Grailhunter
Well-Known Member
I would think that Yeshua would be important to you also.
Most of the scriptures I quote are from Yeshua or Paul.
But I am still looking for what you disagree with.
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I would think that Yeshua would be important to you also.
Most of the scriptures I quote are from Yeshua or Paul.
But I am still looking for what you disagree with.
Here is what Yeshua/Christ through Paul taught that is required for a person today to be saved/sealed/justified.
If you disagree then list all the relevant verses from the Yeshua chosen Apostle for today :)
..
Who did Christ select as the Apostle & Minister to the Gentiles ?
Acts 9:15
But the Lord said unto him, Go thy way: for he is a chosen vessel unto me, to bear my name before the Gentiles, ...
Rom 11:13
For I speak to you Gentiles, inasmuch as I am the apostle of the Gentiles...
Rom 15:16
That I should be the minister of Jesus Christ to the Gentiles, ministering the gospel of God...
+++
The other Apostles agreed & knew who taught who
Gal 2:2
And I went up by revelation, and communicated unto them that gospel which I preach among the Gentiles,....
Gal 2:7
But contrariwise, when they saw that the gospel of the uncircumcision was committed unto me, as the gospel of the circumcision was unto Peter;
Gal 2:9
And when James, Cephas, and John, who seemed to be pillars, perceived the grace that was given unto me, they gave to me and Barnabas the right hands of fellowship; that we should go unto the heathen, and they unto the circumcision.
++++
What is the role of an Apostle/Minister ?
To teach THEIR audience.
BUT NOW there are NO SEPARATE audiences ALL are equal :-
Gal 3:28
There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither bond nor free, there is neither male nor female: for ye are all one in Christ Jesus.
Gal 6:15
For in Christ Jesus neither circumcision availeth any thing, nor uncircumcision, but a new creature.
1 Cor 12:13
For by one Spirit are we all baptized into one body, whether we be Jews or Gentiles, whether we be bond or free; and have been all made to drink into one Spirit.
Col 3:11
Where there is neither Greek nor Jew, circumcision nor uncircumcision, Barbarian, Scythian, bond nor free: but Christ is all, and in all.
++++
How are believers 'today' saved, sealed, justified, made righteous ?
By the SAVING Gospel that applies today.
Gal 1:11-12
11But I certify you, brethren, that the gospel which was preached of me is not after man.
12For I neither received it of man, neither was I taught it, but by the revelation of Jesus Christ.
1 Cor 15:1-4
1Moreover, brethren, I declare unto you the gospel which I preached unto you, which also ye have received, and wherein ye stand;
2By which also ye are saved, if ye keep in memory what I preached unto you, unless ye have believed in vain.
3For I delivered unto you first of all that which I also received, how that Christ died for our sins according to the scriptures;
4And that he was buried, and that he rose again the third day according to the scriptures:
Eph 1:13
13In whom ye also trusted, after that ye heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation: in whom also after that ye believed, ye were sealed with that holy Spirit of promise,
++++
The PERFORMANCE conditions :-
Titus 3:
5Not by works of righteousness which we have done, but according to his mercy he saved us, by the washing of regeneration, and renewing of the Holy Ghost;
Gal 2:
16Knowing that a man is not justified by the works of the law, but by the faith of Jesus Christ, even we have believed in Jesus Christ, that we might be justified by the faith of Christ, and not by the works of the law: for by the works of the law shall no flesh be justified.
Rom 3:
28Therefore we conclude that a man is justified by faith without the deeds of the law.
Eph 2:
8For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God:
9Not of works, lest any man should boast.
Rom 4:
5But to him that worketh not, but believeth on him that justifieth the ungodly, his faith is counted for righteousness.
Rom 5:
1Therefore being justified by faith, we have peace with God through our Lord Jesus Christ:
++++
Your 'deeds'/works/behavior/performance only decide your eternal rewards/loss
Rom 14:10
10But why dost thou judge thy brother? or why dost thou set at nought thy brother? for we shall all stand before the judgment seat of Christ.
1 Cor 3:10-15
10According to the grace of God which is given unto me, as a wise masterbuilder, I have laid the foundation, and another buildeth thereon. But let every man take heed how he buildeth thereupon.
11For other foundation can no man lay than that is laid, which is Jesus Christ.
12Now if any man build upon this foundation gold, silver, precious stones, wood, hay, stubble;
13Every man's work shall be made manifest: for the day shall declare it, because it shall be revealed by fire; and the fire shall try every man's work of what sort it is.
14If any man's work abide which he hath built thereupon, he shall receive a reward.
2 Cor 5:10
10For we must all appear before the judgment seat of Christ; that every one may receive the things done in his body, according to that he hath done, whether it be good or bad.
Grailhunter
Well-Known Member
Again You are all over the place. Pick a topic.
Let me help you out.
How are believers 'today' saved, sealed, justified, made righteous ?
I covered this in my post with scriptures....
But YOU have to decide to be interested.
YOU have to decide to have faith. John 3:16 John 3:18 Ephesians 2:8-9 Hebrews 11:6
YOU have to repent of your sins and decide to do your best to be good. Galatians 5:22-23
YOU have to go and be baptized. Acts 2:38
YOU decide to participate in the Bread and Wine Ritual. Gospel of John chapter 6
From there YOU work out your salvation with fear and trembling. Philippians 2:12
But still without Yeshua you could do all that and still not be saved, you accept the invitation and God the Son saves you.
Beyond this salvation through Yeshua redeems us, and justifies us.
How did He do this?
Scriptures concerning redemption
What Does the Bible Say About Jesus Redeeming All Of Our Being?
Bible verses about Jesus Redeeming All Of Our Being
What Does the Bible Say About Justified Through Jesus?
Bible verses about Justified Through Jesus
Propitiation
>>>>>>>""Again You are all over the place. Pick a topic.Again You are all over the place. Pick a topic.
Let me help you out.
How are believers 'today' saved, sealed, justified, made righteous ?
I covered this in my post with scriptures....
But YOU have to decide to be interested.
YOU have to decide to have faith. John 3:16 John 3:18 Ephesians 2:8-9 Hebrews 11:6
YOU have to repent of your sins and decide to do your best to be good. Galatians 5:22-23
YOU have to go and be baptized. Acts 2:38
YOU decide to participate in the Bread and Wine Ritual. Gospel of John chapter 6
From there YOU work out your salvation with fear and trembling. Philippians 2:12
But still without Yeshua you could do all that and still not be saved, you accept the invitation and God the Son saves you.
Beyond this salvation through Yeshua redeems us, and justifies us.
How did He do this?
Scriptures concerning redemption
Scriptures concerning justificationWhat Does the Bible Say About Jesus Redeeming All Of Our Being?
Bible verses about Jesus Redeeming All Of Our Beingwww.openbible.info
Other aspects of salvationWhat Does the Bible Say About Justified Through Jesus?
Bible verses about Justified Through Jesus
Propitiation
Reconciliation
Here is an easy question for you.
Gal 2:7-9 who is the Apostle that teaches you ?
Grailhunter
Well-Known Member
We are not done with the last topic.
You seem to want to pick an Apostle.
What apostles teaches me?
I am an educated Theologian so I take the scriptures as a whole.
But I do consider who is speaking to who.
Jewish-Christians believed differently than Gentile-Christians.
Yeshua laid the foundation.
Paul either wrote or influenced most of the New Testament.
Peter was in his camp and so was Luke.
""I am an educated Theologian"" - and all educated Theologians agree with each other ? :)
So again "educated Theologian" who does Gal 2:7-9 teach is your Apostle ?
Grailhunter
Well-Known Member
Again, we are not done with the last topic.
7 On the contrary, they recognized that I had been entrusted with the task of preaching the gospel to the uncircumcised, just as Peter had been to the circumcised. 8 For God, who was at work in Peter as an apostle to the circumcised, was also at work in me as an apostle to the Gentiles. 9 James, Cephas and John, those esteemed as pillars, gave me and Barnabas the right hand of fellowship when they recognized the grace given to me. They agreed that we should go to the Gentiles, and they to the circumcised.
Still not one Apostle. And Yeshua counts to.
Like I said Peter and Luke were in Paul's camp.
Please tell me where you disagree with the last topic.
Which version of Gal 2:7 are you relying on ?
The new nonsense TO or the original eg KJV, Bishops, Vulgate, Duoay Rheims gospel OF.
ps, I assume you understand the difference between OF & TO !!!
eg The writings OF GH verses the writing TO GH, the Book OF Revelation versus the Book TO Revelation
Grailhunter
Well-Known Member
I mostly rely on the raw scriptures in their native tongue.
But there are a few Bibles I like. NASB, NIV, ESV.
I collect old KJV's but do not use them for study.....great for poetic verses.
Great, then you do understand the significant difference between gospel >>>OF<<< the UNcirc V gospel >>>TO<<<< the uncirc.
..
Acts 9:15, Rom 11:13, Rom 15:16, Gal 2:7-9
Question remains, who do those verses teach is your Apostle & Minister ?
Grailhunter
Well-Known Member
Grailhunter
Well-Known Member
@PeterAndroz
The site is messing up now.
gospel >>>OF<<< the UNcirc V gospel >>>TO<<<< the uncirc. I have already explained.
And it is not one Apostle. Paul was the leader of the Gentile-Christians but Peter was part of his camp and luke was his disciple.
..
The site is messing up now.
gospel >>>OF<<< the UNcirc V gospel >>>TO<<<< the uncirc. I have already explained.
And it is not one Apostle. Paul was the leader of the Gentile-Christians but Peter was part of his camp and luke was his disciple.
..
Again, stop being condescending. And do some proper word study rather than simply appealing to old versions that appear to support what your belief.
What has Paul already told us in Gal. 1?
Gal 1:6 I am astonished that you are so quickly deserting him who called you in the grace of Christ and are turning to a different gospel—
Gal 1:7 not that there is another one, but there are some who trouble you and want to distort the gospel of Christ.
Gal 1:8 But even if we or an angel from heaven should preach to you a gospel contrary to the one we preached to you, let him be accursed.
Gal 1:9 As we have said before, so now I say again: If anyone is preaching to you a gospel contrary to the one you received, let him be accursed.
…
Gal 1:11 For I would have you know, brothers, that the gospel that was preached by me is not man's gospel.
Gal 1:12 For I did not receive it from any man, nor was I taught it, but I received it through a revelation of Jesus Christ. (ESV)
Then, in chapter 2:
Gal 2:2 I went up because of a revelation and set before them (though privately before those who seemed influential) the gospel that I proclaim among the Gentiles, in order to make sure I was not running or had not run in vain. (ESV)
So, by the time Paul writes 2:7-9, he has already stated there is no other gospel than the one he preaches, that the gospel he preaches was received directly from Jesus, and that he went to Jerusalem to confirm with the other apostles that his gospel is accurate.
It is worth noting again, since you are dishonest and continually ignore this passage, that Paul himself says the Jesus is not divided and that claiming to exclusively follow Paul or exclusively follow Peter, or any other, is false and needlessly divisive. More than that, in that context, he also says;
1Co 1:22 For Jews demand signs and Greeks seek wisdom,
1Co 1:23 but we preach Christ crucified, a stumbling block to Jews and folly to Gentiles,
1Co 1:24 but to those who are called, both Jews and Greeks, Christ the power of God and the wisdom of God.
Clearly, Paul believes there is only one gospel for both Jews and Greeks that is taught by him and the other apostles, that one which was given to all of them by Christ.
Acts 9:15, Rom 11:13, Rom 15:16, Gal 2:7-9
According to those verses, who teaches you the saving gospel for today ?
In context, Jesus, Paul, Peter, John, and James all teach me the saving gospel for today.
I need to stop discussing things with you.Yet again you ignore everything I post, things that prove your position false, and simply keep repeating. You really lack honesty and integrity.
Here is the saving Gospel that Paul teaches.
Now list the same for Peter, John, James :)
Gal 1:11-12
11But I certify you, brethren, that the gospel which was preached of me is not after man.
12For I neither received it of man, neither was I taught it, but by the revelation of Jesus Christ.
1 Cor 15:1-4
1Moreover, brethren, I declare unto you the gospel which I preached unto you, which also ye have received, and wherein ye stand;
2By which also ye are saved, if ye keep in memory what I preached unto you, unless ye have believed in vain.
3For I delivered unto you first of all that which I also received, how that Christ died for our sins according to the scriptures;
4And that he was buried, and that he rose again the third day according to the scriptures:
Eph 1:13
13In whom ye also trusted, after that ye heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation: in whom also after that ye believed, ye were sealed with that holy Spirit of promise,
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