Two Ways of thinking about OSAS

[JPPT1974]

God establishes the law. He made the Ten Commandments. As well as sent Jesus to die and rise from the dead. To give us eternal life.

 

[H. Richard]

You appear to be still confused by the law of Moses, the sacrificial etc laws (613) which were temporary, and the ten commandments written by God personally and are permanent.
Paul said in Romans "it is NOT hearers of the law that are justified, but DOERS of the law" That should be clear enough for anyone to understand..also in Romans Paul said "do we make void the law through fath? God forbid. We ESTABLISH the law.

You are confused in that you do not know the difference between law and grace.

In religion there seem to be no difference. The religious think that Jesus just came to set up a modified religion, organized by men and taught by men. They do not see that it was religion that had Jesus crucified.

 

[Dcopymope]

You are confused in that you do not know the difference between law and grace.

In religion there seem to be no difference. The religious think that Jesus just came to set up a modified religion, organized by men and taught by men. They do not see that it was religion that had Jesus crucified.

He also seems to be confused as to what Paul meant by the establishment of the law. When Jesus fulfilled the law, the law was henceforth written in the heart and spirit of men for all who repent. Romans 2 makes it very clear that It is by the letter of the law that all will be judged according to their works. In Romans 3, it is stated that it is only through Jesus Christ that man can be justified in the eyes of the Father, and not by the mosaic letter of the law, because Jesus Christ IS the law. And like I said before, to be justified means to be saved, and being saved means the expungement or remission of all sins through the atonement of Jesus, so that you DON'T have to face the great white throne of judgement as clearly shown in Revelation 20. This is what it truly means to be "justified" in the eyes of the father when it comes down to it.

 

[heretoeternity]

You are confused in that you do not know the difference between law and grace.

In religion there seem to be no difference. The religious think that Jesus just came to set up a modified religion, organized by men and taught by men. They do not see that it was religion that had Jesus crucified.

You chose to ignore the teachings of scripture...that is your choice and typical of the influence of satan and his demons..

 

[H. Richard]

You chose to ignore the teachings of scripture...that is your choice and typical of the influence of satan and his demons..

Foolishness, don't you know I can say the same thing to you. But what does that accomplish?

 

[T1m0thy]

Hebrews 6:1-12,,,, OSAS or not?

 

[H. Richard]

Hebrews 6:1-12,,,, OSAS or not?

IMO, the book of Hebrews was written by Paul to the Jews explaining about the implication of how Jesus is much better that the Law. He did not write anything about grace in it. Since the Jews are God's chosen people, at the time this book was written, they only needed to accept the fact the Jesus is their Messiah and King. After the destruction of the Jewish Temple the Jews must have faith in Jesus' shed blood for salvation the same as the Gentles.

Do I believe OSAS? Yes I do. A child of God is made a child of God by God and no one or anything can change that. Religious people teach that if a child of God sins then they become unsaved and lose their salvation. God will not lose any of His children.

 

[heretoeternity]

IMO, the book of Hebrews was written by Paul to the Jews explaining about the implication of how Jesus is much better that the Law. He did not write anything about grace in it. Since the Jews are God's chosen people, at the time this book was written, they only needed to accept the fact the Jesus is their Messiah and King. After the destruction of the Jewish Temple the Jews must have faith in Jesus' shed blood for salvation the same as the Gentles.

Do I believe OSAS? Yes I do. A child of God is made a child of God by God and no one or anything can change that. Religious people teach that if a child of God sins then they become unsaved and lose their salvation. God will not lose any of His children
If





You obviously have not read Revelation 12 Salvation is for those who have the testimony of Jesus and follow the commandments of God.,. and Rev 22 Jesus said behold I come quickly and my reward is with me for every man according to his works.
Sin is transgression of God's law 1st John...those passages in Revelation would seem to exclude those who wilfully continue to sin...

 

[mjrhealth]

Sin is transgression of God's law 1st John...those passages in Revelation would seem to exclude those who wilfully continue to sin...

Playing a stuck record, than how did Adam sin since he had no law or His son??? Sice the law came through moses. According to you all those including Adam where without sin, since they had no law, if that is so, than how could Sin have come into the world by Adam??? The law was not given until Moses nearly 6000 years later. thats a lot of people without sin, if that is so, why did God institute the great flood if no one was sinning.

 

[T1m0thy]

IMO, the book of Hebrews was written by Paul to the Jews explaining about the implication of how Jesus is much better that the Law. He did not write anything about grace in it. Since the Jews are God's chosen people, at the time this book was written, they only needed to accept the fact the Jesus is their Messiah and King. After the destruction of the Jewish Temple the Jews must have faith in Jesus' shed blood for salvation the same as the Gentles.

Do I believe OSAS? Yes I do. A child of God is made a child of God by God and no one or anything can change that. Religious people teach that if a child of God sins then they become unsaved and lose their salvation. God will not lose any of His children.

oh, so Paul's advice to the Jews is not for us today?

 

[Phoneman777]

IMO, the book of Hebrews was written by Paul to the Jews explaining about the implication of how Jesus is much better that the Law. He did not write anything about grace in it. Since the Jews are God's chosen people, at the time this book was written, they only needed to accept the fact the Jesus is their Messiah and King. After the destruction of the Jewish Temple the Jews must have faith in Jesus' shed blood for salvation the same as the Gentles.

Do I believe OSAS? Yes I do. A child of God is made a child of God by God and no one or anything can change that. Religious people teach that if a child of God sins then they become unsaved and lose their salvation. God will not lose any of His children.

Friend, Dispensationalism is a made up 19th century error by J. N. Darby who also gave us the error of the "Secret Rapture".

The Jews are no longer "God's chosen". Jesus said Gentiles would come from the "east, west, north, south while you yourselves (Israel) shall be cast out". Paul puts it this way: "If ye be Christ's, then are ye Abraham's seed." Christ's church is God's chosen, and according to Romans 15, the success of Christ's chosen is supposed to inspire individual Israelites to jealousy and repentance, but as an entire nation, it will never be so, according to Isaiah 5:1-7 KJV. This very OT passage is from where Jesus delivers His warning of the impending doom of Israel in Matthew 21:33-46 KJV in His parable of the "Wicked Husbandmen" to the Jews. If you find one hint of the restoration of Israel in that Isaiah passage, this vegetarian will BBQ for dinner.

 

[H. Richard]

Friend, Dispensationalism is a made up 19th century error by J. N. Darby who also gave us the error of the "Secret Rapture".

The Jews are no longer "God's chosen". Jesus said Gentiles would come from the "east, west, north, south while you yourselves (Israel) shall be cast out". Paul puts it this way: "If ye be Christ's, then are ye Abraham's seed." Christ's church is God's chosen, and according to Romans 15, the success of Christ's chosen is supposed to inspire individual Israelites to jealousy and repentance, but as an entire nation, it will never be so, according to Isaiah 5:1-7 KJV. This very OT passage is from where Jesus delivers His warning of the impending doom of Israel in Matthew 21:33-46 KJV in His parable of the "Wicked Husbandmen" to the Jews. If you find one hint of the restoration of Israel in that Isaiah passage, this vegetarian will BBQ for dinner.

If you are a protestant Christian then your religion is also made up since it did not start until about the 15th or 16th century. So you are at odds with every protestant on this forum.

It is a Jewish kingdom that God will set up when Jesus returns. The Jews have been set aside until the time of the Gentiles is finished.
Luke 21:24
24 And they will fall by the edge of the sword, and be led away captive into all nations. And Jerusalem will be trampled by Gentiles until the times of the Gentiles are fulfilled.
NKJV

 

[Phoneman777]

If you are a protestant Christian then your religion is also made up since it did not start until about the 15th or 16th century. So you are at odds with every protestant on this forum.

It is a Jewish kingdom that God will set up when Jesus returns. The Jews have been set aside until the time of the Gentiles is finished.
Luke 21:24
24 And they will fall by the edge of the sword, and be led away captive into all nations. And Jerusalem will be trampled by Gentiles until the times of the Gentiles are fulfilled.
NKJV

You have no answer for Jesus' and Isaiah's proclamation that Israel would be destroyed and cast out of the kingdom and replaced by Gentiles? Why not?

As for your "proof text" that the "Times of the Gentiles" refers to occupation of the ancient land by non-Jews until 1948, that period refers to the time the Gospel began to be preached to the Gentiles until Jesus' Second Coming. That strip of land in the Middle East that is recognized as being occupied by "God's chosen" is not "Israel" for two reasons:

• God never once in all the Bible gathered Israel back to the land after scattering them for their sin unless they first repented per 2 Chronicles 7:14 KJV. Have they repented of murdering Jesus? No, they still to this day call Him "son of a whore" and "the Great Imposter". Can you imagine calling my wonderful, sweet, merciful Jesus a "son of a whore", especially when His mother was a virgin? They will plead for His mercy in the Day of Judgment and will receive none. Therefore, God was not in 1948 - it was the satanic work of globalist Luciferians, to which "enlightened" Christians today are completely blind, though Paul says we are not to be "ignorant of Satan's devices". Please don't argue, "but they will accept Him after they blindness is gone, yada yada". The Bible is clear: FIRST repentance, and THEN they are gathered back, not visa-versa.

• The borders of that little patch of real estate known as "Israel" do not even begin to approach the territory that was ancient Israel in the Bible. The Gentiles to this day still "trodden under foot" the land and to claim it has ceased requires one to be either geographically challenged or just willfully ignorant.

"Israel" in prophecy refers to the church, friend, for "if ye be Christ's, then are ye Abraham's seed and heirs according to the promise."

 

[FHII]

If you are a protestant Christian then your religion is also made up since it did not start until about the 15th or 16th century. So you are at odds with every protestant on this forum.

It is a Jewish kingdom that God will set up when Jesus returns. The Jews have been set aside until the time of the Gentiles is finished.
Luke 21:24
24 And they will fall by the edge of the sword, and be led away captive into all nations. And Jerusalem will be trampled by Gentiles until the times of the Gentiles are fulfilled.
NKJV

That's a very brief summary of what will hapoen, but yes... My studies show me the same thing.

Perhaos the only thing I would disagree on is the notion that it will be a Jewish kingdom.. It'll be God's kingdom made up and governed by descendants of the 12 tribes. But only for a thousand years.

 

[T1m0thy]

And this is the Father's will which hath sent me, that of all which he hath given me I should lose nothing, but should raise it up again at the last day. John 6:39. Jesus said he would not lose even one person who the Father has given him. Thus anyone who makes a sincere commitment to believe in Jesus Christ as Savior is secure in God's promise of eternal life. Christ will not let his people be overcome by Satan and lose their salvation. God bless

 

[mjrhealth]

PM God has never forsaken nor forgotten teh Jews. It was becuase of them we have salavtion so do not despise the things of God, for we do nor=t know all that is.

Rom 11:24 For if thou wert cut out of the olive tree which is wild by nature, and wert graffed contrary to nature into a good olive tree: how much more shall these, which be the natural branches, be graffed into their own olive tree?

Lev_26:44 And yet for all that, when they be in the land of their enemies, I will not cast them away, neither will I abhor them, to destroy them utterly, and to break my covenant with them: for I am the LORD their God.

God has not and will not change just because you have a problem. He made a covenant with the Jews for ever

 

[Phoneman777]

And this is the Father's will which hath sent me, that of all which he hath given me I should lose nothing, but should raise it up again at the last day. John 6:39. Jesus said he would not lose even one person who the Father has given him. Thus anyone who makes a sincere commitment to believe in Jesus Christ as Savior is secure in God's promise of eternal life. Christ will not let his people be overcome by Satan and lose their salvation. God bless

A "commitment to believe in Jesus as Savior" without repentance from sin and daily surrender to Him is insufficient, for the devils also believe that Jesus is Savior, yet they tremble if fear of their coming demise, according to Acts 16:17 KJV and James 2:19 KJV.

 

[T1m0thy]

A "commitment to believe in Jesus as Savior" without repentance from sin and daily surrender to Him is insufficient, for the devils also believe that Jesus is Savior, yet they tremble if fear of their coming demise, according to Acts 16:17 KJV and James 2:19 KJV.

"A sincere commitment to believe in Jesus Christ" does incorporate repentance and surrender (for me also). However my comment was if relation to the topic "OSAS". But thank you for your comment, God bless

 

[H. Richard]

A "commitment to believe in Jesus as Savior" without repentance from sin and daily surrender to Him is insufficient, for the devils also believe that Jesus is Savior, yet they tremble if fear of their coming demise, according to Acts 16:17 KJV and James 2:19 KJV.

I take issue with you on the devil comment. There has never been a salvation offered to Satan and his dominions. You are just using this to foster your idea that Jesus only paid for a person's sin before they believed in Jesus and they must continue to repent daily in order for God to forgive them.

You, like all of the religious, use fear to intimidate others to you ideas and I do not believe you. I will believe the scriptures.

Normally I would include scriptures to prove what I believe but I will not continue to do so because it falls on deaf ears.

 

[H. Richard]

That's a very brief summary of what will hapoen, but yes... My studies show me the same thing.

Perhaos the only thing I would disagree on is the notion that it will be a Jewish kingdom.. It'll be God's kingdom made up and governed by descendants of the 12 tribes. But only for a thousand years.

The 1,000 year reign of a Jewish kingdom was promised to the Jews. It was not promised to the Gentiles.

God has another plan for those saved under grace. We are in heavenly places.

1 Cor 15:48-49
48 As was the man of dust, so also are those who are made of dust; and as is the heavenly Man, so also are those who are heavenly.
49 And as we have borne the image of the man of dust, we shall also bear the image of the heavenly Man.
NKJV

Eph 1:3
3 Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, who has blessed us with every spiritual blessing in the heavenly places in Christ,
NKJV

Eph 2:5-7
5 even when we were dead in trespasses, made us alive together with Christ (by grace you have been saved),
6 and raised us up together, and made us sit together in the heavenly places in Christ Jesus,
7 that in the ages to come He might show the exceeding riches of His grace in His kindness toward us in Christ Jesus.
NKJV

2 Tim 4:18
18 And the Lord will deliver me from every evil work and preserve me for His heavenly kingdom. To Him be glory forever and ever. Amen!
NKJV

Heb 9:11
The Heavenly Sanctuary 11 But Christ came as High Priest of the good things to come, with the greater and more perfect tabernacle not made with hands, that is, not of this creation.
NKJV