The TRUE Meaning Of The Little Horn Prophecy For the End

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Davy

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What results in Armageddon is that the world will see the sign of the Son of Man in heaven - which will be Jesus, sickle in hand. And the kings of the earth assemble their armies at Armageddon in hopes of keeping Jesus from executing judgment on them.
You definitely left... The Bible with that above idea.

The kings of the earth will be SHOCKED when Jesus appears coming in the clouds, just as all nations will be shocked too at His coming, AS WRITTEN. Where is that written folks? Help me out here, those of you who know your Bible. (I know, but I'm tired of spoon-feeding here.)
 

Davy

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Jesuit Francisco Ribera would like a word with you. He's the one who put together the whole idea of a "last 7 years of tribulation"in which the "future antichrist" would come and sit in a rebuilt temple "of God" and broker a peace "covenant" between the Arabs and Jews before breaking the covenant "in the middle of it" which results in Armageddon.

The whole idea was unknown to the world, as well as to the ECFs, until the 16th century:

Ha! You make me laugh with your FALSE theories from men! Futurism is just a seminary label a group of men came up with. They most often try to associate it with the false Pre-trib Rapture theory. They actually serve Satan by doing that, because their real aim is to try and get the Bible student off track from paying attention to Bible prophecy that is for the very end of this world. The idea of a coming Antichrist to Jerusalem is one of those Bible prophecies for the end. And it's the enemies of Christ who would want to hide Bible prophecy about that coming event.

When did Ribera live? The 16th century A.D. if I recall.


The following is by the early Church father Hippolytus that lived in the 2 century A.D.:

(Treatise On Christ and Antichrist, by Hippolytus of Rome)

6. Now, as our Lord Jesus Christ, who is also God, was prophesied of under the figure of a lion, on account of His royalty and glory, in the same way have the Scriptures also aforetime spoken of Antichrist as a lion, on account of his tyranny and violence. For the deceiver seeks to liken himself in all things to the Son of God. Christ is a lion, so Antichrist is also a lion; Christ is a king, so Antichrist is also a king. The Saviour was manifested as a lamb; so he too, in like manner, will appear as a lamb, though within he is a wolf. The Saviour came into the World in the circumcision, and he will come in the same manner. The Lord sent apostles among all the nations, and he in like manner will send false apostles. The Saviour gathered together the sheep that were scattered abroad, and he in like manner will bring together a people that is scattered abroad. The Lord gave a seal to those who believed on Him, and he will give one like manner. The Saviour appeared in the form of man, and he too will come in the form of a man. The Saviour raised up and showed His holy flesh like a temple, and he will raise a temple of stone in Jerusalem. And his seductive arts we shall exhibit in what follows. But for the present let us turn to the question in hand.

So how is it, that YOU say, Ribera is who began that idea about a future Antichrist, when Hippolytus in the 2nd century had taught about it per the above??

You simply have succumbed to false one's that are against many Bible prophecies that are for the very end of this world.
 
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Douggg

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The kings of the earth will be SHOCKED when Jesus appears coming in the clouds, just as all nations will be shocked too at His coming, AS WRITTEN. Where is that written folks?
Before Jesus comes in the clouds of heaven, the sign of the Son of man appears in heaven.

Matthew 24:30 And then shall appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven: and then shall all the tribes of the earth mourn, and they shall see the Son of man coming in the clouds of heaven with power and great glory.
 

Phoneman777

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If the Jesuits are the founders of the futurist view of eschatology, don't you think that at Jesuit sites there would be timeline charts of the final seven years before Jesus returns ?
Why are you questioning mverified history?

>Around 1520, the Protestant Reformers began universally preaching the papacy is the antichrist.
>Millions of catholic fled the catholic church and joined the Reformation.
>Around 1545, the papacy responded with the "Counter-Reformation".
>The Jesuits were charged with finding an alternative prophecy interpretation to exonerate them.
>Jesuit Alcazar and Jesuit Ribera introduced "Jesuit Preterism" and "Jesuit Futurism".

Instead of questioning historic fact, we ought question why so many await Jesuit Futurism's future antichrist.
 

Phoneman777

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Ha! You make me laugh with your FALSE theories from men! Futurism is just a seminary label a group of men came up with. They most often try to associate it with the false Pre-trib Rapture theory. They actually serve Satan by doing that, because their real aim is to try and get the Bible student off track from paying attention to Bible prophecy that is for the very end of this world. The idea of a coming Antichrist to Jerusalem is one of those Bible prophecies for the end. And it's the enemies of Christ who would want to hide Bible prophecy about that coming event.
You obviously didn't read the link.
When did Ribera live? The 16th century A.D. if I recall.


The following is by the early Church father Hippolytus that lived in the 2 century A.D.:

(Treatise On Christ and Antichrist, by Hippolytus of Rome)

6. Now, as our Lord Jesus Christ, who is also God, was prophesied of under the figure of a lion, on account of His royalty and glory, in the same way have the Scriptures also aforetime spoken of Antichrist as a lion, on account of his tyranny and violence. For the deceiver seeks to liken himself in all things to the Son of God. Christ is a lion, so Antichrist is also a lion; Christ is a king, so Antichrist is also a king. The Saviour was manifested as a lamb; so he too, in like manner, will appear as a lamb, though within he is a wolf. The Saviour came into the World in the circumcision, and he will come in the same manner. The Lord sent apostles among all the nations, and he in like manner will send false apostles. The Saviour gathered together the sheep that were scattered abroad, and he in like manner will bring together a people that is scattered abroad. The Lord gave a seal to those who believed on Him, and he will give one like manner. The Saviour appeared in the form of man, and he too will come in the form of a man. The Saviour raised up and showed His holy flesh like a temple, and he will raise a temple of stone in Jerusalem. And his seductive arts we shall exhibit in what follows. But for the present let us turn to the question in hand.
Davy, any fool who reads 2 Thessalonians 2 would write as Hippolytus wrote about an evil dude sitting in a rebuilt temple in Jerusalem.

This by itself does not constitute the warped lies of "Jesuit Futurism" - understand? More on this:
So how is it, that YOU say, Ribera is who began that idea about a future Antichrist, when Hippolytus in the 2nd century had taught about it per the above??

You simply have succumbed to false one's that are against many Bible prophecies that are for the very end of this world.
Before I show you from his own words Hippolytus was a Historicist, I'll show you what Jesuit Futurism teaches and that everything in red was unknown to him and everyone else prior to the 16th century:

>Earth's history will conclude with "7 years (or 3 1/2 years) of tribulation"
>At the beginning of Earth's final 7 years (or 3 1/2 years) an evil "antichrist" man will arise

>A one man "antichrist" will arise and sit in a rebuilt Jerusalem temple
>the Jewish sacrificial system will be set up again
>Antichrist will broker a 7 year "covenant of peace" between the Arabs and Jews
>He will break the covenant in the middle of it and suspend Jewish sacrifices
>Armageddon will break out because of this broken covenant
>Jesus returns in glory after the 7 years (or 3 1/2 years) tribulation


You got that, Davy? See how ridiculous it is for you to claim Hippolytus was Futurist? OK, now for proof that Hippolytus was Historicist:

On Christ and Antichrist:
“Tell me, blessed John, apostle and disciple of the Lord, what didst thou see and hear concerning Babylon? Arise and speak, for it (Pagan Rome) sent thee also into banishment”.
Got that? Hippolytus knew "Babylon" was "Pagan Rome" - not some "last 7 years" Antichrist!
The golden head of the image,” he says, “is identical with the lioness, by which the Babylonians were represented ; the shoulders and the arms of silver are the same with the bear, by which the Persians and Medes are meant ; the belly and thighs of brass are the leopard, by which the Greeks who ruled from Alexander onwards are intended ; the legs of iron are the dreadful and terrible beast, by which the Romans who hold the empire now are meant ; the toes of clay and iron are the ten horns which are to be;the one other little horn springing up in their midst is the antichrist ; the stone that smites the image and breaks it in pieces, and that filled the whole earth, is Christ, who comes from heaven and brings judgment on the world.”
Hippolytus followed the prophetic template of Daniel 2!
A striking illustration of this is the interpretation by Irenaus and Hippolytus of the mysterious number 666, the number of the revived head of the beast, or antichrist. Irenaus gives as its interpretation the word Latinos. He says : ” Latinos is the number 666, and it is a very probable (solution), this being the name of the last kingdom, for the LATINS are they who at present bear rule”. Hippolytus gives the same solution in his treatise on ” Christ and Antichrist.”
Got that, Davy? Both Irenaus and Hippolytus say the antichrist would be Roman - NOT JEWISH!
Davy, either show how the preceding proof that all the ECFs were Protestant Historicist or put away your Jesuit Futurist errors and embrace the truth.
 

Douggg

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Why are you questioning mverified history?
No Jesuit internet sites having timeline charts of the final seven years before Jesus returns - means false claim of Jesuits as originators of futurism.

What about Catholic timeline charts of the final seven years before Jesus returns, at their sites? Do you know of any ?

Futurism in a nutshell is about the final seven years before Jesus returns.

Here is my futurist timeline chart of the final seven years before Jesus returns.


horiziontal chart June 25, 2022 .jpg
 

Timtofly

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70 Weeks = 490 days...which you make "years" in order to stretch down from the king's decree to restore and rebuild Jerusalem to Messiah's first advent....but then insist the 2300 days are days only. Pretty inconsistent.
Not in the Hebrew. Not in the English translation. The Hebrew states 70 sets of either years or days. The Hebrew already has years built into the thought, in Daniel 9. Your 2300 is not a set of years in Hebrew, nor in English.

You change the 2300 days into years via your own human understanding.
 

Phoneman777

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No Jesuit internet sites having timeline charts of the final seven years before Jesus returns - means false claim of Jesuits as originators of futurism.
Here's a homework assignment for you:
Instead of searching 21st century internet sites for Jesuit timelines, try looking up the 16th century writings of Jesuit priest Francisco Ribera for detailed descriptions of what's now known as Jesuit Futurism.

Bonus question:
Check out 16th century writings of Jesuit priest Luis Alcazar for detailed descriptions of what's now known as Jesuit Preterism.

Extra credit:
Try to find anything that even remotely resembles these two 16th century Jesuit lies written down prior to the 16th century. BTW, the ECFs were solid Historicists:
 

Douggg

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Here's a homework assignment for you:
Instead of searching 21st century internet sites for Jesuit timelines, try looking up the 16th century writings of Jesuit priest Francisco Ribera for detailed descriptions of what's now known as Jesuit Futurism.

Bonus question:
Check out 16th century writings of Jesuit priest Luis Alcazar for detailed descriptions of what's now known as Jesuit Preterism.

Extra credit:
Try to find anything that even remotely resembles these two 16th century Jesuit lies written down prior to the 16th century. BTW, the ECFs were solid Historicists:
I tried that 15 years ago and many times since for a English translation of what Ribera in his words wrote (your claim, I have heard 20 years ago, and countless times), but there are not any. Instead, since you insist that Jesuits created the futurist view - then there should be countless Jesuits internet sites of the them presenting a 7 year timeline of events preceding Jesus's return. There should be charts that Jesuits present as well of that seven years.

I not only present charts of that 7 year timeframe, but also a breakdown of the verses in Ezekiel 39 that forms the framework of the 7 years. Present something from Ribera or Jesuits of that breakdown of the verses in Ezekiel 39.

Ezekiel 39 breakdown:

In Ezekiel 39, the destruction of Gog's army verses 1-6
In Ezekiel 39, then followed by 7 years verses 9-10 (the 70th week )
In Ezekiel 39, then the Armageddon event verses 17-20
In Ezekiel 39, then Jesus's return to this earth verses 21-29, His Second Coming
 

Phoneman777

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Not in the Hebrew. Not in the English translation. The Hebrew states 70 sets of either years or days. The Hebrew already has years built into the thought, in Daniel 9. Your 2300 is not a set of years in Hebrew, nor in English.

You change the 2300 days into years via your own human understanding.
Look, even a blind man can see the "day/year" principle of prophecy (Numbers 14:34 KJV; Ezekiel 4:6 KJV; Luke 13:32 KJV). He can also see that the 70 Weeks are 490 symbolic days for 490 literal years.

Anyone who correctly applies this principle to Daniel 9 but not to Daniel 8 simply doesn't understand how Bible prophecy works.
 

Phoneman777

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Then stop lying about me, since you don't even know what my thoughts are.
Look, either you believe antichrist came in the 1st century or will come in the last century.

Which is it?
 

Phoneman777

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I tried that 15 years ago and many times since for a English translation of what Ribera in his words wrote (your claim, I have heard 20 years ago, and countless times), but there are not any. Instead, since you insist that Jesuits created the futurist view - then there should be countless Jesuits internet sites of the them presenting a 7 year timeline of events preceding Jesus's return. There should be charts that Jesuits present as well of that seven years.

I not only present charts of that 7 year timeframe, but also a breakdown of the verses in Ezekiel 39 that forms the framework of the 7 years. Present something from Ribera or Jesuits of that breakdown of the verses in Ezekiel 39.

Ezekiel 39 breakdown:

In Ezekiel 39, the destruction of Gog's army verses 1-6
In Ezekiel 39, then followed by 7 years verses 9-10 (the 70th week )
In Ezekiel 39, then the Armageddon event verses 17-20
In Ezekiel 39, then Jesus's return to this earth verses 21-29, His Second Coming
Be honest...did you look any further than the internet?
 

Douggg

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Be honest...did you look any further than the internet?
No. Why would I ?

I just watched this interesting video. Starts off about muddying the waters. I think the speaker is right in his final conclusion at the end that we need to be focusing on what the bible says (he said that without presenting his own view) .

 

Timtofly

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Look, even a blind man can see the "day/year" principle of prophecy (Numbers 14:34 KJV; Ezekiel 4:6 KJV; Luke 13:32 KJV). He can also see that the 70 Weeks are 490 symbolic days for 490 literal years.

Anyone who correctly applies this principle to Daniel 9 but not to Daniel 8 simply doesn't understand how Bible prophecy works.
Or just understand Hebrew.

The day / year principle applies to double fulfillment prophecy, which you seem to post, but deny that is how you come across. You think there is a 2300 year period, but Daniel also points out that times, time, and half a time is 3500 years, without using the word day. 483 years got us barely to the 500 year mark. We have had 2 millenia since then, and 1 more to go.

I don't have to apply your double fulfillment to Daniel 9. Jesus does not die on the Cross 2 times, nor was there a second coming in the first century, that will happen again.

The word "day" is not found in Daniel 9, so what is your point? Even a blind person can see there is no day/year principle in Daniel 9. There is a year to week principle. Daniel points out the 70 year captivity in relationship to the 70 weeks.

"In the first year of his reign I Daniel understood by books the number of the years, whereof the word of the Lord came to Jeremiah the prophet, that he would accomplish seventy years in the desolations of Jerusalem."

Would you symbolize that number 70? That was 30 years longer than the 40 year punishment. But both numbers did not just pop into existence. The 40 years in the wilderness did represent the 40 days the spies were in the promised land. The 70 years covered the amount of Sabbath days missed. Did they only miss 70 literal days? So do you come up with your own symbolic reason, or do you stick with Scripture? I don't need man's day year principle, because I understand that from how God punishes His own people. I am not sure I need double fulfillment unless God gives a reason in Scripture why that would even happen. You don't even acknowledge that Hanukkah was the fulfillment of Daniel, yet you rely heavily on other historical facts.
 

Timtofly

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Look, either you believe antichrist came in the 1st century or will come in the last century.

Which is it?

Neither.

There are other options, like reading the actual Word of God, instead of human theology, based on an attempt at interpretation through the lense of history.

The little horn already happened, so I don't see that happening again, and neither is that thought articulated in the book of Revelation.

You seem to deny it was Antiochus Epiphanes. Last I checked Antiochus Epiphanes did not happen in the first century.

The ten horns in Revelation is not the ten toes of Daniel 2. The ten horns will be the aftermath of the 6th Seal, Second Coming. According to the 6th Seal not even the current nations that are powerful will be recognizable. All mountains and islands/continents will be moved out of their places. Even if you only symbolize that, it means all governments will be moved out of their places. No one will recognize earth after the 6th Seal. No one will be in spiritual blindness either.

Satan will use full blown deception, because all on earth will know and understand God, Jesus, and reality without any excuses. That is when the false christs, and many antichrists will arise, even ten charismatic leaders looking to lead their own kingdoms will be those ten horns attached to Satan like disciples. The closest thing to an AC will be what John calls a beast, which is the image brought to life. It will not be human, like every one claims. Because nothing John wrote in the book of Revelation describes a human antichrist. People cannot even place Jesus on the earth in the book of Revelation. Not sure why not.

It is like one arguing in the first century BC that Jesus would never be on the earth physically as the Messiah, because the prophets only talked about a Lamb, and Jesus is not a literal Lamb, so could never be on the earth, only the Lamb could come symbolically. All some see in Revelation is symbols, so the fact Jesus is actually on the earth eludes them.
 

Davy

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Before Jesus comes in the clouds of heaven, the sign of the Son of man appears in heaven.

Matthew 24:30 And then shall appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven: and then shall all the tribes of the earth mourn, and they shall see the Son of man coming in the clouds of heaven with power and great glory.
Don't be confused, the sign of The Son of Man appearing is... about Jesus coming in the clouds. That's the sign.
 

Davy

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I not only present charts of that 7 year timeframe, but also a breakdown of the verses in Ezekiel 39 that forms the framework of the 7 years. Present something from Ribera or Jesuits of that breakdown of the verses in Ezekiel 39.

Ezekiel 39 breakdown:

In Ezekiel 39, the destruction of Gog's army verses 1-6
In Ezekiel 39, then followed by 7 years verses 9-10 (the 70th week )
In Ezekiel 39, then the Armageddon event verses 17-20
In Ezekiel 39, then Jesus's return to this earth verses 21-29, His Second Coming

Your chart fails, because it does not align with God's written Word. The "day of the Lord" when the 1 Thess.5 "sudden destruction" event happens is ONLY on the final day of this present world, NOT... prior to the "great tribulation" like your false chart shows.

You're only applying 'pieces' of God's Word in a vain attempt to make it support man's false Pre-trib Rapture theory. Doing that is going to get you in big trouble with The LORD.


And the actual Ezekiel 39 chapter flow is this:

Ezekiel 39:1-8 = a continuation of description of the "day of the Lord" event of GOD's destruction of Magog army that comes out of the northern quarters upon Israel. This happens ONLY on the 'last day' of this world, on the "day of the Lord" that will come "as a thief in the night". That day is Christ's future return to earth.

Ezekiel 39:9-16 = the burying of the Magog army for seven months upon the mountains of Israel after that Magog army is destroyed by GOD's WRATH ON THE LAST DAY of this world, leaving only 1/6 of that army. This is all future MILLENIUM TIME AFTER Christ's return.

Ezekiel 39:17-21 = the supper of the Great GOD, of Revelation 19 on the day when Jesus returns, which will be the last day of this present world. God calls it His sacrifice. His consuming fire on that "day of the Lord" of 2 Peter 3:10 will accomplish this event. Thus the timeline here is back to the subject of the final battle of this present world on the last day, the "day of the Lord".

Ezekiel 39:22-29 = how the "house of Israel" (ten tribes only) will know on that day of destruction of Gog/Magog, that God had scattered the ten lost tribes because they rebelled against Him. The "heathen" (Gentile nations) will then also know that God did that to the ten tribe "house of Israel". So all this is FUTURE MILLENNIAL REIGN time by Lord Jesus Christ and His elect. That is when the ten tribes of the "house of Israel" AND the "house of Judah" will be gathered back to the holy lands. That phrase "whole house of Israel" is put for the two sticks of Ezekiel 37 being joined back together in the holy land. Until Jesus returns, the two sticks will remain apart, like it is today.

Therefore Brethren in Christ... God's Word is very easy to grasp when you actually know what The Scripture shows. If you listen to the clowns out there that try to change... what HIS WORD says as written, then you deserve to be deceived in these end times, because the Antichrist comes first as "strong delusion" before Lord Jesus returns to gather His Church. God will allow you to be deceived if that's what you want with listening to clowns that preach against His Word of Truth.
 
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Douggg

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Ezekiel 39:9-16 = the burying of the Magog army for seven years upon the mountains of Israel after that Magog army is destroyed by GOD's WRATH ON THE LAST DAY of this world, leaving only 1/6 of that army. This is all future MILLENIUM TIME AFTER Christ's return.
Read the text again.

The burying of Gog's army is not for seven years, but 7 months.

The burning of the weapons of Gog's army, instead of wood from the forests, is for 7 years.
 

Phoneman777

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No. Why would I ?

I just watched this interesting video. Starts off about muddying the waters. I think the speaker is right in his final conclusion at the end that we need to be focusing on what the bible says (he said that without presenting his own view) .

Oh, so if it's not on the internet, it doesn't exist.