What does it mean to be born again?

[1stCenturyLady]

that the one who has this particular hope purifies themself.

How?


Sorry I was away so long and it took me so long to answer. And now I'm going to bed. Good night.

 

[Aunty Jane]

In discussing this rather emotional topic, Jesus did not say that all who would gain everlasting life must be “born again.” Rather, what he said was that unless one was “born again” he could not see the “kingdom of God.”

We know that the kingdom of God is heavenly. Jehovah has purposed that the Kingdom should rule over this earth to bring us back to what God purposed in Eden. Jehovah also purposed that a limited number, taken from among mankind, would reign with Christ Jesus as associate "kings and priests". For this amazing privilege they must be resurrected and given spirit bodies, in order to reside in heaven, in the presence of God, as the apostle said, “flesh and blood cannot inherit God’s kingdom.” (1 Cor 15:50)

That the Father has set a limitation on the number of those who will reign with his Son in the heavenly kingdom is manifest from Jesus’ words: “Have no fear, little flock, because your Father has approved of giving you the kingdom.” The exact number of the “little flock” approved by the Father to be Kingdom heirs was not known until Christ, through an angel, revealed it to be 144,000 “who have been bought from the earth.”

I believe that this “little flock” of 144,000 Kingdom heirs, are the only ones from among mankind who are “born again.” (Luke 12:32; Rev 14:1-4)
Jesus also said...."Most truly I say to you, unless anyone is born from water and spirit, he cannot enter into the Kingdom of God."
This is the baptism of water, then the baptism of the holy spirit.....only the elect can experience both.

Whilst still in the flesh on earth they have a token of their choosing....God's spirit bears witness with their spirit that they have been chosen to rule with Christ in his Kingdom, (Romans 8:15-17) but being "born again" actually takes place at their resurrection when they are literally "born again", being given new spirit bodies capable of dwelling in the spirit realm.

These will rule over mankind, bringing them back to the perfection that Adam and his wife once enjoyed before sin entered into the world through their disobedience. Jesus came to give us back what Adam took away from us.

Nothing else makes sense to me....

 

[Huperetes]

There was a common vernacular meaning for the term "born again" that Nicodemus was well aware of. The term was used for gentile converts to the Jewish faith. After baptism, they were called "born again" This is why Jesus marveled at Nicodemus apparent ignorance of the term. He should have had at least a basic grasp of the term. As for us? There is something to be considered in being baptized into Christ and translating from death to life.

There term "arabon" also has a distinction that should bring Godly fear to all. It truly was the down payment or "earnest" for a wedding. However, it could be FORFEITED if the contractual agreement was not met by both parties. This is something to ponder.

I must confess about the lengthy trail contained in my own wilderness experience. I confess that I have sinned in every way that Israel did. My complaining, murmuring, idolatry and rebellion have only served to increase the the length of my sojourn here. I have not arrived into the promised land. I have not been a full and perfect partaker of the divine nature. While I am not happy to be in this place I will always seek for that promised rest in the fellowship of His presence. Perhaps I may never fully enter in in this life. However, I have hope. Moses was never allowed to enter in during his earthly life..BUT he finally made it at the mount of transfiguration. I take solace that as an overcomer I will be granted to eat of the HIDDEN manna. Manna is only given in the wilderness,,,I take solace in that.
I leave off with this word:

2 Co 5:10-11
For we must all appear before the judgment seat of Christ; that every one may receive the things done in his body, according to that he hath done, whether it be good or bad.Knowing therefore the terror of the Lord, we persuade men;

Praise Jesus.

 

[Episkopos]

There was a common vernacular meaning for the term "born again" that Nicodemus was well aware of. The term was used for gentile converts to the Jewish faith. After baptism, they were called "born again" This is why Jesus marveled at Nicodemus apparent ignorance of the term. He should have had at least a basic grasp of the term. As for us? There is something to be considered in being baptized into Christ and translating from death to life.

There term "arabon" also has a distinction that should bring Godly fear to all. It truly was the down payment or "earnest" for a wedding. However, it could be FORFEITED if the contractual agreement was not met by both parties. This is something to ponder.

I must confess about the lengthy trail contained in my own wilderness experience. I confess that I have sinned in every way that Israel did. My complaining, murmuring, idolatry and rebellion have only served to increase the the length of my sojourn here. I have not arrived into the promised land. I have not been a full and perfect partaker of the divine nature. While I am not happy to be in this place I will always seek for that promised rest in the fellowship of His presence. Perhaps I may never fully enter in in this life. However, I have hope. Moses was never allowed to enter in during his earthly life..BUT he finally made it at the mount of transfiguration. I take solace that as an overcomer I will be granted to eat of the HIDDEN manna. Manna is only given in the wilderness,,,I take solace in that.
I leave off with this word:

2 Co 5:10-11
For we must all appear before the judgment seat of Christ; that every one may receive the things done in his body, according to that he hath done, whether it be good or bad.Knowing therefore the terror of the Lord, we persuade men;

Praise Jesus.

Amen! And God bless you for your honesty. I went through the same things as you describe along my own path. I never got it right the first time. I always managed to take a wrong turn. But the Lord is good and faithful. He led Me into His dwelling place.

I am still at a place of working things out....as I know basically everyone is. But I know where we are to go...we are to present ourselves as a living sacrifice that God will accept to translate us into the higher walk. However, falling short of that, we remain hopeful and faithful in whatever capacity we have been given!

Never lose heart. He gives grace to the humble ones who wait for Him.

Peace in Him <><

 

[Johann]

....become a reality???? This, of course, is a denial of the power of the cross to work in us at the present time. You speak in circles as so many here...claiming one thing and then another...with no consistency. So either you agree with Patrick that being born again is for a future age...where there is no sin...OR...you agree with the gospel that gives us the grace OVER sin as we enter INTO Christ right now.

All religious speculations or unbelief aside.

It only takes a human religious belief to agree with no sin in a future age. But it takes an actual faith that is in Christ to walk as Jesus walked (without sin) today.

Gnosticism is rampant on this Forum, coming in many guises

"cleanses us from all sin" This is a PRESENT ACTIVE INDICATIVE. The term "sin" is SINGULAR with no ARTICLE. This implies every kind of sin. Notice this verse is focusing on a one-time cleansing (salvation, 1 John 1:9), but on an ongoing cleansing (the Christian life). Both are part of the Christian experience (cf. John 13:10).

1. 1:8 "If we say that we have no sin" This is another THIRD CLASS CONDITIONAL SENTENCE. Sin is a spiritual reality in a fallen world, even for believers (cf. Romans 7; Eph. 4:14; 6:10-18). John's Gospel addresses this issue often (cf. John 9:41; 15:22,24; 19:11). This verse rejects all ancient and modern claims that deny individual moral responsibility.
   
   And why must we put on the armor of God? Are you incapable of being TEMPTED! Oh sinless one!?
   

Joh 9:40 Some of the Pharisees near him heard these things, and said to him, “Are we also blind?”
Joh 9:41 Jesus said to them, “If you were blind, you would have no guilt; but now that you say, ‘We see,’ your guilt remains.




"we are deceiving ourselves" This Greek phrase refers to personal, willful rejection of truth, not ignorance.

"the truth is not in us" The way to acceptance by a Holy God is not denial, but recognition of our sin and acceptance of His provision in Christ (cf. Rom. 3:21-31). "The truth" can refer to the message about Jesus or the person of Jesus (cf. John 14:6).

Are you in denial that we are still in the flesh, PRONE to sin?


1:8,9 "If" These are both THIRD CLASS CONDITIONAL SENTENCES which means potential action.<<<<<<

1:9 "confess" This is a compound Greek term from "to speak" and "the same." Believers continue to agree with God that they have violated His holiness (cf. Rom. 3:23). It is PRESENT TENSE, which implies ongoing action. Confession implies

a specific naming of sins (1 John 1:9)
a public admitting of sins (cf. Matt. 10:32; James 5:16)
a turning from specific sins (cf. Matt. 3:6; Mark 1:5; Acts 19:18; James 5:16)
1 John uses this term quite often (cf. 1 John 1:9; 4:2,3,15; 2 John 7). Jesus' death is the means of forgiveness, but sinful mankind must respond and continue to respond in faith to be saved (cf. John 1:12; 3:16).



"our sins" Notice the PLURAL. This refers to specific acts of sin.

Are you incapable to commit one ACT of sin, in thought, word and deed?

"He is faithful" This refers to God the Father (cf. Deut. 7:9; 32:4; Ps. 36:5; 40:10; 89:1,2,5,8; 92:2; 119:90; Isa. 49:7; Rom. 3:3; 1 Cor. 1:9; 10:13; 2 Cor. 1:18; 1 Thess. 5:24; 2 Tim. 2:13). God the Father's unchanging, merciful, faithful character is our surest hope! This phrase accentuates God's faithfulness to His Word (cf. Heb. 10:23;11:11). This may also refer to God's New Covenant promise made in Jer. 31:34, which promised the forgiveness of sins.


"and righteous" This term is unusual in a context related to a holy God freely pardoning unholy people. However, this is theologically accurate because God takes our sins seriously, yet He has provided the means for our forgiveness in the substitutionary death of Christ (cf. Rom. 3:21-31).



"forgive . . . cleanse" These are both AORIST ACTIVE SUBJUNCTIVES. These two terms are synonymous in this context; they refer both to the salvation of the lost and to the ongoing cleansing necessary for fellowship with God (i.e., when God forgives, God fogets, cf. Isa. 1:18; 38:17; 43:25; 44:22; Ps. 103:3,11-13; Mic. 7:19). The false teachers who denied the gospel, needed salvation. Believers who continue to commit acts of sin need restoration of fellowship. John seems to address the first group implicitly and the second explicitly.

1:10 "If we say" See note at 1 John 1:6.

"we have not sinned" This is a PERFECT ACTIVE INDICATIVE which implies that one has never sinned in the past nor in the present.

The term "sinned" is SINGULAR and refers to sin in general. The Greek term means "to miss the mark." This means that sin is both the commission and the omission of the things revealed in God's Word. The false teachers claimed salvation was related only to knowledge, not to life.

You are a "knowledgeable" kind of guy, yes?

"we make Him a liar" The gospel is based on the sinfulness of all mankind (cf. Rom. 3:9-18,23; 5:1; 11:32). Either God (cf. Rom. 3:4) or those who claim sinlessness, is lying.

"His word is not in us" This involves the dual aspect of the term "logos," both as a message and a person (cf. 1 John 1:1,8; John 14:6). John often refers to this as "truth."

"I am writing these things to you so that you may not sin" This is an AORIST ACTIVE SUBJUNCTIVE.

John is making a definite distinction between PRESENT TENSE, an ongoing habitual lifestyle of sinning (cf. 1 John 3:6,9, i.e., a sect of the Gnostic false teachers) and individual acts of sin committed by struggling and tempted Christians. He is trying to bring a balance between the two extremes of

taking sin too lightly (cf. Rom. 6:1; 1 John 1:8-10; 3:6-9; 5:16)

Christian harshness and brittleness over personal sins

These two extremes probably reflect two different schools of Gnostic teachings. One group felt that salvation was an intellectual matter; it did not matter how one lived because the body was evil. The other group of Gnostics also believed the body was evil and, therefore had to be limited in its desires.

"And if anyone sins" This is a THIRD CLASS CONDITIONAL SENTENCE which speaks of potential action. Even Christians sin (cf. Romans 7; Eph. 4:14; 6:10-18).


"we have an Advocate with the Father" This is a PRESENT ACTIVE INDICATIVE which refers to Jesus' ongoing intercession as our heavenly Advocate (paraklētos). This was a legal term for a defense lawyer or "one called alongside to help" (from para, beside and kaleō, to call). It is used in the upper room discourse in the Gospel of John, for the Holy Spirit, our earthly, indwelling advocate (cf. John 14:16,26; 15:26; 16:7). However, this is the only use of the term for Jesus (although it is implied in John 14:16; Rom. 8:34; Heb. 4:14-16; 7:25; 9:24).

Fom Utley...and you have completely misunderstood @mailmandan as we await our final redemption, to wit, the redemption of our bodies. Or you really believe that we are sinless, in word, thought and deed.

Watch your pride and gnostic symptoms.
There's no unity among the brethren on this Forum

 

[VictoryinJesus]

What does it mean to be born again? Are we God's favourites without responsibility? Or are we become the people of God equivalent to the Jews?...and with the same risk of being cut off for lack of bearing the right kind of fruit?

I have a strange thought about being born from above. To me it helps with some of the passages.

Born from above reminds me of coming down from above…to bow (not literally but to take a knee), to submit, to be made humble before God. Positional wise when considering the flesh being lifted up in hierarchy of arrogance or pride above God…that is what I consider in “to be born again” “to come down from above”. For example Christ who humbled himself even unto death. His coming down from above (lowering Himself) and tasted of death for us all. To me this is “born from above” given of God.

I don’t know if that gets the thought across but consider; paraphrasing: no one is lifted up unless he must first come down. Seems to line up with Proverbs 11:2-4 When pride comes, then comes shame: but with the lowly is wisdom. [3] The integrity of the upright shall guide them: but the perverseness of transgressors shall destroy them. [4] Riches profit not in the day of wrath: but righteousness delivers from death.

Also (for me) this takes “born again” away from some mystical wording to James 4:6-10 But he gives more grace. Wherefore he says, God resists the proud, but gives grace unto the humble. [7] Submit yourselves therefore to God. Resist the devil, and he will flee from you. [8] Draw near to God, and he will draw near to you. Cleanse your hands, you sinners; and purify your hearts, you double minded. [9] Be afflicted, and mourn, and weep: let your laughter be turned to mourning, and your joy to heaviness. [10] Humble yourselves in the sight of the Lord, and he shall lift you up.

Where to be “born again” there is no getting around: you must come down from above to be born anew. To me if that is the meaning of to come down from above … how many would then ask “to come down from above” “to be born” Anew?

 

[Episkopos]

I have a strange thought about being born from above. To me it helps with some of the passages.

Born from above reminds me of coming down from above…to bow (not literally but to take a knee), to submit, to be made humble before God. Positional wise when considering the flesh being lifted up in hierarchy of arrogance or pride above God…that is what I consider in “to be born again” “to come down from above”. For example Christ who humbled himself even unto death. His coming down from above (lowering Himself) and tasted of death for us all. To me this is “born from above” given of God.

Bless your heart. I like your way of seeing things!

For Jesus it was indeed a coming down. For us it is an ascending into His presence and love. However, we have an uncrucified nature at the beginning. The divine challenge of being born from above is to humble ourselves...as Jesus did. But many will never do this...instead calaculating a higher benefit for themselves and an unconditional forgiveness for their evil works.

I don’t know if that gets the thought across but consider; paraphrasing: no one is lifted up unless he must first come down. Seems to line up with Proverbs 11:2-4 When pride comes, then comes shame: but with the lowly is wisdom. [3] The integrity of the upright shall guide them: but the perverseness of transgressors shall destroy them. [4] Riches profit not in the day of wrath: but righteousness delivers from death.

We need to take the next steps downward...being downwardly mobile...in order to be Christ-like.

Also (for me) this takes “born again” away from some mystical wording to James 4:6-10 But he gives more grace. Wherefore he says, God resists the proud, but gives grace unto the humble. [7] Submit yourselves therefore to God. Resist the devil, and he will flee from you. [8] Draw near to God, and he will draw near to you. Cleanse your hands, you sinners; and purify your hearts, you double minded. [9] Be afflicted, and mourn, and weep: let your laughter be turned to mourning, and your joy to heaviness. [10] Humble yourselves in the sight of the Lord, and he shall lift you up.

Where to be “born again” there is no getting around: you must come down from above to be born anew

or...we must come down in our own estimations and ways AFTER we have been born anew. We are to receive with meekness the ingrafted word!

But I agree that we would never have been born again and lifted up if we had never first lowered ourselves into repentance.

Peace.

 

[VictoryinJesus]

Bless your heart. I like your way of seeing things!

For Jesus it was indeed a coming down. For us it is an ascending into His presence and love. However, we have an uncrucified nature at the beginning. The divine challenge of being born from above is to humble ourselves...as Jesus did. But many will never do this...instead calaculating a higher benefit for themselves and an unconditional forgiveness for their evil works.



We need to take the next steps downward...being downwardly mobile...in order to be Christ-like.

or...we must come down in our own estimations and ways AFTER we have been born anew. We are to receive with meekness the ingrafted word!

But I agree that we would never have been born again and lifted up if we had never first lowered ourselves into repentance.

Peace.

To me it takes to be born again away from fairy tales and fables to God has shown the way. Reminds me of when He told them “you know the way” “for I have shown it to you”. Also your topic reminds me of the song about Luke 19:5 Lexicon: When Jesus came to the place, He looked up and said to him, "Zaccheus, hurry and come down, for today I must stay at your house."

 

[Episkopos]

Gnosticism is rampant on this Forum, coming in many guises

This sounds more like a confession than an accusation.

"cleanses us from all sin" This is a PRESENT ACTIVE INDICATIVE. The term "sin" is SINGULAR with no ARTICLE. This implies every kind of sin. Notice this verse is focusing on a one-time cleansing (salvation, 1 John 1:9), but on an ongoing cleansing (the Christian life). Both are part of the Christian experience (cf. John 13:10).

If we are cleansed of all sin by abiding in the resurrection life of Christ.....then...wait for it....there is such a thing as a walk without sin. But you will refute that very thing. You will contradict yourself as so many do here...who have not thought out their position well enough.

1. 1:8 "If we say that we have no sin" This is another THIRD CLASS CONDITIONAL SENTENCE. Sin is a spiritual reality in a fallen world, even for believers (cf. Romans 7; Eph. 4:14; 6:10-18). John's Gospel addresses this issue often (cf. John 9:41; 15:22,24; 19:11). This verse rejects all ancient and modern claims that deny individual moral responsibility.
   
   And why must we put on the armor of God? Are you incapable of being TEMPTED! Oh sinless one!?

Joh 9:40 Some of the Pharisees near him heard these things, and said to him, “Are we also blind?”
Joh 9:41 Jesus said to them, “If you were blind, you would have no guilt; but now that you say, ‘We see,’ your guilt remains.

Again...this is your own guilty conscience speaking here as a confession. You claim to know when you don't.

"we are deceiving ourselves" This Greek phrase refers to personal, willful rejection of truth, not ignorance.

"the truth is not in us" The way to acceptance by a Holy God is not denial, but recognition of our sin and acceptance of His provision in Christ (cf. Rom. 3:21-31). "The truth" can refer to the message about Jesus or the person of Jesus (cf. John 14:6).

Are you in denial that we are still in the flesh, PRONE to sin?

Of course we can sin...that is unless we abide in Christ in whom is no sin.

 

[GTW27]

Exactly the way it reads. It's a simple statement. I just accept what it says, that the one who has this particular hope purifies themself.

Much love!

How?


Sorry I was away so long and it took me so long to answer. And now I'm going to bed. Good night.

I am purified daily, as The Lord is just to forgive my trespasses(sins). One can not walk in The Spirit, unless they be clean.

 

[Johann]

If we are cleansed of all sin by abiding in the resurrection life of Christ.....then...wait for it....there is such a thing as a walk without sin. But you will refute that very thing. You will contradict yourself as so many do here...who have not thought out their position well enough.

Ephesians 4:13 says that the spiritual gifts are given to build up the body of Christ “until we all reach unity in the faith and in the knowledge of the Son of God and become mature, attaining to the whole measure of the fullness of Christ.”

Some translations say that we will become “perfect” (instead of “mature”), and from this some people have mistakenly thought that we can reach sinless perfection in this life.

The Bible teaches that, while we are in the flesh, we will always struggle with a sin nature (see Romans 7:14–24). No one will be “perfect” (sinless) until we reach heaven.

*Unless, of course, you want to say that it was Paul, the unregenerate man in Rom 7.*

• The word translated “mature” in Ephesians 4:13 is the Greek word teleios. It is used throughout the New Testament to mean “perfect,” “complete,” “full-grown,” and “mature.”
  
  What Ephesians 4:13 teaches is that, the more we grow in Christ, the stronger and more unified we will be as a church. The verse does not teach that we will stop sinning.

Another passage that people sometimes get confused about is Colossians 1:28, which says, in some translations, that Paul wants to “present every man perfect in Christ Jesus.”

Also, in Colossians 4:12 Paul prays that we would “stand perfect and complete in all the will of God.”

In both verses, the Greek word for perfect should be understood to mean “mature” or “full-grown,” not “having no sin.”

As human beings we are bound under Adam’s nature in this world. No matter how hard we try not to, we will still sin against God. This holds true for everyone. The apostle Paul rebuked Peter for showing favoritism (Galatians 2:11–13). Late in his ministry, Paul calls himself the chief of sinners (1 Timothy 1:15). Peter, James, John, and Paul all admitted that they were imperfect. How could you or I claim anything different?

True perfection will not come until the rapture of the church, when we rise to meet Jesus in the air (1 Thessalonians 4:17). At that time the dead in Christ will be resurrected, and the bodies of the living will be changed (Philippians 3:20, 21; 1 Corinthians 15:54). We will stand before the Judgment Seat of Christ (2 Corinthians 5:10) where our works will be judged and rewards will be given (1 Corinthians 3:9–15). Our redemption will be complete, and our sin will be gone forever. We will live and reign with Christ in sinless perfection forever.

Is sinless perfection possible in this life? | GotQuestions.org

Is sinless perfection possible in this life? Is it possible to be completely and permanently free from sin?

www.gotquestions.org

I listened to your video clip on "To be born again, and you are not for "progressive sanctification".............care to explain this one for me?

 

[Episkopos]

Ephesians 4:13 says that the spiritual gifts are given to build up the body of Christ “until we all reach unity in the faith and in the knowledge of the Son of God and become mature, attaining to the whole measure of the fullness of Christ.”

Some translations say that we will become “perfect” (instead of “mature”), and from this some people have mistakenly thought that we can reach sinless perfection in this life.

Only Jesus is sinlessly perfect. We take on HIS attributes by entering into Him. I have explained this like getting into an airplane. It is the airplane that overcomes gravity...not the individual. Likewise, it is by being IN Christ that we are made holy, righteous and pure...free from all spot or wrinkle of sin.

Then there is the idea of maturity. A mature person is one that has no other desire than to remain where he is when he is in Christ.

Jesus gives us the purity...but we must WANT to be with Him...that takes a mature kind of love. Basically a mature Christian is self-less as God is self-less.

The Bible teaches that, while we are in the flesh, we will always struggle with a sin nature (see Romans 7:14–24). No one will be “perfect” (sinless) until we reach heaven.

*Unless, of course, you want to say that it was Paul, the unregenerate man in Rom 7.*

• The word translated “mature” in Ephesians 4:13 is the Greek word teleios. It is used throughout the New Testament to mean “perfect,” “complete,” “full-grown,” and “mature.”
  
  What Ephesians 4:13 teaches is that, the more we grow in Christ, the stronger and more unified we will be as a church. The verse does not teach that we will stop sinning.

We are in a race. That race is according to a divine challenge based on a very high covenant...the covenant of an exchanged life that is found in Christ. While we can always sin... which we will do when we live from our own power....there is an alternative.....that of walking by grace.

Another passage that people sometimes get confused about is Colossians 1:28, which says, in some translations, that Paul wants to “present every man perfect in Christ Jesus.”

Also, in Colossians 4:12 Paul prays that we would “stand perfect and complete in all the will of God.”

In both verses, the Greek word for perfect should be understood to mean “mature” or “full-grown,” not “having no sin.”

As human beings we are bound under Adam’s nature in this world. No matter how hard we try not to, we will still sin against God. This holds true for everyone. The apostle Paul rebuked Peter for showing favoritism (Galatians 2:11–13). Late in his ministry, Paul calls himself the chief of sinners (1 Timothy 1:15). Peter, James, John, and Paul all admitted that they were imperfect. How could you or I claim anything different?

We will never be full grown IN sin. A full grown (mature disciple) follower of Christ has learned to not have any confidence in the temporal world. God translates the disciple to be as pure as He is....and it is the maturity of the saint to have that same desire for an UNBROKEN eternal fellowship that God desires.

True perfection will not come until the rapture of the church, when we rise to meet Jesus in the air (1 Thessalonians 4:17). At that time the dead in Christ will be resurrected, and the bodies of the living will be changed (Philippians 3:20, 21; 1 Corinthians 15:54). We will stand before the Judgment Seat of Christ (2 Corinthians 5:10) where our works will be judged and rewards will be given (1 Corinthians 3:9–15). Our redemption will be complete, and our sin will be gone forever. We will live and reign with Christ in sinless perfection forever.

Is sinless perfection possible in this life? | GotQuestions.org

Is sinless perfection possible in this life? Is it possible to be completely and permanently free from sin?

www.gotquestions.org

The new body is only a dwelling place for the soul. In this life we are to work out the salvation of our souls with fear and trembling, to make ourselves worthy of that new body.

I listened to your video clip on "To be born again, and you are not for "progressive sanctification".............care to explain this one for me?

No one becomes more holy over time. Actually, it goes the other way. Most people get used to being as they are. It takes getting tired of being the way we are and crying out to God for His help through repentance....THAT's what gets God's attention. Then He can translate us into a heavenly walk in HIS holiness. Holiness is NEVER our own. Always His. Likewise eternal life is always His....never ours. God is selfless. And to understand the things of God, the self has to get out of the way. The self is meant to be crucified with Christ....so that the inner man can be empowered with His resurrection life. Then, it is HIS holiness that keeps us from sin.

 

[1stCenturyLady]

I am purified daily, as The Lord is just to forgive my trespasses(sins). One can not walk in The Spirit, unless they be clean.

Do you forgive others their trespasses against you? Are you mad at anyone?

 

[marks]

How?


Sorry I was away so long and it took me so long to answer. And now I'm going to bed. Good night.

I would answer that this is what happens as we are believing His promises.

That's walking by faith.

Much love!

 

[marks]

Likewise, it is by being IN Christ that we are made holy, righteous and pure...free from all spot or wrinkle of sin.

Romans 6:3-11 KJV
3) Know ye not, that so many of us as were baptized into Jesus Christ were baptized into his death?
4) Therefore we are buried with him by baptism into death: that like as Christ was raised up from the dead by the glory of the Father, even so we also should walk in newness of life.
5) For if we have been planted together in the likeness of his death, we shall be also in the likeness of his resurrection:
6) Knowing this, that our old man is crucified with him, that the body of sin might be destroyed, that henceforth we should not serve sin.
7) For he that is dead is freed from sin.
8) Now if we be dead with Christ, we believe that we shall also live with him:
9) Knowing that Christ being raised from the dead dieth no more; death hath no more dominion over him.
10) For in that he died, he died unto sin once: but in that he liveth, he liveth unto God.
11) Likewise reckon ye also yourselves to be dead indeed unto sin, but alive unto God through Jesus Christ our Lord.

Much love!

 

[GTW27]

Do you forgive others their trespasses against you? Are you mad at anyone?

LOL. How can one not forgive his brother in his heart with The Lord(Holy Spirit) within. Why would you say such a crazy thing?

 

[Episkopos]

Romans 6:3-11 KJV
3) Know ye not, that so many of us as were baptized into Jesus Christ were baptized into his death?
4) Therefore we are buried with him by baptism into death: that like as Christ was raised up from the dead by the glory of the Father, even so we also should walk in newness of life.
5) For if we have been planted together in the likeness of his death, we shall be also in the likeness of his resurrection:
6) Knowing this, that our old man is crucified with him, that the body of sin might be destroyed, that henceforth we should not serve sin.
7) For he that is dead is freed from sin.
8) Now if we be dead with Christ, we believe that we shall also live with him:
9) Knowing that Christ being raised from the dead dieth no more; death hath no more dominion over him.
10) For in that he died, he died unto sin once: but in that he liveth, he liveth unto God.
11) Likewise reckon ye also yourselves to be dead indeed unto sin, but alive unto God through Jesus Christ our Lord.

Much love!

Of course Romans 6 isn't the same as Romans 8. Reckoning yourself to be dead to sin is good....we shouldn't think of ourselves as alive to sin. ...but it doesn't stop us from sinning entirely. For that to happen we need to go to the cross to have the outer man (ego) dealt with by the cross.

God is self-less. But we are selfish...until we come to the end of ourselves and cry out to God.


The conundrum is with a religious system that caters to the uncrucified flesh in people...promising them illusions. But judgment day will sort that out.

If we are to mature we will come out of the religious system....or else be there to teach the selfish to become self-less.

 

[marks]

Of course Romans 6 isn't the same as Romans 8. Reckoning yourself to be dead to sin is good....we shouldn't think of ourselves as alive to sin. ...but it doesn't stop us from sinning entirely. For that to happen we need to go to the cross to have the outer man (ego) dealt with by the cross.

Which is why I'm posting portions of chapter 6 for you. This teaches us about that very thing.

We are then to believe this is true so that we will live accordingly. But when we do not receive those portions of the Bible which seem contrary to our views, this will create error. When we blend old and new covenants as so many do, this also creates error.

Much love!

 

[1stCenturyLady]

LOL. How can one not forgive his brother in his heart with The Lord(Holy Spirit) within. Why would you say such a crazy thing?

The way you wrote your post was not taking any responsibility for forgiving others; just that God forgives you.

 

[marks]

The conundrum is with a religious system that caters to the uncrucified flesh in people...promising them illusions. But judgment day will sort that out.

That contributes to the lack of faith people demonstrate when committing sin. A failure to believe we are actually, in truth, freed from sin is a frequent cause of living as though not freed from sin.

The fact is, the language in ch. 6, not to mention 7 and 8, the language is very clear. It's whether we trust these things to be true or not.

Much love!