All this raving madness here over what day it was that our Lord Jesus was crucified, just BECAUSE some here would rather follow men's doctrines about it instead of heeding what God's Word reveals about it. A literal... 3 days and 3 nights is what Scripture states. That is how long Christ's body was in the tomb before being raised by The Father. And it MUST be reckoned using the Hebrew calendar reckoning of the day, not the later Gregorian calendar instituted in the 16th century A.D. that we still use today.
Three Days and Three Nights
- Thread starter rstrats
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dragonfly,
re: "Amen"
Hebrew calendar or Gregorian calendar; I don’t see what difference it makes regarding the light periods and the dark periods that the Messiah said He would be in the heart of the earth. Using either one comes out the same with regard to the number of light/dark periods.
re: "Amen"
Hebrew calendar or Gregorian calendar; I don’t see what difference it makes regarding the light periods and the dark periods that the Messiah said He would be in the heart of the earth. Using either one comes out the same with regard to the number of light/dark periods.
Hi rstrats,
Your comment sent me back to the OP, and I re-read, slowly, this sentence.
Surely it is obvious that 'at least parts' of 'day' or 'night' would be included in whole days and nights?
The Hebrew calendar helps us make other connections in our understanding., including that Jesus did spend 'three days and three nights' in the heart of the earth, and rose from death on the third day, not the fourth day, as a Wednesday crucifixion would indicate necessary.
Jesus died at the time of the evening sacrifice, and also at the time some people would have been trying to kill their passover lambs - but it was pitch dark, making any other kind of slaying, impossible.
I've realised, during this thread, that Atonement was normally later in the year, but the rending of the Temple vail was well in advance of those sacrifices, or, was half a year after them, depending on how one wants to look at it. Either way, the Mosaic law is rendered useless by the coming of the Holy Spirit at Pentecost.
Jonah 1:17 7 Now the LORD had prepared a great fish to swallow up Jonah. And Jonah was in the belly of the fish three days and three nights.
{belly: Heb. bowels} Matt 12:40, Isaiah 27:1, 2 (and the whole chapter), where sea = people.
Jonah 2:2 And said, I cried by reason of mine affliction unto the LORD, and he heard me; out of the belly of hell cried I, [and] thou heardest my voice.
{by...: or, out of mine affliction} {hell: or, the grave}
There is, also, in the great flood, a shadow of the same picture, such as: the coming of the Ark to rest, corresponds with Passover, or, resurrection. I'm not sure which, since God declared a new 'first month' when the Hebrews left Egypt, the day after the first Passover. I'm unclear where that month used to fall in the Hebrew year, and as a result, it's difficult to understand the parallels, or overlaps, symbolically.
The John 19 chapter is where we must start...
John 19:30-31
30 When Jesus therefore had received the vinegar, he said, It is finished: and he bowed his head, and gave up the ghost.
31 The Jews therefore, because it was the preparation, that the bodies should not remain upon the cross on the sabbath day, (for that sabbath day was an high day,) besought Pilate that their legs might be broken, and that they might be taken away.
(KJV)
John 19:40-42
40 Then took they the body of Jesus, and wound it in linen clothes with the spices, as the manner of the Jews is to bury.
41 Now in the place where he was crucified there was a garden; and in the garden a new sepulchre, wherein was never man yet laid.
42 There laid they Jesus therefore because of the Jews' preparation day; for the sepulchre was nigh at hand.
(KJV)
They rushed to bury Jesus' body because it was the preparation day, and at sundown was a 'high day' (a high sabbath) because of the passover requirement per the OT. So in that week there were TWO sabbaths, the high sabbath per the passover timing, and then later the regular weekly sabbath. Christ's body was buried just prior to the high sabbath starting at sunset.
So all one need do then is to mark the day He arose, which we are shown was the morning of the first day of the week, which was Sunday morning. And then one MUST count back 3 days and 3 nights.
The result will be that He was crucified on a Wednsday and buried just prior to Thursday at sunset, because Thursday began at SUNSET per the Hebrew reckoning.
The idea that Christ was crucified on a Friday and rose on Sunday morning will NOT fit the specific period of 3 days and 3 nights. Instead that was a later Catholic tradition based on the much later Gregorian calendar pope Gregory instituted in the 16th century A.D.
John 19:30-31
30 When Jesus therefore had received the vinegar, he said, It is finished: and he bowed his head, and gave up the ghost.
31 The Jews therefore, because it was the preparation, that the bodies should not remain upon the cross on the sabbath day, (for that sabbath day was an high day,) besought Pilate that their legs might be broken, and that they might be taken away.
(KJV)
John 19:40-42
40 Then took they the body of Jesus, and wound it in linen clothes with the spices, as the manner of the Jews is to bury.
41 Now in the place where he was crucified there was a garden; and in the garden a new sepulchre, wherein was never man yet laid.
42 There laid they Jesus therefore because of the Jews' preparation day; for the sepulchre was nigh at hand.
(KJV)
They rushed to bury Jesus' body because it was the preparation day, and at sundown was a 'high day' (a high sabbath) because of the passover requirement per the OT. So in that week there were TWO sabbaths, the high sabbath per the passover timing, and then later the regular weekly sabbath. Christ's body was buried just prior to the high sabbath starting at sunset.
So all one need do then is to mark the day He arose, which we are shown was the morning of the first day of the week, which was Sunday morning. And then one MUST count back 3 days and 3 nights.
The result will be that He was crucified on a Wednsday and buried just prior to Thursday at sunset, because Thursday began at SUNSET per the Hebrew reckoning.
The idea that Christ was crucified on a Friday and rose on Sunday morning will NOT fit the specific period of 3 days and 3 nights. Instead that was a later Catholic tradition based on the much later Gregorian calendar pope Gregory instituted in the 16th century A.D.
Hi veteran,
Why crucified on the Wednesday?
Was He not arrested on Wednesday night, shipped between Herod and Pilate during His 'trial', and finally crucified on Thursday morning.
After the darkness Matt 27:45, there would have been three hours till sunset, when He was taken down from the cross and buried.
That last portion of daylight on the Thursday would count as if
a whole day (1), then
Friday night (1),
Friday day (2)
Saturday night (2)
Saturday day (3)
Sunday night (3).
It comes to something over 60 hours, but it covers both three 'days' and three 'nights', and He rose on the third 'day' if Thursday is day zero.
Why crucified on the Wednesday?
Was He not arrested on Wednesday night, shipped between Herod and Pilate during His 'trial', and finally crucified on Thursday morning.
After the darkness Matt 27:45, there would have been three hours till sunset, when He was taken down from the cross and buried.
That last portion of daylight on the Thursday would count as if
a whole day (1), then
Friday night (1),
Friday day (2)
Saturday night (2)
Saturday day (3)
Sunday night (3).
It comes to something over 60 hours, but it covers both three 'days' and three 'nights', and He rose on the third 'day' if Thursday is day zero.
We have to pick up the 3 days and 3 nights timing back from when He rose, on Sunday morning before dawn, the first day of the week (Matt.28:1; Mark 16:2; Mark 16:9; Luke 24:1; John 20:1; John 20:19). And it must be according to the Hebrew reckoning of a calendar day, NOT the later Gregorian calendar day of the 16th century A.D.
Per Hebrew reckoning, a calendar day began at sunset and ended at the next sunset (i.e., Friday begins at sunset, and continues to the next sunset). Thus night time = sunset to dawn; day time = dawn to sunset.
Sunday, the first day of the week, Christ rose, sometime before dawn, for the sepulchre was found empty "when it was yet dark" (John 20:1-2).
From Saturday sunset back to Saturday dawn = 1st day
From Saturday dawn back to Friday sunset = 1st night
From Friday sunset back to Friday dawn = 2nd day
From Friday dawn back to Thursday sunset = 2nd night
From Thursday sunset back to Thursday dawn = 3rd day
From Thursday dawn back to Wednsday sunset = 3rd night
Thusly, Christ was crucified on a Wednsday, and His body buried just prior to sunset.
That's not correct. Here's the proof:
Matt 28:1-6
1 In the end of the sabbath, as it began to dawn toward the first day of the week, came Mary Magdalene and the other Mary to see the sepulchre.
2 And, behold, there was a great earthquake: for the angel of the Lord descended from heaven, and came and rolled back the stone from the door, and sat upon it.
3 His countenance was like lightning, and his raiment white as snow:
4 And for fear of him the keepers did shake, and became as dead men.
5 And the angel answered and said unto the women, Fear not ye: for I know that ye seek Jesus, which was crucified.
6 He is not here: for he is risen, as he said. Come, see the place where the Lord lay.
(KJV)
As it began to grow light (epiphosko), means while stil yet dark, but with dawn coming. Sunday is the first day of the week that began at the previous sunset. So this was sometime before dawn early Sunday morning.
Luke 24:1-3
1 Now upon the first day of the week, very early in the morning, they came unto the sepulchre, bringing the spices which they had prepared, and certain others with them.
2 And they found the stone rolled away from the sepulchre.
3 And they entered in, and found not the body of the Lord Jesus.
(KJV)
Same idea, very early dawn per the Greek, on Sunday. Christ's body had resurrected.
John 20:1-2
1 The first day of the week cometh Mary Magdalene early, when it was yet dark, unto the sepulchre, and seeth the stone taken away from the sepulchre.
2 Then she runneth, and cometh to Simon Peter, and to the other disciple, whom Jesus loved, and saith unto them, They have taken away the Lord out of the sepulchre, and we know not where they have laid Him.
(KJV)
Same idea, early dawn first day of the week, while it was still dark, they found the sepulchre open and His body not there.
veteran,
re: "That’s not correct...Matt 28:1-6...Luke 24: 1-3...John 20:1-2"
Sure it is. Nowhere in those verses does it say when the resurrection actually took place. They only say that the tomb was empty when the women got there on the first of the week. They don't say when it became empty.
re: "That’s not correct...Matt 28:1-6...Luke 24: 1-3...John 20:1-2"
Sure it is. Nowhere in those verses does it say when the resurrection actually took place. They only say that the tomb was empty when the women got there on the first of the week. They don't say when it became empty.
I'm a bit board today but I thought you might enjoy this. Reading your post brought several things to mind. I'm not so sure about the date but a bit of food for thought. We teach Christ crucified.
2 Peter 1:18-19
http://bytheword.com/birth
Hi rstrats,
You said:
"Sure it is. Nowhere in those verses does it say when the resurrection actually took place. They only say that the tomb was empty when the women got there on the first of the week. They don't say when it became empty."
I would say the resurrection took place just before the earthquake happened that rolled away the stone. Yeshua exited the tomb between the time the soldiers left and the women arrived. Just my opinion.
You said:
"Sure it is. Nowhere in those verses does it say when the resurrection actually took place. They only say that the tomb was empty when the women got there on the first of the week. They don't say when it became empty."
I would say the resurrection took place just before the earthquake happened that rolled away the stone. Yeshua exited the tomb between the time the soldiers left and the women arrived. Just my opinion.
In the end of the sabbath meant at sunset Saturday, which per Hebrew reckoning sunset began Sunday. That's when they were free to come visit Christ's sepulchre.
Mark 16:9
9 Now when Jesus was risen early the first day of the week, He appeared first to Mary Magdalene, out of whom He had cast seven devils.
(KJV)
You're correct that that Mark 16:9 verse is specific that Christ rose sometime early Sunday morning, and the other Scriptures also point to that timing of early Sunday morning sometime before dawn, and the requirement Jesus made of 3 days and 3 nights. All that must be weighed together, and not separated like you appear to want to do.
veteran,
re: " And it MUST be reckoned using the Hebrew calendar reckoning of the day, not the later Gregorian calendar instituted in the 16th century A.D. that we still use today.
I’m afraid I don’t see what difference it makes with regard to the 3 light periods and the 3 dark periods. I wonder if you might explain?
veteran,
re: ". All that must be weighed together, and not separated like you appear to want to do."
I was merely responding to the three scriptures that you furnished to support your contention that my assertion that Mark 16:9 is the only scripture that places the resurrection on the first of the week is incorrect. If you needed more scriptures you should have included them.
re: " And it MUST be reckoned using the Hebrew calendar reckoning of the day, not the later Gregorian calendar instituted in the 16th century A.D. that we still use today.
I’m afraid I don’t see what difference it makes with regard to the 3 light periods and the 3 dark periods. I wonder if you might explain?
veteran,
re: ". All that must be weighed together, and not separated like you appear to want to do."
I was merely responding to the three scriptures that you furnished to support your contention that my assertion that Mark 16:9 is the only scripture that places the resurrection on the first of the week is incorrect. If you needed more scriptures you should have included them.
Hi veteran, 
The problem with working backwards in time, is that you've missed out the part of the day during which Jesus was buried before the sunset which commenced His first night in the tomb.
One of the reasons the Jews wanted the bodies down, was to get them buried before sunset.
If you begin with the 'day' they were crucified and work forwards the way time normally runs, you will find He is rising early on Saturday morning according to your reckoning of having been buried prior to Wednesday sunset.
Please give it a go, counting the day of crucifixion and burial, as the first day in the tomb, as a Hebrew would count it?
I know it seems a bit shocking to the western mind that Jesus was crucified, died and buried, all in the same 12 hours of 'day', (three of which were dark from noon till 3 pm), but this is what we read, I believe.
The problem with working backwards in time, is that you've missed out the part of the day during which Jesus was buried before the sunset which commenced His first night in the tomb.
One of the reasons the Jews wanted the bodies down, was to get them buried before sunset.
If you begin with the 'day' they were crucified and work forwards the way time normally runs, you will find He is rising early on Saturday morning according to your reckoning of having been buried prior to Wednesday sunset.
Please give it a go, counting the day of crucifixion and burial, as the first day in the tomb, as a Hebrew would count it?
I know it seems a bit shocking to the western mind that Jesus was crucified, died and buried, all in the same 12 hours of 'day', (three of which were dark from noon till 3 pm), but this is what we read, I believe.
I think you need to take your 'reading' problems somewhere else. Afterall, you yourself quoted those other Scriptures that I posted.
veteran,
re: "I think you need to take your 'reading' problems somewhere else. Afterall, you yourself quoted those other Scriptures that I posted."
I think you have me confused with someone else because I haven’t done that. Why would I?
re: "I think you need to take your 'reading' problems somewhere else. Afterall, you yourself quoted those other Scriptures that I posted."
I think you have me confused with someone else because I haven’t done that. Why would I?
Hi veteran,
The problem with working backwards in time, is that you've missed out the part of the day during which Jesus was buried before the sunset which commenced His first night in the tomb.
One of the reasons the Jews wanted the bodies down, was to get them buried before sunset.
If you begin with the 'day' they were crucified and work forwards the way time normally runs, you will find He is rising early on Saturday morning according to your reckoning of having been buried prior to Wednesday sunset.
Please give it a go, counting the day of crucifixion and burial, as the first day in the tomb, as a Hebrew would count it?
If you look carefully, I didn't miss the count start of the first night (ending sunset Wednesday and starting Thursday). I'll do it forwards then... but it's going to be the same:
A. Wednesday prior to sunset - the preparation day (John 19:14). Jesus died near the 9th hour (between 3 - 4 P.M. per the required time of sacrifice of Exo.12; Lev.23).
B. Sunset - start of Thursday, the "high day" of John 19:31, a high sabbath per the passover requirement (Exo.12; Lev.23)
So...
Wednesday sunset to Thursday dawn = 1st night (sunset began Thursday the "high day", a holy convocation)
Thursday dawn to next sunset = 1st day (still the "high day" period)
Thursday sunset to Friday dawn = 2nd night
Friday dawn to Friday sunset = 2nd day
Friday sunset to Saturday dawn = 3rd night (regular weekly sabbath began at sunset on Friday)
Saturday dawn to Saturday sunset = 3rd day (still the regular weekly sabbath)
Saturday sunset to Sunday dawn = 'within' this time period Christ rose, sometime on Sunday morning but before dawn. Can't count this as a full "night".
That's how the Scripture has it. And like Apostle Paul said, "For Christ our Passover is sacrificed for us." (2 Cor.5:7). Thus Paul knew our Lord Jesus was sacrificed at the very time requirement God gave in the OT for the passover lamb in Egypt. They were to smear the blood of the lamb on their door posts for that evening to keep the angel of death away that night. What gets us confused is not being used to the Hebrew reckoning for a day starting at sunset and continuing to the next sunset. But that reckoning is required to Biblically figure this.
Then maybe you have a split personality???
Your Post #28:
veteran,
re: "Then maybe you have a split personality???"
Why do you ask that question and what is the point of your post #38? All I can see is you’re restatement of your inappropriate referencing of Matt.28:1, Mark 16:2, Luke 24:1, John 20:1, and John 20:19 that you offered in your post #27 to support the idea of a first day resurrection.
re: "Then maybe you have a split personality???"
Why do you ask that question and what is the point of your post #38? All I can see is you’re restatement of your inappropriate referencing of Matt.28:1, Mark 16:2, Luke 24:1, John 20:1, and John 20:19 that you offered in your post #27 to support the idea of a first day resurrection.
tim_from_pa
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I want to address this issue, Dragonfly, because I agree with Veteran's chronology of events.
Yahweh considered the start of Yahshua's time in the tomb on Nisan 15. This is to fulfill the feast of Unleavened Bread. I care not if he was actually being buried the last few minutes of Nisan 14 or not. We have to count by Yahweh's way of counting, and that starts on the 15th, and not just count the crucifxion AND burial as the same day event, otherwise, the feast days and what they foreshadowed were not kept by Yahweh himself.
Frankly, if we have to be precise here, I believe he was being laid and not technically buried yet in the tomb at the very end of Nisan 14. Then I could imagine the stone rolled with a resounding echo cutting off any light and covering the tomb at the exact same moment the sun's last limb sunk below the horizon. They were done with the work of laying him to rest and could now keep the sabbath, while the "3-day" clock starting ticking so-to-speak early Nisan 15.
Now, what's 3 days later? Easy enough 15+3=18 (of Nisan). Likewise, the last limb of the Sabbath sun was fading, and at the moment of time he arose, fulfilling the coming day of First fruits. We know that firstfruits occurs on a Sunday. So, if Sunday was the 18th, then project backwards and we see the 14th (like on any calendar( is on a Wednesday. Simple math.
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