What are Your Feelings on Tithes

[Waiting on him]

That's the problem. It's a "trade, not a calling!"



Worship was never about its professionalism or entertainment value. By hiring "professionals," you discourage those that have been given gifts to use what God have given them for the Body.

In many churches, everyone is a paid hired "professional" and the only jobs they leave for people is usher/door greeter or working the nursery!

I have been far more blessed by a song sung from a flawed Believer that loves God and has yet an undeveloped gift of music than any professional I have ever heard!

Professional "Music Ministers" are pretty "mediocre" in my mind.

It's interesting to me the word hypocrite defined=== an actor.

 

[Candidus]

Worship leaders are essential.

And, where in the Bible, the Early Church was this stated as "essential"?

 

[Waiting on him]

Considering 1 Corinthians 9:1-18, I consider that those who preach the gospel ought to make their living from the work of preaching the gospel.



Yes, it is not something that we should insist upon as those who might benefit from it. However, it is also true that the promise, that God would pour out a blessing so large that you would be unable to receive it all, it is so great; has a condition to it that you bring the whole tithe into the storehouse. And yes, @bbyrd009, there needs to be a storehouse; and if a church is not making the tithe a contribution to that storehouse, something is wrong. However, the pastor's salary is something that is to be handled as a percentage of the tithe. Because it is a sin to muzzle the ox that treadeth out the grain.

I really don't understand how you can't see that God has poured out a blessing greater than any one single person can recieve.
I believe you need to take some time and consult with God as to what is the storehouse.

 

[justbyfaith]

And, where in the Bible, the Early Church was this stated as "essential"?

You don't think that worship is essential? (try Revelation 4...)

In Psalms 150, it shows that musical instruments are intended to be a part of the worship experience.

I know that I am blessed by worship leaders who are even paid to do what they do; many of them are quite anointed, if not all of them.

I listen to Christian radio almost 24/7. I know that the people who sing and play music on Christian radio are not unpaid for their contributions. And they are very much anointed!

 

[Josho]

Agreed!

Does this really work? I have never been a part of a church big enough have that many elders or formal ministers so I cannot speak from even observing such things. There were problems in small churches, but not quite the same.


In small churches of my experience the pastor often or usually worked at a full-time secular job to earn a living for self and family. I would hope that every minister holding a formal position would do the same [decline compensation] rather than expecting full support from the congregation. Is that too idealistic of an expectation? I wonder if Paul had to make most of his living from tent making or did the people to whom he ministered contribute largely to his support?

The Holy Spirit should do so, but in practice is this the case? I belonged to one assembly where they insisted that people pay a tithe so that the ministry could function. I was too ignorant at the time of the things of God to understand God's will in such things. I could afford it so I simply paid a tithe. Years later my understanding was increased. I continued to make a large contribution because I have become convicted to do so. What people give or don't give depends on their own material situation as well as where they are in their walk with God. I don't believe we should ever insist that people pay a certain amount or percentage, but...it is not up to me any where now... except in my own home. Only me and my wife now!


Yes I probably understand the historical situations better than some of the current situations today.

I was a part of a small assembly for several years, but now I am into my second year without such a connection any more. My experience and what I would expect added to my age diminishing physical strength make it very unlikely that I will ever move up beyond being a periodic visitor to such places... My old pastor was forcibly put out of his assembly and the politics disguised as spiritual necessities make me very cautious even when things look good. For him he does not need an income from the church. Do churches often provide for disabled ministers to survive or are they sometimes left to their own means. My pastor's case and what happened to my father in his church make me wonder. I trust God, but what happens when too many people are depending on other resources to live?


You are speaking of how it should and I agree with that. I simply do not trust men. There are undoubtedly some men who are trusting God in churches but there are too many leaning to heavily on other things. Being in that situation without some real faith could be a real problem, couldn't it? Will God always supply the material needs of a faithful man of God? I believe that He will, but some people may have different views as to what is needed.

I know in the Anglican Churches of Australia, the Vicars are paid, but it does not directly come out of the congregation though.

 

[justbyfaith]

I really don't understand how you can't see that God has poured out a blessing greater than any one single person can recieve.
I believe you need to take some time and consult with God as to what is the storehouse.

I'm not sure I'm following you.

 

[amadeus]

I know in the Anglican Churches of Australia, the Vicars are paid, but it does not directly come out of the congregation though.

It would not bother me that they were being paid a reasonable salary if I also knew they were really putting God and God's people before their own personal comforts. If a person wanted simply to be materially comfortable, probably he should not be pursuing a vocation as a minister to people.

 

[Waiting on him]

I'm not sure I'm following you.

You seem to believe that a brick and mortar building is God's storehouse?

 

[justbyfaith]

It would not bother me that they were being paid a reasonable salary if I also knew they were really putting God and God's people before their own personal comforts. If a person wanted simply to be materially comfortable, probably he should not be pursuing a vocation as a minister to people.

While that may indeed be true, I don't believe that it is necessarily a sin for a minister to enjoy "creature comforts".

 

[justbyfaith]

You seem to believe that a brick and mortar building is God's storehouse?

I'm saying that the storehouse has to do with having food ready to give to the poor. Anyway, you should be taking it up with @bbyrd009; he is the one that started me down that line of thinking.

 

[Josho]

It would not bother me that they were being paid a reasonable salary if I also knew they were really putting God and God's people before their own personal comforts. If a person wanted simply to be materially comfortable, probably he should not be pursuing a vocation as a minister to people.

Yep true, it's about the heart and doing it for Jesus.

 

[amadeus]

While that may indeed be true, I don't believe that it is necessarily a sin for a minister to enjoy "creature comforts".

Of course he may enjoy things! But with or without much in the way of creature comforts, he will be held to a higher standard, I believe by God than other men.

 

[Candidus]

You don't think that worship is essential? (try Revelation 4...)

In Psalms 150, it shows that musical instruments are intended to be a part of the worship experience.

I know that I am blessed by worship leaders who are even paid to do what they do; many of them are quite anointed, if not all of them.

I listen to Christian radio almost 24/7. I know that the people who sing and play music on Christian radio are not unpaid for their contributions. And they are very much anointed!

People have worshiped in Church for 2000 years without "worship leaders"! Why would I believe a made-up "job" was "essential?

 

[justbyfaith]

People have worshiped in Church for 2000 years without "worship leaders"! Why would I believe a made-up "job" was "essential?

They have worshiped with the use of organs for at least 1,000 of those years; I consider the organ players to be worship leaders.

And you did not live over 1,000 years ago, so who are you to say that there were no official music ministers throughout church history?

 

[justbyfaith]

Of course he may enjoy things! But with or without much in the way of creature comforts, he will be held to a higher standard, I believe by God than other men.

Yes, Paul said that he could do all things through Christ who strengthened him...whether that was to be abased or whether it was to abound financially.

 

[bbyrd009]

If they [the pastors[ don't fit then it is between the person in the congregation and God. If called you to be there, then it should be God calls you to 'come out' of there. Of course a lot of people are in a place and don't have a clue as whether or not God called them to be there... although they might say they do.

This kind of a question makes it clear [to me] why it is so important to have and retain a regular communication between the individual and God. Too many, who claim to be "Christians" have seemingly never the voice of God. A 'good' pastor would be helpful, but who has a 'good' pastor? Should a person simply join up with some church group so as to have a pastor without regard to what kind of a pastor he is or whether or not God called the person to that place? I wouldn't advise it, but that is a generality which could mean nothing at all. When you have a real situation maybe sound advice is available through some man.

What does this have to do with tithing? I don't know!

there is a little-discussed concept i heard many years ago, "Right Pastor," that a Gsearch returns for a diff concept, for a "church," but i heard it as "the Right Pastor" for a seeker, that ive tried to adhere to since then; and i questioned the choice a couple of times, but was never sorry

 

[bbyrd009]

People have worshiped in Church for 2000 years

fwiw im not so sure much actual "worship" was done, according to the Scriptural def, anyway?
maybe a long time ago, but hardly in my experience
in a couple Mennonite congregations i guess

 

[bbyrd009]

Considering 1 Corinthians 9:1-18, I consider that those who preach the gospel ought to make their living from the work of preaching the gospel.

well, i wont say that i havent given many Cult of Sol preachers tithe money, but i am sorry i did now

 

[Candidus]

They have worshiped with the use of organs for at least 1,000 of those years; I consider the organ players to be worship leaders.

And you did not live over 1,000 years ago, so who are you to say that there were no official music ministers throughout church history?

There have been entire Denominations that do not use musical instruments and they sing just fine!

Who ever said that music was the only form of "worship"?

Leading music in the church does not make one a "minister".

 

[justbyfaith]

well, i wont say that i havent given many Cult of Sol preachers tithe money, but i am sorry i did now

See, here is the thing...you are not a Christian if you define Christianity as "the Cult of Sol."

So then, why the deception on your profile?