True or false?

[CoreIssue]

Or just your church conditioning. A doctrine can be of demons without the demons themselves speaking. The devil has many ministers. And these appeal to the desire for salvation in the outer man. So his ministers are HUGELY successful.

They say a lie goes around the world twice while the truth is still putting his shoes on.

I'm nondenominational.

You need to look in the mirror.

 

[Pearl]

It is by real faith. Real faith that is a gift from God, and causes a person to move & change. Not the cheap grace stuff.

I have no doubt that when you told them "we are saved by grace", that what they heard was you advocating for cheap grace. Such a misunderstanding (thinking Protestants believe in cheap grace) is tragically common among LDS Christians. In order to be heard and understood here, a person really needs to talk about the seed AND the fruits.

'Cheap grace'? That is an insult to God. God's grace is by no means cheap. It cost the life of his Son.

 

[CoreIssue]

Or just your church conditioning. A doctrine can be of demons without the demons themselves speaking. The devil has many ministers. And these appeal to the desire for salvation in the outer man. So his ministers are HUGELY successful.

They say a lie goes around the world twice while the truth is still putting his shoes on.

I am nondenominational.

You need to look in the mirror.

 

[Pearl]

Sadly, most "eye openers" are usually going for shock value, as opposed to being accurate as to what LDS Christians actually believe. Misconceptions are rampant.

There shouldn't be misconceptions from those who have researched the subject properly.

 

[CoreIssue]

Sadly, most "eye openers" are usually going for shock value, as opposed to being accurate as to what LDS Christians actually believe. Misconceptions are rampant.

Mormonism

 

[Jane_Doe22]

'Cheap grace'? That is an insult to God. God's grace is by no means cheap. It cost the life of his Son.

Of course it wasn't cheap! It was the biggest sacrifice and price ever!

The phrase "cheap grace" refers to a person who errantly treats grace as if it were cheap. Somebody who says "oh yeah I believe in Christ" but is completely superficial about it, having no interest in discipleship or following Christ. The phrase was originally popularized by a Lutheran theologian named Dietrich Bonhoeffer.

There shouldn't be misconceptions from those who have researched the subject properly.

Sadly, proper scholarship is frequently lacking, and biased agendas are very common.

 

[Pearl]

I read a brilliant description of Mormonism a few weeks ago and now I can't find it again. I think it was on www.crosswalk.com but can't be certain. It was a real eye opener. I know they have a big following but it is a different gospel.

Found it. Are Mormons Christians? 7 Major Differences in Critical Theology

 

[Pearl]

The phrase "cheap grace" refers to a person who errantly treats grace as if it were cheap. Somebody who says "oh yeah I believe in Christ" but is completely superficial about it, having no interest in discipleship or following Christ.

I have never heard the phrase before and I definitely am not superficial about my faith. Perhaps the young Mormon missionaries thought I was but that was their mistake.

 

[CoreIssue]

Cheap grace is a term used by Calvinists and those who claim salvation by works.

 

[Jane_Doe22]

Found it. Are Mormons Christians? 7 Major Differences in Critical Theology

This article is... so incredibly inaccurate, biased driven, and offensive I'm not even sure where to start with it. Literally every sentence in this thing is false and purposely twisted.

 

[Enoch111]

What about Mormon beliefs? You dodged.

He did not dodge. 'Going to "heaven" is for right now.' Which means absolutely nothing.

He does not believe that the saints go to Heaven purely by God's grace, and solely on the basis of the finished work of Christ.

False Christianity (which includes Catholicism and Mormonism) teaches that people have to earn their way to Heaven. As do most religions.

 

[Jane_Doe22]

False Christianity (which includes Catholicism and Mormonism) teaches that people have to earn their way to Heaven.

Reposting this here:

Actual member of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints here--- a "Mormon" if you insist on the nickname.

Clarifying LDS Christian beliefs here: we are saved by having faith in Jesus Christ, our Savior, the Son of God. It is a gift. The idea that you could some how "earn" salvation is downright laughable. You're saved by faith.

Real saving faith does result in change for a person-- bearing good fruit, which is something everyone can agree on. Real faith is not the cheap grace of superficially saying "I believe in Christ" and then continuing about your same sinful ways (that would be a barren tree). Real faith bears fruit.

Where confusion comes in: Protestants tend to classify (1) the seed as being salvation and (2) the fruit as sanctification. LDS Christians (and most other Christians too) don't make such a distinction and see it all as one package of being a disciple of Christ. Not understanding that can cause lot of confusion all around: non-Protestants thinking that Protestants believe in cheap grace, and Protestants thinking non-Protestants believing in works salvation.

 

[CoreIssue]

He did not dodge. 'Going to "heaven" is for right now.' Which means absolutely nothing.

He does not believe that the saints go to Heaven purely by God's grace, and solely on the basis of the finished work of Christ.

False Christianity (which includes Catholicism and Mormonism) teaches that people have to earn their way to Heaven. As do most religions.

We can disagree if he dodged.

But we agree salvation is by faith, not works.

 

[CoreIssue]

Reposting this here:

Mormonism
Contains links two official LDS.

You refuse to address the materials but keep making false claims elsewhere to paint yourself as a biblical Christian.

 

[Pearl]

This article is... so incredibly inaccurate, biased driven, and offensive I'm not even sure where to start with it. Literally every sentence in this thing is false and purposely twisted.

What about this one? A Comparison Between Christian Doctrine and Mormon Doctrine | CARM.org

 

[Enoch111]

Reposting this here:

Please note the OFFICIAL POSITION of the LDS Church:
'In the doctrine of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints, the terms “saved” and “salvation” have various meanings. As used in Romans 10:9–10, the words “saved” and “salvation” signify a covenant relationship with Jesus Christ. Through this covenant relationship, followers of Christ are assured salvation from the eternal consequences of sin if they are obedient...

Salvation from Sin. To be cleansed from sin through the Savior’s Atonement, an individual must exercise faith in Jesus Christ, repent, be baptized, and receive the gift of the Holy Ghost (see Acts 2:37–38). Those who have been baptized and have received the Holy Ghost through the proper priesthood authority have been conditionally saved from sin. In this sense, salvation is conditional, depending on an individual’s continuing in faithfulness, or enduring to the end in keeping the commandments of God (see 2 Peter 2:20–22).
Salvation

So Mormonism has added several conditions to salvation by grace through faith:

1. Water baptism

2. The gift of the Holy Ghost "through the proper priesthood authority"

3. The individuals continuing faithfulness

4. Keeping the commandments of God.

THIS IS FALSE CHRISTIANITY, JUST LIKE CATHOLICISM.

It is sad to see these zealous Mormon missionaries going all over the world and nullifying the Gospel of Grace because their church has brainwashed them.

 

[marks]

So then being quickened to new life by the Spirit those who have the faith of Christ are translated into the kingdom realm in heavenly places in order to walk as Jesus walked. And this as a gift...without having to improve our carnal capabilities. It is a free gift. It is by grace. But the way there is very narrow and few will be able to let go of their own carnal thinking to become as little children...to believe that God can do as He says.

You know, there's nothing in this statement I would disagree with.

Knowing what I know of your doctrine, I know this statement doesn't really say all that you think, however.

What you put as an extra part to salvation the Bible declares to be yours in Christ, even from the moment of rebirth.

You don't make yourself righteous by doing works of righteousness. You do works of righteousness because you have been made righteous in Christ.

You don't make yourself holy by doing holy things. You do holy things because God has already made you holy in Christ.

It's a narrow path to enter salvation, but entering salvation is by faith in Jesus and His righteousness, not be righteous acts you believe you do.

Carnal thinking is to think that we contribute to our own righteousness, our own holiness.

Now, if you are talking about putting of the old man, and putting on the new, that's a different matter. But we put of the old because we are righteous and holy, not to become righteous and holy.

God is not a respector of persons.

Much love!

 

[marks]

If more would put their understanding of the scriptures in their own words wouldn't that help sort out what they actually believe?

Hi Iforrest,

I think so. I think that people sometimes like to obfuscate what they actually believe, trying to walk people into their ideas without revealing where their ideas are leading.

I think we should all try to be as straightforward as possible with what we think, I've we're to actually have profitble discussion.

Much love!

 

[marks]

The crazy thing about brainwashing...is that you don't know you have been. You think it is your own reasoning.

If this is so . . . how can you know, yourself personally, that this does not apply to you?

Much love!

 

[Jane_Doe22]

What about this one? A Comparison Between Christian Doctrine and Mormon Doctrine | CARM.org

Complete bunk. Even the "sources" cited aren't real LDS Christian doctrinal sources.

If you want me to address any of these "points", I happily do so. I just don't no where would be a profitable place to start.