Understanding the Trinity.

[Wrangler]

So the most logical conclusion is that it refers to Jesus as the true God.

It takes 8 points of tortured logic to reach that conclusion - in TOTAL opposition to Jesus saying only his Father is the true God. How's that logic working out for ya?

 

[Enoch111]

The Trinity is a concept that is impossible for any human being to fully understand, let alone explain.

And that is exactly why it must be believed in simple faith.

 

[Enoch111]

The only clear, undisputed scripture which speaks of the only true God is Jesus' prayer at John 17:3. And that is that the Father is the only true God.

And is that the end of the matter, or must that be understood within its context as well as the context of the whole Bible? So now let's look at that verse closely, and also another related verse: And this is life eternal, that they might know thee the only true God, and Jesus Christ, whom thou hast sent.

So Christ did not stop at "true God" but continued with "and Jesus Christ, whom thou hast sent." In other words you cannot exclude Jesus Christ from the true God. So that there will be no misunderstanding, and the naysayers will be taken in their own craftiness, the same apostle John goes on to say (1 John 5:20): And we know that the Son of God is come, and hath given us an understanding, that we may know him that is true, and we are in him that is true, even in his Son Jesus Christ. This is the true God, and eternal life.

Did you get this? Jesus called the Father "the only true God" and the Father called Jesus "the true God, and Eternal Life" through John (which should have been capitalized since Christ Himself is Eternal Life).

 

[Brakelite]

“The most difficult thing about the Christian concept of the Trinity is that there is no way to perfectly and completely understand it.

You correctly state here that no-one can fully comprehend the infinite, let alone explain it so that anyone else can comprehend it, yet you make a belief in this "mystery" which no-one can understand or explain, salvational?
Another point which I would like you to explain, if you can, is the meaning of "eternally begotten". And can you find that expression in the Bible?

 

[Brakelite]

And that is exactly why it must be believed in simple faith.

So in order to be saved we must have simple faith in a concept?

 

[MatthewG]

“For I am

not ashamed of the

gospel of Christ,

for it is the

power

of God

to salvation

for everyone

who believes, for the Jew first and also for the Greek.”
‭‭Romans‬ ‭1:16‬ ‭NKJV‬‬

 

[Wrangler]

The Trinity is a concept that is impossible for any human being to fully understand, let alone explain.

Such assertions are quintessential Appeal To Ignorance. Look it up.

How and why would anyone advocate for a concept they neither understand nor can explain is the height of irresponsibility! As intellectually and morally responsible as it is illogical.

Some things are complete nonsense. Contradictions are nonsense. That is how one explains it. Simple. Compare to the concepts below that are impossible for any human being to fully understand, let alone explain.

• Some things are in and out at the same place and time etc ... It is impossible for any human being to fully understand, let alone explain.
• Some things are up and down relative to the same place and time etc ... It is impossible for any human being to fully understand, let alone explain.
• Some things are alone (1) and not alone (3) at the same place and time etc ... It is impossible for any human being to fully understand, let alone explain.

 

[ChristisGod]

It takes 8 points of tortured logic to reach that conclusion - in TOTAL opposition to Jesus saying only his Father is the true God. How's that logic working out for ya?

Logic ?

You think the Miraculous Jesus is logic ?

You think God can be proven by science ?

Do you think miracles are logical ?

yikes..............

 

[Wrangler]

Logic ?

You think the Miraculous Jesus is logic ?

You think God can be proven by science ?

Do you think miracles are logical ?

yikes..............

Yes. Yes. And Yes.

 

[farouk]

Logic ?

You think the Miraculous Jesus is logic ?

You think God can be proven by science ?

Do you think miracles are logical ?

yikes..............

@Christophany The witness in Scripture to God in Three Persons is just overwhelming...

 

[Wrangler]

@Christophany The witness in Scripture to God in Three Persons is just overwhelming...

You mean the 3 witnesses the KJV translators invented or the real 3 witnesses in Scripture; the Spirit, the water, and the blood?

 

[Wrangler]

And that is exactly why it must be believed in simple faith.

Why must it be believed at all?

 

[farouk]

You mean the 3 witnesses the KJV translators invented or the real 3 witnesses in Scripture; the Spirit, the water, and the blood?

The end of Matthew 28; John's Gospel, esp. chapters 13- 17; Romans 8; John's First Epistle, etc. The witness of Scripture to God in Three Persons is ovewhelming; and it becomes senseless to continue to debate denials of the this glorious fact in the face of such overwhelming Biblical evidence.

 

[Wrangler]

The end of Matthew 28; John's Gospel, esp. chapters 13- 17; Romans 8; John's First Epistle, etc. The witness of Scripture to God in Three Persons is ovewhelming; and it becomes senseless to continue to debate denials of the this glorious fact in the face of such overwhelming Biblical evidence.

There are not 3 persons. Every epistle testifies to this truth. But I do agree it is senseless to debate such a twisting of the plain word of God.

I pray that God our Father and the Lord Jesus, the Anointed One, will shower you with grace and peace.
1 Corinthians 1:3 (The Voice)

God, unseen until now, is revealed in the Voice, God’s only Son, straight from the Father’s heart.
John 1:18

 

[farouk]

I am now going to press a particular button....

 

[ChristisGod]

Yes. Yes. And Yes.

Then you do not know Who God is or what a miracle is.

next

 

[farouk]

Then you do not know Who God is or what a miracle is.

next

@Christophany Biblical salvation and the Biblical Triune God are deeply linked...

 

[Enoch111]

So in order to be saved we must have simple faith in a concept?

Not in a "concept" but in the REALITY of the Godhead. So yes. Unless a person sincerely believes that Jesus is GOD who became Man for our salvation, that person cannot and will not be saved. Saving faith is truly believing who Jesus is, and what He accomplished in His death, burial, and resurrection.

And without controversy great is the mystery of godliness: God was manifest in the flesh, justified in the Spirit, seen of angels, preached unto the Gentiles, believed on in the world, received up into glory. (1 Timothy 3:16 KJB)

Only the King James Bible has "GOD" in this verse, which is the correct rendering of the Greek THEOS when abbreviated. So who was "God manifest in the flesh" other than Jesus of Nazareth? Hence the confession of Thomas after the resurrection, when he exclaimed "My Lord and my GOD".

 

[Wrangler]

Then you do not know Who God is or what a miracle is.

next

What humility, to claim to know better what I know that me. Jesus said, "Follow me" not "abandon logic."

@Christophany Biblical salvation and the Biblical Triune God are deeply linked...

Except the trinity is nowhere in Scripture.

 

[amadeus]

So in order to be saved we must have simple faith in a concept?

We must rather have faith in what some men have decided is the necessary way to believe. Never mind about faith in God!