The Wisdom of Sirach/Ecclesiasticus

[Hidden In Him]

And what an example you set as one who professes themselves to be Christian.

Nonsense. I welcomed you to the forum. I just happen to think your religion is demonically-inspired, so I said so. It was not a comment on you, but on what you apparently think is good reading for the "seeker."

Would I be doing you a service if I thought it was dangerous but didn't tell you?

Seeking to turn a young woman against me because you disagree with my posts to her.

I haven't sought to turn her against you, only your advice. But I do have to say that this is always your response when someone questions what you teach. You always post this "some Christian you are" stuff. Trust me, I don't hate you. I'm just vehemently opposed to what you espouse. Other than that, I have no problems with you.

Yes, I see who you are hidden within. Praise God his reign is for a short time and only on earth.

You are referring to my God, whose name is Yahweh, the God of the Old Testament? If you accuse me of being a coward (which I most certainly am not), tell me what you believe about the Old Testament God. Is he a just God, or an evil God?

 

[marks]

I am glad somebody is looking at this stuff....LOL

So are the publishers!

 

[Hidden In Him]

I'm just gonna be in the corner trying to come up with a solution to life's problems

Lol!

Life has a lot of problems, and there's a lot that needs to be erased. I can attest to that myself, glory to God.

 

[Pythagorean12]

I'm just gonna be in the corner trying to come up with a solution to life's problems

Starting with an eraser? You'll do fine. Just follow God's leading. Pray, meditate, study his word to find how to discern the difference between God and that other guy, you'll be blessed all your days.

 

[Pythagorean12]

So are the publishers!

And many publish all those different versions of the Bible too. Big business, publishing.

 

[DuckieLady]

Okay.

Here is what I came up with:

Luther wanted to remove "James." Now book of James was Jesus' brother. I'm going to obviously trust James more than Martin Luther.

So I think the first step would be to look at what Martin Luther was up to - because he was human and maybe it's okay to say Martin Luther was probably wrong about some things, especially if he wanted to silence Jesus' brother because "faith without works is dead thing" didn't fit right with him.

I think we can safely travel back to the 1500s, look at those books that we already had for 1,500+ years and not end up in any sort of trouble.

 

[Pythagorean12]

Okay.

Here is what I came up with:

Luther wanted to remove "James." Now book of James was Jesus' brother. I'm going to obviously trust James more than Martin Luther.

So I think the first step would be to look at what Martin Luther was up to - because he was human and maybe it's okay to say Martin Luther was probably wrong about some things, especially if he wanted to silence Jesus' brother because "faith without works is dead thing" didn't fit right with him.

I think we can safely travel back to the 1500s, look at those books that we already had for 1,500+ years and not end up in any sort of trouble.

You're aware the faith in Christ, those who were members of The Way, predated what we today call the bible?

 

[Truman]

I'm just gonna be in the corner trying to come up with a solution to life's problems

Personally, I find hiding under the bed useful...there's no internet there! Lol

 

[Hidden In Him]

Okay.

Here is what I came up with:

Luther wanted to remove "James." Now book of James was Jesus' brother. I'm going to obviously trust James more than Martin Luther.

So I think the first step would be to look at what Martin Luther was up to - because he was human and maybe it's okay to say Martin Luther was probably wrong about some things, especially if he wanted to silence Jesus' brother because "faith without works is dead thing" didn't fit right with him.

I think we can safely travel back to the 1500s, look at those books that we already had for 1,500+ years and not end up in any sort of trouble.

Good.

Luther is held up as a hero figure by many Protestants, and he did correct some rather egregious errors in his time. But there were a number of things he had problems with, and was in error about. I'm not going to get into it, but I do agree that it is far better to go with a New Testament writer than with anyone, regardless of how highly esteemed they might be by the modern church or anyone else for that matter.

 

[Pythagorean12]

Personally, I find hiding under the bed useful...there's no internet there! Lol

 

[Hidden In Him]

Personally, I find hiding under the bed useful...there's no internet there! Lol

Isn't it fun? LoL!

It could be worse, Truman. I'm going easy with our "brother" here and letting him off the hook from actually answering me. I suppose I'm getting used to the Gnostics. Like 'em or love 'em, they're here to stay until, as Pythagorean puts it, the real enemy's "reign" comes to an end.

 

[Hidden In Him]

That's cute, LoL.

 

[Enoch111]

...I would warn you very strongly about taking this advice. Gnosticism was the single most dangerous and demonically-inspired "Christian" heresy of the early church era, and it caused some (if not many) to lose their salvation,

This is a rather extreme and unfair comment on the Wisdom of Sirach (Ecclesiasticus). While it may not be regarded as Scripture, it has much which can edify anyone. It is DENIFITELY NOT a Gnostic writing since it was written by a Jew -- Ben Sira. Here is the truth:
"Ecclesiasticus contains practical and moral rules and exhortations, frequently arranged according to subject matter—e.g., hypocrisy, generosity, filial respect. Wisdom, personified as Sophia, or Lady Wisdom, delivers an extended discourse on her eternal relationship with God (chapter 24) and is identified with the Mosaic Law (see Torah)."

We know that wisdom should not be personified as "Lady Wisdom", since Christ is the Wisdom of God. But that should not detract from the exhortations. This book is found in the Catholic Bibles as Ecclesiasticus and here are some of its exhortations which are also biblical such as these:

The fear of the Lord is honour, and glory, and gladness, and a crown of joy.

The fear of the Lord shall delight the heart, and shall give joy, and gladness, and length of days.

It shall go well with him that feareth the Lord, and in the days of his end he shall be blessed.

The root of wisdom is to fear the Lord: and the branches thereof are long-lived.

 

[DuckieLady]

You're aware the faith in Christ, those who were members of The Way, predated what we today call the bible?

Are you referring to the 1st Century Christians?

Yes, but I feel like jumping around through history everywhere would cause a lot of confusion, especially with a lack of familiarity. So I think the easiest step would be to just take a couple steps back and look at Luther and his intentions.

That's probably the earliest significant change.

Then we can see what he was up to and look at the books that were removed.

And I have his some of his commentaries on .mobi so I can get into his head more.

 

[Hidden In Him]

This is a rather extreme and unfair comment on the Wisdom of Sirach (Ecclesiasticus).

Umm.. you might wanna read through and come at that again, my brother. I wasn't commenting on Sirach there. I make such mistakes myself sometimes if I don't fully read through a thread.

God bless,
- H

 

[Truman]

Isn't it fun? LoL!

It could be worse, Truman. I'm going easy with our "brother" here and letting him off the hook from actually answering me. I suppose I'm getting used to the Gnostics. Like 'em or love 'em, they're here to stay until, as Pythagorean puts it, the real enemy's "reign" comes to an end.

There's a few things I've read outside the bible, but I've been around for awhile and been through the bible a number of times. Some of the extra stuff's okay, but the gnostic stuff isn't. If one is unsure, they should, in my opinion, stick to the bible. I don't think you really need to go outside of it.

 

[DuckieLady]

@Hidden In Him

I was trying to respond but couldn't find your comment. Lol I dont feel called to do anything.

I am just bored, don't watch regular TV, and this makes me feel like Indiana Jones

Which I never saw
But I get the adventure and finding a thing part

 

[DuckieLady]

There's a few things I've read outside the bible, but I've been around for awhile and been through the bible a number of times. Some of extra stuff's okay, but the gnostic stuff isn't. If one is unsure, they should, in my opinion, stick to the bible. I don't think you really need to go outside of it.

I would say the majority of people should stick to the Bible. It is already set up perfectly...

But something just occurred to me while I was writing this:

2 Timothy 3:16
All Scripture is God-breathed and is useful for teaching, rebuking, correcting and training in righteousness...

I think that is meant to include other scriptures too (possibly)

 

[Hidden In Him]

@Hidden In Him

I was trying to respond but couldn't find your comment. Lol I dont feel called to do anything.

I am just bored, don't watch regular TV, and this makes me feel like Indiana Jones

Which I never saw
But I get the adventure and finding a thing part

LoL. That's why I'm here at present. I'm fasting, and boredom is my worst enemy. But if there's one thing you won't be around here, it's bored. It's like the true "Temple of Doom." You might get something really good out of it, but the situation is dangerous in so many ways, Lol.

 

[Pythagorean12]

Are you referring to the 1st Century Christians?

Yes, but I feel like jumping around through history everywhere would cause a lot of confusion, especially with a lack of familiarity. So I think the easiest step would be to just take a couple steps back and look at Luther and his intentions.

That's probably the earliest significant change.

Then we can see what he was up to and look at the books that were removed.

And I have his some of his commentaries on .mobi so I can get into his head more.

The idea that Martin Luther removed books from the bible has been contested for quite some time. You may wish to look further to find Luther didn't remove per say 7 books from the bible. Some sources claim the number to have been 14.

Instead, he moved certain books to a different part of the bible. Protestants know these books to be called the Apocrypha. Which appeared in the 1611 version of the King James bible. Catholics refer to these books as the Pseudepigrapha. Luther also did not remove the book of James from the NT.