What OSAS Rejects

[Behold]

if a believer commits suicide they are still saved. .

You really just have no idea what you are talking about.
Your entire personal religion is simply..."let me show you all the things i can make up that i teach as REASONS you can lose your salvation".
You have nothing else to offer.
You are just "works, self effort, and I dont Trust Christ to keep me saved".

Listen,
First, regarding your concept of : "suicide'
Read PAUL., regarding Samson.
Samson killed Himself using 2 Pillars that He pulled down on top of himself to kill himself and a lot of Philistines.
What does the NEW TESTAMENT, say about Samson?
What does Paul say?
You have no idea, till you go and find it now, then pretend you knew !

THE NT says SAMSON is a "HERO OF THE FAITH".
So, does that sound like he's in hell for committing suicide?
See, you know so little about the NT ,and you write so MUCH. Its really just comical, except there is potential that you can harm weak believers with your Religious NONSENSE.

And you'll write more, as you have nothing else to do.

 

[Blue Dragonfly's]

The problem is that you are misreading those verses in 2 Peter 2 because you are not reading and believing 2 Peter 2:1, and 2 Peter 2:14 about how false teachers are those who believe they cannot cease from sin. That is exactly what many Christians today teach. They misinterpret 1 John 1:8 as an excuse that they cannot cease from sin.

It is you who misread 2 Peter 2. It isn't talking about the Saints of God who are irrevocably saved by the grace of God. It's speaking of false teachers and prophets who mislead people to a false faith that ultimately condemns them all.

 

[Bible Highlighter]

Paul teaches that "God made Christ to be sin" for the sin of the World.

Paul this teaches this..... 1 Corinthians 5:19 that clearly says that God was in Christ not counting man's sins against them.

That's actually 2 Corinthians 5:19. 1 Corinthians 5:19 does not exist.

2 Corinthians 5:19 says,
“To wit, that God was in Christ, reconciling the world unto himself, not imputing their trespasses unto them; and hath committed unto us the word of reconciliation.”

This is in context to verse 17 that says,

“Therefore if any man be in Christ, he is a new creature: old things are passed away; behold, all things are become new.”
(2 Corinthians 5:17).

This is in context to verse 15 that says,

“And that he died for all, that they which live should not henceforth live unto themselves, but unto him which died for them, and rose again.”
(2 Corinthians 5:15).

For God's grace teaches us to deny ungodliness and that we should live righteously and godly in this present world (Titus 2:11-12).
Your version of grace teaches that you can sin and still be saved (of which you made yourself abundantly clear on in this post here).

2 Corinthians 13:5 says,
“Examine yourselves, whether ye be in the faith; prove your own selves. Know ye not your own selves, how that Jesus Christ is in you, except ye be reprobates?”

How can you have an assurance that Jesus Christ is in you (Whereby you are not reprobate)?

1 John 2:3-4 says,
“And hereby we do know that we know him, if we keep his commandments.”

In fact, the person who says they know the Lord and they do not keep His commandments (i.e. they sin - see 1 John 3:4), they are a liar and the truth is not in them.

For 1 John 2:4 says,
“He that saith, I know him, and keepeth not his commandments, is a liar, and the truth is not in him.”

Yet, you said that believers who are in sin are taken to Heaven early. As if doing excessive evil is some kind of early reward.
This is why you are deceived.
By holding to this view of sin and salvation: It appears you have no real understanding of basic morality.
Do you know what a sociopath is?

Anyways, what is 2 Corinthians 5:19 saying:
Is it saying we can continue in sin so that grace may abound? Paul says God forbid to that kind of question (See: Romans 6:1-2).

So we must conclude that 2 Corinthians 5:19 is referring to any sins by believers that are confessed and forsaken (i.e. sins put away).
For Proverbs 28:13 says he that confesses and forsakes sin shall have mercy.
1 John 1:9 says if we confess our sins He is faithful and just to forgive us our sins and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness.
1 John 1:7 says if we walk in the light as He is in the light, we have fellowship with one another and the blood of Jesus Christ cleanses us from all sin.

Walking in the light = Loving your brother according to the indirect wording in 1 John 2:9-11.
So you have to love your brother in order for the blood of Jesus to continue to cleanse you from all sin.
For if you hate your brother, you are like a murderer and no murderer has eternal life abiding in him (1 John 3:15).
So no. Jesus does not take away your future sins giving you a license to sin. Jude 1:4 warns against turning God's grace into a license for immorality. That's what your belief in God's grace is. A license for immorality. You don't have to worry about how you live as a part of God's grace.

Isaiah 26:10 (NKJV) says,
“Let grace be shown to the wicked, Yet he will not learn righteousness; In the land of uprightness he will deal unjustly, And will not behold the majesty of the LORD.”

Paul then teaches in Romans 4:8, that God does not charge sin to the Born again.

So, its not "do you sin" or not, its..... those 2 verses and what they TEACH.

Romans 4:8 says,
“Blessed is the man to whom the Lord will not impute sin.”

This is referring to Initial Salvation because we can see in Romans 4:9-12 the order of how Abraham first believed God involving the Promise of how his descendants would be numbered like the stars of Heaven, and it was accounted to him as righteousness for his believing God on that point before he was circumcised (Which is a work). Granted, we are not under circumcision. That was for Abraham and later for those who were under the Law of Moses. But if Abraham did not later become circumcised, he would have been cut off from his people and would have broken God's covenant (See: Genesis 17:14). Abraham is paralleling Abraham's belief before works as a model of how we need to first be saved by God's grace in our Initial Salvation.

“For whosoever shall call upon the name of the Lord shall be saved.” (Romans 10:13).

But this does not mean we are forever locked into being saved.

For we are told:

“...We are made partakers of Christ, if we hold the beginning of our confidence stedfast unto the end.” (Hebrews 3:13-14).

"Keep yourselves in the love of God, looking for the mercy of our Lord Jesus Christ unto eternal life." (Jude 1:21).

"...be thou faithful unto death, and I will give thee a crown of life." (Revelation 2:10).​

We are told to:

1. Continue in the grace of God (Acts of the Apostles 13:43).
   
   
2. Continue in the faith (Acts of the Apostles 14:22) (Colossians 1:23).
   
   
3. Continue in his goodness, otherwise we can be cut off (just like the Jews were cut off) (Romans 11:21-22).

But of course you don't believe these verses.

Read them carefully, as its really obvious that you have not read them since '1993,

First, actually, it was in 1992 that I received Jesus Christ as my Savior, and I started to read and study the Bible, and it was not 1993.
Second, I have read these two verses since that time. Your implying that it is obvious I have not read these two verses since 1993 (Which is not true). So this would be a false accusation.

and if you have, you have not understood them, or believed them.

Now you contradict yourself by saying I may have read them. So which is it? Make up your mind.
Anyways, I do believe and understand 2 Corinthians 5:19, and Romans 4:8 just fine.
I just don't take your Diplomatic immunity interpretation or your sin and still be saved interpretation upon these two verses that is clearly false (See again Titus 2:11-12, Romans 6:1-2, Jude 1:4).

 

[Bible Highlighter]

It is you who misread 2 Peter 2. It isn't talking about the Saints of God who are irrevocably saved by the grace of God. It's speaking of false teachers and prophets who mislead people to a false faith that ultimately condemns them all.

Logic dictates that if false teachers have certain characteristics that make them false teachers (like how they cannot cease from sin), then we must conclude that no believer or saint would ever truly teach that they cannot cease from sin. Yet, that is what we see going on today in Christianity. We see them misuse 1 John 1:8 as saying that they cannot cease from sin. Why I even have to tell you this is beyond me.

 

[Bible Highlighter]

You really just have no idea what you are talking about.
Your entire personal religion is simply..."let me show you all the things i can make up that i teach as REASONS you can lose your salvation".
You have nothing else to offer.
You are just "works, self effort, and I dont Trust Christ to keep me saved".

Listen,
First, regarding your concept of : "suicide'
Read PAUL., regarding Samson.
Samson killed Himself using 2 Pillars that He pulled down on top of himself to kill himself and a lot of Philistines.
What does the NEW TESTAMENT, say about Samson?
What does Paul say?
You have no idea, till you go and find it now, then pretend you knew !

THE NT says SAMSON is a "HERO OF THE FAITH".
So, does that sound like he's in hell for committing suicide?
See, you know so little about the NT ,and you write so MUCH. Its really just comical, except there is potential that you can harm weak believers with your Religious NONSENSE.

And you'll write more, as you have nothing else to do.

And you abuse God's grace seeing everything wrong as a license to sin or as some kind of diplomatic immunity.

 

[Blue Dragonfly's]

Q

I quote an abundance of scripture.

You’re ire is really directed at the scriptures I quote. Don’t you wish those scriptures never existed?

I try to PREVENT men from being cast into the lake of fire by means of fairytale doctrines like ONCE SAVED ALWAYS SAVED.

I always talk about the truth of scripture.

Logic dictates that if false teachers have certain characteristics that make them false teachers (like how they cannot cease from sin), then we must conclude that no believer or saint would ever truly teach that they cannot cease from sin. Yet, that is what we see going on today in Christianity. We see them misuse 1 John 1:8 as saying that they cannot cease from sin. Why I even have to tell you this is beyond me.

Much is beyond you. And shall continue to be when you ignore God's word and prefer your own imagining off what it means to know Christ.

Imo, atheists and JW's should never be allowed on a Christian forum.

 

[Michiah-Imla]

Much is beyond you. And shall continue to be when you ignore God's word and prefer your own imagining off what it means to know Christ.

What is “beyond me”?

I read and direct my path according to the Bible. I show the scriptures that expose falsehoods. But the problem is that many have been trained away from the plain surface readings of the holy scriptures into cult readings. @mailmandan tried that gaslighting tactic on me recently.

Imo, atheists and JW's should never be allowed on a Christian forum.

I don’t mind.

I don’t tire of exposing heretics and cultists and atheists.

 

[Bible Highlighter]

Much is beyond you. And shall continue to be when you ignore God's word and prefer your own imagining off what it means to know Christ.

If so, then help me to understand. Did not Jesus even say we are to love our enemies? Is it really beyond explaining?

Imo, atheists and JW's should never be allowed on a Christian forum.

I am happy to be a Bible Alone believing Christian who believes in the Trinity.

As for whether atheists and JW’s should be allowed on the forums: Well, I believe that atheists and JW’s could be allowed an outreach forum under an entirely different name. But I agree that atheists and JW’s should never be involved on a Christian forum discussion that is among Bible Alone Christians who just want to discuss the doctrines in the Bible. Believers want to also fellowship sometimes and that becomes problematic if atheists and JW’s are constantly disrupting our discussion of the Bible.

 

[Blue Dragonfly's]

What is “beyond me”?

I read and direct my path according to the Bible. I show the scriptures that expose falsehoods. But the problem is that many have been trained away from the plain surface readings of the holy scriptures into cult readings. @mailmandan tried that gaslighting tactic on me recently.



I don’t mind.

I don’t tire of exposing heretics and cultists and atheists.

If so, then help me to understand. Did not Jesus even say we are to love our enemies? Is it really beyond explaining?



I am happy to be a Bible Alone believing Christian who believes in the Trinity.

As for whether atheists and JW’s should be allowed on the forums: Well, I believe that atheists and JW’s could be allowed an outreach forum under an entirely different name. But I agree that atheists and JW’s should never be involved on a Christian forum discussion that is among Bible Alone Christians who just want to discuss the doctrines in the Bible. Believers want to also fellowship sometimes and that becomes problematic if atheists and JW’s are constantly disrupting our discussion of the Bible.

''You do not have His word abiding in you, for you do not believe Him whom He sent.''
John 5:38

 

[Bible Highlighter]

''You do not have His word abiding in you, for you do not believe Him whom He sent.''
John 5:38

I believe Jesus as my Savior just fine. But to believe in Jesus is more than just believing in Him for your salvation. It’s believing everything Jesus taught, said, and did, too. For example: Do you believe Jesus’s words when He said, sin no more? (See: John 5:14) (John 8:11).

 

[Michiah-Imla]

''You do not have His word abiding in you, for you do not believe Him whom He sent.''
John 5:38

I believe in God and in Christ.

What are you on about?

 

[Bible Highlighter]

''You do not have His word abiding in you, for you do not believe Him whom He sent.''
John 5:38

And the context:

“But if ye believe not his writings, how shall ye believe my words?” (John 5:47).

Jesus wants us to believe His words and not just believe in Him.

In John 15: Jesus says, “If ye abide in me, and my words abide in you, ye shall ask what ye will, and it shall be done unto you.” (John 15:7).

Jesus says, “If ye keep my commandments, ye shall abide in my love; even as I have kept my Father's commandments, and abide in his love.” (John 15:10).

Are you for keeping the commandments of Jesus in order to abide in His love?

I don’t get that impression from you that we have to obey the commands of Jesus to abide in His love.

 

[Robert Gwin]

"Christ IN YOU......the hope of Glory".

Paul said...>"it is not i who lives,...... but CHRIST IN ME"..

Do you see that?
WAKE UP.
Get out of your cult, while you have time.

Jesus does not possess like demons do Be, in fact he is in heaven right now. Since Jesus is not "in" individuals what did Paul literally mean sir?

Wouldn't you say that Paul meant that he wholeheartedly dedicated himself to being obedient to the teachings of Christ? I know I do my utmost to be obedient to his teachings, yet I fully realize that he resides in heaven where the Bible teaches he went. I further realize that he is going to return soon as well, perhaps you might even observe the fulfillment of 1 Thes 4:17 in your lifetime.

 

[Blue Dragonfly's]

You[ don't believe Christians are indwelt by God's holy spirit?
[QUOTES="Robert Gwin, post: 1407503, member: 10159"]Jesus does not possess like demons do Be, in fact he is in heaven right now. Since Jesus is not "in" individuals what did Paul literally mean sir?

Wouldn't you say that Paul meant that he wholeheartedly dedicated himself to being obedient to the teachings of Christ? I know I do my utmost to be obedient to his teachings, yet I fully realize that he resides in heaven where the Bible teaches he went. I further realize that he is going to return soon as well, perhaps you might even observe the fulfillment of 1 Thes 4:17 in your lifetime.[/QUOTE]

 

[robert derrick]

What the heck is OSAS Rob?

OSAS is unconditional salvation based on faith alone.

So long as a person believes they are saved, then they are saved, no matter what they may be doing at the time, whether good or evil.

There are many wonderfully lying teachings around it, but the cornerstone is that they believe they are not condemned, when doing the same work of the flesh as any unbeliever.

It's the soul separation theology, that says the body is still sinning, but not the soul that would rather not, but just can't stop that ol' rascally body from doing it's own thing from time to time.

Any person on earth that thinks they are not condemned as others, when doing the same thing as another, has no truth nor soundness of mind in them.

That's why I don't argue with them anymore, but just keep exposing their new self-justifying lies they keep coming up with. It's all about rejecting James 2:24 as written.

Just like I don't argue with people anymore who think the word was not God.

Once someone is willing to do away with simply written Scripture, then there only remains an endless debate about all other Scriptures down the line.

If we can't agree on something simple, like a man is justified by works, and not by faith only, or the Word was God, then there's no point in arguing about it.

 

[Robert Gwin]

OSAS is unconditional salvation based on faith alone.

So long as a person believes they are saved, then they are saved, no matter what they may be doing at the time, whether good or evil.

There are many wonderfully lying teachings around it, but the cornerstone is that they believe they are not condemned, when doing the same work of the flesh as any unbeliever.

It's the soul separation theology, that says the body is still sinning, but not the soul that would rather not, but just can't stop that ol' rascally body from doing it's own thing from time to time.

Any person on earth that thinks they are not condemned as others, when doing the same thing as another, has no truth nor soundness of mind in them.

That's why I don't argue with them anymore, but just keep exposing their new self-justifying lies they keep coming up with. It's all about rejecting James 2:24 as written.

Just like I don't argue with people anymore who think the word was not God.

Once someone is willing to do away with simply written Scripture, then there only remains an endless debate about all other Scriptures down the line.

If we can't agree on something simple, like a man is justified by works, and not by faith only, or the Word was God, then there's no point in arguing about it.

The Word is Jesus sir, he is God's son, not God. But to answer one who thinks they are saved I simply quote Mat 24:13, and they either believe it or not. Frankly I take Jesus' word over others any day of the week, if one cannot believe him, who can we believe?