The Wrath of God - How is it love?

[bdavidc]

I view it as Jesus paying our death penalty for sin.
God the Father did not direct His wrath at His only-begotten. IMHO

Your view contradicts what Scripture clearly teaches. It is not about what we prefer to believe, it is about what God has said. According to Sola Scriptura, the Bible alone is our authority, and it plainly states that Jesus bore the wrath of God on our behalf. Isaiah 53:5 says, “But he was wounded for our transgressions, he was bruised for our iniquities, the chastisement of our peace was upon him, and with his stripes we are healed.” Verse 10 goes even further: “Yet it pleased the Lord to bruise him, he hath put him to grief.” That is not a poetic metaphor, that is a statement of divine judgment. God’s wrath against sin was poured out on His Son, so that those who believe would not have to face it themselves.

Romans 3:25 says that God set forth Jesus “to be a propitiation through faith in his blood.” The Greek word for “propitiation” (hilastērion) means a wrath-satisfying sacrifice. That means God's wrath was directed at Christ in our place. Galatians 3:13 confirms this by saying, “Christ hath redeemed us from the curse of the law, being made a curse for us.” And 2 Corinthians 5:21 declares, “For he hath made him to be sin for us, who knew no sin, that we might be made the righteousness of God in him.”

It is not up to us to redefine God's justice or His love to fit our opinions. The cross was not just a display of love, it was also a display of wrath satisfied. God’s holiness demanded payment for sin, and Jesus willingly took that penalty for His people. That is the gospel. Anything less is not the truth.

 

[bdavidc]

I see "wrath", as typically defined, to be opposite.

It doesn’t matter how we personally define “wrath.” What matters is how God defines it in His Word. Sola Scriptura means we don’t rely on our own opinions, feelings, or reasoning, we submit to what Scripture says. The Bible consistently speaks of God’s wrath as a righteous and holy response to sin, not a loss of control or an act of cruelty. Romans 1:18 says, “For the wrath of God is revealed from heaven against all ungodliness and unrighteousness of men, who hold the truth in unrighteousness.” That is not man's wrath, it is God’s just reaction to rebellion against His holiness.

You don’t get to reshape the character of God based on what you feel is opposite or uncomfortable. Isaiah 55:8-9 makes it clear, “For my thoughts are not your thoughts, neither are your ways my ways, saith the Lord.” God’s wrath is not in conflict with His love, it exists because of His love. A holy God who loves righteousness must hate sin. John 3:36 says plainly, “He that believeth on the Son hath everlasting life, and he that believeth not the Son shall not see life, but the wrath of God abideth on him.” That’s not a symbolic or redefined wrath. It is literal, and it abides on those who reject Christ.

Whether or not you see wrath as fitting doesn’t change the fact that it is a central part of God’s revealed character. He is both just and merciful, and He has made a way through Christ to escape His coming judgment. But we don’t get to redefine who He is, we bow to who He has revealed Himself to be.

 

[St. SteVen]

Do you really believe God is to blame, or are you just refusing to take responsibility for your own sin?

No, I don't blame God. I blame humankind for creating a god that is a tyrant.
I believe in responsibility for sin. But that it warrants God's mercy, not everlasting wrath.
Shouldn't the consequences fit the crime?

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[St. SteVen]

Matthew 25:46, “And these shall go away into everlasting punishment, but the righteous into life eternal.”

Aionios mistranslated as "eternal" or "everlasting" in Matthew 25:46.

All these verses below use the same NT Greek word, "aionios", the Greek word mistranslated as "eternal" or "everlasting" in Matthew 25:46. See bold below. This shows that "aionios" cannot mean eternal or everlasting.

Matthew 13:22
The seed falling among the thorns refers to someone who hears the word, but the worries of this life and the deceitfulness of wealth choke the word, making it unfruitful.

Romans 12:2
Do not conform to the pattern of this world, but be transformed by the renewing of your mind. Then you will be able to test and approve what God’s will is—his good, pleasing and perfect will.

1 Corinthians 1:20
Where is the wise person? Where is the teacher of the law? Where is the philosopher of this age? Has not God made foolish the wisdom of the world?

1 Corinthians 2:8
None of the rulers of this age understood it, for if they had, they would not have crucified the Lord of glory.

Ephesians 2:2
in which you used to live when you followed the ways of this world and of the ruler of the kingdom of the air, the spirit who is now at work in those who are disobedient.

Galatians 1:4-5 KJV
Who gave himself for our sins, that he might deliver us from this present evil world, according to the will of God and our Father:5 To whom be glory for ever and ever. Amen.

Luke 18:29-30
“Truly I tell you,” Jesus said to them, “no one who has left home or wife or brothers or sisters or parents or children for the sake of the kingdom of God 30 will fail to receive many times as much in this age, and in the age to come eternal life.”

Compare: Matthew 12:32; Mark 10:30; Luke 18:30; Luke 20:35; Ephesians 1:21

Aionios, the Greek word mistranslated as "eternal" and "everlasting" in the Bible (eternal hell?)

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[St. SteVen]

God’s holiness demanded payment for sin, and Jesus willingly took that penalty for His people.

Sounds like the playground bully that beats the snot out of anyone smaller than he is.
Because they obviously don't measure up.

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[Eternally Grateful]

gods love can not overrule his justice.

it can however. satisfy his justice..

 

[St. SteVen]

gods love can not overrule his justice.

Isn't that what God's mercy is?

We tend to forget that mercy is also justice.

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[Eternally Grateful]

Isn't that what God's mercy is?

Gods mercy is based on the cross..

We tend to forget that mercy is also justice.

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No. Gods mercy is based on the cross. and his love will offger you forgiveness but he will not force it on you

if you reject him, you will suffer Gods wrath

 

[ProDeo]

Your view contradicts what Scripture clearly teaches. It is not about what we prefer to believe, it is about what God has said. According to Sola Scriptura, the Bible alone is our authority, and it plainly states that Jesus bore the wrath of God on our behalf. Isaiah 53:5 says, “But he was wounded for our transgressions, he was bruised for our iniquities, the chastisement of our peace was upon him, and with his stripes we are healed.” Verse 10 goes even further: “Yet it pleased the Lord to bruise him, he hath put him to grief.” That is not a poetic metaphor, that is a statement of divine judgment. God’s wrath against sin was poured out on His Son, so that those who believe would not have to face it themselves.

When it's about the cross and what exactly happened between God the Father and God the Son we cannot even fathom and is above my understanding, except what is given to us in Scripture. And the word wrath is not is Isa 53 nor in the NT.

 

[bdavidc]

No, I don't blame God. I blame humankind for creating a god that is a tyrant.
I believe in responsibility for sin. But that it warrants God's mercy, not everlasting wrath.
Shouldn't the consequences fit the crime?

It’s not up to you to decide what God should or shouldn’t do. God is not a tyrant, and He’s not a product of man’s imagination, He is the holy, righteous Judge revealed in Scripture. When you say everlasting wrath doesn’t fit the crime, you’re accusing God of injustice, whether you admit it or not. That’s dangerous ground. The Bible is clear: “The wages of sin is death” (Romans 6:23), and “the wrath of God abideth” on those who reject His Son (John 3:36). Sin is not just a mistake, it is rebellion against a holy God who gave you life. Eternal punishment is not excessive, it is just. God’s holiness is infinite, and sin against Him carries eternal consequences.

Mercy is not something you’re entitled to. It’s offered freely in Christ, but only to those who repent and believe. If you refuse that, the wrath of God remains on you. That’s not cruelty, that’s justice. You don’t get to redefine sin, judgment, or love. God has already spoken, and His Word stands.

 

[bdavidc]

Aionios mistranslated as "eternal" or "everlasting" in Matthew 25:46.

All these verses below use the same NT Greek word, "aionios", the Greek word mistranslated as "eternal" or "everlasting" in Matthew 25:46. See bold below. This shows that "aionios" cannot mean eternal or everlasting.

Matthew 13:22
The seed falling among the thorns refers to someone who hears the word, but the worries of this life and the deceitfulness of wealth choke the word, making it unfruitful.

Romans 12:2
Do not conform to the pattern of this world, but be transformed by the renewing of your mind. Then you will be able to test and approve what God’s will is—his good, pleasing and perfect will.

1 Corinthians 1:20
Where is the wise person? Where is the teacher of the law? Where is the philosopher of this age? Has not God made foolish the wisdom of the world?

1 Corinthians 2:8
None of the rulers of this age understood it, for if they had, they would not have crucified the Lord of glory.

Ephesians 2:2
in which you used to live when you followed the ways of this world and of the ruler of the kingdom of the air, the spirit who is now at work in those who are disobedient.

Galatians 1:4-5 KJV
Who gave himself for our sins, that he might deliver us from this present evil world, according to the will of God and our Father:5 To whom be glory for ever and ever. Amen.

Luke 18:29-30
“Truly I tell you,” Jesus said to them, “no one who has left home or wife or brothers or sisters or parents or children for the sake of the kingdom of God 30 will fail to receive many times as much in this age, and in the age to come eternal life.”

Compare: Matthew 12:32; Mark 10:30; Luke 18:30; Luke 20:35; Ephesians 1:21

Aionios, the Greek word mistranslated as "eternal" and "everlasting" in the Bible (eternal hell?)

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Your entire argument collapses when you look at the actual context of Scripture and the consistent use of the word aionios (αἰώνιος) across the New Testament. You’re attempting to redefine a biblical word to fit your theology rather than letting the Bible speak for itself. Aionios does not simply mean “age-based” or “temporary,” its meaning depends entirely on the context, and in Matthew 25:46, the context makes it absolutely clear. The verse says, “And these shall go away into everlasting punishment, but the righteous into life eternal.” The Greek word aionios is used in both phrases. If aionios means “temporary,” then the life believers receive is also temporary. That is absurd and completely unbiblical. The parallel use proves that both the punishment of the wicked and the life of the righteous are equally unending.

The New Testament writers, under the inspiration of the Holy Spirit, used aionios to refer to things that are clearly eternal, such as aionios zoe (eternal life, John 3:16), aionios God (Romans 16:26), and aionios redemption (Hebrews 9:12). These are not temporary qualities, and they are never presented as limited in duration. In Titus 1:2, Paul writes of the “hope of eternal life, which God, that cannot lie, promised before the world began.” If aionios is not truly eternal, then God is promising something temporary as our hope, that is a lie, and that is blasphemy.

Yes, the root word aion (αἰών) can sometimes mean “age” or “era,” but aionios is the adjective form and often refers to that which pertains to the age to come, which is unending. In texts speaking of judgment and life after death, it consistently means eternal. Hebrews 6:2 speaks of “eternal judgment” (kriseōs aiōniou). Are you suggesting God's judgment fades away over time? Revelation 14:11 says, “The smoke of their torment ascendeth up for ever and ever, and they have no rest day nor night.” That is not aionios, that is explicit eternal torment with no relief.

You are twisting Scripture instead of reading it the way God actually meant it. You’re grasping at word games to avoid the plain truth, eternal punishment is real, because sin against an eternal God carries eternal consequences. God's Word says what it means, and no amount of linguistic manipulation will erase the fact that aionios punishment is just as eternal as aionios life. You don’t get to change the meaning to make it easier to accept. Let God be true, but every man a liar (Romans 3:4).

 

[bdavidc]

Sounds like the playground bully that beats the snot out of anyone smaller than he is.
Because they obviously don't measure up.

That analogy is not only irreverent, it’s a gross misrepresentation of the holy, righteous God revealed in Scripture. Comparing God to a playground bully shows you don’t understand who He is or what sin actually is. God is not lashing out at the weak, He is judging rebellion against His perfect holiness. The Bible says, “The LORD is righteous in all His ways, and holy in all His works” (Psalm 145:17). Sin is not some minor flaw, it is outright defiance against the Creator of the universe. Romans 3:23 says, “For all have sinned, and come short of the glory of God,” and Romans 6:23 makes the consequence clear: “For the wages of sin is death.”

You are not a victim of divine injustice, you are guilty of sin. And God's wrath is not random, it is the just response to that guilt. He is not a bully, He is a Judge. A better analogy is this: imagine a convicted criminal standing before a judge, and instead of taking responsibility, he mocks the court and insults the law. The judge hands down the sentence. Is that injustice? No, it’s justice. That’s what you’re doing now. You’re blaming God for holding people accountable.

But here’s the difference, this Judge also took your sentence on Himself. Jesus Christ bore the wrath of God so you could be forgiven. That’s not a bully, that’s unmatched mercy. But if you spit on that mercy, don’t be surprised when judgment comes. You’ve been warned.

 

[bdavidc]

When it's about the cross and what exactly happened between God the Father and God the Son we cannot even fathom and is above my understanding, except what is given to us in Scripture. And the word wrath is not is Isa 53 nor in the NT.

Your claim that “wrath” is not in Isaiah 53 or the New Testament is simply false. Just because the word wrath (Hebrew: ʾaph, Greek: orge) isn’t used explicitly in a particular verse doesn’t mean the concept isn’t clearly present. Isaiah 53 is filled with language that points directly to God’s judgment and wrath being poured out on the suffering Servant in our place. Verse 10 says, “Yet it pleased the Lord to bruise him, he hath put him to grief,” and verse 5 says, “He was wounded for our transgressions, he was bruised for our iniquities, the chastisement of our peace was upon him.” That is not mere suffering, it is substitutionary judgment. The Hebrew word for “chastisement” (mûsār) means correction or discipline by punishment. God was punishing His Son for our sins. That is wrath.

The New Testament confirms this. Romans 3:25 says God presented Jesus “to be a propitiation through faith in his blood.” The word propitiation (Greek: hilastērion) means a wrath-satisfying sacrifice. In other words, Jesus absorbed God’s wrath in our place. Galatians 3:13 says, “Christ hath redeemed us from the curse of the law, being made a curse for us.” And in Romans 5:9, Paul writes, “Being now justified by his blood, we shall be saved from wrath through him.” Wrath is absolutely central to the gospel. Without it, the cross makes no sense.

God’s wrath is not some abstract or removed concept. It is real, holy, and just, and it was poured out on Christ so that repentant sinners could be saved. You may not fully understand every detail of what happened between the Father and the Son at the cross, but Scripture gives you more than enough to know this: Jesus took the wrath you deserved, so you wouldn’t have to. That is what the Bible says. Anything less denies the very heart of the gospel.

 

[ElieG12]

Punishment is part of justice. This is true of human laws that judge those who break them. How much more will God punish all those who ultimately decided to continue violating His righteous principles? The only ones who complain about criminals being punished, aren't the criminals themselves?

Up to this moment, earth and heaven continue to feed the just and the unjust, without distinction. The evils that befall humans are not caused by God, but by themselves.

God's justice and love balance each other out. Mercy causes God to continue patiently forgiving those who repent of their evil deeds and change their behavior. However, His patience will not last forever, and the judgment of evil people will give way to a future free from suffering for those who do strive to do right.

Jesus paid with His life so that humans would have that opportunity. Even people who were unjust in life will be raised from the dead and have another chance.

 

[St. SteVen]

It’s not up to you to decide what God should or shouldn’t do.

That saw cuts both ways.

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[St. SteVen]

Wrath is absolutely central to the gospel. Without it, the cross makes no sense.

I don't buy the idea that God poured out His wrath on His only-begotten.
As I understand it, Jesus paid our death penalty. It was a simple transaction.
It didn't require God's anger to be poured out on the obedient Son that He loved.
Why would God the Father be angry at God the Son? Being crucified was bad enough.

Matthew 3:17 NIV
And a voice from heaven said, “This is my Son, whom I love; with him I am well pleased.”

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[St. SteVen]

You are twisting Scripture instead of reading it the way God actually meant it.

Who are you to declare what God meant?

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[St. SteVen]

You’re blaming God for holding people accountable.

Not at all.
I believe in personal accountability.
But I believe that God's purpose in it is correction and restoration.
Not pointless and endless punishment. That doesn't resolve the sin issue at all.

Acts 3:21 NIV
Heaven must receive him until the time comes for God to restore everything,
as he promised long ago through his holy prophets.

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