Tithing Or 2 Corinthians chs 8 & 9 - which is right?

[Truman]

I used to tithe. I thought it was what God wanted me to do, so I didn't give it a second thought. I may have thought that anyone who didn't tithe was ripping off God. My life was already committed to God, including my money. So I didn't think about it.
But then I was challenged to reconsider my thinking on the topic. Where does it say in the New Testament that we are to tithe? I looked into it and found an instance where Jesus told someone to tithe. But then I realized that He was talking to a Jew who was still under the Law. I believe that there is also another instance where He told another to tithe but it was the same thing.
Since Jesus had yet to be sacrificed and shed His blood, and a covenant is only in effect after blood is shed, the Old Covenant was still the only covenant. But once He was crucified, raised from the dead and the New Covenant was in place, what, if any, would be the new teaching on giving?
I believe 2 Corinthians 8 & 9 holds the answers. What do you think?

 

[Hidden In Him]

I used to tithe. I thought it was what God wanted me to do, so I didn't give it a second thought. I may have thought that anyone who didn't tithe was ripping off God. My life was already committed to God, including my money. So I didn't think about it.
But then I was challenged to reconsider my thinking on the topic. Where does it say in the New Testament that we are to tithe?

Same here. I fully believe in giving, but the NT teaching was to practice giving and receiving, not only between churches and ministers but between the churches and believers in general, that all might have all things common. The idea that tithing was taught during NT times is rather uninformed. The tithing system was designed to support the Jewish Temple and Jewish Priesthood. It was still standing until 70 AD, and all the apostles were Jews, which means for the Jewish apostles and leaders of the church to be telling believers in the Lord to be tithing to them would have been so slanderous as to see them rejected wholesome. The temple was still standing even when Jesus was alive, and not only did He not demand tithes to Himself, but the suggestion from scripture is that He paid tithes. For the disciples to turn around and demand them from Jews would have been blasphemous.

So yes. 2 Corinthians 8 and 9 most certainly. Tithing, not on your life. It was introduced into the church in the 3rd century when church doctrine and leadership was starting to become more corrupt and donations were thus starting to taper off.

 

[justbyfaith]

I used to tithe. I thought it was what God wanted me to do, so I didn't give it a second thought. I may have thought that anyone who didn't tithe was ripping off God. My life was already committed to God, including my money. So I didn't think about it.
But then I was challenged to reconsider my thinking on the topic. Where does it say in the New Testament that we are to tithe? I looked into it and found an instance where Jesus told someone to tithe. But then I realized that He was talking to a Jew who was still under the Law. I believe that there is also another instance where He told another to tithe but it was the same thing.
Since Jesus had yet to be sacrificed and shed His blood, and a covenant is only in effect after blood is shed, the Old Covenant was still the only covenant. But once He was crucified, raised from the dead and the New Covenant was in place, what, if any, would be the new teaching on giving?
I believe 2 Corinthians 8 & 9 holds the answers. What do you think?

Do you think that the words of Christ aren't applicable to us because they were spoken before He died on the Cross?

 

[Bobby Jo]

I used to tithe. ...

1 Tim. 5:17 Let the elders who rule well be considered worthy of double honor, especially those who labor in preaching and teaching. 18 For the Scripture says, “You shall not muzzle an ox when it treads out the grain,” and, “The laborer deserves his wages.”​

Seems to me that people who steal from GOD's Kingdom are robbing THEMSELVES of blessings. And I'd MUCH rather have GOD's ABUNDANT Blessings in my life versus a few measly dollars.

I'm reminded of the "Church of Christ" which uses the wacky theology where musical instruments aren't mentioned in the N.T., therefore they no longer apply. -- And some use the same wacky theology because they want to rob GOD.

We all choose, and we all receive our respective "reward".
Bobby Jo

 

[DNB]

I used to tithe. I thought it was what God wanted me to do, so I didn't give it a second thought. I may have thought that anyone who didn't tithe was ripping off God. My life was already committed to God, including my money. So I didn't think about it.
But then I was challenged to reconsider my thinking on the topic. Where does it say in the New Testament that we are to tithe? I looked into it and found an instance where Jesus told someone to tithe. But then I realized that He was talking to a Jew who was still under the Law. I believe that there is also another instance where He told another to tithe but it was the same thing.
Since Jesus had yet to be sacrificed and shed His blood, and a covenant is only in effect after blood is shed, the Old Covenant was still the only covenant. But once He was crucified, raised from the dead and the New Covenant was in place, what, if any, would be the new teaching on giving?
I believe 2 Corinthians 8 & 9 holds the answers. What do you think?

I don't believe that tithing is an obligation to a Christian, as it was stipulated as an ordinance to the Jews, under the Old Covenant.
But, clearly and invariably, charity is a virtue, and anyone, firstly, created in the image of God, and secondly, born-again, is meant to be virtuous.
In that, even if it was not a specified command under the Old Law, it would still have all the merits and edification to all who practiced it, ...and obviously, to all who were the recipients of it.
Thus, I don't believe that a regimented frequency or amount of support is compulsory to a Christian, but because compassion, aid and mercy are, it is incumbent upon all Christians that in some manner or another, to not overlook the needy, the underprivileged, distressed or unfortunate.

I personally have had 4 sponsored children for about 15 years, and then about 15 years ago, for personal reasons, I changed the support instead to give to where most needed (food or infrastructure). These both were/are automatic payments, a monthly fixed amount, that comes off my credit card.
This structure, again, is not mandatory, just convenient for me. But, the principle, I believe, is an obligation, ...to whatever means are available to the person.

 

[farouk]

I used to tithe. I thought it was what God wanted me to do, so I didn't give it a second thought. I may have thought that anyone who didn't tithe was ripping off God. My life was already committed to God, including my money. So I didn't think about it.
But then I was challenged to reconsider my thinking on the topic. Where does it say in the New Testament that we are to tithe? I looked into it and found an instance where Jesus told someone to tithe. But then I realized that He was talking to a Jew who was still under the Law. I believe that there is also another instance where He told another to tithe but it was the same thing.
Since Jesus had yet to be sacrificed and shed His blood, and a covenant is only in effect after blood is shed, the Old Covenant was still the only covenant. But once He was crucified, raised from the dead and the New Covenant was in place, what, if any, would be the new teaching on giving?
I believe 2 Corinthians 8 & 9 holds the answers. What do you think?

@Ron Coates If people want to give even more than a tenth of their freewill offerings (of which the NT speaks), then this is commendable.

But strictly a tithe is the due payable to Old Testament Levites. Malachi, still under the old economy, makes this clear.

Where are the Levites now? (What happened to the distinction between Israel - an earthly ppl - and the church - a heavenly ppl?) Any claim that preacher so-and-so is a latter day Levite is no more exegetically Scriptural than other sorts of latter day extrapolations sometime made out West.

 

[Truman]

I don't believe that tithing is an obligation to a Christian, as it was stipulated as an ordinance to the Jews, under the Old Covenant.
But, clearly and invariably, charity is a virtue, and anyone, firstly, created in the image of God, and secondly, born-again, is meant to be virtuous.
In that, even if it was not a specified command under the Old Law, it would still have all the merits and edification to all who practiced it, ...and obviously, to all who were the recipients of it.
Thus, I don't believe that a regimented frequency or amount of support is compulsory to a Christian, but because compassion, aid and mercy are, it is incumbent upon all Christians that in some manner or another, to not overlook the needy, the underprivileged, distressed or unfortunate.

I personally have had 4 sponsored children for about 15 years, and then about 15 years ago, for personal reasons, I changed the support instead to give to where most needed (food or infrastructure). These both were/are automatic payments, a monthly fixed amount, that comes off my credit card.
This structure, again, is not mandatory, just convenient for me. But, the principle, I believe, is an obligation.

Hi:
I used to support a child through World Vision but had to stop. Later we started supporting a little Mexican girl. She later caught the flu and died. I haven't done that since. Being on a disability pension means all my money is tied up in bills. But I do what I can. After all, the greatest in the Kingdom Of God is the servant of all. The least of these should be at the top of our list. It is on His list. But He wants us to do it. He won't change His mind. Good. If He used a cattle prod on me, I don't think it would be inappropriate. Lol But seriously, if we got what we deserved, we'd all be burning in hell. Thank God for God. Shalom.

 

[DNB]

Hi:
I used to support a child through World Vision but had to stop. Later we started supporting a little Mexican girl. She later caught the flu and died. I haven't done that since. Being on a disability pension means all my money is tied up in bills. But I do what I can. After all, the greatest in the Kingdom Of God is the servant of all. The least of these should be at the top of our list. It is on His list. But He wants us to do it. He won't change His mind. Good. If He used a cattle prod on me, I don't think it would be inappropriate. Lol But seriously, if we got what we deserved, we'd all be burning in hell. Thank God for God. Shalom.

Thank you for that, i changed the last part of my post to stipulate an important caveat that you brought to my attention, 'within one's means'.
Sorry to hear about one of your sponsors, and your personal limitations. ... it only emphasizes the point that support for all is necessary.

 

[Truman]

@Ron Coates If people want to give even more than a tenth of their freewill offerings (of which the NT speaks), then this is commendable.

But strictly a tithe is the due payable to Old Testament Levites. Malachi, still under the old economy, makes this clear.

Where are the Levites now? (What happened to the distinction between Israel - an earthly ppl - and the church - a heavenly ppl?) Any claim that preacher so-and-so is a latter day Levite is no more exegetically Scriptural than other sorts of latter day extrapolations sometime made out West.

Hi, Farouk. Hope your days' going well. As to the above, the key-word is want. We are encouraged to give but not if it means we go without. See 2 Corinthians chs 8 & 9. Whereas the tithe was mandatory. This was so the people God prepared to serve Him wouldn't have to worry about what they were going to eat. I recall that there was an occasion where the Levites had to go and work in the fields in order to feed their families.
As far as being descended from Levi goes, my beliefs have not changed since last Fall. God, Himself has clearly told me that I'm a Levite. I've seen others online who take tithes though I believe the guy I have in mind calls himself an orthodox Jew. I'm a Messianic Levite. I do not believe in New Testament tithing. I'm fairly new to this and it hasn't been long since I came out of the closet, so to speak. I mean making it public about who I am. Lol I seem to be digging myself deeper. Since I made public my belief that God told me and showed me that I am a Levite, descended from the tribe of Levi. There.
I am not gay but if I was, would you treat me any differently? Jesus wouldn't. He would speak to me the truth in love. I recently decided what I would tell an unsaved gay person. "You are a sinner who needs Jesus and you need to repent." Would I expect him to repent all at once? No. I used to be whitewashed. I tried the instant sanctification thing but it just didn't change anything. And I needed change. Still do, though God's not finished with me yet. Glory to God.
Most people believe that God destroyed Sodom because of it's gayness. The only reason I could find stated in the bible was that they were arrogant, overfed and unconcerned in regards to the needy. I think gay and lesbian people are just as much victims of the enemy as anyone else. People like me who come from a drug past, and those who struggle with homosexuality are brutalized when churchianity turns on us because their Christian superstition doesn't work for real problems.
When make-believe doesn't work, it's not long until one is forced out. Along with the slander and gossip that inevitably follows. For years I heard that the Army Of God (the church) is the only army that shoots their wounded. I didn't know what that meant. I do now.
You have a good night, my friend. Shalom.

 

[Bobby Jo]

Hi:
I used to support a child through World Vision but had to stop. Later we started supporting a little Mexican girl. She later caught the flu and died. I haven't done that since. Being on a disability pension means all my money is tied up in bills. But I do what I can. After all, the greatest in the Kingdom Of God is the servant of all. The least of these should be at the top of our list. It is on His list. But He wants us to do it. He won't change His mind. Good. If He used a cattle prod on me, I don't think it would be inappropriate. Lol But seriously, if we got what we deserved, we'd all be burning in hell. Thank God for God. Shalom.

A dear older Christian Saturday-Coffee buddy did a study on O.T. Tithing, and explained that if a person had ~two sheep or less they didn't need to tithe, which is an interesting concept. And although I never followed up on his research I have no reason to doubt his finding.

But with today's cemetery graduates (sometimes spelled seminary) it seems an inconvenience to have anything less that every penny possible. So we'll never hear this aspect preached from the pulpit, which leads to another interesting concept, -- the HIRELING.

With Best Regards,
Bobby Jo

 

[Truman]

Thank you for that, i changed the last part of my post to stipulate an important caveat that you brought to my attention, 'within one's means'.
Sorry to hear about one of your sponsors, and your personal limitations. ... it only emphasizes the point that support for all is necessary.

Your last statement is huge. It shows me who you are. Blessings, my friend.

 

[Truman]

A dear older Christian Saturday-Coffee buddy did a study on O.T. Tithing, and explained that if a person had ~two sheep or less they didn't need to tithe, which is an interesting concept. And although I never followed up on his research I have no reason to doubt his finding.

But with today's cemetery graduates (sometimes spelled seminary) it seems an inconvenience to have anything less that every penny possible. So we'll never hear this aspect preached from the pulpit, which leads to another interesting concept, -- the HIRELING.

With Best Regards,
Bobby Jo

Hey, you spell seminary like I do. Lol Blessings.

 

[mailmandan]

Many churches teach that Christians are commanded to give a minimum of 10% of their income to their church. Others teach that preachers of these churches are turning the 10% tithe in the Old Testament, under the old covenant into a monetary, legalistic prescription for Christians under the new covenant. I even once heard a Pastor make a challenge to his congregation to give 10% of their income for 90 days and if God does not bless them then he will give them their money back.

In 2 Corinthians 9:5-7 we read: Therefore I thought it necessary to exhort the brethren to go to you ahead of time, and prepare your generous gift beforehand, which you had previously promised, that it may be ready as a matter of generosity and not as a grudging obligation. But this I say: He who sows sparingly will also reap sparingly, and he who sows bountifully will also reap bountifully. So let each one give as he purposes in his heart, not grudgingly or of necessity; for God loves a cheerful giver.

I don't see a "specific percentage" amount of income commanded for Christians to give in the New Testament, but I certainly believe in giving and not just to our church. I also believe that everything we own belongs to God.

 

[Bobby Jo]

... I also believe that everything we own belongs to God.

Matt. 5:42 Give to him who begs from you, and do not refuse him who would borrow from you.​

It would seem that a man is measured not by how much he has, but by how much he gives, in all things! -- But be wise.
Bobby Jo

 

[justbyfaith]

In Malachi 3:10 we have a promise associated with tithing that the Lord will open the windows of heaven and pour out for you a blessing that you will not be able to receive.

Giving that 10% apprehends the promise spoken of in Malachi 3:10.

Of course you can give more or less...if you sow sparingly, you will reap also sparingly; but if you sow bountifully, you will reap also bountifully. So then, less than 10% does not apprehend the promise of Malachi 3:10; while giving more than 10% promises more of a harvest. And giving 10% or more does in fact apprehend the promise of Malachi 3:10.

 

[farouk]

Many churches teach that Christians are commanded to give a minimum of 10% of their income to their church. Others teach that preachers of these churches are turning the 10% tithe in the Old Testament, under the old covenant into a monetary, legalistic prescription for Christians under the new covenant. I even once heard a Pastor make a challenge to his congregation to give 10% of their income for 90 days and if God does not bless them then he will give them their money back.

In 2 Corinthians 9:5-7 we read: Therefore I thought it necessary to exhort the brethren to go to you ahead of time, and prepare your generous gift beforehand, which you had previously promised, that it may be ready as a matter of generosity and not as a grudging obligation. But this I say: He who sows sparingly will also reap sparingly, and he who sows bountifully will also reap bountifully. So let each one give as he purposes in his heart, not grudgingly or of necessity; for God loves a cheerful giver.

I don't see a "specific percentage" amount of income commanded for Christians to give in the New Testament, but I certainly believe in giving and not just to our church. I also believe that everything we own belongs to God.

If ppl want to give more than 10% of their income, more power to them; but....it comes back to basic dispensational principles: OT tithing was to be given to the Levites. Where are the Levites in the church today? Hebrews 7 tells us that the priesthood was changed. Today, in the pilgrim church, it is freewill offerings which prevail; otherwise one will find reverend gentlemen trying to use the OT to take us back in one way or another to the old economy.

 

[justbyfaith]

If ppl want to give more than 10% of their income, more power to them; but....it comes back to basic dispensational principles: OT tithing was to be given to the Levites. Where are the Levites in the church today? Hebrews 7 tells us that the priesthood was changed. Today, in the pilgrim church, it is freewill offerings which prevail; otherwise one will find reverend gentlemen trying to use the OT to take us back in one way or another to the old economy.

I believe that Malachi 3:10 is profitable for doctrine, for correction, for reproof, and for instruction in righteousness.

 

[farouk]

I believe that Malachi 3:10 is profitable for doctrine, for correction, for reproof, and for instruction in righteousness.

It's a basic principle; Malachi, still under the old economy talks about the Levites; Hebrews 7 shows that they are gone, and shows what has taken their place.

1 Cor. 10.32 tells me there are Jews, Gentiles and the church of God. I don't see Gentile Levites. I don't see Levites in the church of God.

 

[justbyfaith]

Abraham tithed to Melchizedec; and this predated the law.

The new priesthood is according to the order of Melchizedec; and tithing is still a part.

 

[Bobby Jo]

... Hebrews 7 shows that they are gone, ...

You steal from GOD, and justify it by misconstruing Scripture. That's OK, I'm quite confident that GOD will still bless your household, -- yeah, not.

Bobby Jo