The Two Witnesses Will Appear in the Next New Moon

[ewq1938]

They haven't died yet??

No. The beast who kills them isn't ruling yet either. Scripture says the two prophets are only dead for 3.5 days before publicly resurrecting together.

No person in the OT could have total forgiveness of sins, or ascend into heaven UNTIL the blood of Christ was shed.

That is false.

 

[ewq1938]

The ministry of John the Baptist and Jesus was a joint ministry. Therefore, the 1260 days of their ministry is totaled: 6 months for John and 3 years for Jesus, equalling 1260 days, or 42 months or 3.5 years

That doesn't match what we are told in Rev 11. The two prophets do not die years apart and they only have their ministry when the two beasts of Rev 13 have their time to rule, which hasn't happened yet.

 

[Gottservant]

Jesus said "five in one household will be against one another: the three against the two, and the two against the three"

If there were "two witnesses", and what Jesus said was true, shouldn't there be another "three witnesses"?

 

[Earburner]

No. The beast who kills them isn't ruling yet either. Scripture says the two prophets are only dead for 3.5 days before publicly resurrecting together.

Actually, the 10H beast is the 4th beast of Dan., which was the Rom. Emp., wounded to death by a sword, and is now evolved into the 1st beast of Rev.

It has been ruling for awhile now, in the form of a Global Economic Empire, of which no military empire can make war against it.

In these past 100 years, the 10H beast is only now coming into it's final manifestation, along with that of the 2H Beast, and the image of the 10H beast.

That "10H Beast"** (a.), the 2H "another beast" (b.) and the "Image of the beast" (c.) are ALL now speaking with their voices together.
a. EU (banking elite) WEF.
b. US/NATO.
c. The UN and the WEF.
**Note: the 10 individual kingdoms with the beast have not been acquired or appointed yet.

The words in Rev. are signified/coded and are in symbolic form. They are not to be understood literally, but rather spiritually, by the Lord's Spirit. Zech. 4:6.
As a result, in their manifestations on earth, they will have a similarity of likeness to the prophecies, but will be fully void of religious overtones by any denominational persuasion.

 

[ewq1938]

Actually, the 10H beast is the 4th beast of Dan., which was the Rom. Emp.,

The 4th beast of Daniel is destroyed by fire at the Coming of God so it cannot be the Roman empire.

wounded to death by a sword, and is now evolved into the 1st beast of Rev.

Dan 4th beast does not "evolve" into another beast in any part of Daniels writings. What John wrote about the 10h beast does not match Daniels 10h beast anyways. It's a mistake to try to blend them together.

 

[Earburner]

The 4th beast of Daniel is destroyed by fire at the Coming of God so it cannot be the Roman empire

Evidently you skipped class for Ancient History. But that's okay, because the Jews wrote about it in 1&2 Maccabees, when Antiochus Epiphanes lV, of the Seleucid Empire (Grecian-3rd beast) was "the little horn". You know....the guy who actually committed the "abomination that maketh desolate", that Jesus spoke of.

Here is a clue: 1&2 Maccabees is literal history about the temple in Jerusalem, but when Jesus spoke of it, guess Who was the OTHER "Temple"? KJV John 2:19-23.

Now, if you want to see who committed THAT "abomination that maketh desolate", go to Proverbs 6:16-19 about the 7th abomination, which is actually #3 on God's "original" list of 6 abominations, but then interjected with the 7th.
Now compare that with KJV Mat. 27:17-25.

YES! the mortal body of God's Son being destroyed, was an abomination unto God His Father, who was within Him, until Jesus cried out on the cross at that time: "Father, why hast thou forsaken me?"
Yes! God actually left His Son, to bare the sins of the whole world, alone. BtW, you do realize that God the Father and God the Son, for all Eternity past, had NEVER been separated. Think on that for a bit, and the enormity of the sacrifice of both God the Father and the Son!

Don't you see? The "abomination that maketh desolate" is already past. It happened to Jesus, in the temple of His mortal body.

Some of church-ianty have it all wrong.
To God, WE EACH ARE that pearl of Great Price!

In fact, they have quite alot more wrong also. Why? They are studying the Bible by the wisdom of men, and not by the mind of Christ that is within them. 1 Cor. 2:5.

 

[ewq1938]

Evidently you skipped class for Ancient History.

You are just side stepping the facts in my post. Try again, but address the issue. "The 4th beast of Daniel is destroyed by fire at the Coming of God so it cannot be the Roman empire"

 

[Earburner]

No. The beast who kills them isn't ruling yet either. Scripture says the two prophets are only dead for 3.5 days before publicly resurrecting together.




That is false.

Israel under the OC (Malachi 3:16) were written in the book of Remembrance, until Jesus' first manifestation in the flesh, and the shedding of His blood.
The total forgiveness of sin is for EVERY person, who put their faith in the Messiah to come (OC.) and those of us who believe under the NC, through His second manifestation by His Spirit, since Pentecost.

As for the OC. Saints, who waited for "the Promise to come", they are shown as being under the Altar. Though they had died in faith believing (Malachi 3:16), God did not forget them, and on Pentecost, God gave to each of them the Gift of His Holy Spirit (white robes), which is the vehicle of Eternal Life, because the shed blood of Christ applied to them ALSO, and are NOW written in "the Book of Life", who is Jesus. Rev. 6:9-11

We all together are now still waiting for Jesus' third manifestation from Heaven, in the Glory of His Eternal Immortality

Jesus is:
Rom.8[29] For whom he did foreknow, he also did predestinate to be conformed to the image of his Son, that he might be the firstborn among many brethren.
Col.1
[15] Who is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn of every creature:
[18] And he is the head of the body, the church: who is the beginning, the firstborn from the dead; that in all things he might have the preeminence.
Heb.12
[23] To the general assembly and church of the firstborn, which are written in heaven, and to God the Judge of all, and to the spirits of just men made perfect,

 

[Earburner]

You are just side stepping the facts in my post. Try again, but address the issue. "The 4th beast of Daniel is destroyed by fire at the Coming of God so it cannot be the Roman empire"

I am not side stepping anything. Ancient history reveals that the beginning of the Roman Empire, was established by Romulus in 753 BC, known at that time as the Roman Kingdom, aka the 4th beast having 10 horns, in Daniel.

King of Rome - Wikipedia

en.m.wikipedia.org

The little horn, named Antiochus Epiphanes (who was in "the latter time of their kingdom" of the 3rd beast-Greece), rose up to power in 175 BC, while the 4th beast with 10 horns* was still evolving into it's formation of the Roman Empire.
*Note- to this day, the 10 horns have still not yet been manifested, of which we now know that they don't come to be, until just before the Lord returns.

Read 1 Maccabees and the Jewish account of their history, in the time period of Antiochus Epiphanes, the Romans and Israel's Prince Judas Maccabeus of Israel.
In the background, you will hear and see all the details of that era, in conjunction with reading God's prophetic words from
KJV Daniel, which was written in approx. 535-540 BC.

Antiochus IV Epiphanes - Wikipedia

en.m.wikipedia.org

Judas Maccabeus - Wikipedia

en.m.wikipedia.org

 

[ewq1938]

I am not side stepping anything.

How can it be the Roman Empire when the coming of God is what destroys it? Also, how are the first 3 beast empires still "alive" after the 4th is destroyed? Nothing matches the text if the 4th beast was Rome.

 

[Earburner]

How can it be the Roman Empire when the coming of God is what destroys it? Also, how are the first 3 beast empires still "alive" after the 4th is destroyed? Nothing matches the text if the 4th beast was Rome.

The Roman Empire was wounded to death but it never died. The statue like image of Neb's dream reveals that it split in two and became the two legs of iron. It became the two separate empires, known as the Eastern Empire and the Western Empires. One evolved into Europe, and the other evolved into the Papacy of the RCC. Today, they are still with us, being the feet and ten toes, partly iron and partly clay.
Dan. 2:31-45

 

[ewq1938]

The Roman Empire was wounded to death but it never died.

No, it like all other former empires did fall and is gone. The coming of God in Daniel does not defeat the Romans nor do 3 empires that came before the Romans continue to exist. Daniel says the first 3 beasts live on past the 4th beast's destruction.

You don't address any of these issues but rather just continue on sharing your beliefs. Ignoring the problems won't get you anywhere.

 

[Earburner]

No, it like all other former empires did fall and is gone. The coming of God in Daniel does not defeat the Romans nor do 3 empires that came before the Romans continue to exist. Daniel says the first 3 beasts live on past the 4th beast's destruction.

You don't address any of these issues but rather just continue on sharing your beliefs. Ignoring the problems won't get you anywhere.

You need to examine Daniel 7:3-7......

Daniel 7
[3] And four great beasts came up from the sea, diverse one from another.
[4] The first was like a lion, and had eagle's wings: I beheld till the wings thereof were plucked, and it was lifted up from the earth, and made stand upon the feet as a man, and a man's heart was given to it.
[5] And behold another beast, a second, like to a bear, and it raised up itself on one side, and it had three ribs in the mouth of it between the teeth of it: and they said thus unto it, Arise, devour much flesh.
[6] After this I beheld, and lo another [third], like a leopard, which had upon the back of it four wings of a fowl; the beast had also four heads; and dominion was given to it.
[7] After this I saw in the night visions, and behold a fourth beast, dreadful and terrible, and strong exceedingly; and it had great iron teeth: it devoured and brake in pieces, and stamped the residue with the feet of it: and it was diverse from all the beasts that were before it; and it had ten horns.

....In comparison, to see the characteristics of all four beasts in Daniel, being in the FIRST beast of Rev. 13:1-2

Rev. 13
[1] And I stood upon the sand of the sea, and saw a beast rise up out of the sea, having seven heads and ten horns, and upon his horns ten crowns, and upon his heads the name of blasphemy.
[2] And the beast which I saw was like unto a leopard, and his feet were as the feet of a bear, and his mouth as the mouth of a lion: and the dragon gave him his power, and his seat, and great authority.

Remember, the ten horns have NOT been manifested in the world YET!!
Rev. 17
[12] And the ten horns which thou sawest are ten kings, which have received no kingdom as yet; but receive power as kings one hour with the beast.

Edit: the remnants of all four beasts are incorporated into the FIRST beast of Rev. 13, which are people and governments, that are no longer world ruling.
We are still waiting for it's manifestation in the world. The sure thing of it's identification will be that it shall appoint and secure ten militaristic countries to protect itself from both the kingdoms of men, and the return of the Lord.

"The mark of the beast" is economic.
We are waiting for the beast to evolve into its final manifestation, being the beast that literally and finally has appointed and secured ten VISIBLE countries to do it's bidding.
It will be a Global Economic Empire, that has no military of it's own, whatsoever.

 

[Jay Ross]

It seems to me that few on this forum have read Jeremaih 50 where he tells us that Babylon will be made desolate and be devastated for two ages.

The devastation and the desolation ended in 1926 as prophesied in Rev 16:17-21, the Seventh Bowl Judgement.

Since the Roman Empire as such did not exercise any prominent global dominance until around 60 BC when the Grecian influence on the world stage wanned, some 60 years or so after Babylon was desolated and devastated by the Sicilian Greek Empire in the east.

As such the Roman Empire held no dominion over the Land of Babylon at any time.

The reformation fathers introduced the false argument against the Roman Catholic Church that they were the fourth beast and the fourth segment of the Daniel 2 Statue prophecy.

The continuing of the claim that the Roman Empire was the two legs of the Daniel 2 Statue prophecy and that the fifth segment, i.e., the feet, of this same statue was the Revived Roman Empire is quite simply wrong.

Oh well, why let the actual facts get in the way of a good story.

 

[ewq1938]

You need to examine Daniel 7:3-7......

You don't address any of these issues but rather just continue on sharing your beliefs. Ignoring the problems won't get you anywhere.

"No, it like all other former empires did fall and is gone. The coming of God in Daniel does not defeat the Romans nor do 3 empires that came before the Romans continue to exist. Daniel says the first 3 beasts live on past the 4th beast's destruction."

 

[Earburner]

You don't address any of these issues but rather just continue on sharing your beliefs. Ignoring the problems won't get you anywhere.

"No, it like all other former empires did fall and is gone. The coming of God in Daniel does not defeat the Romans nor do 3 empires that came before the Romans continue to exist. Daniel says the first 3 beasts live on past the 4th beast's destruction."

Actually no, it is the 4th beast of Daniel that has 10 horns, of which was the Roman Empire. It's coming into existence began in 753 BC. as the "Roman Kingdom" under Romulus, 195 years before Daniel prophesied about it, having 10Hs. It didn't come into the fulness of being the Roman Empire until 23 BC.

Revelation points out that the 10H beast, originally being the Roman Empire, though wounded to death, it never died, but morphed and evolved into a more subtle empire, and remained alive incognito, aka, "the beast that was, and is not, and yet is".

The clear explanation of the statue/image in Daniel, is of the feet and ten toes of iron and clay, being that of Europe as well as that of the Roman Papacy over the Roman Catholic Church.

Who here wants to deny the existence of the Roman Empire being divided into the Eastern Roman Empire and the Western Roman empire??

We are now waiting for the final manifestation of the Beast with 10Hs, of which shall emerge as a Global Economic Empire, which is the 8th head, being OF [from among] THE 7 heads, seeking to appoint and secure 10 visible countries to do it's bidding.
Rev. 13:14, 13:3, 17:8.

Europe is still with us, and so is the Roman Papacy. BUT...they will not be a revived Roman Empire.
The Global Economic Empire, will arise from the "Banking Elite", of which originated from out of Europe, which is where the Roman Empire dispersed into.

 

[ewq1938]

Actually no, it is the 4th beast of Daniel that has 10 horns, of which was the Roman Empire.

You still avoid addressing the problems I have brought up. I'm not going to read your red herrings.

 

[Earburner]

It seems to me that few on this forum have read Jeremaih 50 where he tells us that Babylon will be made desolate and be devastated for two ages.

The devastation and the desolation ended in 1926 as prophesied in Rev 16:17-21, the Seventh Bowl Judgement.

Since the Roman Empire as such did not exercise any prominent global dominance until around 60 BC when the Grecian influence on the world stage wanned, some 60 years or so after Babylon was desolated and devastated by the Sicilian Greek Empire in the east.

As such the Roman Empire held no dominion over the Land of Babylon at any time.

The reformation fathers introduced the false argument against the Roman Catholic Church that they were the fourth beast and the fourth segment of the Daniel 2 Statue prophecy.

The continuing of the claim that the Roman Empire was the two legs of the Daniel 2 Statue prophecy and that the fifth segment, i.e., the feet, of this same statue was the Revived Roman Empire is quite simply wrong.

Oh well, why let the actual facts get in the way of a good story.

My focus is not on the empire of Babylon, but rather the beginning of the 4th beast of Daniel, which at that time was the "Roman Kingdom". The Roman Empire didn't come to be until 23 BC.

 

[Earburner]

You still avoid addressing the problems I have brought up. I'm not going to read your red herrings.

What problems?
Sorry, but I may not be seeing them, if you are not making them clear and specific enough.

I am not saying that there will be a literal revived Roman Empire. I am saying what scripture is pointing to:
Revelation points out that the 10H beast, originally being the Roman Empire, though wounded to death, it never died, but morphed and evolved into a more subtle empire, and remained alive incognito, aka, "the beast that was, and is not, and yet is".

The ten horns have been prophetically spoken of for approx. 2,600 years, yet not once do they ever appear as being manifested in the world, except for a brief time, just before Jesus returns from Heaven. The tens horns are still future.

 

[Earburner]

You still avoid addressing the problems I have brought up. I'm not going to read your red herrings.

Red herrings? That's too bad, but it's your loss, because while the "banking elite" have fomented the Russian- Ukraine war, as a distraction, and have agitated China to go after Taiwan, they are making ready the "mark of the beast" (CBDC-Digital money) for AFTER WW3- Rev. 9:13-21.
The world has already just gone through the "scorpion sting", Rev. 9:1-12.