The theological fallacy of a spiritual 'resurrection'

Earburner · May 22, 2022

GISMYS_7 said:
Yes!! At the rapture we believers that are looking for and expecting Jesus will be changed and receive a new immortal body, PTL.
1 Corinthians 15:51-52
51 Behold, I shew you a mystery; We shall not all sleep, but we shall all be changed,

52 In a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trump: for the trumpet shall sound, and the dead shall be raised incorruptible, and we shall be changed.

And of course, that part of Christ's Resurrection (who is the First), being that of His Holy Spirit, was imparted, deposited, seeded and/or planted in the hearts of all who ARE Born Again of His Holy Spirit.
Rev.20[6] Blessed and holy is he that hath part in the first resurrection: on such the second death hath no power, but they shall be priests of God and of Christ, and shall reign with him a thousand years

Therefore, if we do not receive NOW the power of His Resurrection first, we have NO promise of hope to be physically resurrected into the immortality of His likeness.
Phil.3[10] That I may know him, and the power of his resurrection, and the fellowship of his sufferings, being made conformable unto his death;

There are many in the churches who are copying and mimicking Jesus, but are void of His Holy Spirit.
2Tim.3[5] Having a form of godliness, but denying the power thereof: from such turn away.
All of such are the "tares" and not the "wheat".
Matthew 13:18-30.

To become born again by God's Holy Spirit NOW, is to be a "partaker" of His divine nature.
2Pet.1[4] Whereby are given unto us exceeding great and precious promises: that by these ye might be partakers of the divine nature, having escaped the corruption that is in the world through lust.

Zao is life · May 22, 2022

@GISMYS_7

Remember that the words anástasis (resurrection); égersis; anístēmi; and egeírō (being raised from death); and synegeírō (being raised with Christ's bodily resurrection) are referring only to the bodily resurrection in each and every verse in the New Testament where the words are found, so Philippians 3:10 is talking about the power of Christ's bodily resurrection:

"That I may know Him and the power of His (bodily) resurrection and the fellowship of His sufferings, being made conformable to His death"

Earburner said:
Phil.3[10] That I may know him, and the power of his resurrection, and the fellowship of his sufferings, being made conformable unto his death;

Bear in mind that this below has nothing to do with this thread or with the fact that in the New Testament resurrection is never spiritual, but only bodily (which has been clearly shown, and all the New Testament verses listed in the first two posts in this thread):

Earburner said:
There are many in the churches who are copying and mimicking Jesus, but are void of His Holy Spirit.
2Tim.3[5] Having a form of godliness, but denying the power thereof: from such turn away.
All of such are the "tares" and not the "wheat". Matthew 13:18-30.

The above has nothing to do with the subject of this thread at all, and is out of place (a red herring). But in any case, we don't know, and have no right, to judge who, of those who claim to believe in Jesus, truly believe and are therefore His, and who are "mimicking Jesus but are void of His Holy Spirit".

It's quite a strange red herring in the middle of a thread about the resurrection, IMO.

But just remember that if anyone ever accuses you or any other believer in Jesus of being one such person (or even implies that you or the other person is), then the accuser has proved that he is either void of the Holy Spirit, or completely disobedient to Him, so we all who believe in Jesus need to be careful (and alert) whenever such an accuser opens his mouth in accusation against the brethren.

This below, though true, does not change the fact that the way in which someone shares in the (bodily) resurrection is through being born of the Spirit (i.e quickened by the Spirit), but again, this is merely going off-topic and making a completely off-topic point, without answering any facts mentioned in the first four posts of this thread (and who knows why):

Earburner said:
To become born again by God's Holy Spirit NOW, is to be a "partaker" of His divine nature.
2Pet.1[4] Whereby are given unto us exceeding great and precious promises: that by these ye might be partakers of the divine nature, having escaped the corruption that is in the world through lust.

Everyone who is of Christ (who believes in Jesus and belongs to Him, having been bought by His blood) knows that the above is God's gift to us, which Christ has earned and He (who is the LORD our righteousness) deserves, but we did not earn and do not deserve. But the fact has nothing to do with the fact that in the New Testament, the words anástasis (resurrection); égersis; anístēmi; and egeírō (being raised from death); and synegeírō (being raised with Christ's bodily resurrection) are referring only to the bodily resurrection in each and every verse in the New Testament where the words are found, and the power of the resurrection is the Holy Spirit, which (or Whom) we receive only through spiritual birth from above.

Earburner · May 22, 2022

Fullness of the Gentiles said:
@GISMYS_7

Remember that the words anástasis (resurrection); égersis; anístēmi; and egeírō (being raised from death); and synegeírō (being raised with Christ's bodily resurrection) are referring only to the bodily resurrection in each and every verse in the New Testament where the words are found, so Philippians 3:10 is talking about the power of Christ's bodily resurrection:

"That I may know Him and the power of His (bodily) resurrection and the fellowship of His sufferings, being made conformable to His death"

Bear in mind that this below has nothing to do with this thread or with the fact that in the New Testament resurrection is never spiritual, but only bodily (which has been clearly shown, and all the New Testament verses listed in the first two posts in this thread):

The above has nothing to do with the subject of this thread at all, and is out of place (a red herring). But in any case, we don't know, and have no right, to judge who, of those who claim to believe in Jesus, truly believe and are therefore His, and who are "mimicking Jesus but are void of His Holy Spirit".

It's quite a strange red herring in the middle of a thread about the resurrection, IMO.

But just remember that if anyone ever accuses you or any other believer in Jesus of being one such person (or even implies that you or the other person is), then the accuser has proved that he is either void of the Holy Spirit, or completely disobedient to Him, so we all who believe in Jesus need to be careful (and alert) whenever such an accuser opens his mouth in accusation against the brethren.

This below, though true, does not change the fact that the way in which someone shares in the (bodily) resurrection is through being born of the Spirit (i.e quickened by the Spirit), but again, this is merely going off-topic and making a completely off-topic point, without answering any facts mentioned in the first four posts of this thread (and who knows why):

Everyone who is of Christ (who believes in Jesus and belongs to Him, having been bought by His blood) knows that the above is God's gift to us, which Christ has earned and He (who is the LORD our righteousness) deserves, but we did not earn and do not deserve. But the fact has nothing to do with the fact that in the New Testament, the words anástasis (resurrection); égersis; anístēmi; and egeírō (being raised from death); and synegeírō (being raised with Christ's bodily resurrection) are referring only to the bodily resurrection in each and every verse in the New Testament where the words are found, and the power of the resurrection is the Holy Spirit, which (or Whom) we receive only through spiritual birth from above.

Please pay attention to the title of this thread, and you will see that that this topic and my comments are very much on point.
1John.5[13] These things have I written unto you that believe on the name of the Son of God; that ye may know that YE HAVE eternal life, and that ye may believe on the name of the Son of God.

John.11[26] And whosoever liveth and believeth in me shall never die. Believest thou this?

If you have come to God through faith and Jesus, and have received His Holy Spirit, then how did you get the Gift of eternal life, as John says that you have?

In the below, which fits your situation?
1. Through the resurrection of Jesus, who was/is the First resurrection, I received His Holy Spirit, the Gift of eternal life.
2. I don't have the Gift of eternal life, because I am still waiting for His Glorious return.

Edit: do you not see and understand that our salvation is through Jesus' resurrection, who He alone IS THE First resurrection, which is saying: "blessed and holy is he that HATH part in [Jesus'] resurrection....".
ONLY by His resurrection is anyone made holy, and therefore they are blessed.
When is it that anyone is made holy?
The day they believed in Christ and received God's HOLY Spirit.
All of such have been given* the Gift of His Eternal life, and are only waiting for their redemption and to then be made Immortal, after His likeness, in the day of His appearing from Heaven.
Our salvation, and then our redemption, is a two stage process.

*Note: 1 John 5:13. The Gift of the Holy Spirit is the vehicle of His eternal life to usward.
Without Him, we are "none of His", and if that be so, then eternal life cannot be given to any of such.
As a result, they cannot be made immortal after Christ's likeness, upon His return from Heaven.. Romans 8:8-9.

2nd Edit: now you can know WHY the "five foolish virgins" were complaining in that parable (Matthew 25:1-13), saying: [10] And while they went to buy, the bridegroom came; and they that were ready went in with him to the marriage: and the door was shut.
[11] Afterward came also the other [five] virgins, saying, Lord, Lord, open to us.
[12] But he answered and said, Verily I say unto you,
I know you not.
Now connect that with Romans 8:8-9.
[9] But ye are not in the flesh, but in the Spirit, if so be that the Spirit of God dwell in you. Now if any man have not the Spirit of Christ, he is none of his.

See also Matthew 13:24-30 and John 3:7.

Earburner · May 24, 2022

Fullness of the Gentiles said:
Everyone who is of Christ (who believes in Jesus and belongs to Him, having been bought by His blood) knows that the above is God's gift to us, which Christ has earned and He (who is the LORD our righteousness) deserves, but we did not earn and do not deserve.

Please notice that your words do not describe HOW one "belongs" to Christ.
However, what you have described are the "foolish virgins". Yes, many come to Christ for the forgiveness of sins through His blood, but they NEVER asked for the Gift of His Holy Spirit, which IS THE vehicle of the Gift of eternal life to usward.
KJV-Luke 11:13
Such Christians are only half baked.
They agree with God for their need for the blood of Christ, but they never followed through in a one on one personal committment of establishing a covenant relationship with Christ.
Luke 11:13, Revelation 3:20, John 3:7.

Without the Gift of His Holy Spirit permanently dwelling within them, all of such are NOT ready to meet the Lord upon His return.
Matthew 25[10] And while they [five foolish] went to buy, the bridegroom came; and they that were ready went in with him to the marriage:
and the door was shut.
Just like the door on Noah's Ark, whereby only Eight (8) souls were saved.

"Many are called, but few chosen". Matthew 20:16

Earburner · May 25, 2022

So now, let's talk about the "power" of Christ's resurrection. What was it that caused Him to rise from His mortal death of being bone, flesh and blood only, into a brand new, immortal living creature, of being bone, flesh and Spirit, having Eternal Life?
Can you describe who the power was/is?
Here is a clue: "I AM THE resurrection". John 11:25

Do you not know that through faith in Him, the "power" of His Resurrection must first be in us, and that it is simply the reverse of His, but it is not that of ourselves?
John.3[7] Marvel not that I said unto thee, Ye must be born again.

So then, what can we say about those who profess to believe in Christ, but deny the "first stage" of our resurrection process through Christ?
We can say this:
2Tim.3[5] Having a form of godliness, but denying the power thereof: from such turn away.

If the power of His Resurrection is within us, we will be resurrected into the likeness of His immortality.
Remember: Romans 8:8-9 applies right NOW and upto the Day of His return. But if you are not a "partaker" of His "divine nature" NOW, the door will be shut, leaving all of such permanently outside.

Earburner · May 27, 2022

If my comments and scripture references aren't enough to prove that our salvation and redemption is a two stage process, the Holy Spirit through Paul says this:
Ephesians 2:1-6
[5] Even when we were dead in sins, [He] hath
A. quickened us together with Christ, (by grace ye are saved [6] And hath
B. raised us up together [with Christ], and
C. made us sit together [with Christ]
D. in heavenly places in Christ Jesus:
That probably doesn't make sense to you at the moment, but Galatians 2:20 will help to put it into perspective:
Gal.2[20] I am crucified with Christ: nevertheless I live; yet not I, but Christ liveth in me: and the life which I now live in the flesh I live by the faith of the Son of God, who loved me, and gave himself for me.

And Jesus is where, right now?
Ans. Seated at the right hand of God.
So my question is, how did you get to be "quickened", "raised up", and "seated in Heavenly places", "in Christ Jesus"? Iows, how did you receive God's "divine nature"? Isn't His divine nature in the resurrected Christ? 2 Peter 1:4
Ans. In the day that you received Jesus Christ as your personal Savior, His Crucifixion and the power of His Resurrection was applied to you.
You were crucified with Him, and then through His Gift to you of His Holy Spirit, you were spiritually resurrected with Him. (Again, see items A-D above)

So then, what are we all waiting for?
We are waiting to be changed into the likeness of
His immortality, on the Day of our redemption.
But, that cannot happen to anyone, unless they are Born Again of His Holy Spirit. Romans 8:8-9.

It's all about what God is doing for us, and not what we are doing for God.
[7] That in the ages to come he might shew the exceeding riches of his grace in his kindness toward us through Christ Jesus.
[8] For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God:
[9] Not of works, lest any man should boast.

This is the covenant relationship that we have entered into with God the Father through His Son.
He gave to us His Son as the Sacrifice for our sins and restoration back to Him, and therefore expects our "reasonable service" towards Him, that we in turn present ourselves to Him as a living sacrifice also, that He and His Son (the Holy Spirit) may live in and through us for His good pleasure.
Rom.12[1] I beseech you therefore, brethren, by the mercies of God, that ye present your bodies a living sacrifice, holy, acceptable unto God, which is your reasonable service.
Phil.2[13] For it is God which worketh in you both to will and to do of his good pleasure.

Spiritual Israelite · May 27, 2022

Fullness of the Gentiles said:
2. New Testament words used in reference to living or being made alive by the Spirit ("quickened")

záō: a primary verb; to live, to be quick.
zōopoiéō: Used in reference to the Spirit's quickening, making alive again, giving or imparting (eternal) life. Also used in reference to the quickening of the mortal body (see below).
syzōopoiéō: Made alive again together with Christ, quickened together with Christ.

The New Testament never uses the Greek word záō in reference to anyone who has died or is not alive and living in his body.

I just don't find this to be a strong argument against the idea that it could be used that way in Revelation 20:4 because those who are physically dead and spiritually alive in heaven are rarely even referred to at all in the New Testament. If they were frequently referred to in the New Testament without ever being referred to using the word záō then that would increase the strength of your argument, but that is not the case.

So, just because the word záō is not used in reference to them anywhere else besides Revelation 20:4 does not mean it can't be used to refer to them in that verse. The souls and spirits of those who are physically dead are still alive (záō), so it isn't as if the word can't be used to refer to a person who is alive spiritually but not physically and bodily.

Would you agree that the Greek word záō at least can be used to refer to those who are physically, but not spiritually, dead even if you don't think it is actually used that way anywhere in scripture? If not, then what word would be used to refer to them being alive and living in heaven?

Then there's also the question of why the word záō would be used to refer to them instead of the word anazáō which is used to refer to "the rest of the dead" in Revelation 20:5 (which you try to deny). You, and other premils, claim that Revelation 20:4 says that the martyrs John saw are bodily resurrected and then reign with Christ for a thousand years afterwards. But, the Greek word záō is not a word used to described the act of someone rising from the dead. So, the question is, why wouldn't a Greek word like anazao, instead of záō, have been used there instead if it's describing the bodies of the souls John saw being resurrected? How would you answer that question?

Spiritual Israelite · May 27, 2022

ewq1938 said:
Can Amillennialists even provide a scripture that speaks of being born again using the word resurrection? Being born is very different than resurrecting.

Let me make it clear that not all Amillennialists claim that the first resurrection specifically refers to when someone is born again as if being spiritually born and being spiritually resurrected are somehow the same thing.

Some of us see the first resurrection as being Christ's bodily resurrection in particular (Acts 26:23; 1 Cor 15:20,22; Col 1:18; Rev 1:5) and that having part in the first resurrection (Christ's resurrection) happens by way of being spiritually saved and born again, as described in passages like Romans 6 and Ephesians 2:1-6. So, in this view, we are acknowledging that the word "resurrection" in the phrase "the first resurrection" is a bodily resurrection and is Christ's bodily resurrection in particular. We don't need to be bodily resurrected in order to have part in Christ's resurrection (the first resurrection).

Making the first resurrection itself anything but Christ's bodily resurrection contradicts scripture.

Acts 26:23 that the Messiah would suffer and, as the first to rise from the dead, would bring the message of light to his own people and to the Gentiles.”

Paul gave the order of resurrections unto bodily immortality here:

1 Corinthians 15:22 For as in Adam all die, so in Christ all will be made alive. 23 But each in turn: Christ, the firstfruits; then, when he comes, those who belong to him.

Christ's resurrection itself was the first unto bodily immortality. Next in order to be resurrected unto bodily immortality are those who belong to Christ at His coming. That can't be the first resurrection because Christ's resurrection is the first resurrection.

But, the question is, can someone have part in Christ's resurrection before being bodily resurrected themselves? Of course.

Romans 6:9 For we know that since Christ was raised from the dead, he cannot die again; death no longer has mastery over him. 10 The death he died, he died to sin once for all; but the life he lives, he lives to God. 11 In the same way, count yourselves dead to sin but alive to God in Christ Jesus.

When we have spiritually had part in the first resurrection, Christ's bodily resurrection, then we can count ourselves "dead to sin but alive to God in Christ Jesus".

Spiritual Israelite · May 27, 2022

ewq1938 said:
That particular wording is not used in scripture regarding the concept of being born again.

Ephesians 2:4 But God, who is rich in mercy, for his great love wherewith he loved us, 5 Even when we were dead in sins, hath quickened us together with Christ, (by grace ye are saved; ) 6 And hath raised us up together, and made us sit together in heavenly places in Christ Jesus:

You don't think being quickened together with Christ (saved by grace) occurs as a result of being born again?

Spiritual Israelite · May 27, 2022

Fullness of the Gentiles said:
No, they can't, because resurrection implies the bodily resurrection from death, and this is the case with each and every New Testament verse talking about resurrection, without exception.

Notice the silence regarding the first four posts (the OP) of this topic. They seem to know they cannot produce anything to refute any of it.

Good grief, dude. Why didn't you allow for more time for some of us to respond before saying this? I have replied to several other posts in other threads before getting to this one. And I do have other things to do besides post here as well. I was planning to address part of your four long posts at some point and I've gotten around to doing that today. Your argument regarding the word anastasis doesn't apply to my particular view so that's why I only responded to what you said about the Greek word zao.

It's almost as though the terror they feel at the prospect of how that might cause them to interpret the resurrection mentioned in Revelation Chapter 20 has paralyzed them, and made them completely incapable of even trying to refute any of the facts or scriptures listed in the first four posts of this thread.

LOL. Get over yourself.

Timtofly · May 27, 2022

Spiritual Israelite said:
Ephesians 2:4 But God, who is rich in mercy, for his great love wherewith he loved us, 5 Even when we were dead in sins, hath quickened us together with Christ, (by grace ye are saved; ) 6 And hath raised us up together, and made us sit together in heavenly places in Christ Jesus:

You don't think being quickened together with Christ (saved by grace) occurs as a result of being born again?

Being born again is not a resurrection. "Again" is not indicative of a dead state. Being born indicates no prior state. You did not exist prior to you conception and birth physically.

Being born into the family of God, does not mean you were already a part of the family and just needed a resurrection. That is not how definitions work. Being resurrected means you already were part of God's family, but died.

If your spirit is dead, then it is not coming back. It is a demon, and unless you have a verse that claims demons can be resurrected from death, then your usage may seem innocent and reasonable. But if you realized the truth of how definitions worked, you would stop trying to force your doctrines into wrong conclusions.

Adam was a son of God. But does that really make you one? You claim one needs a spiritual birth, or even a resurrection. But the very need of birth, declares you are not a son of God until that birth. So you are not a resurrected son of God, but a new born son of God.

Now you can claim you are dead in sin, but what is that death really. I keep pointing out that it is physical death, but you keep avoiding that point. Even to the point of displinary action from a forum. Obviously that point seems to be the deep seated emotional trigger to some Amil in their refusal to see Amil is wrong. Pointing out truth should not be offensive, unless that truth sheds light on a deep seated deception that some cannot shake.

Adam did physically die the instant he disobeyed God. All human flesh needs a physical resurrection at the same point they need a spiritual birth. And at the point a human reaches that conclusion, and accepts the Atonement of the Cross, there is not a literal change. The acceptance of salvation is a removal of doubt and skepticism, not an outward change or instantly standing in God's presence. It is literally now my word against your word something happened.

Now you can declare certainly there is a connection between believers and like minded people. There is a sense of belonging. But that is still a well known human phenomenon. Paul points out that fruit is produced, which is also helpful. But most here tend to attack each other telling them what they are not, only to score a few logical points in defense of some human understanding.

Paul's promise of being seated in heavenly places is very much literal and real. The point is it happens after the soul leaves this dead flesh. It is immediate. There is still a separate physical body from a body of spirit. We are still a soul, body, and spirit in Paradise, just the same as a soul, body, and spirit on earth. No one has put on the spirit or as Paul puts it, put on immortality.

At the Second Coming the redeemed will finally experience that state of death for the last time. The soul will put on both the physical body and the spirit. The redeemed will be full and complete sons of God.

Spiritual Israelite · May 27, 2022

Timtofly said:
Being born again is not a resurrection.

I didn't say it was. Please try to pay attention to what is actually being discussed instead of making assumptions which make you look bad and make you look like you have no reading comprehension skills.

It was claimed that the word "quickened" is "not used in scripture regarding the concept of being born again". And I showed where it was used in scripture regarding the concept of being born again, if we understand being born again to be equivalent to being spiritually saved and being made spiritually alive in Christ.

Do you understand what I'm telling you? I was not making the claim that being born again is the same as being resurrected. Obviously, being born is not a case of going from being dead to being alive. I simply saw someone say something that isn't true and I corrected them. That's all.

"Again" is not indicative of a dead state. Being born indicates no prior state. You did not exist prior to you conception and birth physically.

Being born into the family of God, does not mean you were already a part of the family and just needed a resurrection. That is not how definitions work. Being resurrected means you already were part of God's family, but died.

If your spirit is dead, then it is not coming back. It is a demon, and unless you have a verse that claims demons can be resurrected from death, then your usage may seem innocent and reasonable. But if you realized the truth of how definitions worked, you would stop trying to force your doctrines into wrong conclusions.

Adam was a son of God. But does that really make you one? You claim one needs a spiritual birth, or even a resurrection. But the very need of birth, declares you are not a son of God until that birth. So you are not a resurrected son of God, but a new born son of God.

Now you can claim you are dead in sin, but what is that death really. I keep pointing out that it is physical death, but you keep avoiding that point. Even to the point of displinary action from a forum. Obviously that point seems to be the deep seated emotional trigger to some Amil in their refusal to see Amil is wrong. Pointing out truth should not be offensive, unless that truth sheds light on a deep seated deception that some cannot shake.

Adam did physically die the instant he disobeyed God. All human flesh needs a physical resurrection at the same point they need a spiritual birth. And at the point a human reaches that conclusion, and accepts the Atonement of the Cross, there is not a literal change. The acceptance of salvation is a removal of doubt and skepticism, not an outward change or instantly standing in God's presence. It is literally now my word against your word something happened.

Now you can declare certainly there is a connection between believers and like minded people. There is a sense of belonging. But that is still a well known human phenomenon. Paul points out that fruit is produced, which is also helpful. But most here tend to attack each other telling them what they are not, only to score a few logical points in defense of some human understanding.

Paul's promise of being seated in heavenly places is very much literal and real. The point is it happens after the soul leaves this dead flesh. It is immediate. There is still a separate physical body from a body of spirit. We are still a soul, body, and spirit in Paradise, just the same as a soul, body, and spirit on earth. No one has put on the spirit or as Paul puts it, put on immortality.

At the Second Coming the redeemed will finally experience that state of death for the last time. The soul will put on both the physical body and the spirit. The redeemed will be full and complete sons of God.

How much time did you spend saying all of that? You can't get that time back. It was a waste of time because I never even claimed that being born again is the same as being resurrected.

It's true that before we become saved and spiritually made alive in Christ we are spiritually dead in sins (Eph 2:1-6) and that's why some say that being born again is also a case of being resurrected, in a sense, but I'm not personally making that claim as far as claiming that the act of being born again is specifically the first resurrection. My claim is that Christ's resurrection itself is the first resurrection (Acts 26:23; 1 Cor 15:20,22; Col 1:18, Rev 1:5) and we have part in His resurrection spiritually when we become saved.

ewq1938 · May 27, 2022

Spiritual Israelite said:
Ephesians 2:4 But God, who is rich in mercy, for his great love wherewith he loved us, 5 Even when we were dead in sins, hath quickened us together with Christ, (by grace ye are saved; ) 6 And hath raised us up together, and made us sit together in heavenly places in Christ Jesus:

You don't think being quickened together with Christ (saved by grace) occurs as a result of being born again?

The issue is that a resurrection is a standing up again which is physical. Being born again is a spiritual change not a physical change.

Rev 20:6 Blessed and holy is he that hath part in the first resurrection: on such the second death hath no power, but they shall be priests of God and of Christ, and shall reign with him a thousand years.

That proves the first resurrection is not related to being born again but if the human body being raised back to life so it can stand again like rising from a seat.

G386
ἀνάστασις
anastasis
Thayer Definition:
1) a raising up, rising (e.g. from a seat)
2) a rising from the dead
2a) that of Christ
2b) that of all men at the end of this present age
2c) the resurrection of certain ones history who were restored to life (Heb_11:35)
Part of Speech: noun feminine
A Related Word by Thayer’s/Strong’s Number: from G450
Citing in TDNT: 1:371, 60

ewq1938 · May 27, 2022

Spiritual Israelite said:
My claim is that Christ's resurrection itself is the first resurrection (Acts 26:23; 1 Cor 15:20,22; Col 1:18, Rev 1:5) and we have part in His resurrection spiritually when we become saved.

Christ's resurrection is not what is being spoken about in Revelation 20 nor is it speaking of anyone being born again. Those people died for the testimony of Christ which means they were born again before being killed. The only resurrection left for them to take part in is the resurrection of the dead in Christ Paul wrote about. The Amillennial understanding here ignores all the facts and re-writes it in the image of Amillennialism. That doesn't match the text whatsoever.

Earburner · May 27, 2022

Spiritual Israelite said:
It's true that before we become saved and spiritually made alive in Christ we are spiritually dead in sins (Eph 2:1-6) and that's why some say that being born again is also a case of being resurrected, in a sense, but I'm not personally making that claim as far as claiming that the act of being born again is specifically the first resurrection. My claim is that Christ's resurrection itself is the first resurrection (Acts 26:23; 1 Cor 15:20,22; Col 1:18, Rev 1:5) and we have part in His resurrection spiritually when we become saved.

Amen! Being born again by His Holy Spirit is our salvation. Being bodily resurrected into immortality, is our redemption. It's a two stage process.

For all who are not born again in this life (have not the Spirit of Christ), it is impossible for them to be redeemed (changed into the likeness of Christ's immortality), when He shall appear the second time, in all His Glory from Heaven.

Many come to Christ for the forgiveness of sin, but neglect to openly receive the Gift of His Holy Spirit, which by the way, is the Promise that we ARE sealed unto the Day of redemption. Luke 11:13, Revelation 3:20.In essence, they have not made their calling and election sure.
2Pet.1[10] Wherefore the rather, brethren, give diligence to make your calling and election sure: for if ye do these things, ye shall never fall:

Eph.1[13] In whom ye also trusted, after that ye heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation: in whom also after that ye believed, ye were sealed with that holy Spirit of promise,
Eph.4[30] And grieve not the holy Spirit of God, whereby ye are sealed unto the day of redemption.
Edited: Luke 11:13

ewq1938 · May 27, 2022

Earburner said:
For all who are not born again in this life (have not the Spirit of Christ), it is impossible for them to be redeemed (changed into the likeness of Christ's immortality), when He shall appear the second time, in all His Glory from Heaven.

Can a person be born again after dying?

Earburner · May 27, 2022

ewq1938 said:
Christ's resurrection is not what is being spoken about in Revelation 20 nor is it speaking of anyone being born again. Those people died for the testimony of Christ which means they were born again before being killed. The only resurrection left for them to take part in is the resurrection of the dead in Christ Paul wrote about. The Amillennial understanding here ignores all the facts and re-writes it in the image of Amillennialism. That doesn't match the text whatsoever.

It is apparent that by your form of belief, you don't agree with Scripture that Jesus is "the Firstborn from the dead", and that it is He alone, who is "the first resurrection", because as He said:
"I AM THE resurrection".

However, if you are now Born again of His Spirit, you ARE a partaker of His "divine nature", and therefore you have taken part in the first resurrection, who is Jesus.

ewq1938 · May 27, 2022

Earburner said:
It is apparent that by your form of belief, you don't agree with Scripture that Jesus is "the Firstborn from the dead", and that it is He alone, who is "the first resurrection", because as He said:
"I AM THE resurrection".

No, I agree with that. The issue is the first resurrection of Revelation 20 is not him or his resurrection. It's the first of two resurrections of the dead.
His resurrection is how the first group of the dead is able to resurrect but they are a different "first resurrection", again being the first group to resurrect.

Jesus was the first singular resurrection.
The beheaded saints are the first group to resurrect.

Conflating them is the error you and your doctrine makes.

Earburner · May 27, 2022

ewq1938 said:
Can a person be born again after dying?

Such a situation is shown to be the case for the OT Saints of faith, who could not yet have the Holy Spirit abiding within them permanently. Because the blood of Christ was not yet shed, their sins were only forgiven, and had not yet been removed.
We see them being remembered by God in Malachi 3:16.
After Pentecost, we see those OT Saints of faith again, in Revelation 6:9-11. This time, they are "sealed" by the Gift of the Holy Spirit.
Let us not forget that an "altar" is a symbol for "remembrance".

Earburner · May 27, 2022

ewq1938 said:
No, I agree with that. The issue is the first resurrection of Revelation 20 is not him or his resurrection. It's the first of two resurrections of the dead.
His resurrection is how the first group of the dead is able to resurrect but they are a different "first resurrection", again being the first group to resurrect.

Jesus was the first singular resurrection.
The beheaded saints are the first group to resurrect.

Conflating them is the error you and your doctrine makes.

So therefore, you don't agree that "the power of His resurrection" is within you, whereby you have been made a "part-aker" of His "divine nature". 2 Peter 1:4.
You do realize that the Holy Spirit is the vehicle of His divine nature gifted to you, which is the power of His resurrection.
That power of His resurrection first must dwell within you, if you ever hope to be made physically immortal upon Christ's return.

A sad situation has been going on in the churches for two thousand years. Many have died in their "religion", having not the Spirit of Christ.
Take a look at this verse:
2Tim.3[5] Having a form of godliness, but denying the power thereof:
from such turn away.

The theological fallacy of a spiritual 'resurrection'

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