What If Real Religious Persecution Came To The U.S.?

[BarneyFife]

Scenario:

A massive, catastrophic disaster brought about by natural causes has struck the earth. Hundreds of millions have been killed or severely injured and every part of the world has been impacted to no small degree. The powers that be are now united, as will often happen under these circumstances, and have reached the consensus that we have angered God to a level we never thought possible, and that some gesture of repentance must be made to Him. Since it has been suggested before by the religious figures of the west so many times and is practical enough to be feasible a national Sunday law is urged and passed, but the disaster and suffering continue, so the rest of the world decides to follow the lead of the U.S. and now the observance of Sunday as a day of rest and worship is world-wide. This "revival" produces very little real reformation. Hearts are not truly changed. It is very quickly apparent that some religious minorities will not cooperate with the new laws and continue to keep a different day of rest and worship. Some people have reported miracles in response to the new laws and a few have even been caught on camera. Yet the minorities remain stubborn in their positions. A call goes out to prescribe severe penalties against the offenders who refuse to violate their consciences, while the dead and dying steadily increase.

Upon what side of the issue would you find yourself?

 

[justbyfaith]

Such a scenario is not very feasible.

Religious freedom is one of the major tenets of the Constitution of the United States.

 

[BarneyFife]

Such a scenario is not very feasible.

Religious freedom is one of the major tenets of the Constitution of the United States.

Which goes out the window under martial law, which would certainly be declared in such a scenario which, in turn, is becoming more feasible every day. Please don't spam the thread with your argumentative, near-sighted judgments.

 

[justbyfaith]

Which goes out the window under martial law, which would certainly be declared in such a scenario which, in turn, is becoming more feasible every day. Please don't spam the thread with your argumentative judgments.

However, there is no point to persecuting those who worship on days other than Sunday from the perspective of any government.

It has no bearing on obedience to the authorities; and therefore the issue would be very well left alone by anyone considering the desire to rule the world.

It would be a source of division from their perspective; and any government desiring to rule the world would be seeking to unify the world in their beliefs so that there would be no dissension. And therefore they would not say anything to those who worship on Saturday; for that would only create division within their system.

 

[amadeus]

@BarnyFife
I would hope that I would not change from the "side" where I strive always to be now, that is... on the Lord's side!

Your "new laws" scenario is not really such a new thing as that in the United States. When I stationed with the US Army at Ft Lewis, Wash. [1965] when visiting for the first time a barroom in the neighboring city of Tacoma I was soon informed about the local 'blue' laws still in place. For one thing bars were not open at all on Sundays and no place sold alcoholic beverages on Sundays.

The letter of the law required that a bar open to the public on Saturday must close at the stroke of midnight with the actual beginning of Sunday. I also learned that once you sat down at a table with your alcoholic beverage [during times when they were open legally] in such a barroom, you could not move to another table or to the bar itself, with the glass or bottle containing the beverage in your own hands. If your really wanted to move, you had to ask an employee of the establishment to move your glass for you. That was the law. Those were old laws left over from another time, but they were still in place and enforceable and enforced. My understanding now is that some years ago those laws were finally taken off of the books in Washington State.

I had come from California where they did not, I believe, have such laws. I don't speak from experience because at the time the legal drinking age in California was 21. The one time I entered a bar prior being of age in California I was asked for my ID and then told to leave. I did not attain to that age [Dec. of 1964] until I was on active duty stationed in South Viet Nam.

There are always enforcers around willing, and perhaps even anxious, to help God out by insisting verbally, or by stronger measures, that people obey God's law. Of course they know, or think they know, those laws better than most, or even all, others.

Men have tried in the past to enforce what they consider to be God's laws. They have legislated them.

Consider the prohibition period [no alcoholic beverages legal] in the United States from the passage of the 18th Amendment to the Constitution in 1919 until its repeal in 1933 by the 21st Amendment. While it may not have been all religious people who instigated the passage of the 18th Amendment, we may be sure that many bearing the label of Christian favored it and made a difference in it becoming the law of the land. But... anyone knowing US history should have no doubt that alcoholic beverages were regularly available in the United States during those years.

Now while you @BarnyFife present it as a supposedly fictitious scenario, I would guess to make a point, actually looking around us it appears that the emphasis today is not much on on Sunday versus Saturday or any other day, but rather away from any pretense of movement toward God at all. Are they having their way in a measure and working or hoping to increase that measure?

If we really do believe in God and His message to men, if we can understand it, I believe that what we should be doing is continuing to walk on top of the water with our eyes ever on Jesus. Probably lots of people bearing the label, Christian, who are not seriously trying walk that walk. Many may even say that Jesus always walked the whole distance for them...

 

[shortangel]

first of all Christians are not extempt from perscuation, Christians were perscuated since the book of Acts, they are not going to be treated very well because they are differnt from the world & it's secular ideas, Christisns must share their faith no matter if they are beaten, shot at, mocked, scoffed at, called names

 

[amigo de christo]

first of all Christians are not extempt from perscuation, Christians were perscuated since the book of Acts, they are not going to be treated very well because they are differnt from the world & it's secular ideas, Christisns must share their faith no matter if they are beaten, shot at, mocked, scoffed at, called names

For not only is it given unto you to BELIEVE on HIS NAME , but to SUFFER for HIS NAME SAKE .
YES INDEED .

 

[BarneyFife]

However, there is no point to persecuting those who worship on days other than Sunday from the perspective of any government.

It has no bearing on obedience to the authorities; and therefore the issue would be very well left alone by anyone considering the desire to rule the world.

It would be a source of division from their perspective; and any government desiring to rule the world would be seeking to unify the world in their beliefs so that there would be no dissension. And therefore they would not say anything to those who worship on Saturday; for that would only create division within their system.

Thank you for participating.

 

[bbyrd009]

unfortunately "sharing their faith" has been turned into "i need to make everyone believe like i do" now i guess

 

[amigo de christo]

However, there is no point to persecuting those who worship on days other than Sunday from the perspective of any government.

It has no bearing on obedience to the authorities; and therefore the issue would be very well left alone by anyone considering the desire to rule the world.

It would be a source of division from their perspective; and any government desiring to rule the world would be seeking to unify the world in their beliefs so that there would be no dissension. And therefore they would not say anything to those who worship on Saturday; for that would only create division within their system.

YES it would . This pope and this world and most all false christains are now uniting under an all inclusive banner .
They wont be persecuting over days . Not at all . THEY will , however , be persecuting the true christians
who wont accept homosexuality or who wont go with this all inclusive flow of accepting muslims , buddists and athiests
as also being in the family and saved . THAT is where men like me are about to be hammered .
I REJOICE IN IT . I REJOICE in whatever comes against me , IF it be for JESUS sake .
PRAISE THE GLORIOUS KING . AS i shun the all inclusive unity lie to hell .
Does that make me sound like a hater . I bet it does to most , even most here .
But i refuse to accept all other religoins as being OF GOD , and i refuse to accept sin , peroid .
WE have a duty to warn folks in error . WE have a duty to point TO JESUS as the ONLY MEANS of salvation .
I aint here for this wicked francis , nor his men in the protestant realm who do his unity work . OH i pray they repent .
Cause i desire none of them in hell . BUT i refuse ten trillion fold to conform to this big UNITY MOVE . ITS all a sham .
WE being decieved under a false love and a false unity . I Will be and have no part of that , no matter the cost .
BUT i wll pray for those who will persecute me , may they be forgiven . SO
do i sound like a hater to you . Be honest . I will not get offended . I hear it all the time anway . Even been called anti christ
and son of perdtion . SO , you feel free to be honest .

 

[BarneyFife]

@BarnyFife
I would hope that I would not change from the "side" where I strive always to be now, that is... on the Lord's side!

Your "new laws" scenario is not really such a new thing as that in the United States. When I stationed with the US Army at Ft Lewis, Wash. [1965] when visiting for the first time a barroom in the neighboring city of Tacoma I was soon informed about the local 'blue' laws still in place. For one thing bars were not open at all on Sundays and no place sold alcoholic beverages on Sundays.

The letter of the law required that a bar open to the public on Saturday must close at the stroke of midnight with the actual beginning of Sunday. I also learned that once you sat down at a table with your alcoholic beverage [during times when they were open legally] in such a barroom, you could not move to another table or to the bar itself, with the glass or bottle containing the beverage in your own hands. If your really wanted to move, you had to ask an employee of the establishment to move your glass for you. That was the law. Those were old laws left over from another time, but they were still in place and enforceable and enforced. My understanding now is that some years ago those laws were finally taken off of the books in Washington State.

I had come from California where they did not, I believe, have such laws. I don't speak from experience because at the time the legal drinking age in California was 21. The one time I entered a bar prior being of age in California I was asked for my ID and then told to leave. I did not attain to that age [Dec. of 1964] until I was on active duty stationed in South Viet Nam.

There are always enforcers around willing, and perhaps even anxious, to help God out by insisting verbally, or by stronger measures, that people obey God's law. Of course they know, or think they know, those laws better than most, or even all, others.

Men have tried in the past to enforce what they consider to be God's laws. They have legislated them.

Consider the prohibition period [no alcoholic beverages legal] in the United States from the passage of the 18th Amendment to the Constitution in 1919 until its repeal in 1933 by the 21st Amendment. While it may not have been all religious people who instigated the passage of the 18th Amendment, we may be sure that many bearing the label of Christian favored it and made a difference in it becoming the law of the land. But... anyone knowing US history doubts that alcoholic beverages were regularly available in the United States during those years.

Now while you @BarnyFife present it as a supposedly fictitious scenario, I would guess to make a point, actually looking around us it appears that the emphasis today is not much on on Sunday versus Saturday or any other day, but rather away from any pretense of movement toward God at all. Are they having their way in a measure and working or hoping to increase that measure?

If we really do believe in God and His message to men, if we can understand it, I believe that what we should be doing continuing to walk on top of the water with our eyes ever on Jesus. Probably lots of people bearing the label, Christian, who are not seriously trying walk that walk. Many may even say that Jesus always walked the whole distance for them...

There were very strict blue laws in Oklahoma when I was stationed there in the Air Force in 1983. However, I am contemplating a possible end-time scenario with totally different circumstances. State and local blue laws in the U.S. are as old as the constitution itself, I believe.

 

[BarneyFife]

YES it would . This pope and this world and most all false christains are now uniting under an all inclusive banner .
They wont be persecuting over days . Not at all . THEY will , however , be persecuting the true christians
who wont accept homosexuality or who wont go with this all inclusive flow of accepting muslims , buddists and athiests
as also being in the family and saved . THAT is where men like me are about to be hammered .
I REJOICE IN IT . I REJOICE in whatever comes against me , IF it be for JESUS sake .
PRAISE THE GLORIOUS KING . AS i shun the all inclusive unity lie to hell .
Does that make me sound like a hater . I bet it does to most , even most here .
But i refuse to accept all other religoins as being OF GOD , and i refuse to accept sin , peroid .
WE have a duty to warn folks in error . WE have a duty to point TO JESUS as the ONLY MEANS of salvation .
I aint here for this wicked francis , nor his men in the protestant realm who do his unity work . OH i pray they repent .
Cause i desire none of them in hell . BUT i refuse ten trillion fold to conform to this big UNITY MOVE . ITS all a sham .
WE being decieved under a false love and a false unity . I Will be and have no part of that , no matter the cost .
BUT i wll pray for those who will persecute me , may they be forgiven . SO
do i sound like a hater to you . Be honest . I will not get offended . I hear it all the time anway . Even been called anti christ
and son of perdtion . SO , you feel free to be honest .

In a scenario such as I have suggested, all of the usual xenophobic concerns would evaporate overnight.

 

[amigo de christo]

There were very strict blue laws in Oklahoma when I was stationed there in the Air Force in 1983. However, I am contemplating a possible end-time scenario with totally different circumstances. State and local blue laws in the U.S. are as old as the constitution itself, I believe.

Your entertaining the wrong scenario my friend .
have you seen this pope , have you listened to it . Its all about unity man .
He would never dare tell a muslim you need to worship on sunday . IT aint gonna happen . ELLEN is wrong as usual .
yall too busy looking a sunday as being the potential mark of the beast .
its got a hold on you barney and its gonna lead you right to the mark . cause you will never see the mark for what it is .
This pope , and these leaders pander to other religoins . IF ANYTHING they might make the day of worship
on saturday to appease both jews and muslims as well . THIS sunday law , mark of the beast , yeah it dont exist .
You know i love you my friend . But its time we get serious and get real .
The greatest threat of delusion rests not on sunday , BUT ON ALL INCLUSIVE UNITY for peace and safety . THERE is your danger
and there IS the deceptoin . Which i see every religoin and faiths now entering into it .
THIS we are ONE . THIS inclusive dung pile . THAT is the danger .

 

[amigo de christo]

In a scenario such as I have suggested, all of the usual xenophobic concerns would evaporate overnight.

You are part correct . BUT its not the way its going down my friend .

 

[amigo de christo]

instead everyone in the name of false love and unity is becoming very accepting of others beliefs and traditions .
THAT IS the danger . We should have never left off that bible .
I know what i say next is gonna cross wires with probably almost everyone on this site .
But this big unity move all your preachers keep focusing on , ITS ALL BAD NEWS under a false love to unify us all
eventually to come together under a one world religoin etc mindset . that is all it is . read it and weep .

 

[justbyfaith]

I aint here for this wicked francis , nor his men in the protestant realm who do his unity work . OH i pray they repent .
Cause i desire none of them in hell . BUT i refuse ten trillion fold to conform to this big UNITY MOVE . ITS all a sham .
WE being decieved under a false love and a false unity . I Will be and have no part of that , no matter the cost .
BUT i wll pray for those who will persecute me , may they be forgiven . SO

Unity at the expense of the truth is not a desirable.

Unity in the truth is (1 Corinthians 1:10, Philippians 2:1-2).

 

[BarneyFife]

Your entertaining the wrong scenario my friend .
have you seen this pope , have you listened to it . Its all about unity man .
He would never dare tell a muslim you need to worship on sunday . IT aint gonna happen . ELLEN is wrong as usual .
yall too busy looking a sunday as being the potential mark of the beast .
its got a hold on you barney and its gonna lead you right to the mark . cause you will never see the mark for what it is .
This pope , and these leaders pander to other religoins . IF ANYTHING they might make the day of worship
on saturday to appease both jews and muslims as well . THIS sunday law , mark of the beast , yeah it dont exist .
You know i love you my friend . But its time we get serious and get real .
The greatest threat of delusion rests not on sunday , BUT ON ALL INCLUSIVE UNITY for peace and safety . THERE is your danger
and there IS the deceptoin . Which i see every religoin and faiths now entering into it .
THIS we are ONE . THIS inclusive dung pile . THAT is the danger .

Thank you for your participation.

 

[amigo de christo]

Unity at the expense of the truth is not a desirable.

Unity in the truth is (1 Corinthians 1:10).

YES . but even the false ones are using that line . we better watch out . IF we sitting in churches
and all them seem to focus on is unity , this love , about being tolerant , about being bridge builders
and so forth . GET OUT of them . they already infected .
IF they over look the pattern JESUS set and the apostels kept . GET OUT .
Gee, where have all the grave ones gone . cause the last time i checked gravity was a part of being any leader .
ALL i see today , is preachers that got so much gel in their hair they could trap a german shepard
and always doing speeches about making anyone who corrects look bad and hateful . Enough with them .
I Fled them along ago . I Wont be looking back . I pray for them . that i will do and if given the change i rebuke them .
But this unity stuff was planned out a long time ago . THEY will never and do never just bring in the end picture .
THEY always start very small . And i have watched folks fall for it for years and then they steadily get worse and worse .
TRUE UNITY is UNITY IN JESUS , which means UNITY IN HIS TEACHINGS , UNITY IN THE TRUTH
UNITY in what the aposetles said and taught .
And yes , i know the difference between simple misundestandings and out right dangerous lies .
As for unity , watch this .
AVOID those who speak contrary to the doctrine which ye have learned . MARK THEM and AVOID THEM . SO much for todays unity .
IT says , oh we all mess up , oh we all make mistakes , LETS just see what we have in common . INSTEAD
of LETS JUST LEARN the BIBLE and LEARN JESUS well . Instead of correcting sin , like homosexuality , its NO lets LOVE THEM TO GOD .
WELL how on earth did that work out . SEEKER Friendly was a lie of satan .
IF it worked so well , HOW COME so many churches are more and more embracing it .
BECAUSE ye cant be unequally yoked is why . HAD they simply continued preaching SOUND doctrine
and then gays or whoever comes in , at least some might have been convicted and repented .
BUT this loving them to GOD , DID not work . INSTEAD in time the churches are accepting it . same as they will this all religions are one stuff .

 

[justbyfaith]

Real unity of the Spirit is in the blood of Jesus.

Even in a physical body, everything is connected and unified by the blood.

We are one bread and one body (I am not talking about the Catholic Church).

In the end, there will be a unified Christianity and there will also be a unified one-world religion that rejects the Cross of Jesus Christ.

 

[CharismaticLady]

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