What Mormons Believe--according to a Former BYU Professor

[Jane_Doe22]

@Jane_Doe22
Thank you for pouring out your heart here. I really try to see the heart of every person here with whom I consider engaging. God does see all of our hearts and sometimes He helps me in this. Sometimes, I am too involved with myself to pay attention. I believe that almost every person on here has a heart containing some good things... I try to remember that so that hopefully I can have just little bit of real understanding before I open my mouth with a yea or a nay. I wonder how many people here consider before posting the option they have to remain silent. God will help us even with that if we simply learn to lean on Him.

Thank you for your wonderful words @amadeus, both here and everywhere on the forum. May God continue to ever be with you.

 

[Jane_Doe22]

If this is what you believe, then why do you talk about Joseph Smith's words or any LDS prophet's words?? Are they God?

You're not being consistent.

Joseph Smith << Christ.

Christ is the foundation of my faith. No one else.

 

[Prayer Warrior]

It's very agreed upon that Lynn Wilder is not God, so it doesn't make any sense to talk about her words at all.

Joseph Smith << Christ.

Then why do you talk about Joseph's Smith's words?

 

[Jane_Doe22]

Then why do you talk about Joseph's Smith's words?

How often do you see me talking about Joseph Smith's words on here?

 

[Prayer Warrior]

How often do you see me talking about Joseph Smith's words on here?

It's very agreed upon that Lynn Wilder is not God, so it doesn't make any sense to talk about her words at all.

I completely agree with you that Lynn is NOT God. She would agree with this statement as well.

You said, "it doesn't make any sense to talk about her [Lynn Wilder's] words at all," not just in this thread, because she is not God.

So, I'm asking, do you talk about Joseph Smith's words "at all"? Do you talk about the LDS prophet's words "at all"? If you don't want to answer this question, that's fine. I already know the answer.
.

 

[Jane_Doe22]

I completely agree with you that Lynn is NOT God. She would agree with this statement as well.

You said, "it doesn't make any sense to talk about her [Lynn Wilder's] words at all," not just in this thread, because she is not God.

So, I'm asking, do you talk about Joseph Smith's words "at all"? Do you talk about the LDS prophet's words "at all"? If you don't want to answer this question, that's fine. I already know the answer.
.

You didn't answer my question: How often do you see me talking about Joseph Smith's words on here?

 

[Harvest 1874]

lol, the version I have is "5For there is one God, and one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus;" (no capitalization of "man").

"The MAN who gave himself" is the particular point here--the anointed Jesus, who finished the giving of himself at Calvary, is the "Mediator between God and men."

It was the “Man” (Greek, Anthropos, the human being, the Messiah (Savior) Jesus who by means of the ransom sacrifice became the mediator between God and men.

"The man Christ Jesus gave himself a ransom (anti-Lutron: corresponding price) for all, to be testified in due time." (1 Tim. 2:6)

Our Lord's offering of himself as a sin-offering and corresponding price for Adam was a complete settlement toward God for the sin of Adam and all those who lost life in him. Jesus, by the payment of the penalty upon Adam, gained the legal right to restore both him and his posterity to life.

"As by a man (Adam) came death, so also by a man (the man Christ Jesus) comes the resurrection of the dead." (1 Cor. 15:21)

The philosophy of the ransom is that all mankind were included in one man's sentence, to the intent that in due time the penalty of sin could be paid for by the one sacrifice.

A perfect man had sinned. Only a perfect man could pay the price. Only a tested, proven, perfect man could be the world's ransom-price.

 

[Harvest 1874]

Yes, you are correct. My bad.

No worries, I assumed it was merely a slip-up

 

[Prayer Warrior]

You didn't answer my question: How often do you see me talking about Joseph Smith's words on here?

Not this again. I asked you first......so there.

 

[Jane_Doe22]

Not this again. I asked you first......so there.

Prayer Warrior: you don't seem to get it-- my focus in not on any human, including Joseph Smith. Hence my lack of quoting and seldom even mentioning him you see here.

My focus is on Christ. Hence my talking about Him , and focusing on Him. Do you want to talk about Christ?

 

[Prayer Warrior]

Prayer Warrior: you don't seem to get it-- my focus in not on any human, including Joseph Smith. Hence my lack of quoting and seldom even mentioning him you see here.

My focus is on Christ. Hence my talking about Him , and focusing on Him. Do you want to talk about Christ?

Your focus has not only been on Christ, and you were not talking about Christ when you called Lynn Wilder an ax-grinder and said that her book was junk.

When I've called you on it, you've ignored my questions and refused to provide proof of your accusations. Then you take the moral high ground and lecture me that we should be talking about Christ.

As a friend of mine likes to say, and the wheels on the bus go round and round.............................
.

 

[Enoch111]

As a friend of mine likes to say, and the wheels on the bus go round and round.............................

I believe it is time to drop this unproductive thread. Going round and round serves no purpose.

 

[Prayer Warrior]

I believe it is time to drop this unproductive thread. Going round and round serves no purpose.

That's your opinion. Why don't you contribute something of substance rather than just giving your opinion? Why don't you show us how Mormon doctrine compares with the Bible?

 

[4Jesus]

"The MAN who gave himself" is the particular point here--the anointed Jesus, who finished the giving of himself at Calvary, is the "Mediator between God and men."

It was the “Man” (Greek, Anthropos, the human being, the Messiah (Savior) Jesus who by means of the ransom sacrifice became the mediator between God and men.

"The man Christ Jesus gave himself a ransom (anti-Lutron: corresponding price) for all, to be testified in due time." (1 Tim. 2:6)

Our Lord's offering of himself as a sin-offering and corresponding price for Adam was a complete settlement toward God for the sin of Adam and all those who lost life in him. Jesus, by the payment of the penalty upon Adam, gained the legal right to restore both him and his posterity to life.

"As by a man (Adam) came death, so also by a man (the man Christ Jesus) comes the resurrection of the dead." (1 Cor. 15:21)

The philosophy of the ransom is that all mankind were included in one man's sentence, to the intent that in due time the penalty of sin could be paid for by the one sacrifice.

A perfect man had sinned. Only a perfect man could pay the price. Only a tested, proven, perfect man could be the world's ransom-price.

This missed my point completely; I wasn't arguing what you're responding to. My point, alone, was the difference in scriptures, that's all (assuming what you had typed from whichever version of the Bible has the capitalized form for "Man" instead of lower case "man" from the KJV). Nothing to do with the meaning of it, within that verse or in the larger meaning of it all.

 

[Enoch111]

That's your opinion. Why don't you contribute something of substance rather than just giving your opinion? Why don't you show us how Mormon doctrine compares with the Bible?

There is a huge difference between Bible Christianity and Mormonism. But you will never convince a committed Mormon to see that. The Church of the LDS believes that it is the true Church, and that it has restored the true Gospel. The Catholic Church says that it is the true Church, so does the Orthodox Church, and so does the SDA denomination. And let's not forget the so-called Restored Church of God (which originated with Herbert Armstrong).

 

[Prayer Warrior]

There is a huge difference between Bible Christianity and Mormonism. But you will never convince a committed Mormon to see that. The Church of the LDS believes that it is the true Church, and that it has restored the true Gospel. The Catholic Church says that it is the true Church, so does the Orthodox Church, and so does the SDA denomination. And let's not forget the so-called Restored Church of God (which originated with Herbert Armstrong).

Hi, Enoch, I haven't talked to you in a while. What have you been up to?

I'm not trying to convince anyone of anything. That's the job of the Holy Spirit. We can present the truth and let the Spirit do His work.

 

[Prayer Warrior]

This missed my point completely; I wasn't arguing what you're responding to. My point, alone, was the difference in scriptures, that's all (assuming what you had typed from whichever version of the Bible has the capitalized form for "Man" instead of lower case "man" from the KJV). Nothing to do with the meaning of it, within that verse or in the larger meaning of it all.

FYI, I use the HCSB a lot and this version capitalizes words used for God. I'd have to look up that verse to see if they capitalized "man," but I don't know what verse it is.

 

[4Jesus]

FYI, I use the HCSB a lot and this version capitalizes words used for God. I'd have to look up that verse to see if they capitalized "man," but I don't know what verse it is.

I wasn't meaning to criticize it; just noting the differences even within scriptural versions of the Bible (or translations/transliterations of the scriptures to be more accurate). I'm sure it was written one way, now we have many ways of something so simple - no wonder the more complex parts get twisted, and the resulting teachings as time goes on.

 

[Prayer Warrior]

I wasn't meaning to criticize it; just noting the differences even within scriptural versions of the Bible (or translations/transliterations of the scriptures to be more accurate). I'm sure it was written one way, now we have many ways of something so simple - no wonder the more complex parts get twisted, and the resulting teachings as time goes on.

Right, I didn't know if you were familiar with the HCSB. I've used several different translations over the years. I like it that the HCSB capitalizes words used for God. It also uses the word Messiah sometimes for Jesus Christ.

 

[4Jesus]

Right, I didn't know if you were familiar with the HCSB. I've used several different translations over the years. I like it that the HCSB capitalizes words used for God. It also uses the word Messiah sometimes for Jesus Christ.

I'm not familiar with it; I'll check it out, thanks!