Where was the Sabbath Abolished?

[Hobie]

If the Sabbath was abolished, there would be many verses and much text to show it, yet there is none. The apostles would have had many discussions and the councils at Jerusalem would have written at least one with a determination of it being abolished and yet there is nothing. Paul exhorts in Corinthians that Circumcision is nothing in comparison to the Ten Commandments.

1 Corinthians 7:19
Circumcision is nothing, and uncircumcision is nothing, but the keeping of the commandments of God.

Since there are more than forty verses and up to ten verses at a time clearly stating that Circumcision of the flesh is a yoke of bondage and abolished, how many scriptures would you expect stating the Sabbath was abolished or changed to Sunday? Perhaps seventy or more? The fact is there is not even one verse that says, 'The Sabbath is abolished' or is now Sunday.

Acts 15:1-19 The Council at Jerusalem​

1 Certain people came down from Judea to Antioch and were teaching the believers: “Unless you are circumcised, according to the custom taught by Moses, you cannot be saved.” 2 This brought Paul and Barnabas into sharp dispute and debate with them. So Paul and Barnabas were appointed, along with some other believers, to go up to Jerusalem to see the apostles and elders about this question. 3 The church sent them on their way, and as they traveled through Phoenicia and Samaria, they told how the Gentiles had been converted. This news made all the believers very glad. 4 When they came to Jerusalem, they were welcomed by the church and the apostles and elders, to whom they reported everything God had done through them.
5 Then some of the believers who belonged to the party of the Pharisees stood up and said, “The Gentiles must be circumcised and required to keep the law of Moses.”
6 The apostles and elders met to consider this question. 7 After much discussion, Peter got up and addressed them: “Brothers, you know that some time ago God made a choice among you that the Gentiles might hear from my lips the message of the gospel and believe. 8 God, who knows the heart, showed that he accepted them by giving the Holy Spirit to them, just as he did to us. 9 He did not discriminate between us and them, for he purified their hearts by faith. 10 Now then, why do you try to test God by putting on the necks of Gentiles a yoke that neither we nor our ancestors have been able to bear? 11 No! We believe it is through the grace of our Lord Jesus that we are saved, just as they are.”
12 The whole assembly became silent as they listened to Barnabas and Paul telling about the signs and wonders God had done among the Gentiles through them. 13 When they finished, James spoke up. “Brothers,” he said, “listen to me. 14 Simon[a] has described to us how God first intervened to choose a people for his name from the Gentiles. 15 The words of the prophets are in agreement with this, as it is written:
16 “‘After this I will return
and rebuild David’s fallen tent.
Its ruins I will rebuild,
and I will restore it,
17 that the rest of mankind may seek the Lord,
even all the Gentiles who bear my name,
says the Lord, who does these things’[b]—
18 things known from long ago.[c]
19 “It is my judgment, therefore, that we should not make it difficult for the Gentiles who are turning to God. 20 Instead we should write to them, telling them to abstain from food polluted by idols, from sexual immorality, from the meat of strangled animals and from blood. 21 For the law of Moses has been preached in every city from the earliest times and is read in the synagogues on every Sabbath.”

The Ten Commandments are the only thing that God personally spoke and then personally etched His Law into stone tablets with His own finger. Yet there is not one clear scripture or commandment from Christ or even a direction from a apostle or as you can see from the Jerusalem Council to abolish the Sabbath anywhere in scripture, just a couple of erroneous assumptions. One of God's Commandments supposedly changes or is abolished and we do not have even one clear verse. Why not? The answer is simple. It was never abolished or changed to Sunday by the authority of God so no such scripture exists..

 

[Randy Kluth]

Jesus, in declaring that the temple would be destroyed, rendered the Old Covenant with its entire set of laws void. Then he declared himself as the source of Eternal Life, requiring attention to the moral commands of God based on his own spirituality.

This was a complete shift from one covenant to another, leaving behind all of the 613 requirements given under the previous administration. In effect people were to devote themselves to be like Jesus, recognizing that his redemption was superior to redemption that had been available, to limited effect, under the Temple Law.

Jesus explicitly said that the previous Covenant, including all 613 requirements, were valid and binding *until* it was completely fulfilled in himself. He was the source of redemption alone, and all works done to accomplish the same were declared thereby inadequate.

Matt 5.17 “Do not think that I have come to abolish the Law or the Prophets; I have not come to abolish them but to fulfill them."

Jesus declared that his fulfillment of the Law is *eternal,* thus displacing the requirements of the Law, including Sabbath Law, forever.

 

[Randy Kluth]

I recently posted this on another forum, explaining that the Moral Law is eternal, whereas the Covenant of Law was temporary....

1 Timothy 1.8 We know that the law is good if one uses it properly. 9 We also know that the law is made not for the righteous but for lawbreakers and rebels, the ungodly and sinful, the unholy and irreligious, for those who kill their fathers or mothers, for murderers, 10 for the sexually immoral, for those practicing homosexuality, for slave traders and liars and perjurers—and for whatever else is contrary to the sound doctrine 11 that conforms to the gospel concerning the glory of the blessed God, which he entrusted to me.

This shows us that the Law, in the NT era, is still useful even though the Covenant of the Law is passe. It still functions as the word of God in the sense that God has not changed, His morality has not changed. Some call this the "Moral Law." It is consistent in all of God's laws because no matter what covenant is in effect, God's holy character and His demands upon Man morally remains the same.

Yes, only Jesus could fulfill the Law.

The point I was trying to make is that the assumption in this verse being made is that the Law is no longer a valid covenant. It is therefore being argued that the Law still has some value in pointing us to God's moral law being fulfilled in Christ. Why else would it be argued that the Law still has some value if it was already believed that it is an ongoing covenant?

In walking in Jesus' ways we continue to walk in righteousness just as Israel had under the Old Covenant. The requirements that the priests do certain things on behalf of Israel is gone. Christ has fulfilled a new priestly requirement, obtaining for us Eternal Life. We do have to walk in his morality, because he is the morality behind both covenants.

 

[Arthur81]

If the Sabbath was abolished, there would be many verses and much text to show it, yet there is none. The apostles would have had many discussions and the councils at Jerusalem would have written at least one with a determination of it being abolished and yet there is nothing. Paul exhorts in Corinthians that Circumcision is nothing in comparison to the Ten Commandments.

1 Corinthians 7:19
Circumcision is nothing, and uncircumcision is nothing, but the keeping of the commandments of God.

Since there are more than forty verses and up to ten verses at a time clearly stating that Circumcision of the flesh is a yoke of bondage and abolished, how many scriptures would you expect stating the Sabbath was abolished or changed to Sunday? Perhaps seventy or more? The fact is there is not even one verse that says, 'The Sabbath is abolished' or is now Sunday.

Acts 15:1-19 The Council at Jerusalem​

1 Certain people came down from Judea to Antioch and were teaching the believers: “Unless you are circumcised, according to the custom taught by Moses, you cannot be saved.” 2 This brought Paul and Barnabas into sharp dispute and debate with them. So Paul and Barnabas were appointed, along with some other believers, to go up to Jerusalem to see the apostles and elders about this question. 3 The church sent them on their way, and as they traveled through Phoenicia and Samaria, they told how the Gentiles had been converted. This news made all the believers very glad. 4 When they came to Jerusalem, they were welcomed by the church and the apostles and elders, to whom they reported everything God had done through them.
5 Then some of the believers who belonged to the party of the Pharisees stood up and said, “The Gentiles must be circumcised and required to keep the law of Moses.”
6 The apostles and elders met to consider this question. 7 After much discussion, Peter got up and addressed them: “Brothers, you know that some time ago God made a choice among you that the Gentiles might hear from my lips the message of the gospel and believe. 8 God, who knows the heart, showed that he accepted them by giving the Holy Spirit to them, just as he did to us. 9 He did not discriminate between us and them, for he purified their hearts by faith. 10 Now then, why do you try to test God by putting on the necks of Gentiles a yoke that neither we nor our ancestors have been able to bear? 11 No! We believe it is through the grace of our Lord Jesus that we are saved, just as they are.”
12 The whole assembly became silent as they listened to Barnabas and Paul telling about the signs and wonders God had done among the Gentiles through them. 13 When they finished, James spoke up. “Brothers,” he said, “listen to me. 14 Simon[a] has described to us how God first intervened to choose a people for his name from the Gentiles. 15 The words of the prophets are in agreement with this, as it is written:
16 “‘After this I will return
and rebuild David’s fallen tent.
Its ruins I will rebuild,
and I will restore it,
17 that the rest of mankind may seek the Lord,
even all the Gentiles who bear my name,
says the Lord, who does these things’[b]—
18 things known from long ago.[c]
19 “It is my judgment, therefore, that we should not make it difficult for the Gentiles who are turning to God. 20 Instead we should write to them, telling them to abstain from food polluted by idols, from sexual immorality, from the meat of strangled animals and from blood. 21 For the law of Moses has been preached in every city from the earliest times and is read in the synagogues on every Sabbath.”

The Ten Commandments are the only thing that God personally spoke and then personally etched His Law into stone tablets with His own finger. Yet there is not one clear scripture or commandment from Christ or even a direction from a apostle or as you can see from the Jerusalem Council to abolish the Sabbath anywhere in scripture, just a couple of erroneous assumptions. One of God's Commandments supposedly changes or is abolished and we do not have even one clear verse. Why not? The answer is simple. It was never abolished or changed to Sunday by the authority of God so no such scripture exists..

Where or when was the Sabbath abolished? I'll give you the passages. Where do you find the command to keep the Sabbath? It is in the Old Covenant, specifically in the Ten Commandments. What happened to those Ten Commandments at the first Advent?

"In that he saith, A new covenant, he hath made the first old. Now that which decayeth and waxeth old is ready to vanish away." (Heb 8:13 KJV)
what was in the Old Covenant that was to vanish away?
"And he was there with the LORD forty days and forty nights; he did neither eat bread, nor drink water. And he wrote upon the tables the words of the covenant, the ten commandments." (Exod 34:28 KJV)

There is another specific passage on this:

"But if the ministration of death, written and engraven in stones, was glorious, so that the children of Israel could not stedfastly behold the face of Moses for the glory of his countenance; which glory was to be done away: How shall not the ministration of the spirit be rather glorious? For if the ministration of condemnation be glory, much more doth the ministration of righteousness exceed in glory. For even that which was made glorious had no glory in this respect, by reason of the glory that excelleth. For if that which is done away was glorious, much more that which remaineth is glorious." (2Cor 3:7-11 KJV)

True believers in Christ who have been born from above, live in the New Covenant, not the Old Covenant. The early church was largely made up of Jews and to evangelize, Paul met with Jews and others on the Sabbath. The church met on the first day of the week, the "Lord's Day", to honor the resurrection of Jesus Christ. As honoring the Lord's Supper, they honored the Lord's Day. Gradually as more Gentiles were brought into the church, who were NEVER under the Old Covenant, meeting on the Sabbath by the Jews faded away. I disagree with my Reformed brethren that the First Day of the Week is a "Sabbath".

 

[Robert Pate]

If the Sabbath was abolished, there would be many verses and much text to show it, yet there is none. The apostles would have had many discussions and the councils at Jerusalem would have written at least one with a determination of it being abolished and yet there is nothing. Paul exhorts in Corinthians that Circumcision is nothing in comparison to the Ten Commandments.

1 Corinthians 7:19
Circumcision is nothing, and uncircumcision is nothing, but the keeping of the commandments of God.

Since there are more than forty verses and up to ten verses at a time clearly stating that Circumcision of the flesh is a yoke of bondage and abolished, how many scriptures would you expect stating the Sabbath was abolished or changed to Sunday? Perhaps seventy or more? The fact is there is not even one verse that says, 'The Sabbath is abolished' or is now Sunday.

Acts 15:1-19 The Council at Jerusalem​

1 Certain people came down from Judea to Antioch and were teaching the believers: “Unless you are circumcised, according to the custom taught by Moses, you cannot be saved.” 2 This brought Paul and Barnabas into sharp dispute and debate with them. So Paul and Barnabas were appointed, along with some other believers, to go up to Jerusalem to see the apostles and elders about this question. 3 The church sent them on their way, and as they traveled through Phoenicia and Samaria, they told how the Gentiles had been converted. This news made all the believers very glad. 4 When they came to Jerusalem, they were welcomed by the church and the apostles and elders, to whom they reported everything God had done through them.
5 Then some of the believers who belonged to the party of the Pharisees stood up and said, “The Gentiles must be circumcised and required to keep the law of Moses.”
6 The apostles and elders met to consider this question. 7 After much discussion, Peter got up and addressed them: “Brothers, you know that some time ago God made a choice among you that the Gentiles might hear from my lips the message of the gospel and believe. 8 God, who knows the heart, showed that he accepted them by giving the Holy Spirit to them, just as he did to us. 9 He did not discriminate between us and them, for he purified their hearts by faith. 10 Now then, why do you try to test God by putting on the necks of Gentiles a yoke that neither we nor our ancestors have been able to bear? 11 No! We believe it is through the grace of our Lord Jesus that we are saved, just as they are.”
12 The whole assembly became silent as they listened to Barnabas and Paul telling about the signs and wonders God had done among the Gentiles through them. 13 When they finished, James spoke up. “Brothers,” he said, “listen to me. 14 Simon[a] has described to us how God first intervened to choose a people for his name from the Gentiles. 15 The words of the prophets are in agreement with this, as it is written:
16 “‘After this I will return
and rebuild David’s fallen tent.
Its ruins I will rebuild,
and I will restore it,
17 that the rest of mankind may seek the Lord,
even all the Gentiles who bear my name,
says the Lord, who does these things’[b]—
18 things known from long ago.[c]
19 “It is my judgment, therefore, that we should not make it difficult for the Gentiles who are turning to God. 20 Instead we should write to them, telling them to abstain from food polluted by idols, from sexual immorality, from the meat of strangled animals and from blood. 21 For the law of Moses has been preached in every city from the earliest times and is read in the synagogues on every Sabbath.”

The Ten Commandments are the only thing that God personally spoke and then personally etched His Law into stone tablets with His own finger. Yet there is not one clear scripture or commandment from Christ or even a direction from a apostle or as you can see from the Jerusalem Council to abolish the Sabbath anywhere in scripture, just a couple of erroneous assumptions. One of God's Commandments supposedly changes or is abolished and we do not have even one clear verse. Why not? The answer is simple. It was never abolished or changed to Sunday by the authority of God so no such scripture exists..

The law which includes Sabbath keeping has been abolished, Ephesians 2:15. Jesus nailed it to his cross, Colossians 2:14. Under the New Covenant the just shall live by faith, Romans 1:17. To be under the law or subject to it is to be under the curse, Galatians 3:10.

 

[Arthur81]

I recently posted this on another forum, explaining that the Moral Law is eternal, whereas the Covenant of Law was temporary....

1 Timothy 1.8 We know that the law is good if one uses it properly. 9 We also know that the law is made not for the righteous but for lawbreakers and rebels, the ungodly and sinful, the unholy and irreligious, for those who kill their fathers or mothers, for murderers, 10 for the sexually immoral, for those practicing homosexuality, for slave traders and liars and perjurers—and for whatever else is contrary to the sound doctrine 11 that conforms to the gospel concerning the glory of the blessed God, which he entrusted to me.

This shows us that the Law, in the NT era, is still useful even though the Covenant of the Law is passe. It still functions as the word of God in the sense that God has not changed, His morality has not changed. Some call this the "Moral Law." It is consistent in all of God's laws because no matter what covenant is in effect, God's holy character and His demands upon Man morally remains the same.

Yes, only Jesus could fulfill the Law.

The point I was trying to make is that the assumption in this verse being made is that the Law is no longer a valid covenant. It is therefore being argued that the Law still has some value in pointing us to God's moral law being fulfilled in Christ. Why else would it be argued that the Law still has some value if it was already believed that it is an ongoing covenant?

In walking in Jesus' ways we continue to walk in righteousness just as Israel had under the Old Covenant. The requirements that the priests do certain things on behalf of Israel is gone. Christ has fulfilled a new priestly requirement, obtaining for us Eternal Life. We do have to walk in his morality, because he is the morality behind both covenants.

Randy, I think we agree on this matter. I embrace the 1646 First London Confession of Faith as best representing my understanding of Scripture. There is an Appendix to that Confession written by Benjamin Cox and on law it reads:

"IX

Though we that believe in Christ, be not under the law, but under grace, Rom.6:14; yet we know that we are not lawless, or left to live without a rule; “not without law to God, but under law to Christ,” 1 Cor.9:21. The Gospel of Jesus Christ is a law, or commanding rule unto us; whereby, and in obedience whereunto, we are taught to live soberly, righteously, and godly in this present world, Titus 2:11,12; the directions of Christ in His evangelical word guiding us unto, and in this sober, righteous, and godly walking, 1 Tim.1:10,11.

X

Though we be not now sent to the law as it was in the hand of Moses, to be commanded thereby, yet Christ in His Gospel teacheth and commandeth us to walk in the same way of righteousness and holiness that God by Moses did command the Israelites to walk in, all the commandments of the Second Table being still delivered unto us by Christ, and all the commandments of the First Table also (as touching the life and spirit of them) in this epitome or brief sum, “Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thine heart, etc.,” Matt.22:37,38,39,40; Rom.13:8,9,10."

An Appendix to the Baptist Confession of Faith – by Benjamin Cox (1646) | Reformed Theology at A Puritan's Mind

I see the ever present, moral law of God in the book of Genesis before Moses existed, and I see it in the New Covenant. This "moral law" I believe is largely what is spoken of that the Gentiles had instinctively, written on the heart -

"When Gentiles, who do not possess the law, do instinctively what the law requires, these, though not having the law, are a law to themselves. They show that what the law requires is written on their hearts, to which their own conscience also bears witness; and their conflicting thoughts will accuse or perhaps excuse them on the day when, according to my gospel, God, through Jesus Christ, will judge the secret thoughts of all." (Rom 2:14-16 NRSV)

 

[atpollard]

I embrace the 1646 First London Confession of Faith as best representing my understanding of Scripture.

Go PARTICULAR BAPTISTS!

 

[atpollard]

Where was the Sabbath Abolished?​

Golgotha. It was abolished ON the Cross AT Golgotha.

 

[SavedInHim]

If the Sabbath was abolished, there would be many verses and much text to show it, yet there is none. The apostles would have had many discussions and the councils at Jerusalem would have written at least one with a determination of it being abolished and yet there is nothing. Paul exhorts in Corinthians that Circumcision is nothing in comparison to the Ten Commandments.

1 Corinthians 7:19
Circumcision is nothing, and uncircumcision is nothing, but the keeping of the commandments of God.

Since there are more than forty verses and up to ten verses at a time clearly stating that Circumcision of the flesh is a yoke of bondage and abolished, how many scriptures would you expect stating the Sabbath was abolished or changed to Sunday? Perhaps seventy or more? The fact is there is not even one verse that says, 'The Sabbath is abolished' or is now Sunday.

Acts 15:1-19 The Council at Jerusalem​

1 Certain people came down from Judea to Antioch and were teaching the believers: “Unless you are circumcised, according to the custom taught by Moses, you cannot be saved.” 2 This brought Paul and Barnabas into sharp dispute and debate with them. So Paul and Barnabas were appointed, along with some other believers, to go up to Jerusalem to see the apostles and elders about this question. 3 The church sent them on their way, and as they traveled through Phoenicia and Samaria, they told how the Gentiles had been converted. This news made all the believers very glad. 4 When they came to Jerusalem, they were welcomed by the church and the apostles and elders, to whom they reported everything God had done through them.
5 Then some of the believers who belonged to the party of the Pharisees stood up and said, “The Gentiles must be circumcised and required to keep the law of Moses.”
6 The apostles and elders met to consider this question. 7 After much discussion, Peter got up and addressed them: “Brothers, you know that some time ago God made a choice among you that the Gentiles might hear from my lips the message of the gospel and believe. 8 God, who knows the heart, showed that he accepted them by giving the Holy Spirit to them, just as he did to us. 9 He did not discriminate between us and them, for he purified their hearts by faith. 10 Now then, why do you try to test God by putting on the necks of Gentiles a yoke that neither we nor our ancestors have been able to bear? 11 No! We believe it is through the grace of our Lord Jesus that we are saved, just as they are.”
12 The whole assembly became silent as they listened to Barnabas and Paul telling about the signs and wonders God had done among the Gentiles through them. 13 When they finished, James spoke up. “Brothers,” he said, “listen to me. 14 Simon[a] has described to us how God first intervened to choose a people for his name from the Gentiles. 15 The words of the prophets are in agreement with this, as it is written:
16 “‘After this I will return
and rebuild David’s fallen tent.
Its ruins I will rebuild,
and I will restore it,
17 that the rest of mankind may seek the Lord,
even all the Gentiles who bear my name,
says the Lord, who does these things’[b]—
18 things known from long ago.[c]
19 “It is my judgment, therefore, that we should not make it difficult for the Gentiles who are turning to God. 20 Instead we should write to them, telling them to abstain from food polluted by idols, from sexual immorality, from the meat of strangled animals and from blood. 21 For the law of Moses has been preached in every city from the earliest times and is read in the synagogues on every Sabbath.”

The Ten Commandments are the only thing that God personally spoke and then personally etched His Law into stone tablets with His own finger. Yet there is not one clear scripture or commandment from Christ or even a direction from a apostle or as you can see from the Jerusalem Council to abolish the Sabbath anywhere in scripture, just a couple of erroneous assumptions. One of God's Commandments supposedly changes or is abolished and we do not have even one clear verse. Why not? The answer is simple. It was never abolished or changed to Sunday by the authority of God so no such scripture exists..

The Sabbath was a type and shadow; Christ was its fulfillment. The Sabbath day wasn't abolished, it was simply made optional. Whether you observe the Sabbath or you don't, the important thing is that you do it unto the Lord. No one has the right to judge another by whether or not they keep the Sabbath.

 

[Randy Kluth]

Randy, I think we agree on this matter. I embrace the 1646 First London Confession of Faith as best representing my understanding of Scripture. There is an Appendix to that Confession written by Benjamin Cox and on law it reads:

"IX

Though we that believe in Christ, be not under the law, but under grace, Rom.6:14; yet we know that we are not lawless, or left to live without a rule; “not without law to God, but under law to Christ,” 1 Cor.9:21. The Gospel of Jesus Christ is a law, or commanding rule unto us; whereby, and in obedience whereunto, we are taught to live soberly, righteously, and godly in this present world, Titus 2:11,12; the directions of Christ in His evangelical word guiding us unto, and in this sober, righteous, and godly walking, 1 Tim.1:10,11.

X

Though we be not now sent to the law as it was in the hand of Moses, to be commanded thereby, yet Christ in His Gospel teacheth and commandeth us to walk in the same way of righteousness and holiness that God by Moses did command the Israelites to walk in, all the commandments of the Second Table being still delivered unto us by Christ, and all the commandments of the First Table also (as touching the life and spirit of them) in this epitome or brief sum, “Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thine heart, etc.,” Matt.22:37,38,39,40; Rom.13:8,9,10."

An Appendix to the Baptist Confession of Faith – by Benjamin Cox (1646) | Reformed Theology at A Puritan's Mind

I see the ever present, moral law of God in the book of Genesis before Moses existed, and I see it in the New Covenant. This "moral law" I believe is largely what is spoken of that the Gentiles had instinctively, written on the heart -

"When Gentiles, who do not possess the law, do instinctively what the law requires, these, though not having the law, are a law to themselves. They show that what the law requires is written on their hearts, to which their own conscience also bears witness; and their conflicting thoughts will accuse or perhaps excuse them on the day when, according to my gospel, God, through Jesus Christ, will judge the secret thoughts of all." (Rom 2:14-16 NRSV)

Excellent. God does not really need witnesses to His truth, but that's how He prefers to do it in some cases. He uses intermediaries, whether angels or ministers, to deliver truth that He wishes to have delivered by desirable parties. So it's important that we obey when God wishes to use us.

But my point is, the Moral Law has gone out into the whole world, reaching the conscience of every man. That is the start. Beyond that, God wishes to use evangelists to bring the whole truth to the heart of Man, so that he knows not only what is right to do but also what is available to bring him into complete conformity to God's will.

Psalm 19.4 Yet their voice goes out into all the earth, their words to the ends of the world.

Rom 10.14 How, then, can they call on the one they have not believed in? And how can they believe in the one of whom they have not heard? And how can they hear without someone preaching to them?

We were created in the image of God so that we can hear Him. We were born with a conscience so that we can understand right and wrong.

This enables us to hear His voice when He speaks directly to our conscience or when others speak in His name. We are judged because we can in fact hear Him and can hear what things are right to do and what things are not right to do.

 

[CadyandZoe]

If the Sabbath was abolished, there would be many verses and much text to show it, yet there is none. The apostles would have had many discussions and the councils at Jerusalem would have written at least one with a determination of it being abolished and yet there is nothing. Paul exhorts in Corinthians that Circumcision is nothing in comparison to the Ten Commandments.

1 Corinthians 7:19
Circumcision is nothing, and uncircumcision is nothing, but the keeping of the commandments of God.

Let's flesh this out a bit more.

1 Corinthians 7:17-20

Only, as the Lord has assigned to each one, as God has called each, in this manner let him walk. And so I direct in all the churches. Was any man called when he was already circumcised? He is not to become uncircumcised. Has anyone been called in uncircumcision? He is not to be circumcised. Circumcision is nothing, and uncircumcision is nothing, but what matters is the keeping of the commandments of God. Each man must remain in that condition in which he was called.​

Given that the sons of Israel were commanded to be circumcised, we can safely say that circumcision is a command of God. That being the case, we have an apparent contradiction in the passage above, a tension that needs to be resolved. Did God command Abraham and his sons to circumcise their sons? Yes, he did. And are those who circumcise their sons obeying the commandments of God? Yes they are. If we know that obedience is something, and since circumcision is a commandment of God, then we know that circumcision is something. So why does Paul say that circumcision is nothing?

The apparent contradiction is resolved by understanding the obligations associated with God's covenant with Israel. The distinction between the two groups is applicable to one's calling. As Paul said, each person must remain in the condition in which they were called. The principle at play here is our individual calling. Some of us were divinely appointed to be sons of Abraham by birth, while others were appointed by a common faith to become sons of Abraham.

So the question is whether our calling to be sons of Abraham by a common faith obligates us to keep a commandment that God gave the Sons of Abraham by birth. As the book of Genesis says, men born into Abraham must be circumcised. But Paul argues that men who are sons of Abraham by a common faith are not obligated to be circumcised. It seems reasonable, therefore, to conclude that those who are born into Jacob are obligated to keep the Sabbath Holy, but those who are sons of Abraham by a common faith are not obligated to Keep the Sabbath Day Holy.

Bear in mind that when Paul talks about keeping the commandments, he isn't specifically talking about the so-called "Ten Commandments." He is talking about all the commandments that are obligatory based on the context. Gentiles are not obligated to obey the commandments strictly associated with those born into Jacob.

 

[Robert Pate]

Let's flesh this out a bit more.

1 Corinthians 7:17-20

Only, as the Lord has assigned to each one, as God has called each, in this manner let him walk. And so I direct in all the churches. Was any man called when he was already circumcised? He is not to become uncircumcised. Has anyone been called in uncircumcision? He is not to be circumcised. Circumcision is nothing, and uncircumcision is nothing, but what matters is the keeping of the commandments of God. Each man must remain in that condition in which he was called.​

Given that the sons of Israel were commanded to be circumcised, we can safely say that circumcision is a command of God. That being the case, we have an apparent contradiction in the passage above, a tension that needs to be resolved. Did God command Abraham and his sons to circumcise their sons? Yes, he did. And are those who circumcise their sons obeying the commandments of God? Yes they are. If we know that obedience is something, and since circumcision is a commandment of God, then we know that circumcision is something. So why does Paul say that circumcision is nothing?

The apparent contradiction is resolved by understanding the obligations associated with God's covenant with Israel. The distinction between the two groups is applicable to one's calling. As Paul said, each person must remain in the condition in which they were called. The principle at play here is our individual calling. Some of us were divinely appointed to be sons of Abraham by birth, while others were appointed by a common faith to become sons of Abraham.

So the question is whether our calling to be sons of Abraham by a common faith obligates us to keep a commandment that God gave the Sons of Abraham by birth. As the book of Genesis says, men born into Abraham must be circumcised. But Paul argues that men who are sons of Abraham by a common faith are not obligated to be circumcised. It seems reasonable, therefore, to conclude that those who are born into Jacob are obligated to keep the Sabbath Holy, but those who are sons of Abraham by a common faith are not obligated to Keep the Sabbath Day Holy.

Bear in mind that when Paul talks about keeping the commandments, he isn't specifically talking about the so-called "Ten Commandments." He is talking about all the commandments that are obligatory based on the context. Gentiles are not obligated to obey the commandments strictly associated with those born into Jacob.

The whole world is under the law. "Now we know that what things the law says, it says to them who are under the law: that every mouth may be stopped, and the whole world may be come guilty before God" Romans 3:19. All are guilty of violating the law and are under condemnation. This is why Paul said, "There is none righteous, no, not one" Romans 3:10.

All that are "In Christ" are not under the law, nor are they subject to it, simply because, "Christ is the end of the law for righteousness for those that believe" Romans 10:4. Jesus is the end and the fulfillment of the law. Under the New Covenant, "The just shall live by faith" Romans 1:17. They live by faith in Christ and his Gospel.

 

[CadyandZoe]

The whole world is under the law. "Now we know that what things the law says, it says to them who are under the law: that every mouth may be stopped, and the whole world may be come guilty before God" Romans 3:19. All are guilty of violating the law and are under condemnation. This is why Paul said, "There is none righteous, no, not one" Romans 3:10.

All that are "In Christ" are not under the law, nor are they subject to it, simply because, "Christ is the end of the law for righteousness for those that believe" Romans 10:4. Jesus is the end and the fulfillment of the law. Under the New Covenant, "The just shall live by faith" Romans 1:17. They live by faith in Christ and his Gospel.

I understand your point. Paul mentions that the Law will convict the entire world, but his focus is on what those who are under the law should expect to find in it. When he says that the "whole world will become guilty before the law", he is directing his message to the Jewish people. It's as if Paul wants to emphasize that "the whole world, including those who are under it, may become guilty before God".

Paul directs his message towards the Jewish leaders who oppose the gospel and believe that following the Law is the only way to attain God's justification. Paul later argues that justification cannot be achieved through obedience, in contrast to his Jewish opponents. He explains that those who are under the law should already know that the Law convicts the entire world, not just the Gentiles.

But as for the Gentiles, they would not be convicted for disobeying the fourth commandment, since they were never obligated to keep the fourth commandment. Gentiles would certainly be convicted of commandments such as "do not murder" and "do not commit adultery" since these commandments proscribe behaviors that are intrinsically evil. It is wrong to commit murder anywhere, anytime, in whatever culture, whatever religion, and whatever period in history one lives. Murder is wrong "in and of itself."

Obeying the fourth commandment could be a bit difficult in this aspect. While everyone is required to follow God's moral principles, not everyone is obliged to show God's moral vision through ritual practices. The act of expressing God's moral vision through ritual practice is exclusive to a specific group of individuals designated as his "people", who are the descendants of those who came out of Egypt.

It is a common question to ask what God wants everyone in the world to do. While there are rules and regulations associated with the Jewish praxis concerning the memorialization of the Sabbath day, it is not clear whether all peoples have the same obligation to memorialize it in the same way. It cannot be assumed that God expects the Gentile peoples to memorialize the Sabbath day in the same manner as the Jewish people do. The fourth commandment does not specify how one should memorialize the Sabbath Day, leaving room for interpretation.

It's important to clarify which Sabbath Day is being referred to here. In the past, Moses instructed his followers to refrain from work on the seventh day of the week to honor God's day of rest. This instruction is highly significant. However, it's unlikely that we are meant to simply remember the seventh day of the week as a Sabbath Day. Instead, we should focus on the day when God rested.

It is reasonable to believe that God has commanded the world to remember the day when He rested, but it seems unlikely that He mandated only one way to memorialize it, as told by Moses. Although Moses instructed his kinsmen on how to remember the Sabbath day, it's possible that different cultures and people have their ways of memorializing it. For instance, Seventh Day Adventists, as well as other groups, have their traditions and practices.

The entire world is obligated to obey God's moral vision, but only a select few are obligated to keep Moses. How and in what manner a person remembers the Sabbath day, the day God rested, is up to the individual. The important thing to remember is that one day those in Christ will enter into God's rest.

Hebrews 3:16-19
For who provoked Him when they had heard? Indeed, did not all those who came out of Egypt led by Moses? And with whom was He angry for forty years? Was it not with those who sinned, whose bodies fell in the wilderness? And to whom did He swear that they would not enter His rest, but to those who were disobedient? So we see that they were not able to enter because of unbelief.

As we see from the passage above, the land promise included "shalom" a day of rest. And God refused to allow the people to enter the promised land of rest because of unbelief. In Hebrews 4, Paul argues that a day of Shalom, a day of rest still remains. And some have not entered that rest. He argues that the call to enter his rest is as near as "Today" and it remains a future promise.

For this reason, I believe that God is commanding everyone everywhere to "Remember the day when God will give everyone rest in Christ Jesus when all those who believe enter into God's shalom, his rest. (Hebrews 3 and 4) Remember God's rest and enter into it by faith.

 

[Lambano]

What we ARE commanded to do is respect each other's choices in this matter:

16 So let no one judge you in food or in drink, or regarding a festival or a new moon or sabbaths, ... (Colossians 2:16)​

​

5 One person considers one day more sacred than another; another considers every day alike. Each of them should be fully convinced in their own mind. 6 Whoever regards one day as special does so to the Lord. (Romans 14:5-6)​

​

4 Who are you to judge someone else’s servant? To their own master, servants stand or fall. And they will stand, for the Lord is able to make them stand. ... 10 You, then, why do you judge your brother or sister? Or why do you treat them with contempt? For we will all stand before God’s judgment seat. (Romans 14:4,10)​

​

​

 

[Robert Pate]

I understand your point. Paul mentions that the Law will convict the entire world, but his focus is on what those who are under the law should expect to find in it. When he says that the "whole world will become guilty before the law", he is directing his message to the Jewish people. It's as if Paul wants to emphasize that "the whole world, including those who are under it, may become guilty before God".

Paul directs his message towards the Jewish leaders who oppose the gospel and believe that following the Law is the only way to attain God's justification. Paul later argues that justification cannot be achieved through obedience, in contrast to his Jewish opponents. He explains that those who are under the law should already know that the Law convicts the entire world, not just the Gentiles.

But as for the Gentiles, they would not be convicted for disobeying the fourth commandment, since they were never obligated to keep the fourth commandment. Gentiles would certainly be convicted of commandments such as "do not murder" and "do not commit adultery" since these commandments proscribe behaviors that are intrinsically evil. It is wrong to commit murder anywhere, anytime, in whatever culture, whatever religion, and whatever period in history one lives. Murder is wrong "in and of itself."

Obeying the fourth commandment could be a bit difficult in this aspect. While everyone is required to follow God's moral principles, not everyone is obliged to show God's moral vision through ritual practices. The act of expressing God's moral vision through ritual practice is exclusive to a specific group of individuals designated as his "people", who are the descendants of those who came out of Egypt.

It is a common question to ask what God wants everyone in the world to do. While there are rules and regulations associated with the Jewish praxis concerning the memorialization of the Sabbath day, it is not clear whether all peoples have the same obligation to memorialize it in the same way. It cannot be assumed that God expects the Gentile peoples to memorialize the Sabbath day in the same manner as the Jewish people do. The fourth commandment does not specify how one should memorialize the Sabbath Day, leaving room for interpretation.

It's important to clarify which Sabbath Day is being referred to here. In the past, Moses instructed his followers to refrain from work on the seventh day of the week to honor God's day of rest. This instruction is highly significant. However, it's unlikely that we are meant to simply remember the seventh day of the week as a Sabbath Day. Instead, we should focus on the day when God rested.

It is reasonable to believe that God has commanded the world to remember the day when He rested, but it seems unlikely that He mandated only one way to memorialize it, as told by Moses. Although Moses instructed his kinsmen on how to remember the Sabbath day, it's possible that different cultures and people have their ways of memorializing it. For instance, Seventh Day Adventists, as well as other groups, have their traditions and practices.

The entire world is obligated to obey God's moral vision, but only a select few are obligated to keep Moses. How and in what manner a person remembers the Sabbath day, the day God rested, is up to the individual. The important thing to remember is that one day those in Christ will enter into God's rest.

Hebrews 3:16-19
For who provoked Him when they had heard? Indeed, did not all those who came out of Egypt led by Moses? And with whom was He angry for forty years? Was it not with those who sinned, whose bodies fell in the wilderness? And to whom did He swear that they would not enter His rest, but to those who were disobedient? So we see that they were not able to enter because of unbelief.

As we see from the passage above, the land promise included "shalom" a day of rest. And God refused to allow the people to enter the promised land of rest because of unbelief. In Hebrews 4, Paul argues that a day of Shalom, a day of rest still remains. And some have not entered that rest. He argues that the call to enter his rest is as near as "Today" and it remains a future promise.

For this reason, I believe that God is commanding everyone everywhere to "Remember the day when God will give everyone rest in Christ Jesus when all those who believe enter into God's shalom, his rest. (Hebrews 3 and 4) Remember God's rest and enter into it by faith.

The Sabbath is just part of the law. Seventh Day Adventist have pulled it out of the law and have tried to make more out of it than it is. The law is the nature and character of God. Any religious thing that we do is a work of the law. Observing the Sabbath is a work of the law. The law does not save or justify, Romans 3:20. Entering into God's rest means that we cease from our own works and rest in the work of Christ, Hebrews 4:10. We rest in the righteousness of Christ. We rest in his atonement of our sins. Christ is our Sabbath; we rest in him and not in a certain day.

 

[Hobie]

Jesus, in declaring that the temple would be destroyed, rendered the Old Covenant with its entire set of laws void. Then he declared himself as the source of Eternal Life, requiring attention to the moral commands of God based on his own spirituality.

This was a complete shift from one covenant to another, leaving behind all of the 613 requirements given under the previous administration. In effect people were to devote themselves to be like Jesus, recognizing that his redemption was superior to redemption that had been available, to limited effect, under the Temple Law.

Jesus explicitly said that the previous Covenant, including all 613 requirements, were valid and binding *until* it was completely fulfilled in himself. He was the source of redemption alone, and all works done to accomplish the same were declared thereby inadequate.

Matt 5.17 “Do not think that I have come to abolish the Law or the Prophets; I have not come to abolish them but to fulfill them."

Jesus declared that his fulfillment of the Law is *eternal,* thus displacing the requirements of the Law, including Sabbath Law, forever.

I dont think like Christ, His commandments would disappear....
Hebrews 13:8
Jesus Christ the same yesterday, and to day, and for ever.

 

[Karl Peters]

I dont think like Christ, His commandments would disappear....
Hebrews 13:8
Jesus Christ the same yesterday, and to day, and for ever.

Of course Jesus Christ has the same personality as He has always had.
The problem is the men also tend to have the same personality yesterday and today.

So it is the God, and The Word is God (not talking about the Scriptures but Jesus Christ, right?),wants to have a personal relationship with us, but we don't want that!! I mean, if we actually listened to God He would reprove us for our sinful ways, and we don't want to hear it!!

So it was that Moses brought His people to the foot of the mountain of God to listen to Him, but they said, "Let not God speak to us"!! They were unwilling to listen to Him and His ways, because that would mean they would have to die to their ways!! So they said let Moses speak to us and we will listen! We men are such liars!!

So the Lord called Moses up the mountain, because Moses showed he would listen to the Lord, at least most of the time, because Moses wound up being kept from going into the promise land when he decided to not listen and speak to the Lord (the Rock) and instead decided to strike the rock (which is like striking God in the face when we don't listen to Him). And so it was that the Law was given to Moses, and commandment of God were written down! And one of those commands were, to keep the Sabbath holy. Which is to say that a specific day of the week was to be put aside for the Lord!!

Of course it was never supposed to be just one day in seven that should be put aside for the Lord. Did we not read that Enoch walked with God - even everyday that Enoch called "Today"? Yet being a merciful God, he allowed in the Law handed down to only make the command for one day of the week. How nice of Him! Yet again, men or lairs, and sinful people (of which women can be included, right?

Of course this problem come all the more apparent when the Law is written down. We find out, if we care to examine ourselves, that we can not keep the Law, even that watered down version which only requires one day to be put aside for the Lord, instead of everyday called "Today", which is what's really needed, right?

So His people became religious people - which is to say they tried to live by their understanding of God and what He had written, instead of actually listening to the Lord "Today". Of course, let's not be silly, that was never ever ever going to save us - because we are still sinful liars!!!! Even if they put aside the day, it was not really going to be about Him but them/us wasn't it? Be honest!


We read Galatians - the book in the Bible, right?

Gal 3: 21- 25 Is the Law then contrary to the promises of God? May it never be! For if a law had been given which was able to impart life, then righteousness would indeed have been based on law.
But the Scripture has shut up everyone under sin, so that the promise by faith in Jesus Christ might be given to those who believe.
But before faith came, we were kept in custody under the law, being shut up to the faith which was later to be revealed.
Therefore the Law has become our tutor to lead us to Christ, so that we may be justified by faith.
But now that faith has come, we are no longer under a tutor.

We were always to be listening to Jesus Christ as the Word of God, because you can't do what is required by God by leaning on your own understanding, even your own understanding of what God wants of you!!!

God knew that!! He knows how we are; that we don't want to listen to Him, but we need Him and so need to listen to Him!! Therefore the Law was written down so we might understand that we need to listen to Him, and thus repent of our ways!! We need to die to Him, and stop saying, "Let not God speak to us" Sadly, like the Galatians, we consistently turn away from Him and the idea of listening to Him "Today"!!

So consider - Why is having a Sabbath day even a topic here on the Christian forum?????????

Do you not see that we are still just like those people at the foot of the mountain saying in our hearts, "Let not God speak to us?"

Yeah we are!! We are people, and He is God! We are sinner, not willing to listen to Him like we should, and He is the Word of God (not the scriptures but God the Son who is the Lord who is trying to speak to us via His Holy Spirit)

We are not like Enoch, but we should be trying to be like Enoch who made it about walking with God, and not about taking one day in a week to think about God! Instead, we are trying to follow a set of rules which were handed down to Moses, who actually did listen to the Lord, and to a people who did not listen to the Lord!!

Did we not even read that Jesus is Lord of the Sabbath???

Did we not read about how the Sabbath was an issue between Christ and those religious Pharisees?

They did not listen to the Lord, even on the Sabbath and the KING OF KINGS AND LORD OF LORDS told them so!!

Jn 5:18 For this reason therefore the Jews were seeking all the more to kill Him, because He not only was breaking the Sabbath, but also was calling God His own Father, making Himself equal with God.

Do you not understand that you are still killing the Word of God, Jesus Christ, in you????

Do you not understand that if you want to kill someone spiritually speaking, you turn your back on them and refuse to ever listen to them again?? And that is what men do!! They turn their back on the Christ and say in there hearts, "Let not God speak to us", and so the pretend obedience to Him by making it about the Law handed down because they wouldn't listen to Him, instead of just turning back to Him and walking with Him like Enoch did everyday called "Today".

If a person really knows the Lord personally, you know what they do??? They make today the day they walk and talk with Him. And you know what you will find?? You will find the rest was never about not working, but always about resting in Him by simply listening to Him and trusting Him with your life!!

You will never ever ever understand that unless you actually do start walking and talking with Him!!!
You will never ever ever understand that it has always been about you and Him having a personally relationship as long as you continue to lean on your own understanding instead of seeking Him. Your religion (your pretense) is not going to save you. The Christ is the Saviour,

And I can tell you, that if you are making it about a Sabbath day which in not "Today", you are making it about your religion, which is your understanding of God not His!

Do you even understand these verses??

Heb 3: 5-12 Now Moses was faithful in all His house as a servant, for a testimony of those things which were to be spoken later;
but Christ was faithful as a Son over His house—whose house we are, if we hold fast our confidence and the boast of our hope firm until the end.
Therefore, just as the Holy Spirit says,
“TODAY IF YOU HEAR HIS VOICE,
DO NOT HARDEN YOUR HEARTS AS WHEN THEY PROVOKED ME,
AS IN THE DAY OF TRIAL IN THE WILDERNESS,
WHERE YOUR FATHERS TRIED Me BY TESTING Me,
AND SAW MY WORKS FOR FORTY YEARS.
“THEREFORE I WAS ANGRY WITH THIS GENERATION,
AND SAID, ‘THEY ALWAYS GO ASTRAY IN THEIR HEART,
AND THEY DID NOT KNOW MY WAYS’;
AS I SWORE IN MY WRATH,
‘THEY SHALL NOT ENTER MY REST.’”
Take care, brethren, that there not be in any one of you an evil, unbelieving heart that falls away from the living God.


Do we not see?? If the Lord said they would not enter His rest, then did they ever rest on the "Sabbath days"?? God is not a liar!!
So the religious people have never ever ever entered His rest!!!

 

[Randy Kluth]

I dont think like Christ, His commandments would disappear....
Hebrews 13:8
Jesus Christ the same yesterday, and to day, and for ever.

Jesus' commandments under the Law became superfluous once Israel's apostasy reached the level of national rejection of him. Can a people reject God and then claim to continue to follow His laws forever? It means nothing.

Therefore, Jesus utilized the same basis for forgiving the failure of the Law as he had used before. That system was called *mercy.* There were prescriptions for forgiveness under the Law, but failure under the entire covenant system of Law could not employ any system of Law, since it had failed. The only thing Israel could appeal to, and which Christ could offer, is mercy.

The New Covenant system of Christ is based on mercy alone, and not by a retrieval of the system of the Law of Moses. Since Jesus did what was necessary to install a final system of mercy, resort back to the Law became not only unnecessary but an insult to the new system that improved on a system that was bound to fail over time.

Following Sabbath Law, therefore, has absolutely no value, since it is based on an expired covenant that is superfluous and counter to a new system that improves on it. To bring back 613 or so laws that were intended to safeguard a covenant relationship with God is no longer able to sustain a covenant that is no longer recognized by God as anything but a failed system. A system based on mercy alone is the only possibility for recovering a covenant relationship with God.

Jesus advocated for the entire system of Law, together with all of its requirements, up until it utterly failed and he was able to fulfill it in his New Covenant. To ignore the fact that he intended to fulfill the old in order to establish the new is to completely ignore Jesus' message of the cross. Forgiveness rested on his words, and not on a resort to prescriptions under the Law.

 

[Karl Peters]

The Law, including keeping the Sabbath, is about love!!

And God is love!!

So the Sabbath is about walking and talking with the Lord our God Jesus Christ, who is the Word of God because His Father gave Him the words of God, so He has them and owns the very words of God!

Therefore, the Sabbath day is "Today", for all those who know Him personally!!

And is it not good that people who indeed walk with Him to get together at times, even maybe once a week or so?

Yet those who do not really know Him and don't want to actually listen to Him, make it about following the Law of God instead of following The Word of God - Jesus Christ!

So to them the word of God will be the orderly line upon line of text that they read a little here and there. And that so they will stumble backways, be snared, and be taken captive by the dark spiritual forces of this world - so perhaps again they will cry out for a Saviour and perhaps at that time they will listen to Him, and get rest?

Is 28: 12-14 He who said to them, “Here is rest, give rest to the weary,”
And, “Here is repose,” but they would not listen.
So the word of the LORD to them will be,
“[fn]Order on order, order on order,
Line on line, line on line,
A little here, a little there,”
That they may go and stumble backward, be broken, snared and taken captive.
Therefore, hear the word of the LORD, O scoffers,
Who rule this people who are in Jerusalem,

 

[Karl Peters]

Jesus' commandments under the Law became superfluous once Israel's apostasy reached the level of national rejection of him. Can a people reject God and then claim to continue to follow His laws forever? It means nothing.

Just so you know, it did take that long!! They level you talk about had been reached long before the Law was handed down, and the proof was provided at the mountain of God when they said, "Let not God speak to us.." Of course there was proof long before that! Did God not even bring them out of Egypt to get them to the mountain? What were they doing in Egypt if they had been faithful about listening to Him?

And why are men and women living in this world as it is, if we had been faithful?
Do we not even understand that God knew this would happen even in the beginning?

But yeah, "Can a people" ... or should we just say people to also include us ... "reject God and then claim to continue to follow His laws forever?

Of course not! But perhaps Today, at some point, we can listen to Him??? Maybe we can talk a short walk with Him, and talk with Him. Maybe we could sat down and eat with Him, when we sat down to eat, and so listen to Him them. And what about the shower? Could we talk to Him in the shower instead of say - singing or whatever else we do in the shower? Might we even sit down in a favorite chair or place and pray the Lord's prayer and then turn our ears to Him and find out what He wants to tell us for today?

Perhaps on a Saturday or Sunday, He might even have you go to church, but listen to Him, because Today is the day we are to enter into His rest!!