The United States of Evil

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tarmack09

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American people that know the real Truth definitely... are NOT... crying for Socialism. The reason today's economy is in the slump it's in is because of... Socialist type policies, causing the disappearance of a middle class structure. Socialism = a rich ruler class vs. a poor class, nothing in between. Like the old saying about Communist-Socialism: "An equal amount of poverty for all."

Your Opinions are very biased and one sided. For Christ sake you still think Hitler was a real socialist! I view Hitler as a mad man type capitalist. I guess you didn't understand what I meant when I said "Time Share Event" on 9/11. No whats causing the disappearance of a middle class structure is people not willing to work with one another! An Equal amount of poverty for all? That sounds like Captialism on its knees. For instance basket ball manufacturer Spalding, everyone contributes to that one manufacturer and the teams that use the balls can notice the difference and they are better for it. In a capitalist system you get all kinds of chaos! The teams would be using all kinds of different balls not knowing where they came from.

Free-market capitalism doesn't breed fascism, Socialism does, as shown even by your OWN words in bold. Socialism = two classes, a ruling class of the rich, and a poor class, the EXACT principle and design of Marxist Socialism.

Didn't you realize that's why Hitler and the Soviets used the word 'Socialist' in their party definitions? (Hitler's 'Nationalist SOCIALIST party', and the Soviet Communist's 'United Soviet SOCIALIST Republic'). Apparently, today's Socialist bent public school systems from the Socialist John Dewey's design forgot to teach people like you about that!

Stop trying to push that button. No socialism became what some people view as fascist when Stalin had placed an order to kill Nazi collaborators. This was After WWII began and After Hitler Invaded most of Poland. Hitler had already broken his pack before WWII Started. Even sitting US President Ted Roosevelt said Stalin was a good man. I believe the same thing as him. This pack that Hitler broke was, Economical, Financial, Military everything. Full Invasion of Poland. Look all I'm saying is Americans cant survive without socialism. So I guess you are the type of person that believes everything they read. Of course Hitler would make everyone believe he is a socialist! The more for us attitude.

You're still talking about Socialism, not Free-Market Capitalism. Under a Free Enterprise system, the many Socialist-Marxist type policies in place in today's system would not be allowed!!! Government would not be allowed to own and operate businesses, which is essentially what the rich Socialists have been getting the government to do, even bail them out by stealing from the people using their powers to sway their political coherts in power in government! That's exactly... how a Socialist system works. Under Marxist-Socialism, the government has power and control WITH the corporations, both in bed together serving each other! Under a free-market system the government has only certain financial powers per the U.S. Constitution, and all other powers belong in the hands of the states and its peoples!

Hey if you know exactly where there is a "Free Market System" let me know about it cause I haven't seen one yet. If haven't Noticed I kinda have been looking! Small Business go under so fast in America its not even funny man! I feel like moving sometimes. China can build a brand new 30-40 story building in 15 days times!

Socialist public school systems do a great job today teaching history I see. Mussolini's politics were the idol of Hitler. You probably didn't know they were allies either.

Wrong again! It started with the clock and then the Watchmen! Then the Watchmen started to watch man which then created Fascism, secret cults, Greed, Lust, a thirst for power. Hitler only believed that "White Germans" were the only race that was pure in the world. His alliences were purely political. They even called Russians Dogs sometimes.

If you really knew your history, you'd have realized that Hitler and Stalin were allies together just prior to Hitler's invasion of Poland that kicked off WWII. They even signed a pact together at the beginning. Also, the Soviets were not the ones doing all the Allied bombing of Hitler's Germany. It was the U.S. and Britain that did most of the bombing. The Soviets didn't even have much of an air force at that time.

A little Lesson on doing Research:

Primary Source - first person source, someone who actually saw and lived through events to tell about it.

Secondary Source - someone who researches info from a Primary source, and then gives their own opinion about it.

Tertiary Source - third removed from a Primary source; opinion of an opinion from a Secondary source.

Most history books written today are so far removed from the Tertiary source level that it's become a whole other 'history'. This operation is called 'Revisionist History' when the far-removed source material is so steeped in opinion built upon opinions that it departs from the facts of a Primary Source that actually experienced the events.

So go ahead, keep buying those Time-Life history book club rip-offs written by some super-professor at Harvard, Princeton, etc. Even the History Channel is guilty of doing some of the history rip-off Revisionist stuff, just for entertainment. Oh yeah, to some people history is supposed to be like fictional entertainment!!! Welcome to George Orwell's 'Newspeak'.

Ok I don't know what the hell you are talking about here? Are you saying that Russia didn't have an industrial revolution before the Nazi's invaded? You my friend are an uneducated Mad Man!!

One of these days you all are going to start understanding that the ONLY just type of ruling system that can exist is a Monarchy type government, the very one that Christ Jesus is going to bring when He returns. All else is just rubbish of men's politics in seeing who can be the most selfish.

Hitler and the Marxists BOTH used the principles of Socialism for a BIG reason. It was an easy way to get POWER over the people and put their thumb upon the peoples! And what did it produce? With Nazi Germany it brought desctruction upon themselves. With the Soviet system it brought death, destruction, and starvation on major scales, constant starvation and lack of even the basic necessities!

Moreover, Socialism does not... work economically. When the fruit of people's labors is stolen from them, which is what Socialism does, it removes the incentive to work. Everyone gets lazy because why work harder if it going to be taken from you and given to those who refuse to work? This was even PROVEN with the early Pilgrims when they first came to the new world.

What is truly a show of ignorance, and of a puppet mentality, are those who latch their hitch to the Socialist type leaders which have NO INTENTION of letting 'you' rule with them once YOU have helped them to come to power! Oh how they love it when you get so duped as to heed their plans and help them promote it for takeover!

So you are one of those fru fru hail to the Queen types too huh?? No one should feel duped for believing in socialism. Its only a different type of economical system. Its nothing to be afraid of. What you should be afraid of is Nazi collaborators. The people literally sinning under gods eyes.. the ones that take take take and never give back! Not because they don't know any better but because they don't want to!!
 

veteran

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Your Opinions are very biased and one sided.

You bet they are, because I'm a real Christian believer, not some milly-mouthed want-a-be that doesn't know their left from their right.


For Christ sake you still think Hitler was a real socialist! I view Hitler as a mad man type capitalist.

I see you as others here are duped also! Whether one calls what Hitler practiced as Socialism or not isn't the point. It's what others... believe it to be and represent that matters, otherwise he would not have been able to dupe the German people. Just so happens, Hitler's Socialism came from the same philosophical principles where Karl Marx got his, from Hegelian philosophy. But we now really know he was ONLY using those ideas as a 'tool', right? Or are you still duped? Socialism is anti-capitalism, so you need to get what side you're gonna' follow straight, because there's only two actual political sides, one for Satan, and the other for God through His Son. So which one do you follow? (Every hear of the work 'The Occult And The Third Reich'? Might want to look into what else Hitler's regime was into).


I guess you didn't understand what I meant when I said "Time Share Event" on 9/11. No whats causing the disappearance of a middle class structure is people not willing to work with one another!

More dupeness I see. What kind of idealism do you think leads people towards not wanting to work together? It sure ain't Christian principles and value systems per God's Word. Socialism IS... Communism. Little difference between the two idealisms. Socialism promotes laziness by stealing the people's wealth, taking their incentive away to be productive. Then incentive has to be replaced by something else; under Communism incentive was replaced with the point of a gun by those in power, and the people still wouldn't work together, but were under constant fear of punishment by their own government rulers, and often to point where they'd willingly deliver up even a family member to the party system. That's the kind of system that the "one world government" hosts plan to exercise over the earth.


An Equal amount of poverty for all? That sounds like Captialism on its knees.

Under Socialism, people seek handouts because they're free, just like what's been happening with those who abuse welfare, simply because they're too lazy to work. God's Word says if a man won't work, then let that man not eat. Capitalism is about a free-market enterprise system, DETACHED from a bunch of government officials that want to have control over eveything and everybody, telling you what to eat, what to think, what to wear, what kind of car to drive, how many babies you can have, just like Socialists love to do.


For instance basket ball manufacturer Spalding, everyone contributes to that one manufacturer and the teams that use the balls can notice the difference and they are better for it. In a capitalist system you get all kinds of chaos! The teams would be using all kinds of different balls not knowing where they came from.

News flash. Spalding ain't... the only basketball manufacterer. Under a Socialist system, the Socialist government selects one basketball manufacterer, and puts the rest of the manufacterers out of buisness, then joins in with the decisions of that one manufacterer, essentially controlling the business and the market and the people. Costs then go sky high all of sudden because the basketball manufacterer can no longer make a profit because of government controls over who they can hire and fire, allowing union strikes to drive up company wage debts, and then the government must begin taking other peoples' money to give to the basketball manufacterer because after all, it's the only one left existing, and can't let it go down, even though it has to operate at a loss because the people are no longer productive because they all get the same whether they work harder or not. That's Socialism.

Under Capitalism, the basketball manufacterer must compete with other basketball manufacterers, so it MUST make a profit to stay in business. If it cannot, then it must seek other avenues for profit, like making footballs instead or other sports items. It does that by helping to keep their employees educated and creative, coming up with new ideas to help the company, promoting innovativeness, rewards for doing a good job and working hard, vs. penalties for laziness. It then becomes a self-sufficient profitable enterprise producing a product which the people want and buy, and is then able to do community projects to help the local peoples where the business is located, and maybe even offer public shares of stock so the people can join in its success and profitability.

But under Socialism, the government gives huge monetary handouts to politica official's pet industries that are not profitable, like Obama's half a billion dollar give-a-way to a solar panel manufacterer that went BANKRUPT! No one will ever see that money again!


Stop trying to push that button. No socialism became what some people view as fascist when Stalin had placed an order to kill Nazi collaborators. This was After WWII began and After Hitler Invaded most of Poland. Hitler had already broken his pack before WWII Started. Even sitting US President Ted Roosevelt said Stalin was a good man. I believe the same thing as him.

Ted Roosevelt wasn't President of the U.S. during WWII. And the rest of what you've said isn't any more accurate that Ted Roosevelt statement. What was that you said about buttons?


So I guess you are the type of person that believes everything they read. Of course Hitler would make everyone believe he is a socialist! The more for us attitude.

Hitler was a Socialist. So was Franklin Delanore Roosevelt, which is most likely why he called Joseph Stalin by the pet name "uncle Joe". Lot of my history comes from study of Primary sources, along with Secondary and later sources which everyone else like myself must also learn to discern. But you're sources, I don't have a clue about, since it taught you that Teddy Roosevelt was U.S. President during WWII.


Hey if you know exactly where there is a "Free Market System" let me know about it cause I haven't seen one yet. If haven't Noticed I kinda have been looking! Small Business go under so fast in America its not even funny man! I feel like moving sometimes. China can build a brand new 30-40 story building in 15 days times!

And you probably won't ever... see one, since we're in the last days with the "one world government" hosts who follow Communist-Socialist goals are trying to make all... nations follow World Socialism. But God's people through His Son Jesus Christ will... see a future Free-Market style system on this earth, when Jesus returns to TAKE control over this earth. As written in God's Word for then, His people shall not build and another inhabit, they shall not plant and another eat. They will long enjoy the work of their hands. Won't be any Communist-Socialists there to try and take it away either.


Wrong again! It started with the clock and then the Watchmen! Then the Watchmen started to watch man which then created Fascism, secret cults, Greed, Lust, a thirst for power. Hitler only believed that "White Germans" were the only race that was pure in the world. His alliences were purely political. They even called Russians Dogs sometimes.

No wonder you know so little about history with ideas like those.

Ok I don't know what the hell you are talking about here? Are you saying that Russia didn't have an industrial revolution before the Nazi's invaded? You my friend are an uneducated Mad Man!!

A little education... about Nazi-Soviet relations in 1939 for... Mad Hatters!

http://www.johndclare.net/RoadtoWWII8.htm
 

Strat

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MR ROSENBERGER and Strat you must remember that in a sucessfull socialist country everyone is working together for the greater good. If America were to adobt this behavior it would work wonders for the community! Their wouldn't be any poverty in a socialist country! Everyone would share the wealth with their friends and neighbors.

Strat you are right in saying that Americans are turning into Isolationists that don't want to leave their homes. Also you're correct capitalism is evil when left in the wrong hands.


How would you enforce this behaviour other than taking people's property and money by force which would in turn destroy all incentive...you say there wouldn't be any poverty in a socialist country as if the only cause of poverty is a lack of money,poverty is also caused by people's choices in habits and lifestyle...are you going to tell an entire population that if they want to work,create,invent and contribute great because we need your money...or if you want to sit home and drink beer all day,smoke dope and make out of wedlock babies thats fine to we will send you a check....it won't work...it isn't working now.....modern man is seeking to create a utopia where all negative consequences that God has put in place to regulate people'...modern man says we will do neither and bes lives are done away with...God has always put this choice before man,obey me and be blessed,disobey me and be cursed...modern man says we will ignore you altogether and be blessed anyway...it will not work.
 

tarmack09

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Veteran..What I meant to say is that he was a sitting president in the past. Oh and you also forgot to mention the great depression when you were talking about the Free Market System. What people like you forget about Veteran is that Europe and Russia had huge battles in the past over Lake Peipus. This also might have contributed to the problems with Hitler. ICE ICE BABY...ANYONE!! As for reading that thanks..but no thanks. What you can teach me is to laugh a little less at you..Thanks though.
 

veteran

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Veteran..What I meant to say is that he was a sitting president in the past. Oh and you also forgot to mention the great depression when you were talking about the Free Market System. What people like you forget about Veteran is that Europe and Russia had huge battles in the past over Lake Peipus. This also might have contributed to the problems with Hitler. ICE ICE BABY...ANYONE!! As for reading that thanks..but no thanks. What you can teach me is to laugh a little less at you..Thanks though.

You're so blind as to what's happening in the real world, debating with you is like having a fight with a one-armed man.
 

tarmack09

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You're so blind as to what's happening in the real world, debating with you is like having a fight with a one-armed man.

So I'm just a one piece to you? You know what.. I can tell the way this conversation is headed so I'm just going to have to end it here...Just remember the great depression was not caused by China..or Mexico, or even Iran... It was caused by Americans like you veteran. We did it to ourselves with poorly run government and a poorly run military budget!
 

aspen

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You're so blind as to what's happening in the real world, debating with you is like having a fight with a one-armed man.

HEY! I resent that! My mom is a one-armed man!
 

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Sounds like this thread is turning into Pro-Islamic, Pro-Communist propaganda against the USA and its Christian nation allies.

At closer look at the terrorists and rebels involved in Panama, Nicaragua, Iran, Iraq, Afghanistan, Libya, Chile, etc., which caused nations like the U.S. and Britain to get involved will reveal how those nations have been helped by Communist states like Russia, i.e., enemies of the USA.

Since you mention 'closer looks', lets have one or two, shall we?

I don't think the thread is becoming pro-Islamic or pro-communist at all. Quite the contrary those political groups have not been examined in detail and for good reason. Most of the writing is from Americans who are unhappy with the direction our nation is taking. The future doesn't look good for us. Nobody cares about improving Islam or Communism (except you-know-who in DC).

I for one care more about drug dealing in my own neighborhood than the slaughter of thousands in Syria. I'm not really happy about either, but I'm most frustrated about my town. So I focus on the conditions I'm most familiar with and the nation I grew up in, work in and live in and am increasingly frustrated with. I think a lot of folks feel the same way. A lot of people are finally waking up and what they see is making them very nervous. Nervous. Nervous. Do you know which industry is growing the fastest these days. Bang bang the private arms business. Gun makers can't make guns fast enough for private sales. America is waking up and we are very nervous. Will Obama take credit for increased jobs in the gun business? <grin> You know he won't...gee whiz why?

Terrorists and rebels? What about them? The contras in Nicaragua were recruited, armed and trained by the CIA. They were mercenary death squads whose sole object was to overthrow the Communist Sandanistas. The whole thing was illegal but in spite of a specific law passed by congress to forbid such covert actions it went on anyway. In the end the Sandanistas won by default and are still in power albeit much changed from the days of 1979 when they first walked in. Thousands died because of American sponsored terrorism.

How about al qaeda and the taliban? Do you remember what nation created them? By created I mean recruited, trained, equipped and guided into their murderous goals. If you guessed the United States you guessed right. The Afghan mujahideen were the parents of the modern groups which our infamous leaders are trying to persuade us need to be killed. How about Libya? Since you mention it, did you know that members of al qaeda were part of the 'rebel' groups that overthrew Moamar gadhafi? US Senator John McCain was even quoted as calling them 'heroes' in the conflict.

Tell me if I get this wrong, ok? In 2001, we were told that al qaeda were the bad guys. In 2011, we're told they're heroes. I'm writing this in 2012 and I think they're bad guys again. Not sure, but I think so.....maybe...the year is young yet.

Then there was Iraq. Oh yes, we had to invade because they had WMD's and an affiliation with al qaeda or the taliban or Ronald McDonald or somebody. We all know now that the whole thing was a pack of lies. America goes to war why? It's ok to believe a lie and to kill people and destroy the lives of folks who've done nothing to us because of lies. American lies.

I was in Chile by the way for the party with marxist president Allende. My military team supported a group of Navy seals who went in to do a little mischief with explosives. The American government only supports fascist dictators because its easier to bribe one man or group of men than to try to influence a parliament or entire nation. We won that one, by the way. Hoo Rah for our side. More innocent deaths, but what the hey they weren't Americans so why worry.

Lets bring it home for one last verse of the popular song 'What's Wrong With America'. Let's keep it simple too and put it right in everybody's face.

Do you love God? Do you know Jesus? Does your faith mean anything to you? It probably means a lot. It does to me.
I am first an foremost a Christian and an American last. That means that if I put things like truth, life, kindness to others, etc. on a high scale it pretty much looks like America is falling short. How short?

In the front of most American churches the American flag is displayed. Its displayed to its own right if I read flag etiquette correctly. That means the American flag is displayed to the left of all other symbols, stage right if your in front of the sanctuary looking out toward the congregation. The cross is in the middle of most Protestant churches. That's where the crucifix is in Catholic houses of worship. On the other side may be displayed the church flag.

Does symbolism mean anything to the reader at this point? The American flag is just a striped piece of cloth, but its a symbol of our nation and there's a lot of meaning to it. Still following me are you? The cross is just a piece of wood or bronze or other material. The cross means something too. It means a lot more than any flag and that's saying a lot. It's meaning is more than a particular congregation or church or denomination. It stands for the very salvation and person of God.

Where do these symbols stand in relation to one another in our churches? The American flag is in the position of superiority and the cross is to its left - a position of lower importance. If symbolism means anything it means that America is bigger and better than God. It means that every church recognizes that God is a vassal of the United States. Maybe we've seen this so much that we don't think about it any more, but I guarantee that the next time you look at this arrangement in church you'll think about it. Is it right? These are only symbols and they don't mean anything. Or do they?

Bottom line is that Americans love the proud new fascist police state we've created. God is an object of ridicule and scorn as are things like morality and truth. Wisdom, always a rare thing more precious than gold, is nowhere to be found in our land. If any of us pretend to love the truth and Jesus and what Christianity is all about we cannot love what is happening in America today. We cannot make excuses and we cannot simply sit on the side lines. Christianity is not a spectator sport.

But that's just me, hollering from the choir loft...
 

veteran

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Since you mention 'closer looks', lets have one or two, shall we?

I don't think the thread is becoming pro-Islamic or pro-communist at all. Quite the contrary those political groups have not been examined in detail and for good reason. Most of the writing is from Americans who are unhappy with the direction our nation is taking. The future doesn't look good for us. Nobody cares about improving Islam or Communism (except you-know-who in DC).

Your rant is without knowledge.

A look at previous documentation by the House Committee on UnAmerican Activities reveals all kinds of evidence for Communist subversion in the U.S., and among its allies. And not only there, but documentation can also be found in Congressional Records for the same, especially in the eras of the 1950's and 1960's.
 

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Choir Loft
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Your rant is without knowledge.

A look at previous documentation by the House Committee on UnAmerican Activities reveals all kinds of evidence for Communist subversion in the U.S., and among its allies. And not only there, but documentation can also be found in Congressional Records for the same, especially in the eras of the 1950's and 1960's.

The current year is 2012, not 1960. My comments are addressing current events, not past ones. If, however, you wish to dwell in the past how about this........

You are partially correct in your statements about communist activity and subversion in the United States during the twenty year period you cite; 1950 - 1970. I say partially because the Congressional Record does indeed state this fact. After the dissolution of the Soviet Union in 1989 information leaked out from KGB sources that Communist activity in the United States was WORSE than suspected or documented including the Congressional source you quote. But American communism isn't the same as the Russian version. More on that later.

I know folks who once lived in Nicaragua during the days of the rise of the Sandanistas. In 1979 or thereabouts the communist Sandanistas, named for a leader in the 1920's who botched a communist uprising, assumed control of the Nicaraguan government. The American CIA responded by illegally establishing mercenary death squads called the contras. Despite a law passed by congress which expressly forbade the activity, these roaming bands of killers embarked on a campaign of murder and terror in an effort to remove the Sandanistas from power. It failed. The communists are still there to this day.

Despite all this, my friends tell me that the communists are liars. They promise the world and give the people nothing. In fact, they were instrumental in destroying most of the factories that had been established in that country. Nicaraguan factories were mostly cottage industries, small community enterprises built by the middle class that employed one or two dozen people at most. The communists promised land and work to those who were too poor or too lazy to acquire it for themselves. In that, the communists were immensely successful. They nationalized the factories and displaced the middle class. The capitalists, my friends tell me, were grasping fascist money grabbers but could be depended upon to throw the people a bone now and then. The Sandanistas did no such thing. The communists lie. They always have.

Previously I stated that American communism isn't the same as the Russian or central american versions. In the 1930's Joseph Stalin criticized the American Communist party by accusing them of a form of American exceptionalism. Some believe that Stalin was the one who created the phrase now bandied about in debates and discussions about the modern American narcissistic view of itself. The bottom line here is that American communism and American fascism like the American version of democracy is similar, but not identical to the classic definitions of those political systems. We make all things, including politics, in our own image. It is that image which is corrupt in 2012.

The basic communist ideology that the wealth of the middle class must be seized and redistributed among the poor and disenfranchised (and the lazy and the criminal) has been modified slightly (only slightly) and accepted as gospel among the American political progressive left. The most prominent figure of these folk is George Soros a one time resident of communist lands. Hungary, I believe. The most prominent political figure of course is Mr. Obama a former resident of lands which are still in dispute (Indonesia <- communist ???). The bottom line, at least from every source I've read, is that communism as a formal entity in America (established in 1919) is little more than a shadowy nuisance in the political spectrum.

The communist part as a formal entity isn't effective in the United States in 2012. Why should it be? The basic ideology of international communism has been adopted and promoted by the American political progressive left - the formal, accepted and dare I say respected political body in America.

Veteran - You consistently and constantly proclaim the danger of communism. In that you do well. I believe you may find that we agree on major points. The issue I have is that communism isn't taken seriously in America today despite the fact that its principle ideology has become an accepted part of the American political dialogue. Americans today are politically illiterate and as a result do not understand the root source of the things they believe. May I suggest you alter your argument slightly to embrace the morphing of communist ideology into popular American politics. The current danger is far more serious than reiteration of subversion in the 1950s.

America today is a fascist police state.

Far from becoming communized in the historical sense, I believe we have already succumbed to much of traditional communist ideology so as to support and justify the raiding of American private middle class wealth. It isn't communism per se, its communist buzz words that are used as smoke and mirrors to hide the machinations of the greatest fascist government to ever rule the planet, Washington DC.

Like a well trained and experienced magician, American oligarchs use communist ideals like smoke and mirrors to hide fascist policy. When the smoke clears and when the mirrors are all broken the citizens of this country will suddenly realize that they are prisoners in their own country and that nothing on earth can save them.

but that's just me, hollering from the choir loft...

PS
The contras live! Mercenary death squads organized and trained much like those who operated in the central american jungles in the 1980s are killing and maiming in Syria. They are providing the justification for the removal of Assad from power there. Old tactics - new country. Same old, same old.
 

veteran

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The current year is 2012, not 1960. My comments are addressing current events, not past ones. If, however, you wish to dwell in the past how about this........

You are partially correct in your statements about communist activity and subversion in the United States during the twenty year period you cite; 1950 - 1970. I say partially because the Congressional Record does indeed state this fact. After the dissolution of the Soviet Union in 1989 information leaked out from KGB sources that Communist activity in the United States was WORSE than suspected or documented including the Congressional source you quote. But American communism isn't the same as the Russian version. More on that later.

I am more than partially correct, as Communist subversion in the U.S. is STILL going on. A few Communist agents have been uncovered working in high U.S. government positions even after... the Berlin Wall had come down. Does Robert Hanson ring a bell?

David Barnett (Soviet spy - 1980)
David Sheldon Boone (spy for KGB - 1999)
Christopher John Boyce (spy for Soviets - 1974)
William Kampiles (spied for Soviets - 1978)
Andrew Dalton Lee (spied for Soviets -1976)
Clayton J. Lonetree (spied for Soviets - 1987)
Harold James Nicholson (spied for Russian - 1996)
Ronald Pelton (spied for Soviets - 1986)
Earl Edward Pitts (spied for Soviets and Russia - 1996)
Jonathan Pollar (spied for state of Israel - 1985)
Sharon Scranage (spied for Ghana - 1985)
Robert Hanson (spied for Soviets and Russia - arrested in 2001)
Stewart Nozette (attempted to spie for Israel - 2009)

That's just a public list. There's probably even more since the 1960's.


The Communist ideology in Stalin's days is the same... Communist ideology today. The only thing that changed was after Stalin died, the Russian Communists were determined to change his reign of terror because of how it had given Communism a bad name. So they came up with their long-range strategy of disinformation against the West, called the New Economic Policy (NEP). That strategy against the West is STILL... in effect for today. They are not going to stop their plans for a "one world government" to create a one-Socialist world.

Shame on all those who support it.
 

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Choir Loft
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I am more than partially correct, as Communist subversion in the U.S. is STILL going on. A few Communist agents have been uncovered working in high U.S. government positions even after... the Berlin Wall had come down. Does Robert Hanson ring a bell?

David Barnett (Soviet spy - 1980)
David Sheldon Boone (spy for KGB - 1999)
Christopher John Boyce (spy for Soviets - 1974)
William Kampiles (spied for Soviets - 1978)
Andrew Dalton Lee (spied for Soviets -1976)
Clayton J. Lonetree (spied for Soviets - 1987)
Harold James Nicholson (spied for Russian - 1996)
Ronald Pelton (spied for Soviets - 1986)
Earl Edward Pitts (spied for Soviets and Russia - 1996)
Jonathan Pollar (spied for state of Israel - 1985)
Sharon Scranage (spied for Ghana - 1985)
Robert Hanson (spied for Soviets and Russia - arrested in 2001)
Stewart Nozette (attempted to spie for Israel - 2009)

That's just a public list. There's probably even more since the 1960's.


The Communist ideology in Stalin's days is the same... Communist ideology today. The only thing that changed was after Stalin died, the Russian Communists were determined to change his reign of terror because of how it had given Communism a bad name. So they came up with their long-range strategy of disinformation against the West, called the New Economic Policy (NEP). That strategy against the West is STILL... in effect for today. They are not going to stop their plans for a "one world government" to create a one-Socialist world.

Shame on all those who support it.

Veteran: If I consider your words and the words of my friends from Nicaragua I think we can agree on one point.

All communists are liars.

Building on that premise shouldn't be too difficult, unless of course the casual reader of these posts is predisposed to fantasy.

it's me, hollering from the choir loft...
 

mandygirl

New Member
Aug 15, 2012
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Texas
i really dont like someone refering to our country as evil as it is disrespectful to our troops. i know we make mistakes but we are not evil.
 

Strat

Member
Mar 25, 2012
784
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One thing Christians seem to do universally when complaining about the world and its condition...they forget that the world is not Christian...because if it were they wouldn't have anything to complain about....can't judge a Chicken by an Eagle's standards.
 

us2are1

Son Of Man
Sep 14, 2011
895
26
0
i really dont like someone refering to our country as evil as it is disrespectful to our troops. i know we make mistakes but we are not evil.

The United States Of America is no more evil than the rest of the world but they will all fall and not get up. all of their armies and troops will be slain.

Isaiah 34
1 Come near, you nations, to hear; And heed, you people! Let the earth hear, and all that is in it, The world and all things that come forth from it. 2 For the indignation of the Lord is against all nations, And His fury against all their armies; He has utterly destroyed them, He has given them over to the slaughter. 3 Also their slain shall be thrown out; Their stench shall rise from their corpses, And the mountains shall be melted with their blood.



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MTPockets

New Member
Aug 4, 2012
155
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Hi! '[email protected]'

I've read your Comments throughout this Thread and I wanted to shout HURRAY! At least we have someone willing to put everything at risk to speak the truth.

Ours is a time when the evil one is entering into a frenzied mimetic rivalry with God, “because he knoweth that he hath but a short time”.
We are living in an age of "AFRAIDS".
We all know of course that AIDS is the abbreviation for 'Acquired Immune Deficiency Syndrome'.
Spiritually speaking, there is also something which I name as "AFRAIDS" ... that is: 'A Factor Related [to an] Acquired Immune Deficiency [of the human] Spirit'.

We are a generation that has been fastidiously trained from a very early age to believe our own propaganda.
When my generation was growing up, we became aware about how power corrupts. But in this present day, we are witnessing the corrupt seeking power.
When we began to attend a community church years ago, we became concerned with the unfaithful falsehoods being uttered by those wearing the garb of clergy.
But presently, we are witness to spiritual sociopaths who traffic in disturbing news and pass on destructive prophetic rumors; falsifying information which damages and injures the “hidden man of the heart”.

It has always been a difficult task to come against the domination system. We are always coming up against an ideology which is more anxious to be right than in doing right. Truth is the thing that is really hated. Those who are transfixed on the counterfeit reality expose their secret need for enemies because they inadvertently disclose a preoccupation with superiority. Previously, cultural Christianity was busy with devaluing evil doers. Today, their ideologies have horribly matured and people are busy to dehumanize an entire people or race. No longer content with merely separating themselves from evil doers, they now demand to completely eradicate them. When people suppress the truth and worship the domination system, they succumb to darkened minds and folly and become overwhelmed by a sense of induced powerlessness. So it is that people live within a lie. In most cases, it is not as if the multitudes happily accept the delusionary web; rather, it is that they have accepted their life with it and in it. They unwittingly confirm the lie, fulfill the lie and ultimately become the lie.

The domination system is by its very nature in a permanent crisis of legitimization. Because its captive to its own lies, it must falsify everything. It pretends to pretend nothing. Because it is so utterly foreign to the composite of man, it became an artificial amalgam held together through violence. This is why falsehood and delusion are so essential to it.

Not surprisingly, transparent spiritual truths are the most hateful of all to the lovers of lies. Delusion possesses nothing more than the power which we confer on it; its powers of persuasion are limited only by the measure of our own acquiescence and complicity. The strength of the powers behind the domination system are never more determinative than when they constrain us invisibly; when they exert their power by extracting genuine being (life) from the dominated. The body, soul and spirit of humankind are being torn, ripped, shredded, ravaged and exhausted by entanglement with the web of deceit which upholds the domination system. The counterfeit reality’s atmosphere is spirit killing; teaching us not only what to believe but also what we can value and what we can see.

I have learned that spiritual eyes are the indispensable precondition to our healing. We need eyes that see the invisible if we are ever to escape the delusions of the domination system ... the counterfeit reality. After all, the powers only have whatever persuasive power which our blindness allows them. And, I have learned too that we must “redeem the time” and overcome our sense of powerlessness and recognize it for the killing spiritual disease it is; of how we were deliberately induced by the counterfeit reality which keeps us complicit in our own spiritual alienation. The defeat of the powers occurs by dying to their control; by dying out from under its jurisdiction and command. Therefore, with the unmasking of our oppressors, there must also be a healing of the servile will in the victims. If the rich young ruler of the Bible narrative must die to his egocentricity, then Nicodemus too must die to his hopelessness, fatalism and acquiescence to his own despoiling.

Ours is a time too of increasing falsehoods which are buried under many layers of doctrinal confusion and stiffened by decades of ideology and politics. It has always been a difficult task to come against cultural Christianity’s fraudulent gospel. We are living in a time when the invisible things from out of the kingdom of darkness are becoming visible on the earth. This could be named a ‘counterfeit reality’; "Having a form of godliness but denying its power", (2Tim 3:5), "evil men and impostors will grow worse and worse, deceiving and being deceived", (v13). The combining of the Israeli Zionist groups with the Evangelical Christian groups has produced what has been named the ‘Armageddon Alliance’. The counterfeit reality is becoming increasingly evidenced and, in particular, masquerading as an Israel ‘after the flesh’ and, as such, “shall shew great signs and wonders; insomuch that, if [it were] possible, they shall deceive the very elect”. So it is that yet another delusion known as the ‘Hebraic Perspective’ is being feverishly embraced today by countless Christians. While it is true (for instance) that Hal Lindsay’s Apocalyptic Dispensationalism theology during the 1970’s proved to blind the cultural church, (just as Darby and Scofield before him), the ‘Hebraic Perspective’ theology is something much more insidious and harmful.

Like vultures eager for their carrion, the cultural church feeds on every new cognitive dissonance. A people kept ignorant of reality will by default believe in falsehoods. People seem to be much more emotionally committed to ideologies as opposed to what we once knew as the ‘doctrines of the ancestors’. When both the eternal and temporal things become horribly twisted into a single strand, the predominant emotive fabric of a person’s consciousness becomes all the more hardened and threatening. Ideology is always more anxious to be right than in doing right; focused more on the ambition to succeed rather than with the call to faithfulness; more preoccupied with producing results than seeing the invisible. In these days we are confronting intransigent ideologies which are even more insidious and difficult to unveil.

Previously, the ‘doctrines of the ancestors’ were busy with devaluing evil doers. Today, ideologies have people busy to dehumanize an entire people or race. While Jesus taught the love of enemies, the ideologues of today encourage their extermination. No longer content with merely separating themselves from evil doers, they now demand to completely eradicate them. Those who are transfixed on the counterfeit reality expose their secret need for enemies because they inadvertently disclose a preoccupation with superiority, (Mark 7:3-5).

The acclaimed teachers of today have supplanted awakening with destroying and purification with annihilation. This is exactly the same sentiment of redemptive violence which ushered in the Crusades of earlier times. None of the false prophets of today can conceive their God as also being the God of those who may differ with them. While the unanswered question prior the Reformation was, “How can I find a gracious God?”, the question sadly remaining unanswered in these days is, “How can I find God in my enemies?”.

The counterfeit reality comes into being by those who seek to grasp the “substance of things unseen” with hands of flesh. The counterfeit reality’s atmosphere is spirit killing; teaching us not only what to believe but also what we can value and what we can see. Since the incident in the Garden of Eden there is the tragic history of the body, soul and spirit of humankind being torn, ripped, shredded, ravaged and exhausted by entanglement with the web of deceit which upholds the counterfeit reality. In my opinion, the goal of the antichrist has always been to import a counterfeit mirror image of the “substance of things unseen” into the visible realm. When this counterfeit has completely developed on the earth (fully manifested to mimic the invisible kingdom of god), we are then entering Armageddon. In other words, the spirit of antichrist is the instrument by which the genuine purposes and intents of God become manifested as a counterfeit on the earth.

Visible things are the nutrient of the counterfeit reality and form the ideologies which serve to confirm it. It is the visible things which construct the false center of the world and which serve to spiritually imprison humanity. Yet, the counterfeit reality could not exist if it were not for the undergirding of blinding ideologies. It is not for nothing that the Bible names the Devil as the ‘god of this world’; meaning to say, the controlling agent of the visible dimension and its ‘domination system’.

Even at the time of Jesus, the Romans were a model of lucidity with the domination system. While they did not worship the seated emperor, they were not shy of worshiping the ‘spirituality’ which inspired the ruler. Jesus perceived this counterfeit reality, (“all the kingdoms of the world, and the glory of them”), and refused to succumb to the temptation of having a position in it. The Bible speaks of another incident “when Jesus therefore perceived that they would come and take him by force, to make him a king, he departed again into a mountain himself alone”. “For what shall it profit a man, if he may gain the whole world (kosmos/system), and forfeit his life?”; “My kingdom (basileia) is not of this world (kosmos/system): if my kingdom were of this world, then would my servants fight, that I should not be delivered to the Jews: but now is my kingdom not from hence”.

Domination is significantly more than a power relation; it is a spiritual state of being. While fear forms its visible chains, shame and rejection are its invisible chains. The result is that which compels a human sense of spiritual insignificance; an internalized oppression which deprives one of godly worth and esteem. “For we wrestle not against flesh and blood (human foes), but against principalities (cosmic powers), against powers (authorities), against the rulers (potentates) of the darkness of this world (age), against spiritual wickedness in high places (invisible realm)”. What we are talking about here is of a struggle to the death for recognition. One does not merely desire the other, but forcibly desires to be desired by the other. It is this compulsive desire to be desired that has the evil powers sharing their consuming lies from the very beginnings. The strength of these powers is never more determinative than when they constrain us invisibly; when they exert their power by extracting genuine being (life) from the dominated.

When the Bible speaks of “principalities and powers”, it is speaking of the economic, political and cultural institutions which give form to the counterfeit reality. We need to perceive a distinct difference between the “principalities and powers” and the “rulers of darkness” and that of “spiritual wickedness”. While the principalities and powers speak of the influences affecting the visible dimension of our existence (outer), the rulers of darkness and spiritual wickedness speak of the influence affecting the invisible dimension (inner). While “powers of the air” speak to a collective manifestation of evil which permeates the counterfeit reality, the spiritual wickedness speaks to a deeper and more destructive evil; a layer of sludge beneath the murky waters, a hellish hatred of light and truth, a brute lust for violence and annihilation.

The body, soul and spirit of humankind are torn, ripped, shredded, ravaged and exhausted by entanglement with this deceitful reality. When Paul speaks of a life lived “according to the flesh”, he is speaking of a life subordinated to a counterfeit reality; a life subjugated to the inauthentic values which form the domination system. It is the carnal mind which seeks complicity with the “powers of this age”; “Behold, they [are] all vanity; their works [are] nothing: their molten images [are] wind and confusion”. While the faithful are imprisoned for their faith, the unfaithful are imprisoned by their faith. We note throughout the Book of Revelation the refrain: the Beast was allowed to exercise authority; was allowed to make war; was given authority; is allowed to perform miracles; is allowed to make the image of the first Beast speak. Delusion possesses nothing more than the power which we confer on it; its powers of persuasion are limited only by the measure of our own acquiescence and complicity.

“Beware lest any man spoil you through philosophy and vain deceit, after the tradition of men, after the rudiments of the world, and not after Christ”. The counterfeit reality is by its very nature in a permanent crisis of legitimization. Because its captive to its own lies, it must falsify everything. It pretends to pretend nothing. Because it is so utterly foreign to the composite of man, (“no so from the beginning”), it is an artificial amalgam held together through violence. This is why falsehood and delusion are so essential to it. When people suppress the truth and worship the created things, (counterfeit reality), they succumb to darkened minds and folly; become overwhelmed by a sense of induced powerlessness. So it is that people live within a lie. In most cases, it is not as if the multitudes happily accept the delusionary web; rather, it is that they have accepted their life with it and in it. They unwittingly confirm the lie, fulfill the lie and ultimately become the lie. Our triumph over the domination system occurs as we overcome the “present evil epoch” (aion) who “has blinded the minds of the unbelievers, to keep them from seeing the light of the gospel of the glory of Christ”. In this sense, we “redeem the time”, (Col 4:5). The wonderful testimony of our gospel is not that it is a convincing substitute for the counterfeit reality; rather, it is in its being hated by it. Thus, our gospel has no need of salesmanship because genuine reality is eager to confirm it.

Paul wrote, “Be not conformed to this world: but be ye transformed by the renewing of your mind, that ye may prove what [is] that good, and acceptable, and perfect, will of God”. Spiritual eyes are the indispensable precondition to our healing. We need eyes that see the invisible if we are ever to escape the delusions of the counterfeit reality. After all, the enemy only has whatever persuasive power which our unbelief (blindness) allows him. We must therefore “redeem the time” and overcome our sense of powerlessness and recognize it for the killing spiritual disease it is; of how we were deliberately induced by the counterfeit reality which keeps us complicit in our own alienation. The defeat of the powers occurs by dying to their control; by dying out from under its jurisdiction and command. So it is that, with the unmasking of our oppressors, there must also be a healing of the servile will in the victims. “Wherefore if ye be dead with Christ from the rudiments of the world, why, as though living in the world, are ye subject to ordinances?” If the rich young ruler must die to his egocentricity, then Nicodemus too must die to his hopelessness, fatalism and acquiescence to his own despoiling. Even those whose lives have been stolen from them must lose their lives to find them; they must die to what killed them. I am not speaking here of those who are preoccupied with the delusional practice of dying to ego. Rather, I am speaking of dying to the powers which hold us captive and subservient to the counterfeit reality.

After the Fall, the weeds (“sons of the gods”) began to be sown. The resulting atmosphere of the ‘domination system’ is subsequently described as “corrupt before God”. The ‘domination system’ caused the earth to be “filled with violence through them”. While the weeds were maturing in his midst as “mighty men which [were] of old, men of renown”, Noah remained busy with things centered on that which was producing a “plant of renown”. While the ‘domination system’ was producing weeds which manifested themselves as “every imagination of the thoughts of his heart [was] only evil continually", Noah “found grace in the eyes of the Lord”. At the time of Noah’s Flood, it was said, “the wickedness of man [was] great in the earth, and [that] every imagination of the thoughts of his heart [was] only evil continually”. The domination system had full sway; evil had become a contagion. Noah had refused to participate with the counterfeit realities of the domination system and as such it is said of him that he “walked with God”.

To Noah it was said, "Be fruitful, and multiply, and replenish the earth" (Gen 9:1); but then we read later of people saying, "Let us make us a name lest we be scattered abroad upon the face of the whole earth", (Gen 11:4). Only eight people descended from the Ark. Those people worshipped God. But at some point an influential person became opposed to God and gathered others to his side. The evidence points to Nimrod as the one who did it. Cain had done similarly before the Flood, founding a new city and importing a counterfeit reality; the domination system. Nimrod’s descendents were the ones who began building the tower in Babel. It is the spirit of the antichrist which counterfeits the ‘Gate of God’ with Babylon’s domination system, (social structure and economic organization). Violence always animates the very thing it opposes. Murder calls forth murder and an entire chain of slaughter is the consequence; which even today we see the war machine celebrated and haloed by memorials and parades. It is the religion of Cain which lends the lie which depicts the only good and perfect God as engaging in violence. It is the counterfeit reality which argues that God is inherently violent; that God is the angry and aggrieved party who must be placated by blood sacrifice. It is not God who must be appeased, but humans which must be delivered from their hatred of God’s creation laws. It is Cain who initiates the counterfeit reality; for he pretends to be able to bring about by his own temporal means the eternal purposes of God. Jesus said, “No servant can serve two masters: for either he will hate the one, and love the other; or else he will hold to the one, and despise the other. Ye cannot serve God and mammon (‘the domination system’)”.

Cain as a wanderer builds a city. Spiritually, Cain abandons the opportunity to live after the “substance of things unseen” and proceeds to build a counterfeit reality, an earthly city. His city will be his protection, as well as the iron instruments which his descendents will forge. All of this is placed under the sign that Cain chooses. He calls both his son and his city "Enoch," which means "initiation". Cain lays down his beginning which opposes the one which God had decided for him; a reality closed to God’s order. Because Cain was busy with the domination system, we should not be surprised by the violence which instigated the murder of Abel. (“… Cain, who was of that wicked one, and slew his brother”, (1John 3:12). Every place the sons of Ham went, ‘divine kingship’ was established. In Mesopotamia, Cush (or Kish) was the founder; in Egypt, Mizraim. In Canaan, named for one of Ham's sons, it follows that ‘divine’ kings controlled the city-states. In those kingdoms, religion was the cultural ‘opiate of the people’. It was used by rulers to bind the people's highest loyalties to themselves. So there was plenty of pomp and circumstance, special feast days and rituals during the year to support the counterfeit reality which they controlled. Cain’s language is no longer the same as Adam's before the Fall. He no longer speaks as by the extension of his Creator’s words. While Adam’s position was one of dominion, Cain speaks from out a relationship of domination. He begins to rule the visible reality by instruments of domination rather than love. It is the spirit of antichrist which builds the “city of blood”, Nineveh; which enshrines Asher’s illustrious power and which venerates the wisdom of Nabu.

The Bible says that, “when the fullness of the time was come”, the “tender plant” of Jesus, (Isaiah 53:2) was ‘planted’ in the field. But simultaneous to the appearance of the “tender plant”, the weeds were already in the process of being “gathered to be burned”. The Old Testament speaks at length about how it was that “noble plants” degenerated into “strange vines” while the New Testament speaks about the planting of a “tender plant”. Over the centuries, the bounty of the antichrist was already becoming evident, (as described in Deut 28:15-31). This is the reason that John could plainly say, “This is that [spirit] of antichrist, whereof ye have heard that it should come; and even now already is it in the world”. The spirit of the antichrist was already producing weeds (a counterfeit species) long before; centuries before. Jeremiah had already spoken of this many years earlier saying, “Yet I had planted thee a noble vine, wholly a right seed: how then art thou turned into the degenerate plant of a strange vine unto me?” Similarly, the scripture reads, “I will raise up for them a plant of renown, and they shall be no more consumed with hunger in the land, neither bear the shame of the heathen any more. Then the heathen that are left round about you shall know that I the Lord build the ruined [places, and] plant that that was desolate: I the Lord have spoken [it], and I will do [it]”.

So it is that weeds (counterfeit species) have been sown throughout the generations but the wheat was once again planted with the birth of Jesus. Concerning the “strange vines”, Jesus declared, “Every plant which my heavenly Father hath not planted, shall be rooted up”. For example: the weeds were sown as “children of the wicked one” but, at the time when they are completely bundled to be burned, they have become mature “sons of perdition”. (“Can a man take fire in his bosom, and his clothes not be burned?”). In the same manner, the wheat was planted as “children of God” but, at the time of their appearance “in clouds of glory”, they have become mature “sons of God”. (“… thy soul shall live, and this city shall not be burned with fire; and thou shalt live, and thine house”).

While the wheat is preoccupied with the “substance of things unseen”, the weeds are nurtured by falsehoods fixed on the things which are visible.

In other words, the kingdom of darkness supplants reality through a counterfeit reality with the domination system at its core. This domination system has its tangible temples and commandments and symbols demanding obedience. Thus, the “weeds” have their false hopes manifested in the same reality with which they are preoccupied (earth) while the wheat have their hopes manifested in the invisible dimension (heavens). In a way it could be paraphrased as, ‘For where your treasure is manifested reveals your reality also’. Therefore, it should not surprise us that the cultural (unfaithful) church has as its primary centerpiece the visible temples and visible symbols in a visible Israel. This will continue and with even greater intensity as the endtimes unfold, “if [it were] possible, they shall deceive the very elect”.



Since you mention 'closer looks', lets have one or two, shall we?

I don't think the thread is becoming pro-Islamic or pro-communist at all. Quite the contrary those political groups have not been examined in detail and for good reason. Most of the writing is from Americans who are unhappy with the direction our nation is taking. The future doesn't look good for us. Nobody cares about improving Islam or Communism (except you-know-who in DC).

I for one care more about drug dealing in my own neighborhood than the slaughter of thousands in Syria. I'm not really happy about either, but I'm most frustrated about my town. So I focus on the conditions I'm most familiar with and the nation I grew up in, work in and live in and am increasingly frustrated with. I think a lot of folks feel the same way. A lot of people are finally waking up and what they see is making them very nervous. Nervous. Nervous. Do you know which industry is growing the fastest these days. Bang bang the private arms business. Gun makers can't make guns fast enough for private sales. America is waking up and we are very nervous. Will Obama take credit for increased jobs in the gun business? <grin> You know he won't...gee whiz why?

Terrorists and rebels? What about them? The contras in Nicaragua were recruited, armed and trained by the CIA. They were mercenary death squads whose sole object was to overthrow the Communist Sandanistas. The whole thing was illegal but in spite of a specific law passed by congress to forbid such covert actions it went on anyway. In the end the Sandanistas won by default and are still in power albeit much changed from the days of 1979 when they first walked in. Thousands died because of American sponsored terrorism.

How about al qaeda and the taliban? Do you remember what nation created them? By created I mean recruited, trained, equipped and guided into their murderous goals. If you guessed the United States you guessed right. The Afghan mujahideen were the parents of the modern groups which our infamous leaders are trying to persuade us need to be killed. How about Libya? Since you mention it, did you know that members of al qaeda were part of the 'rebel' groups that overthrew Moamar gadhafi? US Senator John McCain was even quoted as calling them 'heroes' in the conflict.

Tell me if I get this wrong, ok? In 2001, we were told that al qaeda were the bad guys. In 2011, we're told they're heroes. I'm writing this in 2012 and I think they're bad guys again. Not sure, but I think so.....maybe...the year is young yet.

Then there was Iraq. Oh yes, we had to invade because they had WMD's and an affiliation with al qaeda or the taliban or Ronald McDonald or somebody. We all know now that the whole thing was a pack of lies. America goes to war why? It's ok to believe a lie and to kill people and destroy the lives of folks who've done nothing to us because of lies. American lies.

I was in Chile by the way for the party with marxist president Allende. My military team supported a group of Navy seals who went in to do a little mischief with explosives. The American government only supports fascist dictators because its easier to bribe one man or group of men than to try to influence a parliament or entire nation. We won that one, by the way. Hoo Rah for our side. More innocent deaths, but what the hey they weren't Americans so why worry.

Lets bring it home for one last verse of the popular song 'What's Wrong With America'. Let's keep it simple too and put it right in everybody's face.

Do you love God? Do you know Jesus? Does your faith mean anything to you? It probably means a lot. It does to me.
I am first an foremost a Christian and an American last. That means that if I put things like truth, life, kindness to others, etc. on a high scale it pretty much looks like America is falling short. How short?

In the front of most American churches the American flag is displayed. Its displayed to its own right if I read flag etiquette correctly. That means the American flag is displayed to the left of all other symbols, stage right if your in front of the sanctuary looking out toward the congregation. The cross is in the middle of most Protestant churches. That's where the crucifix is in Catholic houses of worship. On the other side may be displayed the church flag.

Does symbolism mean anything to the reader at this point? The American flag is just a striped piece of cloth, but its a symbol of our nation and there's a lot of meaning to it. Still following me are you? The cross is just a piece of wood or bronze or other material. The cross means something too. It means a lot more than any flag and that's saying a lot. It's meaning is more than a particular congregation or church or denomination. It stands for the very salvation and person of God.

Where do these symbols stand in relation to one another in our churches? The American flag is in the position of superiority and the cross is to its left - a position of lower importance. If symbolism means anything it means that America is bigger and better than God. It means that every church recognizes that God is a vassal of the United States. Maybe we've seen this so much that we don't think about it any more, but I guarantee that the next time you look at this arrangement in church you'll think about it. Is it right? These are only symbols and they don't mean anything. Or do they?

Bottom line is that Americans love the proud new fascist police state we've created. God is an object of ridicule and scorn as are things like morality and truth. Wisdom, always a rare thing more precious than gold, is nowhere to be found in our land. If any of us pretend to love the truth and Jesus and what Christianity is all about we cannot love what is happening in America today. We cannot make excuses and we cannot simply sit on the side lines. Christianity is not a spectator sport.

But that's just me, hollering from the choir loft...
 

WhiteKnuckle

New Member
Mar 29, 2009
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The US is no more and no less evil than any other country in this world. All governments have deep dark closets full of horror. I'm frankly tired of the hatred for the US that's been building since it was deemed "IN" back in the 90's.

More and more people in the US are hating their country. More and more people in the US are comparing other countries to us. I would like to add that most of the population haven't even ventured to either of our north or south neighbors much less over seas.

It used to be okay to be proud to be American. Now that ideal is dumped on and torn apart. It's known as arrogance now.

What being proud to be an American is about is not supporting anything the governent does blindly. It means we're proud and stick together. It means we know our children and our childrens children will live here and so on. It's about trying to build a home for future generations.

Now, what purpose does it serve to look back on the US governments and point out wrongs or evils that were done? Just because one event seemed to lead or cause another doesn't mean that was the original intent of the US gov.
 

Arnie Manitoba

Well-Known Member
Mar 8, 2011
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Manitoba Canada
Their wouldn't be any poverty in a socialist country! Everyone would share the wealth with their friends and neighbors.

You got that backwards .... in a socialist country there is no wealth.

For some strange reason socialists have a disability which prevents them from understanding that simple truth.

Socialism does not produce money or wealth .... it prevents it.

You cannot take from the rich and give to the poor if everybody is poor.

This is not complicated , yet the socialist cannot grasp it.

Yet they feel qualified to run our lives and our nation.

The socialist hates the wealthy , yet desires the proceeds of wealth , and wants to prevent wealth.

Talk about confused minds. God help us.
 

Strat

Member
Mar 25, 2012
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Adrian Rogers said it best

"You cannot legislate the poor into freedom by legislating the industrious out of it. You don't multiply wealth by dividing it,Government cannot give anything to anybody that it doesn't first take from somebody else. Whenever somebody receives something without working for it somebody else has to work for it without receiving it. The worst thing that can happen to a nation is for half of the people to get the idea that they don't have to work because somebody else will work for them,and the other half to get the idea that it does no good to work because they don't get to enjoy the fruits of their labor "

The socialist says the fruits of your labor belong to the collective and the government represents the collective and has the right to take it from you to distribute as it see's fit...the "christian" socialist will defend siocialism as a full fillment of Gods command regarding the poor,the poor spoken of in the bible were those unable to care for themsleves,the sick the very old,orphans and the disabled.

The socialist,especially the "christian" variety will suggest that it should include the able but unwilling, women who have several children by several different men,people who abuse alcohol and drugs called drunkards,not "alcoholics" in the Bible and people who just don't want to work...no remedy is offered for any of these people in the bible but repentance...but the modern church that knows so much more about love than God could ever know says we should pay their bills and give them a good life while they continue in their sin......all out of the pockets and off the backs of those struggling to care for their own families by working everyday....thats right...according to these people Jesus would give the drug addict clean needles,the drunk beer money and the chronically pregnant a bigger check unless the father decides to stick around...that he would both condemn sin and command its support at the same time....whats that....i hear the sound of wailing Violins approaching.
 

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Choir Loft
Apr 2, 2009
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I just found out the other day that the USA supported Pakistan in its genocide of up to three million Bengalis back in 1971.

This is in addition to all the other atrocities that the USA has been involved with in the past sixty odd years - Panama, Nicaragua, Iran, Iraq, Afghanistan, Libya, Chile.

How can anyone seriously regard the USA as anything other than a country dedicated to the wanton destruction of human life?


"Don't let anybody make you think that God chose America as His divine messianic force to be a sort of policeman of the whole world. God has a way of standing before the nations with justice and it seems that I can hear God saying to America,
'You are too arrogant. If you don't change your ways I will rise up and break the back bone of your power.'"
- Rev. Martin Luther King, Jr. (circa 1967)

"The US government is the greatest purveyor of violence in the world today."
- - Rev. Martin Luther King, Jr. 1966

"A nation that continues year after year to spend more money on military defense than on programs of social uplift is approaching spiritual death."
- Rev. Martin Luther King, Jr.

Refusal to acknowledge our national sin only mitigates wickedness and encourages it to continue.

No man and no nation can be saved unless they first admit their own evil and need for God to change their lives and actions.
America has forgotten God, demanded that He leave us alone and shaken our moral fist in His face. There is no humility here, only arrogance and pride. Pride as any student of scripture will tell you, goes before a fall. But Americans still hold to the belief that we are too big to fall.

As the prophet said, "we shall see."

America is now subject to the judgment of heaven, not its blessing. Everywhere is evidence of a dying empire and the withering of life. The grape vine of blessing has been severed at the root and we are witness to the decomposition of the corpse of a once great civilization. Liberty is already gone and the prosperity of the past is a faded and yellowed memory. I am a baby boomer, a child of post WWII prosperity. I remember what national glory and seas of money felt like. My children have no memory of it. The children of their generation don't even read about it in history books.

Politically, Pax Americana is dead. The popular ideology of American exceptionalism is a joke in every nation on the planet except those who inhabit the fifty states of the Washington Federation. As I write, it has become painfully obvious that the ultimate hook of destruction has been set in the mouth of the leaders of the American hegemony. We are no longer the masters of our fate. Others now dictate our destiny.

It is only a matter of time before even the most ardent and self-deluded among us are forced by circumstance to realize that our wickedness has brought the righteous wrath of the Almighty down upon our heads.

If God does not judge America, then He will have to apologize to Sodom and Gomorrah.(*)

but that's just me, hollering from the choir loft...

(*) This statement was made by a missionary in the city of Shanghai, China early in the twentieth century. At the time the city was guilty of every vice known to man. In the 1930's the Imperial Japanese army invaded the land and destroyed the town completely.
God does not apologize...to anybody.