What does Law mean Biblically?

[Ancient]

By what definition and qualification do you believe Jesus was a "Jew"?

He was not from Judea (national identity) and certainly was not a practitioner of Judaism (He and the Pharisees didn't get along too well)

I never said He practiced Judaism. Depending on how one defines the word Jew. A Jew can be identified with and directly connected to the house of Judah which is how I refer to Yeshua, as one of His titles is Son of David. David obviously represent the House of Judah. Another title of our Messiah The Lion of Judah.

NKJ John 4:22 "You worship what you do not know; we know what we worship, for salvation is of the Jews.
In His use of first- and second-person pronouns, Jesus identified Himself as being among the Jewish population.

NKJ Hebrews 7:14 For it is evident that our Lord arose from Judah, of which tribe Moses spoke nothing concerning priesthood.

NKJ Matthew 1:1 The book of the genealogy of Jesus Christ, the Son of David, the Son of Abraham:
It is quite clear that Yeshua is of the House of David of the Tribe of Judah.

Also many messianic prophecies are directly connecting our Messiah to the tribe of Judah.

Shalom Friend

 

[Ancient]

There are some on here that are really saying some nasty insulting things that are not from the Spirit of Yahweh. They are not displaying fruits of the spirit in their comments, what a sad representation of what they call their faith. Sorry everyone if my comments have offended please forgive me. I am tapping out of this thread as I do not want to be involved in the slandering that is going on. What a sad state we are all in. Have mercy on us Yahweh, clean us all up to be proper representatives for you, while we still have breath.

Shalom Friends

 

[An Apologetic Sheepdog]

I never said He practiced Judaism. Depending on how one defines the word Jew. A Jew can be identified with and directly connected to the house of Judah which is how I refer to Yeshua, as one of His titles is Son of David. David obviously represent the House of Judah. Another title of our Messiah The Lion of Judah.

NKJ John 4:22 "You worship what you do not know; we know what we worship, for salvation is of the Jews.
In His use of first- and second-person pronouns, Jesus identified Himself as being among the Jewish population.

NKJ Hebrews 7:14 For it is evident that our Lord arose from Judah, of which tribe Moses spoke nothing concerning priesthood.

NKJ Matthew 1:1 The book of the genealogy of Jesus Christ, the Son of David, the Son of Abraham:
It is quite clear that Yeshua is of the House of David of the Tribe of Judah.

What you seem to have is serious contextual and transliteration issues.

In the day of the writing, The Kingdom of Israel was "dispersed" and what "was" Judea was mongrelized even to the point Samaritans were half and half. This was also when the Talmud (traditions) crept in and displaced much of the original law.

So, by the definitions and conditions used at the time of the writings, Jesus was not regarded as a "Jew" despite his lineage.

In John 4:22- you need to read that whole section and conversation as to the Samaritan woman. Jesus was making a comparison talking to her- not a general statement.

 

[Ronald David Bruno]

I guess you are BLIND TO APOSTLE PAUL'S EPISTLES then.

Like to slice and dice God's written Word, and throw away the parts you don't like? It's obvious you have no problem with that, otherwise you wouldn't be so quick to leave the subject of 1 Timothy 1 and Galatians 5 by Apostle Paul!

You are off base pal. I agree with those scriptures. My posts do not teach legalism, nor am I legalistic. I have been saved by Grace through faith alone.
You are bearing false witness, attacking me because you have no argument. You are mean spirited and unfriendly. I reached out to you about the guitar. You are not interested in a friendly dialogue, just attacking and making false accusations against me because why? Where is your brotherly love, fruit of the Spirit?
Don't answer, just look in the mirror, examine yourself.
Jesus said all the Law and the prophets hang on those two commandments, love God and love one another.
>>> What problem do YOU have with Jesus #1 purpose for us??????

 

[Grailhunter]

I have taken nothing of what Apostle Paul said in 1 Timothy 1 and Galatians 5 out of context. You're the one that has done that, wrongly applying ideas as if God's laws no longer exist under Christian doctrine in The New Testament.



You're the LIAR. And your lie is against... Apostle Paul's Epistles!

1 Tim 1:9-11
9 Knowing this, that the law is not made for a righteous man, but for the lawless and disobedient, for the ungodly and for sinners, for unholy and profane, for murderers of fathers and murderers of mothers, for manslayers,

10 For whoremongers, for them that defile themselves with mankind, for menstealers, for liars, for perjured persons, and if there be any other thing that is contrary to sound doctrine;

11 According to the glorious gospel of the blessed God, which was committed to my trust.
KJV

I'm not going to look up the law in U.S. courts against PERJURY. That's easy to find. Do your own homework and educate yourself!

That proves that God's law against PERJURY (telling lies under oath) IS STILL APPLIED PER CHRISTIAN DOCTRINE.

Evidently, you don't understand that those in Christ are dead to God's laws only IF... we are not guilty of breaking them. LIE under oath on the witness stand in a western courtroom and you will have put yourself BACK UNDER God's law against PERJURY!

1 Timothy 1 and Galatians 5 out of context. You're the one that has done that, wrongly applying ideas as if God's laws no longer exist under Christian doctrine in The New Testament.

This is a good one....lying. Still a custom in the middle east...it is called trickery. The Old Religion was governed by laws so lying as far as witnessing would be a sin. But usually God sided with those that used trickery and lies in other matters.
You're the LIAR. And your lie is against... Apostle Paul's Epistles!

I have no issue with the fact that perjury is against the law. And the Mosaic Law did have laws against false witness, but culturally trickery was seen as smart.
You can read up on the story of Jacob and Esau. The use of trickery there is clear and deceitfully. Ultimately God said in Malachi 1:1-3 “I loved you,” says the Lord. “But you ask, ‘How did you love us?’ “Wasn’t Esau Jacob’s brother?” declares the Lord. “I loved Jacob, 3 but Esau I hated. I turned his mountains into a wasteland and left his inheritance to the jackals in the desert.

Again we are not under the Mosaic Law in any way and Paul stood against and struggled with the people that tried to push the Law on Christians and this is what the first Christian council between James and Paul was about.

 

[Bob Estey]

Just wanting to put it out there. What does the English word law mean Biblically?

Ancient

I think "law" refers to the Lord's commandments. Then one might ask, "What does 'commandment' mean biblically?" I wouldn't include all the decrees, statues and ordinances as part of the law. Clearly, in my judgment, some of the Old Testament is aimed only at the Jews. But those that ignore the entire Old Testament are only hurting themselves.

 

[Davy]

You are off base pal. I agree with those scriptures. My posts do not teach legalism, nor am I legalistic. I have been saved by Grace through faith alone.
You are bearing false witness, attacking me because you have no argument. You are mean spirited and unfriendly. I reached out to you about the guitar. You are not interested in a friendly dialogue, just attacking and making false accusations against me because why? Where is your brotherly love, fruit of the Spirit?
Don't answer, just look in the mirror, examine yourself.
Jesus said all the Law and the prophets hang on those two commandments, love God and love one another.
>>> What problem do YOU have with Jesus #1 purpose for us??????

When you refuse to address the Scriptures by Apostle Paul that supports many of God's laws still applying per Christian doctrine, of which I showed with 1 Timothy 1 and Galatians 5, and INSTEAD simply keep posting verses that you THINK overrides what Paul wrote, then then what does that make you, pal?

 

[Grailhunter]

When you refuse to address the Scriptures by Apostle Paul that supports many of God's laws still applying per Christian doctrine, of which I showed with 1 Timothy 1 and Galatians 5, and INSTEAD simply keep posting verses that you THINK overrides what Paul wrote, then then what does that make you, pal?

How dense do have to be to think that Paul supported the law when His ministry was dogged by people like Davy.

2nd Corinthians 3:7-18 But if the ministry of death, in letters engraved on stones, came with glory, so that the sons of Israel could not look intently at the face of Moses because of the glory of his face, fading as it was, how will the ministry of the Spirit fail to be even more with glory? For if the ministry of condemnation has glory, much more does the ministry of righteousness abound in glory. For indeed what had glory, in this case has no glory because of the glory that surpasses it. For if that which fades away was with glory, much more that which remains is in glory. Therefore having such a hope, we use great boldness in our speech, and are not like Moses, who used to put a veil over his face so that the sons of Israel would not look intently at the end of what was fading away. But their minds were hardened; for until this very day at the reading of the old covenant the same veil remains unlifted, because it is removed in Christ. But to this day whenever Moses is read, a veil lies over their heart; but whenever a person turns to the Lord, the veil is taken away. Now the Lord is the Spirit, and where the Spirit of the Lord is, there is liberty. But we all, with unveiled face, beholding as in a mirror the glory of the Lord, are being transformed into the same image from glory to glory, just as from the Lord, the Spirit.

Hebrews 8:13
When He said, “A new covenant,” He has made the first obsolete. But whatever is becoming obsolete and growing old is ready to disappear.

Galatians 5:1-4
It was for freedom that Christ set us free; therefore keep standing firm and do not be subject again to a yoke of slavery. Look! I, Paul, tell you that if you have yourselves circumcised, Christ will be of no benefit to you. And I testify again to every man who has himself circumcised, that he is obligated to keep the whole Law. 4 You have been severed from Christ, you who are seeking to be justified by the Law; you have fallen from grace.

Galatians 3:12 Christ redeemed us from the curse of the Law, having become a curse for us.

Galatians 3:24-26 Therefore the Law has become our tutor to lead us to Christ, so that we may be justified by faith. But now that faith has come, we are no longer under a tutor. For you are all sons of God through faith in Christ Jesus.

Galatians 4:21 Tell me, you who want to be under law, do you not listen to the Law?

Romans 4:15 for the Law brings about wrath, but where there is no law, neither is there violation.

Romans 5:13 For until the Law sin was in the world; sin is not “imputed” when there is no Law.


Galatians 5:18 But if you are led by the spirit, you are not under the Law.

Romans 6:14 For sin shall not be master over you, for you are not under the law, but under grace & 18 Being then free from sin, you become the servants of righteousness.

Romans 7:6 But now we have been released from the Law, having died to that by which we were bound, so that we serve in newness of the Spirit and not in the oldness of the letter.

Romans 7:8 But sin, taking opportunity through the commandment, produced in me coveting of every kind; for apart from the Law sin is dead.

Romans 8:1-2 There is therefore now no condemnation for those who are in Christ Jesus. For the law of the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus hath you free from the law of sin and death.

Romans 10:4 For Christ is the end of the law for righteousness to everyone who believes.

1st John3:6: Whosoever abideth in him sinneth not: whosoever sinneth hath not seen him, neither known him.

1st Cor. 9:20 And to the Jews I became as a Jew, that I might win Jews; to those who are under the Law, as under the Law, through not being myself under the Law, that I might win those who are under the Law;

2nd Cor. 3:3 being manifested that you are a letter of Christ, cared for by us, written not with ink, but with the Spirit of the living God, not on tablets of stone, but on tablets of human hearts.

Galatians 4:21 “Tell me, you who want to be under the law, do you not listen to the law?”

Galatians 5:3&4 And I testify again to every man who receives circumcision, that he is under obligation to keep the whole Law. You have been severed from Christ, you who are seeking to be justified by law; you have fallen from grace.

Galatians 3:12 Christ redeemed us from the curse of the Law, having become a curse for us.

Hebrews 10:1 For the Law, since it has only a shadow of the good things to come and not the very form of things, can never by the same sacrifices year by year, which they offer continually, make perfect those who draw near.

Hebrews 10:4 For it is impossible for the blood of bulls and goats to take away sins.

Act 13:38-39 Paul said, Therefore let it be known to you brethren, that through Him forgiveness of sins is proclaimed to you, and through Him everyone who believes is freed from all things, from which you could not be freed through the Law of Moses.

 

[Davy]

1 Timothy 1 and Galatians 5 out of context. You're the one that has done that, wrongly applying ideas as if God's laws no longer exist under Christian doctrine in The New Testament.

Oh... No! I didn't take what Apostle Paul said out of context. You have, because it's obvious you've been listening to some idiot telling you that believers on Christ Jesus can't be subject to God's law anymore! Those are the same false prophets that tell brethren that they cannot ever sin anymore either, after having believed on Jesus and been baptized!


It's so sad that many of my Christian brethren cannot recognize Christ's enemies that creep into His Church and teach LIES from the Devil. Those are able to do that simply because lazy believers on Christ won't take the time to crack open God's Word in study with His help in order to weed out those false prophets!

Once Saved, Always Saved, is one of the most dangerous doctrines of the devil, because it suggests to the believer that no matter what they do, they will be saved by Lord Jesus. Yet they forgot to read what Lord Jesus said about shutting the door on the five foolish virgins in Matthew 25, and about casting out the unprofitable servant.

They do the same thing with the idea of God's law, trying to throw it away when Apostle Paul never did (as he showed in the 1 Timothy 1 and Galatians 5 Scripture as I have pointed out to hard-heads here several times.)

Christ did NOT nail all of God's laws on His cross!

And Paul taught that 'we' as Christians are 'dead' to the law ONLY IF... we don't do anything that is against God's law (Galatians 5). But those hard-heads won't listen to Paul on that in Galatians 5, so why would they listen to me?

 

[Grailhunter]

Oh... No! I didn't take what Apostle Paul said out of context. You have, because it's obvious you've been listening to some idiot telling you that believers on Christ Jesus can't be subject to God's law anymore! Those are the same false prophets that tell brethren that they cannot ever sin anymore either, after having believed on Jesus and been baptized!


It's so sad that many of my Christian brethren cannot recognize Christ's enemies that creep into His Church and teach LIES from the Devil. Those are able to do that simply because lazy believers on Christ won't take the time to crack open God's Word in study with His help in order to weed out those false prophets!

Once Saved, Always Saved, is one of the most dangerous doctrines of the devil, because it suggests to the believer that no matter what they do, they will be saved by Lord Jesus. Yet they forgot to read what Lord Jesus said about shutting the door on the five foolish virgins in Matthew 25, and about casting out the unprofitable servant.

They do the same thing with the idea of God's law, trying to throw it away when Apostle Paul never did (as he showed in the 1 Timothy 1 and Galatians 5 Scripture as I have pointed out to hard-heads here several times.)

Christ did NOT nail all of God's laws on His cross!

And Paul taught that 'we' as Christians are 'dead' to the law ONLY IF... we don't do anything that is against God's law (Galatians 5). But those hard-heads won't listen to Paul on that in Galatians 5, so why would they listen to me?

I just gave you a heap of scriptures. If you cannot read I would say that is your biggest problem. The scriptures stand against you and Paul fought against your kind. And your kind being called Judaizers

 

[Davy]

How dense do have to be to think that Paul supported the law when His ministry was dogged by people like Davy.

2nd Corinthians 3:7-18 But if the ministry of death, in letters engraved on stones, came with glory, so that the sons of Israel could not look intently at the face of Moses because of the glory of his face, fading as it was, how will the ministry of the Spirit fail to be even more with glory? For if the ministry of condemnation has glory, much more does the ministry of righteousness abound in glory. For indeed what had glory, in this case has no glory because of the glory that surpasses it. For if that which fades away was with glory, much more that which remains is in glory. Therefore having such a hope, we use great boldness in our speech, and are not like Moses, who used to put a veil over his face so that the sons of Israel would not look intently at the end of what was fading away. But their minds were hardened; for until this very day at the reading of the old covenant the same veil remains unlifted, because it is removed in Christ. But to this day whenever Moses is read, a veil lies over their heart; but whenever a person turns to the Lord, the veil is taken away. Now the Lord is the Spirit, and where the Spirit of the Lord is, there is liberty. But we all, with unveiled face, beholding as in a mirror the glory of the Lord, are being transformed into the same image from glory to glory, just as from the Lord, the Spirit.

....

You STILL slyingly bypassed the 1 Timothy 1 Scripture, AND the specifics of Galatians 5. Let's see what Paul said there...

Gal 5:16-21
16 This I say then, Walk in the Spirit, and ye shall not fulfil the lust of the flesh.

If we listen to The Holy Spirit given those who believe on Christ Jesus, and obey, then we won't be fulfilling lusts of the flesh. That is VERY SPECIFIC TO OUR REALITY of living in this flesh body here on earth. It ain't... man's philosophy.

17 For the flesh lusteth against the Spirit, and the Spirit against the flesh: and these are contrary the one to the other: so that ye cannot do the things that ye would.

Because our flesh desires tempt us away from what The Spirit desires for us. Hey, Paul makes this so... simple.

18 But if ye be led of the Spirit, ye are not under the law.

Paul gave a condition with that 'IF'. He said IF... we are led of The Spirit, THEN we are not under the law. Does that sound like he said all of God's laws are done away with for the Christian? God forbid, no.

19 Now the works of the flesh are manifest, which are these; Adultery, fornication, uncleanness, lasciviousness,
20 Idolatry, witchcraft, hatred, variance, emulations, wrath, strife, seditions, heresies,
21 Envyings, murders, drunkenness, revellings, and such like: of the which I tell you before, as I have also told you in time past, that they which do such things shall not inherit the kingdom of God.
KJV

And there ya go, Paul even takes time to list works of the flesh which are still... against God's laws. And in that 21st verse notice Paul said those who do those things "shall not inherit the kingdom of God." That's very... serious. Can't play church with his warning there.

Likewise in 1 Timothy 1, Apostle Paul warned those in Christ about breaking God's laws...

1 Tim 1:8-11
8 But we know that the law is good, if a man use it lawfully;
9 Knowing this, that the law is not made for a righteous man, but for the lawless and disobedient, for the ungodly and for sinners, for unholy and profane, for murderers of fathers and murderers of mothers, for manslayers,

A brief, but sharp explanation of the purpose of God's law for the Christian, that's what Paul gave there. The law was made for the ungodly, unrighteous, and the profane. Are those things in God's law of murder and manslayers applied in Christian society, in the courts? YES! How can any believer on Christ speak against that then?

10 For whoremongers, for them that defile themselves with mankind, for menstealers, for liars, for perjured persons, and if there be any other thing that is contrary to sound doctrine;
11 According to the glorious gospel of the blessed God, which was committed to my trust.
KJV

Paul lists even more sins that were first mentioned being against God's laws in The Old Testament.

Then Paul lays down the hammer in verse 11, declaring... that this teaching is part of the "glorious gospel of the blessed God" which was committed to Paul's trust!!!

Don't like it? too bad, all those in Christ Jesus are STILL subject to what Paul said there.

 

[Davy]

I just gave you a heap of scriptures. If you cannot read I would say that is your biggest problem. The scriptures stand against you and Paul fought against your kind. And your kind being called Judaizers

I showed the 1 Timothy 1 and Galatians 5 Scripture long, long ago in a previous post, and only verses around the 'meat' of Galatians 5 have been addressed. The 1 Timothy 1 Scripture you guys keep bypassing.

 

[Grailhunter]

You STILL slyingly bypassed the 1 Timothy 1 Scripture, AND the specifics of Galatians 5. Let's see what Paul said there...

Gal 5:16-21
16 This I say then, Walk in the Spirit, and ye shall not fulfil the lust of the flesh.

If we listen to The Holy Spirit given those who believe on Christ Jesus, and obey, then we won't be fulfilling lusts of the flesh. That is VERY SPECIFIC TO OUR REALITY of living in this flesh body here on earth. It ain't... man's philosophy.

17 For the flesh lusteth against the Spirit, and the Spirit against the flesh: and these are contrary the one to the other: so that ye cannot do the things that ye would.

Because our flesh desires tempt us away from what The Spirit desires for us. Hey, Paul makes this so... simple.

18 But if ye be led of the Spirit, ye are not under the law.

Paul gave a condition with that 'IF'. He said IF... we are led of The Spirit, THEN we are not under the law. Does that sound like he said all of God's laws are done away with for the Christian? God forbid, no.

19 Now the works of the flesh are manifest, which are these; Adultery, fornication, uncleanness, lasciviousness,
20 Idolatry, witchcraft, hatred, variance, emulations, wrath, strife, seditions, heresies,
21 Envyings, murders, drunkenness, revellings, and such like: of the which I tell you before, as I have also told you in time past, that they which do such things shall not inherit the kingdom of God.
KJV

And there ya go, Paul even takes time to list works of the flesh which are still... against God's laws. And in that 21st verse notice Paul said those who do those things "shall not inherit the kingdom of God." That's very... serious. Can't play church with his warning there.

Likewise in 1 Timothy 1, Apostle Paul warned those in Christ about breaking God's laws...

1 Tim 1:8-11
8 But we know that the law is good, if a man use it lawfully;
9 Knowing this, that the law is not made for a righteous man, but for the lawless and disobedient, for the ungodly and for sinners, for unholy and profane, for murderers of fathers and murderers of mothers, for manslayers,

A brief, but sharp explanation of the purpose of God's law for the Christian, that's what Paul gave there. The law was made for the ungodly, unrighteous, and the profane. Are those things in God's law of murder and manslayers applied in Christian society, in the courts? YES! How can any believer on Christ speak against that then?

10 For whoremongers, for them that defile themselves with mankind, for menstealers, for liars, for perjured persons, and if there be any other thing that is contrary to sound doctrine;
11 According to the glorious gospel of the blessed God, which was committed to my trust.
KJV

Paul lists even more sins that were first mentioned being against God's laws in The Old Testament.

Then Paul lays down the hammer in verse 11, declaring... that this teaching is part of the "glorious gospel of the blessed God" which was committed to Paul's trust!!!

Don't like it? too bad, all those in Christ Jesus are STILL subject to what Paul said there.

No you do take things out of context.
If you read the whole books of what you quote from you would know that Paul struggled against those that would want to say that Christians are under the law or pertains to Christians....People like you fought against the Gospel and the ministry of Paul. The whole Christian story stands against you. Even Christ stands against you. If you want to be a Jew....be a Jew.

 

[Grailhunter]

I showed the 1 Timothy 1 and Galatians 5 Scripture long, long ago in a previous post, and only verses around the 'meat' of Galatians 5 have been addressed. The 1 Timothy 1 Scripture you guys keep bypassing.

1st Timothy...so the law is good? It is a matter of perspective. What God commands and allows is good...
Part of the morality of the Mosaic Laws are included in Christianity but not as laws. Christ’s teaching supersedes and include higher Morals.

Most of the 613 Mosaic Laws we do not observe and or are irrelevant to Christians. That is why most are not even mentioned in the New Testament.

And then there are Mosaic Laws that are not compatible with Christian morals at all.

Christians do not sell their daughters to be sex slaves…concubines.

Christians do not have multiple wives.

In war Christians do not kill all that breaths, except the virgins that become sex slaves for them.

Christians do not kill a woman that was raped because she did not scream.

Christians are not required to be circumcised.

Christians do not kill their wives.

Christians do not kill their children.

Judaism is not our religion!

Christ said if you try to mix Judaism and Christianity that it would ruin both of them.
Luke 5:36-39
36 He told them this parable: “No one tears a piece out of a new garment to patch an old one. Otherwise, they will have torn the new garment, and the patch from the new will not match the old. 37 And no one pours new wine into old wineskins. Otherwise, the new wine will burst the skins; the wine will run out and the wineskins will be ruined. 38 No, new wine must be poured into new wineskins. 39 And no one after drinking old wine wants the new, for they say, ‘The old is better.’”

Again you preach against Christ and the Gospel.

 

[Ronald David Bruno]

I showed the 1 Timothy 1 and Galatians 5 Scripture long, long ago in a previous post, and only verses around the 'meat' of Galatians 5 have been addressed. The 1 Timothy 1 Scripture you guys keep bypassing.

Scripture is in harmony. Scripture does not contradict itself.

 

[Ronald David Bruno]

You STILL slyingly bypassed the 1 Timothy 1 Scripture, AND the specifics of Galatians 5. Let's see what Paul said there...

Gal 5:16-21
16 This I say then, Walk in the Spirit, and ye shall not fulfil the lust of the flesh.

If we listen to The Holy Spirit given those who believe on Christ Jesus, and obey, then we won't be fulfilling lusts of the flesh. That is VERY SPECIFIC TO OUR REALITY of living in this flesh body here on earth. It ain't... man's philosophy.

17 For the flesh lusteth against the Spirit, and the Spirit against the flesh: and these are contrary the one to the other: so that ye cannot do the things that ye would.

Because our flesh desires tempt us away from what The Spirit desires for us. Hey, Paul makes this so... simple.

18 But if ye be led of the Spirit, ye are not under the law.

Paul gave a condition with that 'IF'. He said IF... we are led of The Spirit, THEN we are not under the law. Does that sound like he said all of God's laws are done away with for the Christian? God forbid, no.

19 Now the works of the flesh are manifest, which are these; Adultery, fornication, uncleanness, lasciviousness,
20 Idolatry, witchcraft, hatred, variance, emulations, wrath, strife, seditions, heresies,
21 Envyings, murders, drunkenness, revellings, and such like: of the which I tell you before, as I have also told you in time past, that they which do such things shall not inherit the kingdom of God.
KJV

And there ya go, Paul even takes time to list works of the flesh which are still... against God's laws. And in that 21st verse notice Paul said those who do those things "shall not inherit the kingdom of God." That's very... serious. Can't play church with his warning there.

Likewise in 1 Timothy 1, Apostle Paul warned those in Christ about breaking God's laws...

1 Tim 1:8-11
8 But we know that the law is good, if a man use it lawfully;
9 Knowing this, that the law is not made for a righteous man, but for the lawless and disobedient, for the ungodly and for sinners, for unholy and profane, for murderers of fathers and murderers of mothers, for manslayers,

A brief, but sharp explanation of the purpose of God's law for the Christian, that's what Paul gave there. The law was made for the ungodly, unrighteous, and the profane. Are those things in God's law of murder and manslayers applied in Christian society, in the courts? YES! How can any believer on Christ speak against that then?

10 For whoremongers, for them that defile themselves with mankind, for menstealers, for liars, for perjured persons, and if there be any other thing that is contrary to sound doctrine;
11 According to the glorious gospel of the blessed God, which was committed to my trust.
KJV

Paul lists even more sins that were first mentioned being against God's laws in The Old Testament.

Then Paul lays down the hammer in verse 11, declaring... that this teaching is part of the "glorious gospel of the blessed God" which was committed to Paul's trust!!!

Don't like it? too bad, all those in Christ Jesus are STILL subject to what Paul said there.

I agree with this. Why you think that Christ's Law of Love conflicts with these is beyond me. I think you are projecting animosity that someone else fueled onto me. Again, where did I insult you?

 

[Davy]

No you do take things out of context.
If you read the whole books of what you quote from you would know that Paul struggled against those that would want to say that Christians are under the law or pertains to Christians....People like you fought against the Gospel and the ministry of Paul. The whole Christian story stands against you. Even Christ stands against you. If you want to be a Jew....be a Jew.

I haven't taken anything out of context. You refuse to HEED Apostle Paul in those Scriptures I covered, as they are EASY to understand.

It's apparent that some idiot hireling behind a pulpit that God did not call has been telling you that all of God's laws are now dead under Christ, and that Lord Jesus by fulfilling them means dumped them in the garbage can!!! Thinking that Jesus nailed all of God's laws upon His cross is a teaching from the DEVIL! The handwriting of ordinances is only ONE portion of God's laws!

Your false view of The New Covenant goes along with another false view lie that is taught in many of the Mega-Churches today, the false doctrine of 'Once Saved, Always Saved' (OSAS).

That OSAS doctrine is NOT Biblical, simply because it LIES and tells the believer that once they have believed on Jesus Christ and been baptized, that ALL their sins, including those may commit in the FUTURE, are automatically forgiven, and they have no more need ever, to repent to Jesus again of their sins!

Simple little reading of Christ's Words in Revelation 2 & 3 shows His command for the screw-up Churches to REPENT!

So go on, keep think that all of God's laws are now dead. You will be perfectly aligning yourself with the Devil, because that is exactly... what he wants Christian society to think, so the murderers, thieves, and rapists, can run free in the streets!

 

[Davy]

1st Timothy...so the law is good? It is a matter of perspective.

I sense rebellion against Authority in your words. Apostle Paul didn't lie when he said that in 1 Timothy 1 that God's law is good, IF it is used legitimately ("lawfully"). How can that be up for debate for a believing Christian, since what Paul shows the law is made for is for the ungodly, and lawless, etc.?

What if a murderer broke into your home some night, and you had to shoot that one? Would you like it if there was law established that recognized what that murderer did was wrong, and thus subject to the rule of law? Or would you rather believe like an Anarchist and live in a society with no laws, so you wouldn't be protected? Since in a lawless society it would mean anyone who thought you did wrong by shooting in self-defense would come after you, since there would be no law against them doing that, how would you like that? Anarchists love chaos, so does Satan; that's why anarchism is of him.

Many of God's laws from The Old Testament are STILL... established in Christian society today. Satan's servants have been every busy trying to tear them down and remove them, which is why there's much chaos in today's streets. And because of brain-washed politicians, and Communist-Anarchists that hate the Christian west, and want to destroy the Christian nations, that's why those behaviors by Christ's enemies are allowed to continue. When Lord Jesus returns though, that's all going to change, as those wicked will be under His rod of iron, and they ain't gonna' like it.

 

[Davy]

Scripture is in harmony. Scripture does not contradict itself.

Yeah..., and???

There is NO Scripture that contradicts what Apostle Paul taught in 1 Timothy 1 that God's law is GOOD.

So if YOU have a problem with what Paul said there brother, then it means you might want to look deeper in God's Word as to what is actually... written, and not listen to some cat up at a pulpit who teaches men's doctrines instead...

1 Tim 1:6-11
6 From which some having swerved have turned aside unto vain jangling;
7 Desiring to be teachers of the law; understanding neither what they say, nor whereof they affirm.

That's what those who reject Paul's teaching here in this Chapter do, nothing but a bunch of 'vain jangling' desiring to be teachers of the law, but having no understanding of what they say or affirm.


8 But we know that the law is good, if a man use it lawfully;

What? Did Paul just say that 'the law is good, if a man use it lawfully'? You bet he did! Using it "lawfully" means legitimately, like properly applying it as written.


9 Knowing this, that the law is not made for a righteous man, but for the lawless and disobedient, for the ungodly and for sinners, for unholy and profane, for murderers of fathers and murderers of mothers, for manslayers,
10 For whoremongers, for them that defile themselves with mankind, for menstealers, for liars, for perjured persons, and if there be any other thing that is contrary to sound doctrine;

God's law wasn't made for the righteous. That... is what Paul is saying there. It's made for those who do the above sins! What?

Did you know, if a married Christian has sexual intercourse with another besides their spouse outside their marriage, that ... is against God's law made for the lawless and disobedient? It is called Adultery, and it's a punishable offense in most nations in the Christian nations (just not to death anymore). Don't like that you bunch of Anarchists??? Too bad, for that law is in today's society, WHICH comes from God's laws out of The Old Testament by the way; that law against adultery is not likely to be removed off the books of law in today's society any time soon. I've seen Christian brethren lose just about all they ever worked for when they were sued by their spouse and found guilty of committing adultery.

I could go on about every one of those items in red above that Apostle Paul mentions from God's laws. But of course many of my Christian brethren are offended by what Paul says there! probably most because of that "them that defile themselves with mankind", which is about the sin of homosexuality (the word "defile" is a Greek word that means 'sodomite'-no.733).


11 According to the glorious gospel of the blessed God, which was committed to my trust.
KJV

Did you know this teaching here by Apostle Paul is part of The Gospel of The Blessed God??? That don't mean Old Testament doctrine. It means Gospel of Jesus Christ doctrine per The New Covenant.

 

[Davy]

I agree with this. Why you think that Christ's Law of Love conflicts with these is beyond me.

Where did you ever read in one of my posts that I said 1 Timothy 1 conflicts with Christ's Law of Love? You never heard me say that kind of thing.

It's better to ask, how does 1 Timothy 1 AGREE... with Christ's Law of Love? Simple...

The commandment Lord Jesus gave us to love thy neighbor as thyself is from God's law (Leviticus 19). We're told in The New Testament that all of God's laws are summed up in that one commandment to love thy neighbor as thyself (Matthew 22:37-40; Galatians 5:14). But those who commit those sins of unrighteousness that Paul listed in 1 Timothy 1, are they obeying Christ's Law of Love? Obviously not, and THAT IS WHY God's law is good according to Paul. It's because God's law is the great equalizer AGAINST THOSE LAWLESS who refuse to obey Christ's commandment. Remove God's laws that PROTECT the righteous, and you have an evil society, chaos, anarchy, do whatever you think is right in your OWN mind type thinking, evil is good, and good is evil thinking, etc.