Touchy subject concerning “to put a yoke” around anothers neck they are not able to bear?

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VictoryinJesus

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Acts 15:8-10,24 And God, which knoweth the hearts, bare them witness, giving them the Holy Spirit, even as he did unto us; [9] And put no difference between us and them, purifying their hearts by faith. [10] Now therefore why tempt ye God, to put a yoke upon the neck of the disciples, which neither our fathers nor we were able to bear? [24] Forasmuch as we have heard, that certain which went out from us have troubled you with words, subverting your souls, saying, Ye must be circumcised, and keep the law: to whom we gave no such commandment:
 

VictoryinJesus

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Here is the question ...in the above it seemed one wanted to put a yoke upon another’s neck ...which neither “our fathers nor we were able to bear”

in the above it seems to point to “And put no difference between us and them, purifying their hearts by faith”

Jew or gentile ...having put no difference between us and them ...purifying their heart by faith.

could not the same be said for male and female ... and put no difference between male and female, purifying their hearts by faith.

could not the same be said for bond and free...and put no difference between bond and free, purifying their hearts by faith.

then why put a yoke or burden on Jew, gentiles, male, female, bond or free ...neither were able to bear alone?
 

Pearl

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Matthew 11:28-30
“Come to me, all you who are weary and burdened, and I will give you rest. Take my yoke upon you and learn from me, for I am gentle and humble in heart, and you will find rest for your souls. For my yoke is easy and my burden is light.”
 

Enoch111

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then why put a yoke or burden on Jew, gentiles, male, female, bond or free ...neither were able to bear alone?
Who are you referring to as those putting yokes on others? People are freely choosing their bondages. Some are in bondage to false religions or false ideologies, others to addictions, others to materialism, etc. So people are choosing their own slavery. Those who reject the Gospel are putting themselves under Satan's bondage. The COVID masks are a sign of bondage to fear-mongerers and liars. Taking those bogus vaccines is a sign of bondage to so-called experts who are actually expert manipulators. And the list goes on.
 

amadeus

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Dictators in the nations of men make the rules for other people and the worst dictators will use as much force they deem necessary to accomplish his [the dictator's] own purposes. That is not a good thing for even a benevolent dictator with the best of intentions doesn't see everything and makes mistakes... sometimes very serious mistakes. Then again how many benevolent dictators have there been?

So it too often is seen in churches, when the leadership (single person or group or organization) has figured out how everyone should live their lives for God, set up precise rules, and then strives to enforce those black and white rules so that everyone will be saved. God does not do that and those ministers He really does give to us [And he gave some, apostles; and some, prophets; and some, evangelists; and some, pastors and teachers ... Eph. 4:11] if they are paying attention to God themselves, I believe, also will not do it that way.

Men often want to take the written scriptures and set them out as God's rules...but applying their own definitions and interpretations as if God made them the bosses of everyone else. They are supposed to be God's gifts to work God's purpose:

"For the perfecting of the saints, for the work of the ministry, for the edifying of the body of Christ:
Till we all come in the unity of the faith, and of the knowledge of the Son of God, unto a perfect man, unto the measure of the stature of the fulness of Christ:
That we henceforth be no more children, tossed to and fro, and carried about with every wind of doctrine, by the sleight of men, and cunning craftiness, whereby they lie in wait to deceive;
But speaking the truth in love, may grow up into him in all things, which is the head, even Christ:
From whom the whole body fitly joined together and compacted by that which every joint supplieth, according to the effectual working in the measure of every part, maketh increase of the body unto the edifying of itself in love." Eph 4:12-16

The purpose of those gifts [God given ministers] is to minister to others until others are able to fit into the Body of Christ to and perform their own functions as part of the Body. The ministers should be striving to work themselves out of a job.

Our only Head is to be Jesus.
 
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VictoryinJesus

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Dictators in the nations of men make the rules for other people and the worst dictators will use as much force they deem necessary to accomplish his [the dictator's] own purposes. That is not a good thing for even a benevolent dictator with the best of intentions doesn't see everything and makes mistakes... sometimes very serious mistakes. Then again how many benevolent dictators have there been?

So it too often is seen in churches, when the leadership (single person or group or organization) has figured out how everyone should live their lives for God, set up precise rules, and then strives to enforce those black and white rules so that everyone will be saved. God does not do that and those ministers He really does give to us [And he gave some, apostles; and some, prophets; and some, evangelists; and some, pastors and teachers ... Eph. 4:11] if they are paying attention to God themselves, I believe, also will not do it that way.

Men often want to take the written scriptures and set them out as God's rules...but applying their own definitions and interpretations as if God made them the bosses of everyone else. They are supposed to be God's gifts to work God's purpose:

"For the perfecting of the saints, for the work of the ministry, for the edifying of the body of Christ:
Till we all come in the unity of the faith, and of the knowledge of the Son of God, unto a perfect man, unto the measure of the stature of the fulness of Christ:
That we henceforth be no more children, tossed to and fro, and carried about with every wind of doctrine, by the sleight of men, and cunning craftiness, whereby they lie in wait to deceive;
But speaking the truth in love, may grow up into him in all things, which is the head, even Christ:
From whom the whole body fitly joined together and compacted by that which every joint supplieth, according to the effectual working in the measure of every part, maketh increase of the body unto the edifying of itself in love." Eph 4:12-16

The purpose of those gifts [God given ministers] is to minister to others until others are able to fit into the Body of Christ to and perform their own functions as part of the Body. The ministers should be striving to work themselves out of a job.

Our only Head is to be Jesus.


1 Timothy 6:1-3 Let as many servants as are under the yoke count their own masters worthy of all honour, that the name of God and his doctrine be not blasphemed. [2] And they that have believing masters, let them not despise them, because they are brethren; but rather do them service, because they are faithful and beloved, partakers of the benefit. These things teach and exhort. [3] If any man teach otherwise, and consent not to wholesome words, even the words of our Lord Jesus Christ, and to the doctrine which is according to godliness;

Psalm 51:17 The sacrifices of God are a broken spirit: a broken and a contrite heart, O God, thou wilt not despise.

James 2:6 But ye have despised the poor. Do not rich men oppress you, and draw you before the judgment seats?

1 Thessalonians 5:12-20 And we beseech you, brethren, to know them which labour among you, and are over you in the Lord, and admonish you; [13] And to esteem them very highly in love for their work's sake. And be at peace among yourselves. [14] Now we exhort you, brethren, warn them that are unruly, comfort the feebleminded, support the weak, be patient toward all men. [15] See that none render evil for evil unto any man ; but ever follow that which is good, both among yourselves, and to all men. [16] Rejoice evermore. [17] Pray without ceasing. [18] In every thing give thanks: for this is the will of God in Christ Jesus concerning you. [19] Quench not the Spirit. [20] Despise not prophesyings.

Isaiah 53:2-5 For he shall grow up before him as a tender plant, and as a root out of a dry ground: he hath no form nor comeliness; and when we shall see him, there is no beauty that we should desire him. [3] He is despised and rejected of men; a man of sorrows, and acquainted with grief: and we hid as it were our faces from him; he was despised, and we esteemed him not. [4] Surely he hath borne our griefs, and carried our sorrows: yet we did esteem him stricken, smitten of God, and afflicted. [5] But he was wounded for our transgressions, he was bruised for our iniquities: the chastisement of our peace was upon him; and with his stripes we are healed.

...Psalm 22:24 For he hath not despised nor abhorred the affliction of the afflicted; neither hath he hid his face from him; but when he cried unto him, he heard.

I’m sorry but was considering ‘despise’
 
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Amazed@grace

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Acts 15:8-10,24 And God, which knoweth the hearts, bare them witness, giving them the Holy Spirit, even as he did unto us; [9] And put no difference between us and them, purifying their hearts by faith. [10] Now therefore why tempt ye God, to put a yoke upon the neck of the disciples, which neither our fathers nor we were able to bear? [24] Forasmuch as we have heard, that certain which went out from us have troubled you with words, subverting your souls, saying, Ye must be circumcised, and keep the law: to whom we gave no such commandment:
Who are those certain ones that are referred to?
 

Ferris Bueller

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Who are those certain ones that are referred to?
Believers who belonged to the party of the Pharisees.....

1Certain people came down from Judea to Antioch and were teaching the believers: “Unless you are circumcised, according to the custom taught by Moses, you cannot be saved.” 2This brought Paul and Barnabas into sharp dispute and debate with them. So Paul and Barnabas were appointed, along with some other believers, to go up to Jerusalem to see the apostles and elders about this question. 3The church sent them on their way, and as they traveled through Phoenicia and Samaria, they told how the Gentiles had been converted. This news made all the believers very glad. 4When they came to Jerusalem, they were welcomed by the church and the apostles and elders, to whom they reported everything God had done through them.

5Then some of the believers who belonged to the party of the Pharisees stood up and said, “The Gentiles must be circumcised and required to keep the law of Moses.”

6The apostles and elders met to consider this question.
 

Amazed@grace

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Believers who belonged to the party of the Pharisees.....

1Certain people came down from Judea to Antioch and were teaching the believers: “Unless you are circumcised, according to the custom taught by Moses, you cannot be saved.” 2This brought Paul and Barnabas into sharp dispute and debate with them. So Paul and Barnabas were appointed, along with some other believers, to go up to Jerusalem to see the apostles and elders about this question. 3The church sent them on their way, and as they traveled through Phoenicia and Samaria, they told how the Gentiles had been converted. This news made all the believers very glad. 4When they came to Jerusalem, they were welcomed by the church and the apostles and elders, to whom they reported everything God had done through them.

5Then some of the believers who belonged to the party of the Pharisees stood up and said, “The Gentiles must be circumcised and required to keep the law of Moses.”

6The apostles and elders met to consider this question.
Thank you.:)
 

VictoryinJesus

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"Certain which went out from us", are the gentiles?

you are right. Thanks for pointing that out. Still maybe I misunderstand but as you pointed out those certain that went out from us(the disciples) ...are those certain that went out the same as those here? 1 John 2:18-19 Little children, it is the last time: and as ye have heard that antichrist shall come, even now are there many antichrists; whereby we know that it is the last time. [19] They went out from us, but they were not of us; for if they had been of us, they would no doubt have continued with us: but they went out, that they might be made manifest that they were not all of us.

And again, unless I’ve misunderstood those that went out, or stood up ...wanted gentiles to keep the whole law including circumcising of the flesh ...and is this not what was spoken of as their wanting them to do what they themselves couldn’t do which is to not fail in any point of performing the whole law. Like when Jesus Christ said they bind heavy burdens on others but will lift a finger to help? Trying to understand myself?


Matthew 23:3-5 All therefore whatsoever they bid you observe, that observe and do; but do not ye after their works: for they say, and do not. [4] For they bind heavy burdens and grievous to be borne, and lay them on men's shoulders; but they themselves will not move them with one of their fingers. [5] But all their works they do for to be seen of men: they make broad their phylacteries, and enlarge the borders of their garments,

o_O
 

Amazed@grace

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you are right. Thanks for pointing that out. Still maybe I misunderstand but as you pointed out those certain that went out from us(the disciples) ...are those certain that went out the same as those here? 1 John 2:18-19 Little children, it is the last time: and as ye have heard that antichrist shall come, even now are there many antichrists; whereby we know that it is the last time. [19] They went out from us, but they were not of us; for if they had been of us, they would no doubt have continued with us: but they went out, that they might be made manifest that they were not all of
And again, unless I’ve misunderstood those that went out, or stood up ...wanted gentiles to keep the whole law including circumcising of the flesh ...and is this not what was spoken of as their wanting them to do what they themselves couldn’t do which is to not fail in any point of performing the whole law. Like when Jesus Christ said they bind heavy burdens on others but will lift a finger to help? Trying to understand myself?


Matthew 23:3-5 All therefore whatsoever they bid you observe, that observe and do; but do not ye after their works: for they say, and do not. [4] For they bind heavy burdens and grievous to be borne, and lay them on men's shoulders; but they themselves will not move them with one of their fingers. [5] But all their works they do for to be seen of men: they make broad their phylacteries, and enlarge the borders of their garments,

o_O
I was seeking clarification myself. Then someone replied and noted those that went out in the 1st John verse were Pharisees.

IhI think those in Matthew 23 are people who thought themselves disciples and walked with Jesus for a time but then lost their faith in him and his message.
I think that's why it says they went out because they were not one of us.
I don't think they could have been gentiles but like the other disciples they were Jews.
 

robert derrick

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Who are you referring to as those putting yokes on others? People are freely choosing their bondages. Some are in bondage to false religions or false ideologies, others to addictions, others to materialism, etc. So people are choosing their own slavery.

While this is of course true, we shall all individually stand before God in judgement, He will also hold false teachers, etc... responsible for any hurt and harm upon them that are deceived and led astray by their teachings.

He held the serpent responsible for deceiving Eve, after demanding an account from themselves for their actions, which He will also do with them that feed the sheep of God false doctrine, burdens, etc...

I Cor 3:17: If any man defile the temple of God, him shall God destroy; for the temple of God is holy, which temple ye are...

Most people view this a warning about personal sins, which of course is true, only we can defile ourselves by our words and deeds; however, the whole chapter is in context of Ministry, and the warning is particularly to them that would minister to the believers wrongly, and that they are doing so to the Temple of God. And so, if anyone minister anything that is not of Scripture, and any hearer takes heed to it to do it, and ends up in transgression of Law of Christ, they shall bear their judgment, but likewise shall the false teacher be destroyed along with them.

The Jezebel teacher in Rev 2 is such an example: Behold, I will cast her into a bed, and them that commit adultery with her into great tribulation, except they repent of their deeds...

Both the false teacher and the hearers that obey shall all be cast into the bed of transgression together.
 
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marks

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Here is the question ...in the above it seemed one wanted to put a yoke upon another’s neck ...which neither “our fathers nor we were able to bear”

in the above it seems to point to “And put no difference between us and them, purifying their hearts by faith”

Jew or gentile ...having put no difference between us and them ...purifying their heart by faith.

could not the same be said for male and female ... and put no difference between male and female, purifying their hearts by faith.

could not the same be said for bond and free...and put no difference between bond and free, purifying their hearts by faith.

then why put a yoke or burden on Jew, gentiles, male, female, bond or free ...neither were able to bear alone?
We shouldn't!

We are all purified through faith, so insisting anyone must keep the Law is to put that yoke of bondage on them.

Yes, we are all just people before our Creator. We see ourselves different from each other, but God is not a respecter of persons.

Much love!
 

robert derrick

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We do keep the law. Of Christ, not of Moses. Afterall, what point of law, as James talked about, do you not keep? Drunkenness? Fornication? Respect of persons? Keeping the Law of Christ simply means you are not being a transgressor with God. And being born again of His Spirit simply means we have all power of God to NOT be a transgressor.

The law that could not be kept by man without sin was the law of God by Moses, except of course by Jesus, which is the whole point of the law. To show us that we cannot stand in righteousness before God without God living in us.
 

robert derrick

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“Come to me, all you who are weary and burdened, and I will give you rest. Take my yoke upon you and learn from me, for I am gentle and humble in heart, and you will find rest for your souls. For my yoke is easy and my burden is light.”

Jesus' yoke is easy. Man's yoke is hard. The real problem comes when men add their own rules and commandments (Matthew 7:7) (Titus 1:14).

Taking away from Scripture is not the real problem for believers, because it is easy to spot. It is adding to Scripture that is the real snare. Afterall, it was adding to the Scripture a rule of man (Neither shall you touch it), that led directly to the transgression of man in the garden.

There are two sources of burdens for Christians that God never wrote, and only men add: Adding law of Moses from the Old Covenant to that of Christ in the New Covenant, and adding personal rules to the law of Christ.

People can add whatever rules, disciplines, etc... to their own lives in Christ. Just dont stop preaching, teaching, ministering them as that of God that ALL believers must obey. That's how false teachers make themselves false christs and heads of the body, instead of Jesus.