Walking in love?

[Robbie]

You say salvation is through Jesus and then deny the salvation He brought saying we can only know God through reading a book... if we can't talk directly to God we're still under the curse... as it's only through a direct living relationship through Christ to the Father that the curse has been lifted...

So no... Christ isn't your foundation... a book is... and a big part of that book is the old that's passed away... and because Christ isn't your foundation the old for you hasn't passed away... you are still under the curse and the seperation... because if you were under the New you would testify to God's Word indwelling those who believed... but you deny such and in so doing deny the Lord...

I'm done talking to you for tonight Ducky... I ask that the Father add increase to you... be blessed...

 

[Duckybill]

You say salvation is through Jesus and then deny the salvation He brought saying we can only know God through reading a book...

Nope. I believe in Jesus of the Bible.

if we can't talk directly to God we're still under the curse... as it's only through a direct living relationship through Christ to the Father that the curse has been lifted...

What curse?

So no... Christ isn't your foundation... a book is... and a big part of that book is the old that's passed away... and because Christ isn't your foundation the old for you hasn't passed away... you are still under the curse and the seperation... because if you were under the New you would testify to God's Word indwelling those who believed... but you deny such and in so doing deny the Lord...

I believe in Jesus of the Bible. Which Jesus do you believe in?

I'm done talking to you for tonight Ducky... it really seems pointless anyways but then again it's just my responsibility to water or plant and I can't add any increase to you .. but I ask that the Father add increase to you... be blessed...

The Father? You mean the Father of the book of contradictions?

 

[Groundzero]

How about Jesus direct contradiction to what was written in scripture several times, "You've heard it said an eye for an eye and a tooth for a tooth but I say to you love your enemies, do good to those that hate you, pray for those who spitefully use you"

How about when Solomon says that the wicked and the righteous both will come to the same end and they will never again have a part under the Sun?... but thanks to Christ many who died did have part again under the sun... even many saints after He died on the cross came out of the graves and were seen by many walking around.

Why is this? Because Christ makes everything new... Christ establishes a new covenant... and if it wasn't different than the old it wouldn't be new... and if it is new chances are it will contradict the old.

I mean in the old people only knew God from behind a veil... in the new people know God directly because the veil is torn in two.

In the old people new God through the law and the prophets... in the last days God has spoken to us by His Son...

In the old Elijah called fire down from heaven... in the new the disciples were rebuked for wanting to call fire down from heaven because they didn't know what manner of Spirit they were of... for the Son didn't come to destroy mens lives but to save them...

In the old men were told to listen to Moses and Elijah and in the new they were told not to listen to Moses or Elijah but only to listen to His Son...

And why wouldn't things contradict each other... I mean according to the old I was cursed to death... and under the New the curse is lifted and I have a reestablished relationship with the Father through Jesus... I mean everything is a contradiction really... since one kills and the other gives life...

So I have no problem with any of these things that are in contradiction with each other because I know it's doesn't mean the New or the Old is wrong... it just means that in the New all things are made New because because Christ changed everything on the cross... and now the old is passed away.. to those who believe...

Wow! So they are your contradictions? I believe that there is one very simple answer to them! Different dispensations! God dealt with man in different ways!

They don't actually contradict in the sense that we have been talking about. When I say contradictions, I mean genuine contradictions, where the Bible will say one thing somewhere, and then say the exact opposite. Prentis gave some good examples of them. Your examples are merely to do with dispensations! Nice reasoning, but not quite what we are talking about. Definitely not what I was talking about.

Whoops. Missed the one about Solomon. Solomon was looking at life from a carnal viewpoint. From a carnal man's viewpoint, such a statement is correct! Doesn't matter how you live, you both end up in the grave! That is a carnal man's viewpoint. Solomon himself gives the conclusion later. Fear God.

Not "always". There are times, when necessary, the Spirit will speak directly to the situation. Let me give you an example...

Years ago I smoked. I was a Believer then and I thoroughly enjoyed smoking. I lived out in the country with lots of hills, wooded area, creek, etc. One day I had gone for a hike. I stopped to take a break and leaned up against a tree. I felt the overwhelming presence of God and had a vision of an Angel between me and the tree with his wings wrapped around me. I just stood there basking in the holy comfort. After quite some time, I pulled my cigarettes out of my pocket and lit one up. As soon as I did, I saw the wings unwrap me and heard a voice "I cannot protect you from this".

The meaning was obvious to me...Almost a "DUH!"...However I was not "lead to the written word of God".

Don't take that the wrong way. I believe a steady diet of the Scriptures is necessary to maintain spiritual health. And depending what you're into...sometimes you need more than others...Kinda like a person that's weight training needs more protein than a couch potato.

However...As I have said before...The Bible does not contain God. He is bigger than that and is more than capable of moving in His mysterious ways to deal with us directly.

As a footnote: I also do not believe it is a regular occurrence, however, the possibility should never be ruled out.

Great example of a personal conviction! So true

 

[Robbie]

So it's OK that Solomon was wrong because he was looking at it from a carnal view point? And how do you know it's Solomon looking at it from a carnal viewpoint? Because you start from a foundation of what you're religion says and then interpret and twist the scriptures to whatever suits your religion? because if it's in the bible and everything in the bible is God's Word how can anything in it be from a carnal viewpoint? When the carnal mind is at war with God?

Do you think anything from Christ is from a carnal viewpoint?

It just seems to me like you're in denial about the contradictions and you have no idea why there is contradictions so when they come up you just reach for some excuse.

Christ understood why there was contradictions between Him and Moses... for instance the Pharisees couldn't understand why Jesus said divorce was wrong and why Moses said it was OK... Jesus was contradicting Moses and He let them know, "It was because of the hardness of your hearts that Moses allowed you to divorce your wife"

So you're still mistaken... God's Word is Christ and not a book... take every bible away from this planet and God's Word will still live in those who are His... Christ in them...

Take Christ out of every last person on this planet and stick a bible in their hands and you'll just have a bunch of Pharisees who search the scriptures because in them they think they have life but none of them have God's Word in them...

Those would truly be the days of darkness when no one could work... to work is to believe...

These false teachings that say God is in someway powerless without paper and ink are not only false lies... but also destructive and antichrist...

 

[rockytopva]

I have tried to start silly threads here and they wanted to debate that! Haha!

 

[Prentis]

That's a great explanation! Makes sense too!



Umm, I'll need the references. Just from face value, I'd say that Jesus was referring to the golden rule. Do unto others as you would them do to you. Paul was saying that one who is spiritual will line up all things and test them to see if they are correct. No contradictions.

Gnite

I gotta go too. Training for the finals this sat!

It's not the only instance of this. Paul also says "judge no thing before it's time". James says that if we don't have mercy, there will be no mercy for us.

Even if what you say is true, then there is a double standard. On the one hand we must do unto others as we would like them to do to us, on the other hand we have to judge everything, even though we would hate for that to happen to us (our flesh would).

Here's why.

One speaks of US, our life and mind. In your own understanding, judge no man. You are not God and cannot trust yourself or put yourself above others.

The other speaks of the life of Christ in us. Think about this, Peter says 'you are dead', and Ananias (and later Saphira) falls to the ground dead. According to who's will and power and authority was that done? The Father. Peter, like Jesus, spoke what the Father told him.

God judges all things, and only him.

[sup]1 Corinthians 2:15[/sup] But he who is spiritual judges all things, yet he himself is rightly judged by no one. [sup]16[/sup] For “who has known the mind of the LORD that he may instruct Him?”[sup][e][/sup] But we have the mind of Christ.

Natural man cannot judge because he has not known the mind of the Lord. Spiritual man can judge because he has the mind of Christ, Christ is in him, and alive, and it is no longer him who lives but Christ lives in him.

It contradicts itself because it speaks of two 'dimensions' that are different. The Bible SAYS Noah was a righteous man. It also says NONE are righteous. Why? It speaks on two different levels, the righteousness man can achieve, and the righteousness of God. Jesus said 'man has no greater love than this, that he give his life for his FRIENDS'. That is the greatest love man has, but Jesus says 'love as I loved', and that includes going beyond and giving his life for his enemies. Only with God can we do this.

 

[Groundzero]

So it's OK that Solomon was wrong because he was looking at it from a carnal view point? And how do you know it's Solomon looking at it from a carnal viewpoint? Because you start from a foundation of what you're religion says and then interpret and twist the scriptures to whatever suits your religion? because if it's in the bible and everything in the bible is God's Word how can anything in it be from a carnal viewpoint? When the carnal mind is at war with God?

Do you think anything from Christ is from a carnal viewpoint?

It just seems to me like you're in denial about the contradictions and you have no idea why there is contradictions so when they come up you just reach for some excuse.

Christ understood why there was contradictions between Him and Moses... for instance the Pharisees couldn't understand why Jesus said divorce was wrong and why Moses said it was OK... Jesus was contradicting Moses and He let them know, "It was because of the hardness of your hearts that Moses allowed you to divorce your wife"

So you're still mistaken... God's Word is Christ and not a book... take every bible away from this planet and God's Word will still live in those who are His... Christ in them...

Take Christ out of every last person on this planet and stick a bible in their hands and you'll just have a bunch of Pharisees who search the scriptures because in them they think they have life but none of them have God's Word in them...

Those would truly be the days of darkness when no one could work... to work is to believe...

These false teachings that say God is in someway powerless without paper and ink are not only false lies... but also destructive and antichrist...

I don't profess religion Robbie. I am simply a Believer. I could into detail concerning Ecclesiastes, but I can't see the point. I have given my explanation, of course you probably have some excellent reason, even though you haven't shown it yet, other than it's a flaw in the Bible.

Ok, goodbye Robbie.

 

[Duckybill]

Biblical 'contradictions' are simply bogus. They are the result of listening to a deceiving spirit, Satan. A result of NOT listening to the Holy Spirit.

 

[Robbie]

Ducky you can't even acknowledge anything that isn't in agreement with your religion... so talking to you is pretty much pointless...

On a positive note... I shot water at Wedge tonight and after all the talk about Noah I was stoked on this shot the Lord blessed me with... His Promise to Noah...

 

[Duckybill]

Ducky you can't even acknowledge anything that isn't in agreement with your religion... so talking to you is pretty much pointless...

The Bible is the Word of God. Anyone who attacks the Bible is being led by Satan. You're right Robbie. Why change when you're on the right road?

 

[Robbie]

Just like the Pharisees who were sure their interpretation of the scriptures was correct all the while they rejected the Lord... like I said Ducky... if someone can take God away from you by taking away your book you don't have God... when Christ is in you your relationship with God isn't based on what can be taken away from you... you seriously are just the blind leaders of the blind and my guess is that's because you follow a man who is also blind... start following Christ alone so you can see...

All the best Ducky but I'm over going back and forth with you... there's no point... like Prentis said... we all have said what we have to say... let the Lord destroy anything that isn't from Him...

 

[Duckybill]

Just like the Pharisees who were sure their interpretation of the scriptures was correct all the while they rejected the Lord...

Nope. They were hypocrites.

like I said Ducky... if someone can take God away from you by taking away your book you don't have God... when Christ is in you your relationship with God isn't based on what can be taken away from you... you seriously are just the blind leaders of the blind and my guess is that's because you follow a man who is also blind... start following Christ alone so you can see...

Ah, but you don't even know which Christ you are following. Not the one of the Bible, then which Christ???

All the best Ducky but I'm over going back and forth with you... there's no point... like Prentis said... we all have said what we have to say... let the Lord destroy anything that isn't from Him...

Yes indeed, God will soon clean His house. You can count on it.

Didn't you say you used to believe the Bible?

1 Timothy 4:1 (NKJV)
1 Now the Spirit expressly says that in latter times some will depart from the faith, giving heed to deceiving spirits and doctrines of demons,

 

[Robbie]

Dude... I know Jesus... take away every bible from this planet and I'll still know Jesus... because He lives in me... on the other hand take the bible away from you and you've just lost your God... haha...

And what are you talking about I said I used to believe the bible? I never said I used to believe the bible... as in I no longer believe the bible... you're such a manipulator and a liar... can you even see that you're just like the Pharisees Ducky? Twisting words and making stuff up in order to bare false witness... you need help homey...

 

[Duckybill]

Dude... I know Jesus... take away every bible from this planet and I'll still know Jesus... because He lives in me... on the other hand take the bible away from you and you've just lost your God... haha...

Which Jesus? The one from your corrupt Bible or another one? You don't even know.

And what are you talking about I said I used to believe the bible? I never said I used to believe the bible... as in I no longer believe the bible... you're such a manipulator and a liar... can you even see that you're just like the Pharisees Ducky? Twisting words and making stuff up in order to bare false witness... you need help homey...

I asked a question. All you had to say was no. You're getting desperate Robbie. What do you have to offer? A corrupt Bible version of Jesus or another Jesus? You have nothing to offer anyone but an unknown spirit who guides you. That's just the way it is without the God of the Bible. You have to resort to name calling.

 

[Duckybill]

And what are you talking about I said I used to believe the bible? I never said I used to believe the bible... as in I no longer believe the bible... you're such a manipulator and a liar... can you even see that you're just like the Pharisees Ducky? Twisting words and making stuff up in order to bare false witness... you need help homey...

You wrote:
"Look Ducky... I understand why you believe what you believe... there was a time years ago when I stood in a house and I held the bible and I said, "The Word became flesh" and as I said that I pointed to the bible and said... this is His Word... it's now become flesh.. it's become tangible. Why did I believe that? Because the foundation of my beliefs was that the bible was the Word of God... that the Word of God is a book..."

 

[7angels]

alright i think it is time to clear up some of this. ducky is right about the bible. the bible is the living word(john 1:1, 1:14). you cannot just take out or disbelieve what is written there because it does not make sense. that is why we are told to study the word(2 tim 2:15). the Holy spirit never Goes against the Word. they compliment each other. i am not saying the Holy Spirit cannot talk to or does not talk to us. i feel his guidance continually. but the Word/bible is all true.

there are no contradictions in the bible. the contradictions you have listed that i saw i can be explained. the one is proverbs was answered already, don't judge least you be judged, and we are to judge all things is not a contradiction. what is being stated here is that we are not to judge people. we are to judge actions, behaviors, and ect... i can list scripture if you don't believe me. even Jesus did it and the bible says God never lies and if it is wrong the there is no reason to believe in God.

 

[Duckybill]

Anyone who is determined to find 'contradictions' in the Bible will find them whether they are there or not. Satan has blinded them.

 

[Robbie]

haha... thanks 7angels for clearing up that you also think that Jesus is a book... In John1:1 and 1:14 the Word that was in the beginning that was manifested in the flesh was not a book... the Word that was in the beginning is Jesus... exactly the kind of confusion I was talking about that comes from making your foundation a book instead of Christ...

And it's not man proving the bible as having no contradictions that testifies to me that the testimonies to Jesus in it are true... it's God in me testifying to Jesus that He is true...

And like I said... you make a book the foundation for your relationship with God and all someone has to do to take away your God is take away your bible... you make Christ in you the foundation of your relationship with God and that relationship can't be shaken because nothing can take it way from you or even touch it.

The thing is that you and Ducky see yourselves as so righteous because you think you're standing up for the scriptures... yet you don't even believe what the scriptures say about Christ or what He accomplished on the cross... you want to stand up for the scriptures... start standing up for what the scriptures say about Christ and the direct relationship with now have through Him to the Father that is by the New Covenant which is not according to the letter but of the Spirit.

"alright I think it's time to clear this up" haha... typical religious ego that doesn't even know what it's talking about...

And yeah Ducky... like I said... there was a time when I was carnal minded and thought the Word of God was paper and ink... then my eyes were opened and I came to know the Word Himself... Who's name is Jesus...

And as all you bearers of false witness continue to manipulate, lie and twist my words into things I never said like the bible is corrupt, and that I don't believe what it says, etc... I continue to testify to what the scriptures testify about Christ... but I don't trip... because Jesus said this is exactly how it would be...

 

[Duckybill]

If the Bible has many contradictions then it is corrupt. That is exactly what you are charging Robbie. Nobody here has said that Jesus is a book. The Bible is God's written Word. Those who charge the Bible with contradictions are corrupt messengers of Satan.

 

[Robbie]

7angels just said John1:1 and 1:14 was talking about the bible... so yes... he is saying that Jesus is a book... and no... just because there are contradictions between men who see God through a veil and men who see God without a veil in Christ doesn't mean the bible is corrupt... so you're mistaken...

So quit manipulating my words, twisting them, and lying about what I'm saying in order to bare false witness against me... you're seriously putting yourself in danger... I keep warning you man... you need to stop...