What are the oracles of God and who are they committed too?

[KBCid]

It really depends upon the men and how well I know them. There are some whose testimonies I could trust absolutely.

So then you feel that God has authorized some gentiles to write spirit inspired scripture that is not currently in most bibles?
The Mormons have asserted that they have an entire book of spirit inspired text from God although they still assert it was written by a Jew originally.....
Next I would ask the obvious question how does one discern the inspired message from God vs. satan inspired?
After all that then we can touch on what if the testimonies of men are in direct contradiction of scripture... Whose side do you fall on?

 

[amadeus]

So then you feel that God has authorized some gentiles to write spirit inspired scripture that is not currently in most bibles?

Why would you want to put words in my mouth. I said there were men whose testimonies from God I believed. For them to write them under the anointing of God would require that He put it on their hearts. What I believe has nothing to do with that. That is in God's department.

The Mormons have asserted that they have an entire book of spirit inspired text from God although they still assert it was written by a Jew originally.....

So that is them, not me. I've read the Book of Mormon and afterward left it alone. I read my Bible 7 days a week.

Next I would ask the obvious question how does one discern the inspired message from God vs. satan inspired?

By following the lead of the Holy Ghost. Don't compare my following the Holy Ghost with others who claim the same for I do have answer to that, which I have expressed more than once on this and on other Christian forums. People aren't really interested in my answer. They are for the most part wishing to prove they are right and that I am wrong. So then, I admit it. On anything I am wrong on it is me speaking. On anything on which I right it is God speaking through me.

After all that then we can touch on what if the testimonies of men are in direct contradiction of scripture... Whose side do you fall on?

On God's side!

You asked me an a question about whether I knew men who gave true prophesies and my response was yes. Now you present a hypothetical which would never apply to them when they were speaking the Lord's words. Do you not see my meaning?

 

[KBCid]

Why would you want to put words in my mouth. I said there were men whose testimonies from God I believed. For them to write them under the anointing of God would require that He put it on their hearts. What I believe has nothing to do with that. That is in God's department...
.....You asked me an a question about whether I knew men who gave true prophesies and my response was yes. Now you present a hypothetical which would never apply to them when they were speaking the Lord's words. Do you not see my meaning?

Would not think of putting words in your mouth which is why it was formed as a question to get a better understanding of your original meaning.
Ok so the point in this thread is not about who you may or may not believe has God's inspiration rather, it is about God's prophets as described and appeared in scripture. anyone at any time can believe anything about anyone but, we only have the written record to confirm or deny those who God says are prophets. Beyond that we have mans beliefs. So the point of the thread is about the Jewish heritage of God's prophets. If you don't believe that all of God's prophets are natural Jews then it would require either a scriptural reference or God to state it right now.

 

[amadeus]

Would not think of putting words in your mouth which is why it was formed as a question to get a better understanding of your original meaning.

Thank you for the clarification. Unfortunately even questions can have a misleading or even a negative purpose.

Ok so the point in this thread is not about who you may or may not believe has God's inspiration rather, it is about God's prophets as described and appeared in scripture.

This was not made clear either in the title of the thread or in the OP.

anyone at any time can believe anything about anyone but, we only have the written record to confirm or deny those who God says are prophets.

We are to live by faith which is described here:

Now faith is the substance of things hoped for, the evidence of things not seen. " Heb 11:1

To me that is saying there may be some things that are of God which are not precisely or directly described on written pages. I believe that there are.

Beyond that we have mans beliefs. So the point of the thread is about the Jewish heritage of God's prophets. If you don't believe that all of God's prophets are natural Jews then it would require either a scriptural reference or God to state it right now.

What did Moses have as a scriptural reference when he saw the bush burning that was not consumed? You and I have a book that describes his experience, but what is to prevent God from giving us a similar experience? Has God so limited Himself in what is written? I do not need a scriptural reference to state what God has said.

Now you are redefining the point or purpose of the thread. The time to have done that was before anybody else said a word.

 

[bbyrd009]

If you don't believe that all of God's prophets are natural Jews then it would require either a scriptural reference or God to state it right now.

the Magi prophesied, and were not Jews, did you deal with them already and i missed it? Also several foreign kings made prophecies that came true in Scripture, didn't they? Pretty sure i could quote a prophecy of Nebuchadnezzar coming to pass.

 

[bbyrd009]

I guess I should have put an LOL after my last statement, the only thing I can think of that the Gentiles have written is Commentary.

according to the Jews i correspond with, the whole NT was written by Gentiles lol

 

[bbyrd009]

"the Jews were divorced, the NT writers who were raised Jewish were deemed heretics and outcast/murdered by the Jews, and written in Greek and Aramaic, etc."

Then you can quote the scripture that says this is so.

ha you're kidding right?
Jeremiah 3:8 for the first one, and if i have to quote how Paul became an outcast etc i am just on the wrong forum i guess lol, and the third one is equally self evident, i hope.

 

[KBCid]

We are to live by faith which is described here:
Now faith is the substance of things hoped for, the evidence of things not seen. " Heb 11:1
To me that is saying there may be some things that are of God which are not precisely or directly described on written pages. I believe that there are.

Faith as it is shown in context to Heb 11:1 comes down to 1) man believing that God exists 2) man believing in what God says 3) Man believing in God's promises that are yet to be fulfilled. Faith exhibited by Abram is what caused God to choose him to be the first of the Jew's / Israelites. God chose them to be his people out of all the peoples of the earth because they had faith where everyone else did not.

Deut 7:1When the LORD thy God shall bring thee into the land whither thou goest to possess it, and hath cast out many nations before thee, the Hittites, and the Girgashites, and the Amorites, and the Canaanites, and the Perizzites, and the Hivites, and the Jebusites, seven nations greater and mightier than thou; 2And when the LORD thy God shall deliver them before thee; thou shalt smite them, and utterly destroy them; thou shalt make no covenant with them, nor shew mercy unto them: 3Neither shalt thou make marriages with them; thy daughter thou shalt not give unto his son, nor his daughter shalt thou take unto thy son. 4For they will turn away thy son from following me, that they may serve other gods: so will the anger of the LORD be kindled against you, and destroy thee suddenly. 5But thus shall ye deal with them; ye shall destroy their altars, and break down their images, and cut down their groves, and burn their graven images with fire. 6For thou art an holy people unto the LORD thy God: the LORD thy God hath chosen thee to be a special people unto himself, above all people that are upon the face of the earth.

God's prophets were specifically sent to his people because they were his chosen people.
Have you noticed that we do not see stories of God sending prophets to any of the other nations such as the Hittites, Girgashites, Amorites, Canaanites, Perizzites, Hivites, or the Jebusites. God's prophets were specifically picked by God for his people. He was and is still the God of Israel.

What did Moses have as a scriptural reference when he saw the bush burning that was not consumed? You and I have a book that describes his experience, but what is to prevent God from giving us a similar experience? Has God so limited Himself in what is written? I do not need a scriptural reference to state what God has said.

Moses being of the line of Abraham was already an Israelite. Any of the Israelites who already held a belief in the God of Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob knew of those interactions so, having an encounter with God would not be beyond expectation for him or them. Faith was exhibited based on what was said at the burning bush not because the bush was burning.
The spoken word of God was written by Moses as the spirit moved him to do it so that God's voice would echo down the line to all those Israelites who were not yet alive to hear it.

Now you are redefining the point or purpose of the thread. The time to have done that was before anybody else said a word.

Not intentional. Just didn't see the thread going down the path it did. Even God has to send corrections to people as they follow paths God didn't intend them to. So sorry.

 

[amadeus]

Faith as it is shown in context to Heb 11:1 comes down to 1) man believing that God exists 2) man believing in what God says 3) Man believing in God's promises that are yet to be fulfilled. Faith exhibited by Abram is what caused God to choose him to be the first of the Jew's / Israelites. God chose them to be his people out of all the peoples of the earth because they had faith where everyone else did not.

Abram/Abraham was an Israelite in the same sense that you and I are children of Abraham and are Israelites. God may use the flesh, but He is always looking at the heart:

"And think not to say within yourselves, We have Abraham to our father: for I say unto you, that God is able of these stones to raise up children unto Abraham." Matt 3:9

"Not as though the word of God hath taken none effect. For they are not all Israel, which are of Israel:
Neither, because they are the seed of Abraham, are they all children: but, In Isaac shall thy seed be called.
That is, They which are the children of the flesh, these are not the children of God: but the children of the promise are counted for the seed." Rom 9:6-8

Deut

7:1When the LORD thy God shall bring thee into the land whither thou goest to possess it, and hath cast out many nations before thee, the Hittites, and the Girgashites, and the Amorites, and the Canaanites, and the Perizzites, and the Hivites, and the Jebusites, seven nations greater and mightier than thou; 2And when the LORD thy God shall deliver them before thee; thou shalt smite them, and utterly destroy them; thou shalt make no covenant with them, nor shew mercy unto them: 3Neither shalt thou make marriages with them; thy daughter thou shalt not give unto his son, nor his daughter shalt thou take unto thy son. 4For they will turn away thy son from following me, that they may serve other gods: so will the anger of the LORD be kindled against you, and destroy thee suddenly. 5But thus shall ye deal with them; ye shall destroy their altars, and break down their images, and cut down their groves, and burn their graven images with fire. 6For thou art an holy people unto the LORD thy God: the LORD thy God hath chosen thee to be a special people unto himself, above all people that are upon the face of the earth.

God's prophets were specifically sent to his people because they were his chosen people.
Have you noticed that we do not see stories of God sending prophets to any of the other nations such as the Hittites, Girgashites, Amorites, Canaanites, Perizzites, Hivites, or the Jebusites. God's prophets were specifically picked by God for his people. He was and is still the God of Israel.

And then we see where Jonah was sent. Were the people of Nineveh also Israelites? I believe that they were Assyrians and as a result of their repentance the city was NOT destroyed. It was not until about 150 years later [as per Book of Nahum] based renewed sinful ways that the city was finally destroyed.

Moses being of the line of Abraham was already an Israelite. Any of the Israelites who already held a belief in the God of Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob knew of those interactions so, having an encounter with God would not be beyond expectation for him or them. Faith was exhibited based on what was said at the burning bush not because the bush was burning.
The spoken word of God was written by Moses as the spirit moved him to do it so that God's voice would echo down the line to all those Israelites who were not yet alive to hear it.

You know that there others in scripture who definitely not were carnal Jews but who communicated with God. Was Enoch a prophet? Was Noah a prophet? Was Seth a prophet? Was Abel a prophet? You want to make them special exceptions then do so with what ever explanations you believe are needed, but don't ignore them for they exist.

You have not addressed some difficulties with your position on those and others. Our friend @bbyrd009 already pointed out a couple of problems which thus far, I believe, you have not specifically addressed. They are pertinent it would seem to the discussion.

Not intentional. Just didn't see the thread going down the path it did. Even God has to send corrections to people as they follow paths God didn't intend them to. So sorry.

Apology accepted but... does this mean that you have now effectively changed the rules ex post facto? [A law that makes illegal an act that was legal when committed, increases the penalties for an infraction after it has been committed, or changes the rules of evidence to make conviction easier. The U.S. Constitution prohibits the making of ex post facto law.]

 

[KBCid]

Now the subject of this thread is for me study. I have no spirit inspired instruction on it as of yet so I am looking into its validity via this thread. So at this time I am not asserting this as truth. Just so we all have understanding.

then we see where Jonah was sent. Were the people of Nineveh also Israelites? I believe that they were Assyrians and as a result of their repentance the city was NOT destroyed. It was not until about 150 years later [as per Book of Nahum] based renewed sinful ways that the city was finally destroyed.

a very good point. I will review the Nineveh reference.

You know that there others in scripture who definitely not were carnal Jews but who communicated with God. Was Enoch a prophet? Was Noah a prophet? Was Seth a prophet? Was Abel a prophet? You want to make them special exceptions then do so with what ever explanations you believer are needed, but don't ignore them for they exist. .

I believe I noted that it was prophets after God chose Abram so I will look into the scriptural times for each of these.

You have not addressed some difficulties with your position on those and others. Our friend @bbyrd009 already pointed out a couple of problems which thus far, I believe, you have not specifically addressed. They are pertinent it would seem to the discussion..[/QUOTE]

I was counting on him to chime in.

Apology accepted but... does this mean that you have now effectively changed the rules ex post facto? [A law that makes illegal an act that was legal when committed, increases the penalties for an infraction after it has been committed, or changes the rules of evidence to make conviction easier. The U.S. Constitution prohibits the making of ex post facto law.]

I am not attempting to change any rules since I felt that I had given the proper boundaries as I had heard them. I was thinking that I was simply making things more clarified. Understand this is not my stance on the subject. It is simply a check of the validity of the proposition as I remember it.

 

[bbyrd009]

I was counting on him to chime in.

"the Jews were divorced, the NT writers who were raised Jewish were deemed heretics and outcast/murdered by the Jews, and written in Greek and Aramaic, etc."
"Then you can quote the scripture that says this is so."
"ha you're kidding right?
Jeremiah 3:8 for the first one, and if i have to quote how Paul became an outcast etc i am just on the wrong forum i guess lol, and the third one is equally self evident, i hope."

but i see here that our perspectives are mostly where we differ, i guess; was Paul a Jew, or not? Depends upon whom you ask, right?

 

[KBCid]

but i see here that our perspectives are mostly where we differ, i guess; was Paul a Jew, or not? Depends upon whom you ask, right?

and the defining point may not be Jew as much as Israelite. some people interchange the two terms often without looking at the technicalities. I will check what I wrote down about this subject from when I had the discussion on it and see if that was not the case.
You ask the right questions as I had hoped you would.

 

[Truth]

according to the Jews i correspond with, the whole NT was written by Gentiles lol

I do enjoy your responses, this is serious stuff, BUT, and there is always a But, Humor is always a delight! Thanks

 

[bbyrd009]

I guess I should have put an LOL after my last statement, the only thing I can think of that the Gentiles have written is Commentary. I know that for a fact that the Hebrew way of explaining thing's is Concrete! and the way the Greeks explain thing's is Abstract, Philo-Sophia, Philosophy, and in saying that this could mean this or it could mean that, one could interrupt the meaning of something, through Philosophy!

In rabbinic literature Balaam is represented as one of seven gentile prophets;

 

[Helen]

In rabbinic literature Balaam is represented as one of seven gentile prophets;

Good one!

 

[bbyrd009]

Good one!

ha, maybe

"The book devotes a special section to the history of the prophet discussing why God has taken away the power of prophecy from the Gentiles (Tan., Balak, 1)."
Balaam - Wikipedia

 

[Truth]

In rabbinic literature Balaam is represented as one of seven gentile prophets;

Yes your right, He knew the How To! to approach God, I am not familiar with the other 6!

 

[bbyrd009]

Yes your right, He knew the How To! to approach God, I am not familiar with the other 6!

sorry, from the Ballam link;

"In rabbinic literature Balaam is represented as one of seven gentile prophets; the other six being Beor (Balaam's father), Job, and Job's four friends (Talmud, B. B. 15b)"
Balaam - Wikipedia