Individuals, BECAUSE of their Beliefs, SHALL Apply.
And we certainly DO see a wide Range of what People declare IS their Belief.

Glory to God,
Taken

 

[farouk]

There has been division since the beginning.
The Whole of Scripture is True.

Dividing the Word of Truth is individuals Hearing, Reading, Deciding, which Truth of God “they desire” will “apply” to them, “then DO”, what according to Gods WAY, will Effect/Cause, according to the individuals FREEWILL, that a particular passage of Gods Truth, SHALL apply to them.

Some shall:
Believe in God, Commit to God, believe in a god, or not.
Believe in Jesus, Commit to Jesus, or not.
Believe in the Messiah, Believe it is Christ, Believe it is Jesus, Commit , or not.

Some shall:
Believe in celestial spirits, evil spirits, planets, sun, moon, OTHER PERSONS, etc., as their god, or not.
Believe in crafted statues, trinkets, idols, etc., as their god, or not.

Facts Are: Scripture reveals the Knowledge OF specific things MEN shall choose to Believe, Commit, of Not.
And: Exactly “what shall Apply to them”, Because of their Freewill choice;
Believe, Disbelief, Commitment, Non-Commitment.

It matters Not, what individuals “call” their religion, their denomination, their doctrines....what “they say” and what “they do”, is a “reflection”, of what they have freely chosen.

Bottom Line IS:
Individuals Divide themselves, and God Shall “separate” the Divided, according TO His Order and Way;
* “With” (BELIEVING) in Him,
* “In” COMMITTED) in Him.
* “Without” (BELIEVING) in Him.
* “Without” (COMMITTED) in Him.
**AND ~ A “particular” separation and consequence FOR those WHO:
* Expressly Preached AGAINST Believing in the Lord God Almighty.
* Expressly Persecuted Others, FOR their Belief in God, the Lord, the Almighty.

Bottom Line IS:
SOON, is relative to the individual. Persons are naturally born, live, die.
What is SOON, “their END”, for one person may be 1 year, or 90 years for an other.

* God has already DECIDED, when enough IS enough.
* Mankind has ready available Knowledge, can Observe what the World of men are choosing, doing, Preparing, or not.
* Yes...Some men ARE Disappointed, Angry, at what THEY Observe in this World.
* Yes...Some men ARE Elated, Happy, at what THEY Observe in this World.
* Yes...God IS Elated what A FEW, in this World are Choosing.
* Yes...God IS Disappointed, Jealous, ANGRY, what He Observes in this World.

Pryor to Noah, we discover, Gods Anger...mild, waxing, increasing...HOT
As in the days of Noah~ (Gods First Great Tribulation)
* Gods Anger waxed Hot, to Destroy the Earth (dry Land), with water.
* Saving ONLY A FEW (8 Persons), BY rising them UP Above the Face of the earth.

Gods Anger is mild, waxing, increasing....AND as Prophecy Reveals....Once Again and for the LAST TIME...God SHALL:
* SAVE a FEW, By rising them UP Above the Face of the earth.
^ RAPTURE^
* SAVE Some, During the Tribulation.
* Destroy Many, During the Tribulation.
* A Remnant of Mortals, occupy the earth, 1,000 years, living, dying, establishing Nations, while Jesus Occupy’s His Throne, in His Kingdom (ie the Land Promised Abraham’s heirs), with His Servants.
1,000 yrs VOID of Satan and Evil Demonic spirits.
* During 1,000 years, again Mortals Divide themselves.
* End of 1,000 years, Gods FINAL Separation of:
Men with and without Him.
Spirit with and without Him.
* Final Destruction of the Earth, with FIRE, and a RENEWED Heaven and Earth ajoined as One Holy Kingdom of the Lord God Almighty and His People forever together in Peace and Harmony.

So
Yes, there is a Rapture, Only for Some.
Yes, there is a Tribulation that comes down from Heaven.
Yes, Some will Experience a portion (mild) of the Tribulation.
Yes, Some will Experience a portion (increase) of the Tribulation.
Yes, Some will Experience a portion (hot) of the Tribulation.
Yes, Some will Experience Gods VENGEANCE for their part in Persecuting People Believing and Committing TO God.

So effectively, What Scripture Reveals SHALL apply to Individuals, BECAUSE of their Beliefs, SHALL Apply.
And we certainly DO see a wide Range of what People declare IS their Belief.

Glory to God,
Taken

Hi @Taken Hebrews 12.2 seems to summarize to Whom we should be looking: "Looking unto Jesus, the Author and Finisher of our faith, Who for the joy that was set before Him endured the Cross...."

In the Lord's Supper we have His coming in view: "Till He Come..." (1 Corinthians 11.26).

 

[Taken]

Still on earth correct ?

The World is without End.
The Earth IS dry land.
When the Earth was no longer DRY, it was Destroyed.

To Destroy, is to make what IS, made no longer recognizable, as what it was.

Erect a Building. You recognize it is a Building. Destroy the Building. You no longer can See or Recognize that Building.

When the Earth was Covered with Water. The Earth was no longer DRY.
It was Destroyed.

It’s a foreshadow of Understanding.
What God Creates, He also Makes. He Makes one thing, Destroys it, and Makes it anew.
God caused the water to assuage, and again the earth was DRY, made anew.

 

[Taken]

So because he sends his angels to gather us to him this means he’s not receiving us unto himself?

God sends His Angels to Gather His People.......called by the names; Hebrews, Twelve Tribes, Jews, Israel, Israelites.
OUT OF “HER”, the “wicked corrupt world government systems”!

OUT OF and BACK TO GOD. He their Government Head. He their KING.

If you want to Know, the moment, God Stopped Being “THEIR” KING,
Because they wanted a “WORLD” human king....
READ, 1 Samuel 8: 1-22

That gathering has nothing to do with Gentiles.

 

[Taken]

Not an attack at all, as for my belief I don't believe a rapture is supported in scripture . Where is your scriptual proof of a rapture.
Gave you mine as to why not.

Please show me any scripture of a rapture

The Rapture applies ONLY to those “IN” Christ:

(1 Thes 4:
[16] For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first:
[17] Then we (in Christ) which are alive and remain shall be caught up (one word translation from Latin, to Greek, to English; RAPTURE that means Caught up, Taken) together with them (physically dead IN Christ) in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord.

AND occurs BEFORE Gods Wrath comes down from Heaven.
(1 Thes 5:
[9] For (ie BeCAUSE) God hath not appointed us (IN Christ) to wrath, but to obtain salvation by our Lord Jesus Christ,

Wrath (results of Gods Anger) shall come down from Heaven...
Beginning MILD, increase, become Hot.

During the “phases” from Mild to Hot, men will be, deciding their beliefs, committing to their believes, and being Killed, for their beliefs...
In God, or Not In God.

* Non-Committed Believers and men coming into Belief, during the Tribulation...
(1 Thes 4:
[14] For (ie BeCause) IF we (in the Tribulation) believe that Jesus died and rose again, even so them also which sleep in Jesus will God bring with him.

Rev 20:
[4] And I saw thrones, and they sat upon them, and judgment was given unto them: and I saw the souls of them that were beheaded for the witness of Jesus, and for the word of God, and which had not worshipped the beast, neither his image, neither had received his mark upon their foreheads, or in their hands; and they lived and reigned with Christ a thousand years.

[5] But the rest of the dead, (coming into believe during the Tribulation, God shall bring with Him) lived not again until the thousand years were finished. This is the first resurrection.

Doesn’t matter what you Believe or Do not Believe;
Doesn’t matter what you Choose to Do or not Do;
Gods Will shall prevail.

IF you are with God, God shall be with you.
IF you Leave God, God shall Leave you.
If you are with God and IN Christ, Christ shall be IN you, and FOREVER God shall be with you, and FOREVER you shall be with God.

 

[farouk]

The Rapture applies ONLY to those “IN” Christ:

(1 Thes 4:
[16] For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first:
[17] Then we (in Christ) which are alive and remain shall be caught up (one word translation from Latin, to Greek, to English; RAPTURE that means Caught up, Taken) together with them (physically dead IN Christ) in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord.

AND occurs BEFORE Gods Wrath comes down from Heaven.
(1 Thes 5:
[9] For (ie BeCAUSE) God hath not appointed us (IN Christ) to wrath, but to obtain salvation by our Lord Jesus Christ,

Wrath (results of Gods Anger) shall come down from Heaven...
Beginning MILD, increase, become Hot.

During the “phases” from Mild to Hot, men will be, deciding their beliefs, committing to their believes, and being Killed, for their beliefs...
In God, or Not In God.

* Non-Committed Believers and men coming into Belief, during the Tribulation...
(1 Thes 4:
[14] For (ie BeCause) IF we (in the Tribulation) believe that Jesus died and rose again, even so them also which sleep in Jesus will God bring with him.

Rev 20:
[4] And I saw thrones, and they sat upon them, and judgment was given unto them: and I saw the souls of them that were beheaded for the witness of Jesus, and for the word of God, and which had not worshipped the beast, neither his image, neither had received his mark upon their foreheads, or in their hands; and they lived and reigned with Christ a thousand years.

[5] But the rest of the dead, (coming into believe during the Tribulation, God shall bring with Him) lived not again until the thousand years were finished. This is the first resurrection.

Doesn’t matter what you Believe or Do not Believe;
Doesn’t matter what you Choose to Do or not Do;
Gods Will shall prevail.

IF you are with God, God shall be with you.
IF you Leave God, God shall Leave you.
If you are with God and IN Christ, Christ shall be IN you, and FOREVER God shall be with you, and FOREVER you shall be with God.

@Taken 1 Cor. 10.32 speaks of three groups of ppl; the rapture is linked with the church of God.

 

[Taken]

Hi @Taken Hebrews 12.2 seems to summarize to Whom we should be looking: "Looking unto Jesus, the Author and Finisher of our faith, Who for the joy that was set before Him endured the Cross...."

In the Lord's Supper we have His coming in view: "Till He Come..." (1 Corinthians 11.26).

ONLY by, through, of, IN CHRIST Jesus, is a man ASSURED his Salvation IS Received, IS SECURE and that man NOT subject to experiencing GODS WRATH that comes down from Heaven.

 

[The Light]

How do the very elect miss this rapture ?

Hos 9
10 I found Israel like grapes in the wilderness; I saw your fathers as the firstripe in the fig tree at her first time: but they went to Baalpeor, and separated themselves unto that shame; and their abominations were according as they loved.

The fig tree has two harvests. Israel was supposed to be the first harvest but they served another god. Therefore the Gentiles would become the 1st harvest.

When the fullness of the Gentiles comes in, part of Israel (the tribes across the earth, THE SEED OF THE WOMAN) will have it's blindness removed. They will see that Jesus is the prophesied Messiah. That is why there are 144,000 first fruits of the second harvest.
Rom 11
25 For I would not, brethren, that ye should be ignorant of this mystery, lest ye should be wise in your own conceits; that blindness in part is happened to Israel, until the fulness of the Gentiles be come in.

 

[Taken]

@Taken 1 Cor. 10.32 speaks of three groups of ppl; the rapture is linked with the church of God.

1 Cor 10:
[31] Whether therefore ye eat, or drink, or whatsoever ye do, do all to the glory of God.
[32] Give none offence, neither to the Jews, nor to the Gentiles, nor to the church of God:
[33] Even as I please all men in all things, not seeking mine own profit, but the profit of many, that they may be saved.

1 Cor. is widely accepted as the Gospel of Jesus Christ, according to Paul.
1 Cor 10:32 is simply a direction given to Believers, or “potential Believers”, first hearing the Gospel...

To be concerned with your own beliefs, choices, (IN Jesus Christ) and not worry about what, “other men”, Jews, Gentiles, or believers in “God”, but not Christ Jesus, “believe”.

Rapture ONLY applies to those “IN” Christ Jesus, before the Trib.
Any who come into belief “IN” God, “IN” Jesus, during the Trib.
God shall bring with Him, is FIRST RESURRECTION, after the 1,000 year reign of Christ.

 

[The Light]

They Can't show any scripture of a pre-trib rapture, because it doesn't exist

It would help immensely if you had ears to hear and eyes to see.

Not an attack at all, as for my belief I don't believe a rapture is supported in scripture . Where is your scriptual proof of a rapture.
Gave you mine as to why not.

Please show me any scripture of a rapture

No problem.

Here is the second rapture which occurs at the coming of Jesus at the 6th seal. This occurs immediately after the tribulation and just before the wrath of God which is the trumpets.

Rev 14
14 And I looked, and behold a white cloud, and upon the cloud one sat like unto the Son of man, having on his head a golden crown, and in his hand a sharp sickle.

15 And another angel came out of the temple, crying with a loud voice to him that sat on the cloud, Thrust in thy sickle, and reap: for the time is come for thee to reap; for the harvest of the earth is ripe.

16 And he that sat on the cloud thrust in his sickle on the earth; and the earth was reaped.

17 And another angel came out of the temple which is in heaven, he also having a sharp sickle.

18 And another angel came out from the altar, which had power over fire; and cried with a loud cry to him that had the sharp sickle, saying, Thrust in thy sharp sickle, and gather the clusters of the vine of the earth; for her grapes are fully ripe.

19 And the angel thrust in his sickle into the earth, and gathered the vine of the earth, and cast it into the great winepress of the wrath of God.

Jesus remains in the clouds in this rapture and sends his angels to gather the elect from heaven and earth.
Matthew 24
29 Immediately after the tribulation of those days shall the sun be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light, and the stars shall fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens shall be shaken:
30 And then shall appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven: and then shall all the tribes of the earth mourn, and they shall see the Son of man coming in the clouds of heaven with power and great glory.
31 And he shall send his angels with a great sound of a trumpet, and they shall gather together his elect from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other.


When the Lord comes for His Church, the first rapture, the Lord himself will come.
1 Thes 4
16 For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first:

17 Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord.

 

[n2thelight]

Hos 9
10 I found Israel like grapes in the wilderness; I saw your fathers as the firstripe in the fig tree at her first time: but they went to Baalpeor, and separated themselves unto that shame; and their abominations were according as they loved.

The fig tree has two harvests. Israel was supposed to be the first harvest but they served another god. Therefore the Gentiles would become the 1st harvest.

When the fullness of the Gentiles comes in, part of Israel (the tribes across the earth, THE SEED OF THE WOMAN) will have it's blindness removed. They will see that Jesus is the prophesied Messiah. That is why there are 144,000 first fruits of the second harvest.
Rom 11
25 For I would not, brethren, that ye should be ignorant of this mystery, lest ye should be wise in your own conceits; that blindness in part is happened to Israel, until the fulness of the Gentiles be come in.

Israel are not necessarily the elect also Israel is the Church so the argument doesn't hold water

 

[The Light]

Israel are not necessarily the elect also Israel is the Church so the argument doesn't hold water

4 For Jacob my servant's sake, and Israel mine elect, I have even called thee by thy name: I have surnamed thee, though thou hast not known me.

You can walk around in the Church has replaced Israel blindness if you want. I'm just showing you the FACTS. Part of Israel cannot see until the fullness of the Gentiles comes in. That will occur when the SECRET PRETRIBULATION RAPTURE occurs.

You asked for a rapture in scripture and I showed it to you. If you don't have eyes to see, that's another matter.