Two Types Of Repenters That Find Damnation

[BloodBought 1953]

Ignoring my posts again, @Blood Bought 1953?

This will be evidenced by the fact that you will keep reiterating the same arguments all over again; even though they have been answered.

If you say so, sarge.....lol....

 

[justbyfaith]

...AFTER Turning “ TO” God and NOT Turning “ FROM” Sin...

God is holy....so, to turn to God is to turn to holiness and thus away from unholiness (sin).

 

[BloodBought 1953]

The only problem is that you are saying this of people who are spreading the true gospel.



You are spreading something all right....and it sure ain’t the Gospel.....it’s a Perverted Doctrine Of Works —- it’s ,” Jesus Saves, but then ya gotta Repent from all of your sins before you die and on top of that you gotta be Perfect in your flesh to STAY Saved, lest you be damned! “

The True Gospel is an “ offense” to you.....you HATE it because you HATE Grace, the very thing that saves you...you are utterly blind to the precarious state that you are in.....

 

[BloodBought 1953]

God is holy....so, to turn to God is to turn to holiness and thus away from unholiness (sin).

You so crazy! Lol......go to bed, JBF .....dream of all that money I am sending your way........NOT ! Hahahahahahhha......

 

[justbyfaith]

You so crazy! Lol......go to bed, JBF .....dream of all that money I am sending your way........NOT ! Hahahahahahhha......

So, you lied...

(see Revelation 21:8).

 

[justbyfaith]

The only problem is that you are saying this of people who are spreading the true gospel.



You are spreading something all right....and it sure ain’t the Gospel.....it’s a Perverted Doctrine Of Works —- it’s ,” Jesus Saves, but then ya gotta Repent from all of your sins before you die and on top of that you gotta be Perfect in your flesh to STAY Saved, lest you be damned! “

The True Gospel is an “ offense” to you.....you HATE it because you HATE Grace, the very thing that saves you...you are utterly blind to the precarious state that you are in.....

Bearing false witness again.

While we can be made perfect in the flesh (Romans 8:23, Galatians 4:5-7, 1 Thessalonians 5:23 (kjv), Hebrews 9:13-14), it is very likely not true that this is required for us to have righteousness imputed to us (Romans 4:11)....although that final verse does not present an airtight case for that concept.

 

[justbyfaith]

Of course , you won’t really, and anybody with a lick of Common Sense knows that is true......you have committed sins you are not even aware of..

I repented of walking in the direction of sin when I got born again. And the Holy Spirit is sanctifying me through the process of pinpointing new sins whether I committed them yesterday or twenty years ago. As I walk in the light He cleanses me from all unrighteousness (as I confess my sins)...1 John 1:7-9.

 

[ByGraceThroughFaith]

They got Saved when they obeyed Peter.....they “ Repented” all right......they had just murdered their Savior because they though He was a Blasphemer—- a mere man that claimed to be God in the Flesh! They needed to Repent Of the falsehood that Jesus was just a Sinful man who got what He deserved.....they needed to “ change their mind” ( Repent) about that and Believe that Jesus was who He said He was—- God's Son and our Savior—- THAT is what Saves ANYBODY! NOT Trying and Failing to overcome Sin in your life .....
AFTER one is Saved and gets the Holy Spirit in Him......THEN God can get to work and Transform you from the inside out and then the process of “overcoming Sin “ can begin to take place...it occurs over a lifetime.....AFTER Turning “ TO” God and NOT Turning “ FROM” Sin......Only the first “Turn” will insure the latter......it is Vital to get the order of events straight.....it will stop a lot of needless Confusion...REPENT! ( but do it correctly).....

your "gospel" is FALSE!

 

[ByGraceThroughFaith]

I don't know that I understand that. If Jesus died for the entire human race how does a select number of us only called by God are saved due to Jesus dying?

you are right that you don't understand, because your understanding here is faulty

 

[Amazed@grace]

you are right that you don't understand, because your understanding here is faulty

I think it would help if you were to elaborate .

 

[justbyfaith]

I think it would help if you were to elaborate .

Jesus died for the sins of the whole world (1 John 2:2) and gave His life as a ransom for all (1 Timothy 2:6)...

However, not everyone appropriates themselves of the offer that God gives to them in providing salvation to them through the Cross.

It can only be appropriated by faith.

The provision has been made for all...not everyone avails themselves of that provision by placing their faith in what Jesus did for them on the Cross.

 

[justbyfaith]

You are spreading something all right....and it sure ain’t the Gospel.....it’s a Perverted Doctrine Of Works —-

I am in fact preaching the true gospel and including in my preaching the whole counsel of the Lord...in preaching the law as a schoolmaster to lead men to Christ (Galatians 3:24, Romans 3:20, Psalms 19:7 (kjv)).

 

[ByGraceThroughFaith]

I think it would help if you were to elaborate .

you wrote, "If Jesus died for the entire human race how does a select number of us only called by God are saved due to Jesus dying?" John 3:16, for example says that Jesus did die for "the entire human race", but only those who believe will be actually saved.

 

[Amazed@grace]

you wrote, "If Jesus died for the entire human race how does a select number of us only called by God are saved due to Jesus dying?" John 3:16, for example says that Jesus did die for "the entire human race", but only those who believe will be actually saved.

The condition to arrive at salvation, believe, would seem to then overwrite, all people in the world being saved from the sins of the world that Jesus took upon himself on the cross. Just as what appears to be said of the free irrevocable gift of God's grace that saves alone, and not by any works of ours that we may not boast. Yet, the condition to that is, we must have faith it is true.

 

[ByGraceThroughFaith]

The condition to arrive at salvation, believe, would seem to then overwrite, all people in the world being saved from the sins of the world that Jesus took upon himself on the cross. Just as what appears to be said of the free irrevocable gift of God's grace that saves alone, and not by any works of ours that we may not boast. Yet, the condition to that is, we must have faith it is true.

What do you think about John Calvin on John 3:16?

That whosoever believeth on him may not perish. It is a remarkable commendation of faith, that it frees us from everlasting destruction. For he intended expressly to state that, though we appear to have been born to death, undoubted deliverance is offered to us by the faith of Christ; and, therefore, that we ought not to fear death, which otherwise hangs over us. And he has employed the universal term whosoever, both to invite all indiscriminately to partake of life, and to cut off every excuse from unbelievers. Such is also the import of the term World, which he formerly used; for though nothing will be found in the world that is worthy of the favor of God, yet he shows himself to be reconciled to the whole world, when he invites all men without exception to the faith of Christ, which is nothing else than an entrance into life.

 

[Amazed@grace]

What do you think about John Calvin on John 3:16?

That whosoever believeth on him may not perish. It is a remarkable commendation of faith, that it frees us from everlasting destruction. For he intended expressly to state that, though we appear to have been born to death, undoubted deliverance is offered to us by the faith of Christ; and, therefore, that we ought not to fear death, which otherwise hangs over us. And he has employed the universal term whosoever, both to invite all indiscriminately to partake of life, and to cut off every excuse from unbelievers. Such is also the import of the term World, which he formerly used; for though nothing will be found in the world that is worthy of the favor of God, yet he shows himself to be reconciled to the whole world, when he invites all men without exception to the faith of Christ, which is nothing else than an entrance into life.

I am not versed in John Calvin. Therefore I cannot comment on his teaching of John 3:16. I will address all else you observed with a question. What of those verses that tell us , pertaining to the phrase, "whosever" , no one can come to God, Salvation, unless the father call them? Doesn't that exclusive condition then preclude anyone at all, whosoever?

 

[ByGraceThroughFaith]

I am not versed in John Calvin. Therefore I cannot comment on his teaching of John 3:16. I will address all else you observed with a question. What of those verses that tell us , pertaining to the phrase, "whosever" , no one can come to God, Salvation, unless the father call them? Doesn't that exclusive condition then preclude anyone at all, whosoever?

If what you say is right then John 3.16 is pointless

 

[Ronald Nolette]

From: The Way of Life, chapters 6-7, by Charles Hodge:

There is no duty the necessity of which is either more obvious in itself, or more frequently asserted in the word of God, than that of repentance. Nature itself teaches us, that when we have done wrong, we should be sorry for it, and turn away from the evil. Every man feels that this is a reasonable expectation in regard to those who have offended him. Every parent, especially, looks with anxiety for the repentance of a disobedient child; and he considers nothing worthy of the name, but sincere sorrow and a return to affectionate obedience. No man need wonder, therefore, that God, who requires nothing but what is right, and who can require nothing less, commands all men everywhere to repent. The salvation offered in the gospel, though it be a salvation of sinners, is also a salvation from sin. The heaven which it promises is a heaven of holiness. The rivers of pleasure, which flow from the right hand of God, are filled with the pure waters of life. No man, therefore, can be saved who does not, by repentance, forsake his sins. This is itself a great part of salvation. The inward change of heart from the love and service of sin to the love and service of God, is the great end of the death of Christ, who gave himself for his church, "that he might sanctify and cleanse it with the washing of water by the word, that he might present it to himself a glorious church, not having spot, or wrinkle, or any such thing; but that it should be holy and without blemish." A salvation for sinners, therefore, without repentance, is a contradiction.

Hence it is that repentance is the burden of evangelical preaching. Our Saviour himself, when he began to preach, said, "Repent: for the kingdom of heaven is at hand." And when he came into Galilee preaching the gospel, he said, "The time is fulfilled and the kingdom of God is at hand: repent ye, and believe the gospel." The commission which he gave his apostles was, "That repentance and remission of sins should be preached in his name among all nations." In the execution of this commission his disciples went forth and preached, "Repent ye, and be converted, that your sins may be blotted out, when the times of refreshing shall come from the presence of the Lord." Paul, in the account which he gave Agrippa of his preaching, said that he "showed first unto them of Damascus, and at Jerusalem, and throughout all the coasts of Judea, and then to the Gentiles, that they should repent and turn to God, and do works meet for repentance." And he called upon the elders at Ephesus to bear witness that he had taught "publicly, and from house to house, testifying both to the Jews, and also to the Greeks, repentance toward God, and faith toward our Lord Jesus Christ."

Repentance, then, is the great, immediate, and pressing duty of all who hear the gospel. They are called upon to forsake their sins, and to return unto God through Jesus Christ. The neglect of this duty, is the rejection of salvation. For, as we have seen, unless we repent we must perish. It is because repentance is thus indispensably necessary, that God reveals so clearly not only the evil of sin, and the terms of his law, but his infinite compassion and love; that he calls upon us to turn unto him and live, assuring us that he is "The Lord, The Lord God, merciful and gracious, long-suffering, and abundant in goodness and truth," This call to repentance commonly follows men from the cradle to the grave. It is one of the first sounds which wakes the infant's ear; it is one of the last which falls on the failing senses of the dying sinner. Everything in this world is vocal with the voice of mercy. All joy and all sorrow are calls to return unto God with whom are the issues of life. Every opening grave, every church, every page of the Bible, is an admonition or an invitation. Every serious thought or anxious foreboding is the voice of God, saying, "Turn ye; for why will ye die?" It is through all these admonitions that men force their way to death. They perish, because they deliberately reject salvation.

It is one of the mysteries of redemption, that, under the economy of mercy, all duties are graces. Though repentance is our duty, it is not less the gift of God. Those who wrest the Scriptures to their own destruction, gladly seize on such truths either as an excuse for delay, under pretence of waiting God's time, or as a palliation of the guilt of a hard and impenitent heart. But those who feel the greatness of the work required of them rejoice in the truth, and rouse themselves with new energy to their duty, no longer a hopeless task, and with all earnestness work out their own salvation, because it is God that worketh in them to will and to do according to his own pleasure.

I concur with Dr Hodge on this. What think ye?

Well I will post this:

Matthew 3:2
And saying, Repent ye: for the kingdom of heaven is at hand.

In Classical Greek metanoia meant changing one's mind about someone or something.[4]

Wilkin, Robert N. "New Testament Repentance: Lexical Considerations", Bible.org

repentance is a change of mind. which biblically we agree with God with what He says. Now repentance, if it is Godly repentnace will lead to sa turning from sin, but the turning from sin is not repentance.

I teach a course every 3 or so years on the aspects of salvation and so define these things in their narrow sense.

I know most of Christendom defines repentance as turning from sin but technically turning from sin comes after we change our mind and agree sin is sin.

I realize this is kind of a nit picky thing, but I teach teh Word of God and I like to be correct more so that follow the popular concepts.

Just remember one cannot turn from sin until one has changed their mind and agree with god that sin is sin!

 

[Ronald Nolette]

What do you make of the "conditions" that are attached to our salvation? Like, when Jesus says, "But he that shall endure unto the end, the same shall be saved" (Matthew 24:13). Or, as Paul says in Hebrews 3:12, 14, "Take care, brothers, lest there be in any of you an evil, unbelieving heart, leading you to fall away from the living God...For we have come to share in Christ, if indeed we hold our original confidence firm to the end". Again, Hebrews 10, "28 Anyone who has set aside the law of Moses dies without mercy on the evidence of two or three witnesses. 29How much worse punishment, do you think, will be deserved by the one who has trampled underfoot the Son of God, and has profaned the blood of the covenant by which he was sanctified, and has outraged the Spirit of grace? 30For we know him who said, “Vengeance is mine; I will repay.” And again, “The Lord will judge his people.” 31It is a fearful thing to fall into the hands of the living God.". And in 1 John 5, "16If anyone sees his brother committing a sin not leading to death, he shall ask, and God will give him life—to those who commit sins that do not lead to death. There is sin that leads to death; I do not say that one should pray for that. 17All wrongdoing is sin, but there is sin that does not lead to death."

Well I will tryt o keep the answers as short as possible without doing them harm.

For the Matthew passage. Most pull this out of context!

This is about teh end times and refers to the tribulation saints and not the church saints. They are awaiting Jesus return and the establishment of the physical kingdom as the gospel they present as a witness against the world says.

There is all out genocide declared against Christians and Jews. The Mark or death! The mark means instant and eternal damnation. Those who do not take the mark will be delievered and enter the kingdom! There is far more to it but that is a concise synopsis.


As for the Hebrew passages? These are not talking about salvation at all but about the impending Judgment on Jerusalem Jesus pronounced in Matthew 12 and reiterated in the Luke part of the Olivet discourse. Context is always critical. This book is written to Jews as we see its deep Jewish content.

Teh context is showing that it is written to believer and unbeliever alike. Here is the scenario. This book was written after Titus first laid siege to jerusalem. Then He left off the siege to go to Rome to see His father crowned Cesar. Hebrews was written in the pause between 66-70AD.

The punishments spoken of in Heb. 6 and Heb 10 are not about salvation (for they are not saved individuals as a word study shows) Based on the language and context and content, this was written as a warning to Jews who were fellowshipping with Christians but had not been saved.

They had been brought to the point where they knew the law and the sacrifices could not save, that Jesus was Messiah, they had tasted the power of the Spirit (not been infilled). In common vernacular- all that was left was for them to say8 yes. That is what the language storngly suggests both in construct and in context. So if these folks fall away- there is no more repentance for sin but a fearful looking forward to judgment- that judgment being the 70 AD destruction when 1.1 million Jews died in Jerusalem.

The same is true of Hebrews 10:

in 24-29 the writer is further encouraging them to cross the finish line.

Notice that the word sin is in the singular? That does not mean if someone screws up one more time, but when speaking to Jews when sin like this without it being modified by a type of sin, has always referred to unbelief. So He is telling these almost converts that if they turn their backs on Jesus and return to the law and the sacrifice, there is no sacrifice for sin, but only a fiery judgment soon to come, destruction of Jerusalem and death.

This is the result of the unpardonable sin Israel committed in Matt. 12, Jesus warned of its arrival in Luke 21. these are Jews who are suffering tremendous persecution as was known historically for appearing to be Christians (from their own countrymen) Belioevers were ostracized and rejected by the jewish community at large, and these, who were so close to converting were feeling that pressure as well. They came to know Jesus is Messiah and knew that the sacrifices could not remove sin. so for them to turn back at that point , the writer let them know that there were no more sacrifices for sins, it is Jesus or nothing.

this also is succinct but I hope gives you understanding.

 

[07-07-07]

You got two guys.....they both try to Repent of their sins because they believe that it is how one gets Saved......
The first guy is a successful Repenter—- He is sorry every time he sins and he experiences guilt and remorse and he vows to do better and indeed, he “ does” do better.....he manages to rise above the sins in his life......
The second guy—— he ain’t so lucky.He struggles and fails almost all of the time.....he tries to remember all of his sins and he tries to “ do better”, but he just can’t manage to repent as successfully as the other guy......
The bad news is that both of these guys are Lost.Why? Those that try to get Saved by Repenting have forgotten a few things—— Obsession with Repentance can keep you from Believing and Trusting in Jesus for Salvation.....there is no acknowledgement of Mercy or Grace......no Credit is Given to the Shed Blood which turned out to be the “ Actual” thing that Saved lost Sinners....
Salvation is all about the Acceptance Of a FREE GIFT.....Those trying to be Justified by their ability to Repent have Rejected that Free Gift where Jesus gets all of the Glory and they get None.....They demanded that others had to Repent Of “ their” sins and of course they NEVER really gave up all of the Sins in their lives —— its a Fool’s Errand to think that you can rid yourself of ALL the Sin in your life.....even if you did and became a perfect Performer Of the Law, you will discover that you wasted your time.....it's like playing by the Rules Of Checkers when the “ game” being played was Chess. Why? “ By The Works Of The Law , NO FLESH shall be JUSTIFIED, and those that put their Faith in “ Repenting From Sin” turned it into a Work....
“ Turning From Sin” is a good thing to do, but it is not the Formula for Salvation.....we are not Saved by what “ WE” do —— no matter how great and good it sounds—— that’s for “ itching ears “ .....We are Saved by what JESUS did and our BELIEF in what HE accomplished FOR us .....Relying on Repentance for Salvation won’t get the job done.....it ain’t what we “ DID”, it’s what we “ BELIEVED”, as in “ BELIEVE in The Lord Jesus and Thou Shalt be Saved”.....
Remember this.....if your “Salvation Plan” sneaks in anything that “ YOU” get Credit for.....You are one the Wrong Track.......HE gets ALL the Glory for your Salvation and YOU get NONE! Even if you are the best little repenter of sins that ever lived.....

This belongs in the dunghill. Jesus didn't die for the sins of man so he can continue in sin, catering to his flesh.