TULIP an open discussion

[Ritajanice]

Thanks for posting this Rockerduck.

I personally don't agree with the doctrine of limited atonement, because I don't agree with the idea that the effect of the atonement was payment for sins. If the cross was payment for sins, I agree that payment would be limited to those God has chosen. But since atonement is not payment for sins, then atonement isn't limited to a subgroup of humanity.

Only the Living Holy Spirit can forgive our sins, by the will of God and not by the will of man.

The atonement doesn’t make our spirit Born Again...only the Living Holy Spirit can do that, supernatural act by the will of God via His Spirit, my testimony and belief.

 

[Behold]

But since atonement is not payment for sins, then atonement isn't limited to a subgroup of humanity.

I marvel, for the many years that im on "christian forums" that you actually have people who define themselves as belonging To God, and yet they teach that 'The Cross is not a payment for "sins".

So, if Jesus on the Cross didn't pay for there, then WHO DID?

So, that is about as blasphemous as it gets, as when you deny that the Blood and Death of Jesus.. is not "Jesus came into the world to save sinners"...
= Then what are you, really?

And "christian" forums are filled with these people who say that "the Cross of Christ, is not Payment for sin".. which completely denies the REASON JESUS was Given to us as God's Sacrifice for our sin.... John 3:16

It remarkable that this Cross denying teaching is allowed on a "Christian" forum.

 

[Ritajanice]

I marvel, for the many years that im on "christian forums" that you actually have people who define themselves as belonging To God, and yet they teach that 'The Cross is not a payment for "sins".

So, if Jesus on the Cross didn't pay for there, then WHO DID?

So, that is about as blasphemous as it gets, as when you deny that the Blood and Death of Jesus.. is not "Jesus came into the world to save sinners"...
= Then what are you, really?

And "christian" forums are filled with these people who say that "the Cross of Christ, is not Payment for sin".. which complete denies the REASON was Give to us as God's Sacrifice for our sin.

It remarkable that this Cross denying teaching is allowed on a "Christian" forum.

Of course the cross was payment for our sins, we just aren’t Born Again of the cross...we are Born Of The Spirit..my testimony/ belief.

 

[CadyandZoe]

Remit is to "send away".

My mistake. Thanks for the correction.

Atonement is typically used in the OT for the covering of sins, appearing once in the KJV NT, translating the Greek "reconciliation". Yes, it's been used to refer to NT reconciliation, but I think that causes confusion, treating the OT covering, and the NT removal of sins as if they were the same.

How are they not the same in effect?

Meanwhile, the Bible also teaches we've been redeemed, that is, purchased.

Acts 20:28 KJV
Take heed therefore unto yourselves, and to all the flock, over the which the Holy Ghost hath made you overseers, to feed the church of God, which he hath purchased with his own blood.

Much love!

Yes!

Jesus “redeems” us from condemnation by propitiating God’s wrath toward us (and our sinfulness): God’s wrath toward us is replaced with God’s delight toward Jesus, his Son; at the time of our judgment, God’s delight toward his Son overshadows his wrath toward us.

 

[CadyandZoe]

I marvel, for the many years that im on "christian forums" that you actually have people who define themselves as belonging To God, and yet they teach that 'The Cross is not a payment for "sins".

Historically speaking, The church has not tolerated disagreement with established doctrine. Punishment for wrong think has taken the form of torture, imprisonment, and death.

So then, one can imagine why certain "orthodox" beliefs have remained unchallenged.

So, if Jesus on the Cross didn't pay for there, then WHO DID?

Doesn't the Bible teach us that our sins were forgiven? Didn't Jesus teach us a parable about a king that forgave a man a great debt? The man owed him a gazillion dollars and couldn't pay? And so the king told the man that he didn't need to pay the debt? But another man owed the first man twenty bucks and threatened to put him in jail if he didn't pay. The king told the first man that since he was unwilling to forgive his brother a small amount, the king was no longer willing to forgive his dept.

You really believe that Jesus intended to pay our debt to justice, given Jesus' parable about how our debt was forgiven by God?

So, that is about as blasphemous as it gets

Don't confuse unorthodox with blaspheme. The first is an offence against man; the second is an offense against God.

, as when you deny that the Blood and Death of Jesus.. is not "Jesus came into the world to save sinners"...
= Then what are you, really?

I don't deny the blood and death of Jesus. As the Bible teaches, the blood and death of Jesus was a propitiation of God's wrath, not a punishment for God's wrath.

And "christian" forums are filled with these people who say that "the Cross of Christ, is not Payment for sin".. which completely denies the REASON JESUS was Given to us as God's Sacrifice for our sin.... John 3:16

It completely denies orthodoxy, but it doesn't deny the truth.

It remarkable that this Cross denying teaching is allowed on a "Christian" forum.

Ideas and views on a particular issue can be exchanged in a forum. We are free to hear each other's points of view concerning Biblical and Theological issues. Open dialogue serves the truth. Only falsehood wishes to hide behind censorship.

I encourage you brother, to keep up the dialogue and prove your point from scripture so that we might all learn.

 

[CadyandZoe]

The last two sentences I have an issue with, because Christ's sacrifice of himself also redeemed (made payment) for our sins.

Jesus' sacrifice on the cross is the basis of our redemption, but the cost of Jesus' life was not punishment for our sins. Rather, as I mentioned in another post, Jesus “redeems” us from condemnation by propitiating God’s wrath toward us (and our sinfulness): God’s wrath toward us is replaced with God’s delight toward Jesus, his Son; at the time of our judgment, God’s delight toward his Son overshadows his wrath toward us. Propitiation, not payment, is the basis of our redemption.

Did it cost Jesus his life? Yes, but did his death satisfy justice? No. Our sins are forgiven, not punished.

 

[Behold]

Historically speaking, The church has not tolerated disagreement with established doctrine.

"the church"... ?????????????????

What is that? What are you describing?

Catholic?
JW?
Mormon?
Calvin?

You were not specific, about your particular "church".

I encourage you brother, to keep up the dialogue and prove your point from scripture so that we might all learn.

"God hath made Jesus....to BE SIN.....for Us...(on the Cross), so that we might become the Righteousness of God, IN HIM"

To become "the righteousness of God IN HIM">.....is to be born again, by the Holy Spirit, and you become this.

"A New Creation"... "IN =Christ".......as "one With God".

Now, Because GOD..."Is A SPIRIT"< and "Christ is THAT Spirit".... then to become "IN Christ", and "ONE with God" is to become joined to them both.

"Spiritual Union". = Born again.

 

[Ritajanice]

Jesus' sacrifice on the cross is the basis of our redemption, but the cost of Jesus' life was not punishment for our sins. Rather, as I mentioned in another post, Jesus “redeems” us from condemnation by propitiating God’s wrath toward us (and our sinfulness): God’s wrath toward us is replaced with God’s delight toward Jesus, his Son; at the time of our judgment, God’s delight toward his Son overshadows his wrath toward us. Propitiation, not payment, is the basis of our redemption.

Did it cost Jesus his life? Yes, but did his death satisfy justice? No. Our sins are forgiven, not punished.

@Behold I know Cady wrote this.

Can you explain what he is saying in simple terms please?xx

 

[Behold]

Doesn't the Bible teach us that our sins were forgiven?

"without the SHEDDING OF BLOOD, there is no redemption, forgiveness of sin".

In the OT, you have "kill that calf, kill that dove, kill that beast", and that is a covering, or a temporary resolution.
Its the same in the Garden of Eden.... where Adam and Eve were given the skins of the slain animals, as that was their BLOOD sacrificed for Adam and Eve.

See, with God.. all things are COVENANT, and most of the time, there is BLOOD involved, as that is often something being sacrificed on behalf of the one who needs to be forgiven., and through a Blood Covenant, the "new Covenant" we enter into God's forgiveness based on the Shed BLOOD and DEATH of Jesus.

See that?

That is the "Preaching of the Cross", that is THE Gospel.

Why blood? Because '"LIFE is IN The Blood".... and Eternal Life is found in JESUS's Blood.

Listen Reader,
The Cross of Christ is virgin born Jesus THE LORD, shedding His blood and offering His Body, as the :

A.) "one time.... ETERNAL SACRIFICE for SIN".

This is explained in :

2 Corinthians 5:19

John 3:17

And the Gospel, is to teach that......

Its to explain that Jesus died for your SIN...

And why?

Its because its our SIN that separates us from God, and this has to be resolved, and it has been by The Sacrifice of God's Son, on the Cross for the sin of us ALL. = 2000 yrs ago.

 

[setst777]

Thanks for posting this Rockerduck.

I personally don't agree with the doctrine of limited atonement, because I don't agree with the idea that the effect of the atonement was payment for sins. If the cross was payment for sins, I agree that payment would be limited to those God has chosen. But since atonement is not payment for sins, then atonement isn't limited to a subgroup of humanity.

The sacrificial death of Lord Jesus is the atoning sacrifice - the payment (redemption) for all sins, but only those who believe receive that redemption of Christ's atoning sacrifice.

Romans 3:21-26 (NIV)
21 But now apart from the law the righteousness of God has been made known, to which the Law and the Prophets testify.
22 This righteousness is given through faith in Jesus Christ to all who believe. There is no difference between Jew and Gentile,
23 for all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God, 24 and all are justified freely by his grace through the redemption [payment] that came by Christ Jesus.
25 God presented Christ as a sacrifice of atonement, through the shedding of his blood — to be received by faith.
He did this to demonstrate his righteousness, because in his forbearance he had left the sins committed beforehand unpunished —
26 he did it to demonstrate his righteousness at the present time, so as to be just and the one who justifies those who have faith in Jesus.

Christ's death is the atoning sacrifice made payment (redemption) for all sins, and is given to whoever believes .

John 3:16 (WEB) 16 For God so loved the world that he gave his only begotten Son, that whoever believes in him shall not perish but have eternal life.

 

[setst777]

My mistake. Thanks for the correction.

How are they not the same in effect?

Yes!

Jesus “redeems” us from condemnation by propitiating God’s wrath toward us (and our sinfulness): God’s wrath toward us is replaced with God’s delight toward Jesus, his Son; at the time of our judgment, God’s delight toward his Son overshadows his wrath toward us.

I believe the point he was making is that Christ's atoning sacrifice is the redemption (payment) for all sins, and is given to all who believe (John 3:16).

Jesus' sacrifice on the cross is the basis of our redemption, but the cost of Jesus' life was not punishment for our sins. Rather, as I mentioned in another post, Jesus “redeems” us from condemnation by propitiating God’s wrath toward us (and our sinfulness): God’s wrath toward us is replaced with God’s delight toward Jesus, his Son; at the time of our judgment, God’s delight toward his Son overshadows his wrath toward us. Propitiation, not payment, is the basis of our redemption.

I did not mention anything about punishment; rather, the point made here is that Christ atoning death on the cross is the redemption (payment for all sins), and this redemption (payment) is appropriated to those who believe.

John 3:16 (WEB) 16 For God so loved the world that he gave his only begotten Son, that whoever believes in him shall not perish but have eternal life.

Did it cost Jesus his life? Yes, but did his death satisfy justice? No. Our sins are forgiven, not punished.

Christ’s death did satisfy God’s justice.

Romans 3:23-25 (NIV)
23 for all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God, 24 and all are justified freely by his grace through the redemption [payment] that came by Christ Jesus.
25 God presented Christ as a sacrifice of atonement, through the shedding of his blood — to be received by faith.

Romans 5:9 (WEB) 9 Much more then, being now justified by his blood, we will be saved from God’s wrath through him.

 

[CadyandZoe]

"the church"... ?????????????????

What is that? What are you describing?

I assumed you knew.

You were not specific, about your particular "church".

Does it matter?

"God hath made Jesus....to BE SIN.....for Us...(on the Cross), so that we might become the Righteousness of God, IN HIM"

And what do you think it means that God made Jesus to be sin?

 

[CadyandZoe]

"without the SHEDDING OF BLOOD, there is no redemption, forgiveness of sin".

Okay, it's still forgiveness, not payment.

According to the OT practice, who shed the blood and why?

In the OT, you have "kill that calf, kill that dove, kill that beast", and that is a covering, or a temporary resolution.

You forgot one, very important thing. The blood alone wasn't enough. The sacrifice of the animal represented something: a heart of contrition. God doesn't care about sacrifices, he cares about attitudes. Refer to Psalm 32 and Psalm 51.

Its the same in the Garden of Eden.... where Adam and Eve were given the skins of the slain animals, as that was their BLOOD sacrificed for Adam and Eve.

That is a misunderstanding of Genesis. God was making clothing for Adam and Eve. That's all.

See, with God.. all things are COVENANT, and most of the time, there is BLOOD involved, as that is often something being sacrificed on behalf of the one who needs to be forgiven., and through a Blood Covenant, the "new Covenant" we enter into God's forgiveness based on the Shed BLOOD and DEATH of Jesus.

Sure, here's a clearer version of the text:

According to Paul, Jesus's death on the cross pleased God and allowed Jesus to gain access to the heavenly realm, becoming our high priest. He had to be made like us in every way to be a merciful and faithful high priest in things pertaining to God, making amends for the sins of the people. Jesus wasn't punished for our sins; instead, his death on the cross appeased God's wrath, and God's favor towards Jesus outweighs his wrath toward us. (Hebrews 2:17)

Yes, Jesus died for my sins, but not as payment for them; otherwise, forgiveness is unnecessary. But we are forgiven of our sins.

 

[setst777]

Yes, Jesus died for my sins, but not as payment for them; otherwise, forgiveness is unnecessary. But we are forgiven of our sins.

The Scriptures teach throughout, as Gospel, that forgiveness is possible because God's justice was satisfied by the death of His Son for all sins.

Christ’s death did satisfy God’s justice.

Romans 3:23-25 (NIV)
23 for all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God,
24 and all are justified freely by his grace through the redemption [payment] that came by Christ Jesus.
25 God presented Christ as a sacrifice of atonement, through the shedding of his blood — to be received by faith.
He did this to demonstrate his righteousness, because in his forbearance he had left the sins committed beforehand unpunished —
26 he did it to demonstrate his righteousness at the present time, so as to be just and the one who justifies those who have faith in Jesus.

Romans 5:9 (WEB) 9 Much more then, being now justified by his blood, we will be saved from God’s wrath through him.

 

[CadyandZoe]

The sacrificial death of Lord Jesus is the atoning sacrifice - the payment (redemption) for all sins, but only those who believe receive that redemption of Christ's atoning sacrifice.

Our sins are forgiven, not punished. Jesus' death on the cross was not payment. If Jesus was punished for our sins then forgiveness is unnecessary.

Romans 3:21-26 (NIV)
21 But now apart from the law the righteousness of God has been made known, to which the Law and the Prophets testify.
22 This righteousness is given through faith in Jesus Christ to all who believe. There is no difference between Jew and Gentile,
23 for all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God, 24 and all are justified freely by his grace through the redemption [payment] that came by Christ Jesus.
25 God presented Christ as a sacrifice of atonement, through the shedding of his blood — to be received by faith.
He did this to demonstrate his righteousness, because in his forbearance he had left the sins committed beforehand unpunished —
26 he did it to demonstrate his righteousness at the present time, so as to be just and the one who justifies those who have faith in Jesus.

The NIV translation is throwing you off the meaning. Paul didn't say that "God presented Christ as a sacrifice of atonement."

Let's get verse 23 and 24 under our belt first.

Romans 3:23-24

For all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God, being justified as a gift by His grace through the redemption which is in Christ Jesus; ​

The idea that the cross paid for our sins contradicts Paul's clear assertion that we are being justified as a gift by His grace. A gift is not wages. If Jesus was punished for our sins, then we are right to claim that for ourselves.

Suppose I owed the bank a thousand dollars. And suppose Jesus paid my debt for me? Does this mean that the bank forgave my debt? No. It means that my debt was paid by someone other than me, and my bank balance is reset to zero.

Paul isn't saying that Jesus paid our debt. He is saying that Jesus volunteered to allow himself to become a demonstration of justice as we see in the following verse.

Romans 3:25

Jesus Christ, whom God displayed publicly as a propitiation in His blood through faith. This was to demonstrate His righteousness, because in the forbearance of God He passed over the sins previously committed; ​

Certainly, here is the revised text:

Because God had previously overlooked sins, some might think that God is morally lenient. Therefore, the Father and the Son agreed that Jesus would die on the cross to publicly demonstrate God's righteousness. Since Jesus obediently followed the Father, even to the point of death, this pleased God and satisfied His wrath. Jesus' public display of righteousness became the propitiation through His blood for those who have faith.

Those who want to live, need to seek Jesus' forgiveness.

 

[CadyandZoe]

The Scriptures teach throughout, as Gospel, that forgiveness is possible because God's justice was satisfied by the death of His Son for all sins.

No. Justice was not satisfied. God was mollified by the cross, but not because justice was satisfied. God was mollified because Jesus allowed himself to suffer death on the cross to demonstrate God's righteousness.

 

[CadyandZoe]

I believe the point he was making is that Christ's atoning sacrifice is the redemption (payment) for all sins, and is given to all who believe (John 3:16).

No. Redemption isn't punishment. The idea of redemption comes from the slave markets. If a man wanted to free another man from slavery, he was required to pay the redemption price. Once the redemption price was paid, the slave was set free. In the New Testament, the core idea of redemption is freedom.

Jesus paid for our redemption with his life, but his death wasn't the payment of a moral obligation. His death on the cross is the propitiation of our sins, not the payment of our sins.

I did not mention anything about punishment; rather, the point made here is that Christ atoning death on the cross is the redemption (payment for all sins), and this redemption (payment) is appropriated to those who believe.

What other form of "payment" for a moral debt exists aside from punishment?

Christ’s death did satisfy God’s justice.

No. On the contrary, if what you say is true, then God is immoral. (Heaven forbid)

Suppose Bill kills Bob and is on trial for murder. Bill's mother appeals to the Judge for mercy, since Bill is her only son. The judge then decides to sentence Joe to death instead. What is our evaluation of the judge? Is it moral or immoral to punish Joe for a crime that Bill committed? I don't think so.

Likewise, it would be immoral for God to purposely give Jesus the death sentence for sins we committed.

Since we believe that God is moral, just, and good, we know that he would never put his son on the cross to pay for the sins of others. God is not immoral or unjust. He would never sentence an innocent man to death and neither would he accept the death of Jesus as satisfaction for my evil.

Our sins are forgiven.

 

[setst777]

Our sins are forgiven, not punished. Jesus' death on the cross was not payment. If Jesus was punished for our sins then forgiveness is unnecessary.

The NIV translation is throwing you off the meaning. Paul didn't say that "God presented Christ as a sacrifice of atonement."

Let's get verse 23 and 24 under our belt first.

Romans 3:23-24

For all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God, being justified as a gift by His grace through the redemption which is in Christ Jesus; ​

The idea that the cross paid for our sins contradicts Paul's clear assertion that we are being justified as a gift by His grace. A gift is not wages. If Jesus was punished for our sins, then we are right to claim that for ourselves.

Romans 3:23-24
For all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God, being justified as a gift by His grace through the redemption which is in Christ Jesus;

Suppose I owed the bank a thousand dollars. And suppose Jesus paid my debt for me? Does this mean that the bank forgave my debt? No. It means that my debt was paid by someone other than me, and my bank balance is reset to zero.

That is not how the Scriptures teach about God's grace. Rather, God is justly free to forgiven sins because payment was made for all sins by the death of Christ Jesus.

Romans 3:23-24
For all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God, being justified as a gift by His grace through the redemption which is in Christ Jesus

Paul isn't saying that Jesus paid our debt.

Galatians 3:13 (WEB) Christ redeemed us from the curse of the law, having become a curse for us. For it is written, “Cursed is everyone who hangs on a tree,” [Deuteronomy 21:23]

Galatians 4:4-5 (WEB) 4 But when the fullness of the time came, God sent out his Son, born to a woman, born under the law, 5 that he might redeem those who were under the law, that we might receive the adoption as children.

1 Peter 1:18-19 (WEB) 18 knowing that you were redeemed, not with corruptible things, with silver or gold, from the useless way of life handed down from your fathers, 19 but with precious blood, as of a lamb without blemish or spot, the blood of Christ

Redeem [exagorazó]
Usage: I buy out, buy away from, ransom; mid: I purchase out, buy, redeem, choose.

He is saying that Jesus volunteered to allow himself to become a demonstration of justice as we see in the following verse.

Romans 3:25

Jesus Christ, whom God displayed publicly as a propitiation in His blood through faith. This was to demonstrate His righteousness, because in the forbearance of God He passed over the sins previously committed; ​

Propitiation 2435 hilastḗrion (a substantival adjective, derived from 2433 /hiláskomai, "to propitiate") – the place of propitiation; the lid of the golden ark (the mercy-seat) where the blood of a vicarious lamb appeased God's wrath on sin. See also 2434 (hilasmós).

Usage: (a) a sin offering, by which the wrath of the deity shall be appeased; a means of propitiation, (b) the covering of the ark, which was sprinkled with the atoning blood on the Day of Atonement.

Romans 3:25 This was to demonstrate His righteousness, because in the forbearance [beforehand] of God He passed over the sins previously committed

Before Christ's shedding of blood for us, God left the sins go unpunished because God was looking forward to the payment for those past sins by the sacrifice of His Son.

Certainly, here is the revised text:

Because God had previously overlooked sins, some might think that God is morally lenient. Therefore, the Father and the Son agreed that Jesus would die on the cross to publicly demonstrate God's righteousness. Since Jesus obediently followed the Father, even to the point of death, this pleased God and satisfied His wrath. Jesus' public display of righteousness became the propitiation through His blood for those who have faith.

Exactly!

Christ's death please God because God's justice was satisfied by the shedding of his blood.

Romans 3:25 (NIV) 25 God presented Christ as a sacrifice of atonement, through the {{{shedding of his blood}}} — to be received by faith.

Galatians 3:13 (WEB) Christ redeemed us from the curse of the law, having become a curse for us. For it is written, “Cursed is everyone who hangs on a tree,” [Deuteronomy 21:23]

1 Peter 1:18-19 (WEB) 18 knowing that you were redeemed, not with corruptible things, with silver or gold, from the useless way of life handed down from your fathers, 19 but with precious blood, as of a lamb without blemish or spot, the blood of Christ

Those who want to live, need to seek Jesus' forgiveness.

Forgiveness is only possible because the justice of God was satisfied by the sacrifice of His Son - the shedding of his blood.

Romans 3:23-26 (NIV)
23 for all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God, 24 and all are justified freely by his grace through the redemption [payment] that came by Christ Jesus.
25 God presented Christ as a sacrifice of atonement, through the {{{shedding of his blood}}} — to be received by faith.
He did this to demonstrate his righteousness, because in his forbearance he had left the sins committed beforehand unpunished —
26 he did it to demonstrate his righteousness at the present time, so as to be just and the one who justifies those who have faith in Jesus.

Galatians 3:13 (WEB) Christ redeemed [payment made] us from the curse of the law, having become a curse for us. For it is written, “Cursed is everyone who hangs on a tree,” [Deuteronomy 21:23]

1 Peter 1:18-19 (WEB) 18 knowing that you were redeemed, not with corruptible things, with silver or gold, from the useless way of life handed down from your fathers, 19 but with precious blood, as of a lamb without blemish or spot, the blood of Christ

 

[setst777]

No. Justice was not satisfied. God was mollified by the cross, but not because justice was satisfied. God was mollified because Jesus allowed himself to suffer death on the cross to demonstrate God's righteousness.

The Scriptures uses the word "justified." We are justified by the blood of the cross.

Romans 3:24 and all are justified freely by his grace through the redemption [payment] that came by Christ Jesus.
25 God presented Christ as a sacrifice of atonement, through the {{{shedding of his blood}}} — to be received by faith.

God's wrath was satisfied by the blood of Christ shed for us. We are justified by his blood.

Romans 5:9 (WEB) 9 Much more then, being now justified by his blood, we will be saved from God’s wrath through him.

 

[setst777]

No. Redemption isn't punishment.

For the second time, I never mentioned anything about punishment.

However, Lord Jesus did become a curse for us, to redeem us from the curse of the Law.

Galatians 3:13 (WEB) Christ redeemed us from the curse of the law, having become a curse for us. For it is written, “Cursed is everyone who hangs on a tree,” [Deuteronomy 21:23]

The idea of redemption comes from the slave markets. If a man wanted to free another man from slavery, he was required to pay the redemption price. Once the redemption price was paid, the slave was set free. In the New Testament, the core idea of redemption is freedom.

The redemption is by Christ blood shed for us.

Romans 3:24 and all are justified freely by his grace through the redemption [payment] that came by Christ Jesus.
25 God presented Christ as a sacrifice of atonement, through the {{{shedding of his blood}}} — to be received by faith.

Jesus paid for our redemption with his life, but his death wasn't the payment of a moral obligation. His death on the cross is the propitiation of our sins, not the payment of our sins.

Lord Jesus satisfied the "moral obligation," by his sinless life and sacrificial death on the cross, and is received by faith.

Romans 3:23-26 (NIV)
23 for all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God, 24 and all are justified freely by his grace through the redemption [payment] that came by Christ Jesus.
25 God presented Christ as a sacrifice of atonement, through the {{{shedding of his blood}}} — to be received by faith.

What other form of "payment" for a moral debt exists aside from punishment?

By Christ's shed blood, according to the Gospel.

Romans 3:23-26 (NIV)
23 for all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God, 24 and all are justified freely by his grace through the redemption [payment] that came by Christ Jesus.
25 God presented Christ as a sacrifice of atonement, through the {{{shedding of his blood}}} — to be received by faith.

setst777 said: Christ’s death did satisfy God’s justice.

No. On the contrary, if what you say is true, then God is immoral. (Heaven forbid)

I am just quoting the Scriptures, and you disagree because of your own doctrine.

Romans 3:23-26 (NIV)
23 for all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God, 24 and all are justified freely by his grace through the redemption [payment] that came by Christ Jesus.
25 God presented Christ as a sacrifice of atonement, through the {{{shedding of his blood}}} — to be received by faith.