Was Noah's flood global?

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Taken

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I see many errors in that approach.

Disagree.

If we look at Genesis 10:5 we see the follow…
By these were the isles of the Gentiles divided in their lands; every one after his tongue, after their families, in their nations.

Who are these gentiles?

Non-Hebrews.

And to your point, the subject here is people being divided, not the earth itself.

If we continue to the last verse we can confirm this… notice:

Genesis 10:32
32 These are the families of the sons of Noah, after their generations, in their nations: and by these were the nations divided in the earth after the flood.

Nations divided, not land divided.

Peace

Hebrews and Gentiles were divided.
Hebrews and Hebrews divided in their own Nations.
Gentiles and Gentiles divided in their own Nations.
After the Flood, for 100 years, the lands were noticeably dividing.
In the days of Peleg’s lifetime (100 years post flood) the Land was divided.
Noah’s sons divided one from the other and established their own Nations.

For centuries, Land / Nations have changed landscapes, names, governance, laws, people, languages, customs, gods, beliefs, etc.
 

The Learner

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I see many errors in that approach. If we look at Genesis 10:5 we see the follow…
By these were the isles of the Gentiles divided in their lands; every one after his tongue, after their families, in their nations.

Who are these gentiles?

And to your point, the subject here is people being divided, not the earth itself.

If we continue to the last verse we can confirm this… notice:

Genesis 10:32
32 These are the families of the sons of Noah, after their generations, in their nations: and by these were the nations divided in the earth after the flood.

Nations divided, not land divided.

Peace
there is no flood gap in Egypt Old Kingdom of Egypt - Wikipedia
 

Truthnightmare

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I did explain with perfectly clear Bible. I don't think being global or not is a matter of Christian salvation. Several here totally deny the Genesis Flood. That may be a big issue on Judgment Day.
My take is pretty simple…
The fallen angels attacked the land of Adamics, knowing Christ was going to come from one of them.

Noah’s family didn’t mix, God flooded the land and saved Noah’s family.

When Noah got of the ark his family multiplied and decided to build a tower just in case God was to flood them again.
 

Truthnightmare

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Disagree.



Non-Hebrews.



Hebrews and Gentiles were divided.
Hebrews and Hebrews divided in their own Nations.
Gentiles and Gentiles divided in their own Nations.
After the Flood, for 100 years, the lands were noticeably dividing.
In the days of Peleg’s lifetime (100 years post flood) the Land was divided.
Noah’s sons divided one from the other and established their own Nations.

For centuries, Land / Nations have changed landscapes, names, governance, laws, people, languages, customs, gods, beliefs, etc.
Was Noah and his sons Hebrews? And who was the first gentile?
 
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Taken

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Was Noah and his sons Hebrews? And who was the first gentile?

That would require a complex study.
In brief;

* Noah and his sons; Shem, Ham, Japheth were not particularly “called” Gentile or Hebrew.

* Gentile appears to be moreso, a people who were not following the God of Noah.

* Noah’s sons, each went their own way, established cities, had children, generations of offsprings.

* It was a descendent of Shem, named Eber, that appears to be the namesake of the Hebrews, to whit Abram was one of the offspring from …Shem, Eber, descended.
* It was Abram whom God called to leave his father.
* It was Abram whom was first called a Hebrew.

* Hams descendents…
* Japheths descendants…
I believe are they who were called Gentiles, which primarily having their own “gods”….also referenced as heathens.
 

Truthnightmare

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That would require a complex study.
In brief;

* Noah and his sons; Shem, Ham, Japheth were not particularly “called” Gentile or Hebrew.

* Gentile appears to be moreso, a people who were not following the God of Noah.

* Noah’s sons, each went their own way, established cities, had children, generations of offsprings.

* It was a descendent of Shem, named Eber, that appears to be the namesake of the Hebrews, to whit Abram was one of the offspring from …Shem, Eber, descended.
* It was Abram whom God called to leave his father.
* It was Abram whom was first called a Hebrew.

* Hams descendents…
* Japheths descendants…
I believe are they who were called Gentiles, which primarily having their own “gods”….also referenced as heathens.

I am in agreement regarding Eber (Hebrew) and Abraham being called the first Hebrew.

I believe are they who were called Gentiles, which primarily having their own “gods”….also referenced as heathens.

This belief is false… A man’s race or ethnicity does not change do to what he believes.

Israel and Judah both worshipped false Gods but were never gentiles.

Moreover…

Romans 2:14
For when the Gentiles, which have not the law, do by nature the things contained in the law, these, having not the law, are a law unto themselves:

Obeying, the law or God does not change a gentile to a Israelite

Exodus 12:40-51
40 Now the sojourning of the children of Israel, who dwelt in Egypt, was four hundred and thirty years.
41 And it came to pass at the end of the four hundred and thirty years, even the selfsame day it came to pass, that all the hosts of the Lord went out from the land of Egypt.
42 It is a night to be much observed unto the Lord for bringing them out from the land of Egypt: this is that night of the Lord to be observed of all the children of Israel in their generations.
43 And the Lord said unto Moses and Aaron, This is the ordinance of the passover: There shall no [unconverted] stranger eat thereof:
44 But every man's servant that is bought for money, when thou hast circumcised [converted] him, then shall he eat thereof.
45 A [unconverted] foreigner and an hired servant shall not eat thereof.
46 In one house shall it be eaten; thou shalt not carry forth ought of the flesh abroad out of the house; neither shall ye break a bone thereof.
47 All the congregation of Israel shall keep it.
48 And when a stranger shall sojourn with thee, and will keep the passover to the Lord, let all his males be circumcised, and then let him come near and keep it; and he shall be as one that is born in the land [converted]: for no uncircumcised person shall eat thereof.
49 One law shall be to him that is homeborn, and unto the[converted] stranger that sojourneth among you.
50 Thus did all the children of Israel; as the Lord commanded Moses and Aaron, so did they.
51 And it came to pass the selfsame day, that the Lord did bring the children of Israel out of the land of Egypt by their armies. KJV
 
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Truth7t7

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Much more can be said, perhaps I can go into depth later.. but I leave you with EW Bullinger.

To arrive at the true meaning of this expression, we must note that there are two words translated "foundation" in the New Testament: (1) themelios, and (2) katabole.

The Noun, themelios, occurs in Luke 6:48-49, 14:29, Acts 16:26, Romans 15:20, 1Corinthians 3:l0-12, Ephesians 2:20, 1Timothy 6:19, 2Timothy 2:19, Hebrews 6:1, 11:10, Revelation 21:14,19. It is never used of the world (kosmos) or the earth (ge). The corresponding Verb (themelioo) occurs in Matthew 7:25, Luke 6:48, Ephesians 3:17, Colossians 1:23, Hebrews 1:10 and 1Peter 5:10. The verb is only once used of the earth (ge). Hebrews 1:10.

A comparison of all these passages will show that these are proper and regular terms for the English words "to found", and "foundation".

The Noun, katabole, occurs in Matthew 13:35, 25:34, Luke 11:50, John 17:24, Ephesians 1:4, Hebrews 4:3, 9:26 , 11:11, 1Peter 1:20, Revelation 13:8, 17:8 and the corresponding Verb (kataballo) occurs in 2Corinthians 4:9, Hebrews 6:1 and Revelation 12:10.

A comparison of all these passages (especially 2Corinthians 4:9 and Revelation 12:10) will show that kataballo and katabole are not the proper terms for founding and foundation, but the correct meaning is casting down, or overthrow.

Consistency, therefore, calls for the same translation in Hebrews 6:1, where, instead of "not laying again", the rendering should be "not casting down". That is to say, the foundation already laid, of repentance, etc., was not to be cast down or overthrown, but was to be left and progress made unto the perfection.

Accordingly, the Noun katabole, derived from, and cognate with the Verb, ought to be translated "disruption", or "ruin".

The remarkable thing is that in all occurrences (except Hebrews 11:11) the word is connected with "the world"(Greek kosmos. Appendix 129.1), and therefore the expression should be rendered "the disruption (or ruin) of the world", clearly referring to the condition indicated in Genesis 1:2, and described in 2Peter 3:5-6. For the earth was not created tohu (Isaiah 45:18) but became so, as stated in the Hebrew of Genesis 1:2 and confirmed by 2Peter 3:6, where "the world that then was by the word of God" (Genesis 1:1) perished and "the heavens and the earth which are now, by the same word" were created (Genesis 2:4), and are "kept in store, reserved unto fire against the day of judgment" (2Peter 3:7) which shall usher in the "new heavens and the new earth" of 2Peter 3:13.

"The disruption of the world" is an event forming a great dividing line in the dispensations of the ages. In Genesis 1:1we have the founding of the world (Hebrews 1:10 = themelioo), but in Genesis 1:2 we have its overthrow.

This is confirmed by a further remarkable fact, that the phrase, which occurs ten times, is associated with the Preposition apo = from (Appendix 104. iv) seven times, and with pro = before (Appendix 104. xiv) three times. The former refers to the kingdom, and is connected with the "counsels" of God; the latter refers to the Mystery (or Secret; See Appendix 193) and is connected with the "purpose" of God (see John 17:24, Ephesians 1:4, 1Peter 1:20).
I Disagree
 

Taken

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I am in agreement regarding Eber (Hebrew) and Abraham being called the first Hebrew.



This belief is false… A man’s race or ethnicity does not change do to what he believes.

Israel and Judah both worshipped false Gods but were never gentiles.

Moreover…

Romans 2:14
For when the Gentiles, which have not the law, do by nature the things contained in the law, these, having not the law, are a law unto themselves:

Obeying, the law or God does not change a gentile to a Israelite

Exodus 12:40-51
40 Now the sojourning of the children of Israel, who dwelt in Egypt, was four hundred and thirty years.
41 And it came to pass at the end of the four hundred and thirty years, even the selfsame day it came to pass, that all the hosts of the Lord went out from the land of Egypt.
42 It is a night to be much observed unto the Lord for bringing them out from the land of Egypt: this is that night of the Lord to be observed of all the children of Israel in their generations.
43 And the Lord said unto Moses and Aaron, This is the ordinance of the passover: There shall no [unconverted] stranger eat thereof:
44 But every man's servant that is bought for money, when thou hast circumcised [converted] him, then shall he eat thereof.
45 A [unconverted] foreigner and an hired servant shall not eat thereof.
46 In one house shall it be eaten; thou shalt not carry forth ought of the flesh abroad out of the house; neither shall ye break a bone thereof.
47 All the congregation of Israel shall keep it.
48 And when a stranger shall sojourn with thee, and will keep the passover to the Lord, let all his males be circumcised, and then let him come near and keep it; and he shall be as one that is born in the land [converted]: for no uncircumcised person shall eat thereof.
49 One law shall be to him that is homeborn, and unto the[converted] stranger that sojourneth among you.
50 Thus did all the children of Israel; as the Lord commanded Moses and Aaron, so did they.
51 And it came to pass the selfsame day, that the Lord did bring the children of Israel out of the land of Egypt by their armies. KJV

No doubt…the history is complex.
A Division was Established.
Hebrews……Gentiles.
Hebrew denoted with God….Gentiles without God.
….Hebrews….reject God….sure.
….Gentiles……accept God…sure.
Doesn’t mean….Hebrews became Gentiles or Gentiles became Hebrews.
….Simply reveals regardless of Lineage, Individuals have Freewill.

Try again…Hebrew term fades away…
12 tribes…land divided….all having the same father….but contention….backstabbing…
Are they all still ISRAEL? Yes.
Are they Gentiles? No.
Are Gentiles ISRAEL? No.

Is the Hebrews, Israel Gods People? Yes.
Do they ALL believe in God? No.

Do ALL Gentiles believe in God? No.
Does God ACCEPT any Gentiles as His People? No.
Does God ACCEPT any Gentiles as His Children? Yes.

The positions, titles, change AS individuals freely choose and one day ALL with God will be accounted the SAME…

Rev 21:
[3] And I heard a great voice out of heaven saying, Behold, the tabernacle of God is with men, and he will dwell with them, and they shall be his people, and God himself shall be with them, and be their God.
 

Truthnightmare

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No doubt…the history is complex.
A Division was Established.
Hebrews……Gentiles.
Hebrew denoted with God….Gentiles without God.
….Hebrews….reject God….sure.
….Gentiles……accept God…sure.
Doesn’t mean….Hebrews became Gentiles or Gentiles became Hebrews.
….Simply reveals regardless of Lineage, Individuals have Freewill.

Try again…Hebrew term fades away…
12 tribes…land divided….all having the same father….but contention….backstabbing…
Are they all still ISRAEL? Yes.
Are they Gentiles? No.
Are Gentiles ISRAEL? No.

Is the Hebrews, Israel Gods People? Yes.
Do they ALL believe in God? No.

Do ALL Gentiles believe in God? No.
Does God ACCEPT any Gentiles as His People? No.
Does God ACCEPT any Gentiles as His Children? Yes.

The positions, titles, change AS individuals freely choose and one day ALL with God will be accounted the SAME…

Rev 21:
[3] And I heard a great voice out of heaven saying, Behold, the tabernacle of God is with men, and he will dwell with them, and they shall be his people, and God himself shall be with them, and be their God.
A Division was Established.
Hebrews……Gentiles.
When? Is there a specific Chp and verse that can be equated to this action?

When Israel disobeyed God they didn’t become heathens…


22 Therefore say unto the house of Israel, thus saith the Lord God; I do not this for your sakes, O house of Israel, but for mine holy name's sake, which ye have profaned among the heathen, whither ye went.

23 And I will sanctify my great name, which was profaned among the heathen, which ye have profaned in the midst of them; and the heathen shall know that I am the Lord, saith the Lord God, when I shall be sanctified in you before their eyes.
 
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Taken

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When? Is there a specific Chp and verse that can be equated to this action?

When Israel disobeyed God they didn’t become heathens…


22 Therefore say unto the house of Israel, thus saith the Lord God; I do not this for your sakes, O house of Israel, but for mine holy name's sake, which ye have profaned among the heathen, whither ye went.

23 And I will sanctify my great name, which was profaned among the heathen, which ye have profaned in the midst of them; and the heathen shall know that I am the Lord, saith the Lord God, when I shall be sanctified in you before their eyes.

Gen 10: whole chapter is about Noah’s 3 sons.

Gen 10:2 …The sons of Japheth….
Gen 10:5…Gentiles
AND
Gen 10:6 And the the sons of Ham…

Gen 10:31 The sons of Shem…

Gen 10:21 Shems offspring…Eber.

Eber…ie Hebrew.

Gen 14:13 Hebrew…Abraham
 
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Truthnightmare

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When? Is there a specific Chp and verse that can be equated to this action?
Gen 10: whole chapter is about Noah’s 3 sons.

Gen 10:2 …The sons of Japheth….
Gen 10:5…Gentiles
AND
Gen 10:6 And the the sons of Ham…

Gen 10:31 The sons of Shem…

Gen 10:21 Shems offspring…Eber.

Eber…ie Hebrew.

Gen 14:13 Hebrew…Abraham
I’m not in disagreement, one could say “gentiles” are mentioned before Eber thus therefore having a separation before having something to separate is moot.

However… the subject and object of Genesis 10 may include all mentioned without a timeline based on chronological documentation, which it that case you would be spot on.
 
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Taken

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I’m not in disagreement, one could say “gentiles” are mentioned before Eber thus therefore having a separation before having something to separate is moot.

However… the subject and object of Genesis 10 may include all mentioned without a timeline based on chronological documentation, which it that case you would be spot on.

Backing up a bit…to Adam created outside of the Garden…Put in the Garden…a female for Adam….man and female, God created, call them Adam…

Gen 5: (a recap)
[2] Male and female created he them; and blessed them, and called their name Adam, in the day when they were created.

Gen 4…Adam and Eve (whom Adam named), offsprings revealed. Cain, Able (twins)…death of one and then the birth of Seth.

Gen 4:26
[26] And to Seth, to him also there was born a son; and he called his name Enos: then began men to call upon the name of the LORD.

This appears as revealing a Following of God of some People….thus when Gentiles become first mentioned…the preview for …
People with and without God appears to have been set.
 
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Truthnightmare

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Backing up a bit…to Adam created outside of the Garden…Put in the Garden…a female for Adam….man and female, God created, call them Adam…

Gen 5: (a recap)
[2] Male and female created he them; and blessed them, and called their name Adam, in the day when they were created.

Gen 4…Adam and Eve (whom Adam named), offsprings revealed. Cain, Able (twins)…death of one and then the birth of Seth.

Gen 4:26
[26] And to Seth, to him also there was born a son; and he called his name Enos: then began men to call upon the name of the LORD.

This appears as revealing a Following of God of some People….thus when Gentiles become first mentioned…the preview for …
People with and without God appears to have been set.
I do not believe the man and woman created in Genesis 1:26 are Adam and Eve.
 
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Truthnightmare

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Do you believe there was a man and woman created?
And if so, did they have an identifying name?
And if so, what would that be?
I believe God created mankind ( the races) at the same time for the most part.
No… names or tiles are given to the races.

It would not be until Genesis 2:7 that God formed a special man, the man Adam, then later taking his rib (DNA) to form Eve.
 
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Taken

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I believe God created mankind ( the races) at the same time for the most part.
No… names or tiles are given to the races.

It would not be until Genesis 2:7 that God formed a special man, the man Adam, then later taking his rib (DNA) to form Eve.

I would agree Gen 2:, reveals HOW.
And Gen 1:, reveals … God DID.
God conferred within Himself.
God reveals His conclusions to Create Man-KIND of being, modeled after Gods Likeness.
God thus did create manKIND, male and female, and blessed them.

Gen 1:
[26] And God said, Let us make man in our image, after our likeness: and let them have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of the air, and over the cattle, and over all the earth, and over every creeping thing that creepeth upon the earth.
[27] So God created man in his own image, in the image of God created he him; male and female created he them.
[28] And God blessed them, and God said unto them, Be fruitful, and multiply, and replenish the earth, and subdue it: and have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of the air, and over every living thing that moveth upon the earth.

Remembering…early record, communication Writings were primitive, character etchings, etc. And many many years later were Titles, Chapters, Numbered passages and punctuations added, for ease of reference, teaching and study.

And the very basic knowledge of applicability of who, what, when , were, how….are not always in a neat billeted form.
 
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Truthnightmare

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I would agree Gen 2:, reveals HOW.
And Gen 1:, reveals … God DID.
God conferred within Himself.
God reveals His conclusions to Create Man-KIND of being, modeled after Gods Likeness.
God thus did create manKIND, male and female, and blessed them.

Gen 1:
[26] And God said, Let us make man in our image, after our likeness: and let them have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of the air, and over the cattle, and over all the earth, and over every creeping thing that creepeth upon the earth.
[27] So God created man in his own image, in the image of God created he him; male and female created he them.
[28] And God blessed them, and God said unto them, Be fruitful, and multiply, and replenish the earth, and subdue it: and have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of the air, and over every living thing that moveth upon the earth.

Remembering…early record, communication Writings were primitive, character etchings, etc. And many many years later were Titles, Chapters, Numbered passages and punctuations added, for ease of reference, teaching and study.

And the very basic knowledge of applicability of who, what, when , were, how….are not always in a neat billeted form.
I know I’m kind off on an island with this, but observe the following…

The Differences between the two creation events​
In Genesis chapter One
They all (plural) were CREATED.
Created is Hebrew word #1254 bara'
"...male and female created he them"
(Gen 1:27)​
But in Genesis chapter Two
Adam alone (singular) is FORMED
Formed is Hebrew word #3335 yatsar
"...in Eden; and there he put the man whom he had formed."
(Gen 2:8)​
They are created male and female at the same time. No 'Adam's Rib' here!​
Adam is formed some time before Eve.
She later being made from him.​
They were simply created, human and mortal.
"And as it is appointed unto men once to die, but after this the judgment"(Heb 9:27).​
Adam given the breath of life, became a living soul.
(Adam would have lived forever had he not fell - see Gen 6:3 "for that he also is flesh"). Ask yourself, "also," as in whom else?​
They are told to multiply.
"...Be fruitful and multiply..." (Gen 1:28)
No such command is given to Adam and Eve
(Adam's family was told to multiply after the flood; i.e., Noah's family was told in Gen 9:1).​
Mankind given dominion over animals and fish.​
Adam was a farmer.​
The animals were wild animals and the plants were wild plants. No names given.​
They were domestic animals and crop plants.
Adam named these.​
There was not yet rain.​
"...went up a mist from the earth..."(Gen 2:6)​
The creation was completed. All the various
races, men and women alike, were created.
THEN ------ >>>​
But after that, in Gen 2:5, God saw that He "did not have a man to till the ground" (farmer).
So God then FORMED Adam.​

But probably the most striking evidence that Genesis chapter Oneand Genesis chapter Two are not speaking of the same event would be:

In Gen 1, the plants and animals were created BEFOREman(kind) was created.
In Gen 2, the plants and animals were formed AFTER the man Adam was formed.
This immediately dismisses the misconception that the account in Gen 2 is merely a deeper explanation of the events in Gen 1, as many will say and teach. For if it were, then God 'messed up' on the order of His creation, which is of course impossible. When God and man are at variance, man is always wrong and God always right. Let's now go to the Creation Scriptures themselves for further evidence and documentation.
 
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Taken

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@Truthnightmare ~
Side note. Some years ago I located a diary of my G+ grandfathers brother, he wrote during his participation the Us Civil war. Personally it was interesting to me since much was detailed about the entire family (parents, 16 children, 5 sons in the war.)…
point being, the writing was in pencil, in a small booklet, in primitive cursive….with Zero punctuation, and at times difficult to keep straight one event from another, in the war, and folks at home. For my own pleasure, I kept the original copies of the diary along with 137 pages I typed on full page paper…making paragraphs and punctuations….and additionally added graphs to my pages specific to each family member, and photos as I was able to secure.
Today we simply have to take writing styles from hundreds of years ago, as they saw fit in what manner to reveal the knowledge.

God Bless you,
Taken
 
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