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Featured When is Judgment day ?

Discussion in 'Christian Debate Forum' started by Bible_Gazer, Feb 7, 2020.

  1. DNB

    DNB Well-Known Member

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    Don't you know that "THE" Millenium is fictional work ofReligion??
    You have yet to compare 2 Peter 3:8 with 2 Peter 3:9 of why it is that a thousand years is as a day, and a day is a thousand years. All that is saying is that God has declared an unlimited amount of time of His patience and longsuffering for all to come to repentance.
    [8] But, beloved, be not ignorant of this one thing, that one day is with the Lord as a thousand years, and a thousand years as one day.
    > WHY? See verse 9
    [9] The Lord is not slack concerning his promise, as some men count slackness; but is longsuffering to us-ward, not willing that any should perish, but that all should come to repentance.
    In all of the Bible, 2 Peter 3:8 is the ONLY reference for the description of "a thousand years" in Rev.
    We best find out what it really is, and what's involved, and not what Religion is telling us.

    The symbolic 1000 years Is NOW! Its God's Age of His Grace... NOW![/QUOTE]
    You took 2 Peter 3:8-9 completely out of context. He is solely and exclusively talking about having patience, nothing more.
     
  2. Taken

    Taken Well-Known Member

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  3. Taken

    Taken Well-Known Member

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    Yes that, breathing air, is simple, minds can figure that out straight away, and study of science can reveal, a man's body has the same elements of the Earth from which body was formed, By God, and those same Earthly elements sustain a man's body.

    On the Spiritual side, we gather knowledge of our body from Gods Word...it is the BLOOD that is a body's Life. Drain the blood, the body will die. All body's will die...because all bodys are sentenced to die, by God.

    Gen 9
    [4] But flesh with the life thereof, which is the bloodthereof, shall ye not eat.
    [5] And surely your blood of your lives will I require; at the hand of every beast will I require it, and at the hand of man; at the hand of every man's brother will I require the life of man.

    Adam was created in Gods Likeness and Image...Adam sinned, thereafter, All Body's are created in Adams likeness and Image, born of a corrupt mans, corrupt seed.

    Gen 1
    [26] And God said, Let us make man in our image, after our likeness:

    Gen1
    27] So God created man in his own image, in the image of God created he him; male and female created he them.

    Gen 2
    [16] And the LORD God commanded the man, saying, Of every tree of the garden thou mayest freely eat:
    [17] But of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil, thou shalt not eat of it: for in the day that thou eatest thereof thou shalt surely die.

    Whoops... they Ate what was forbidden!

    Gen 5
    [3] And Adam lived an hundred and thirty years, and begat a son in his own likeness, after his image; and called his name Seth:

    Humm, in Adams image and likeness!

    Jesus brought the Good News of How a man CAN become in Gods likeness and Image, once again!

    The whole point of being forgiven, saving of the soul, and quickening (Born Again) of the spirit, is to become in Gods likeness and image!

    I have said nothing that is not taught in Gods Doctrine...and given you verses that you can go and read and study for yourself.

    You calling Scripture foolishness and fabrication Is egregious.

    Moses didn't require extensive knowledge in science. Their belief and faith depended on hearing the Law and doing it.

    A fairly new creation of men without history of many men before them...not much different than a child, whose knowledge is little, subject to mommy and daddy's rules, whether or not the have learned why. Doesn't make them dumb...but rather immature in not knowing what they have not yet learned.

    God was not distant...God guided Moses...
    While many details were kept secret from early mankind...(as I would presume you kept many things secret from your own young children) They have been revealed by Christ Jesus.
     
  4. Earburner

    Earburner Well-Known Member

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    All I gave to you to look and compare was the breath of life in Adam (Genesis 2), in comparison to the breath of life in animals (Genesis 7) and look what you had to do to explain it from the "religious" perspective! Its a quagmire of concepts glued together, saying nothing to help anyone to understand. All you concluded was that both man and animals have the Eternal Spirit of God within them.
    Now I ask you what's wrong with that picture?
    Therefore, in turn, lets examine the truth about everyone's animal like existenceof a living soul-nephesh in the Hebrew- animal life.

    My explanation is: "the breath of life" IS OXYGEN, and thats all it is!! Its not Moses fault that he didn't know what the gaseous elements were!!
    But, for the sake of you attempting to avoid it, here are some details, that oppose your "religious" formula:

    As for 1 Kings 17:21-22, what is resuscitation?
    Most definitely the child wasn't resurrected from being dead. He was only resuscitated, being brought back to life, by his breathing and a beating heart again, thereby regaining consciousness through his fleshly brain, being fed by oxygenated blood.

    And for those who are comatose, their state of consciouness (soul) is temporarily shut down, while their body remains alive. So you might say they are "brain dead", but there body is still alive. That would be a body, without an operative "soul" (brain).

    So now, even more so, what shall we say about "still born births"?
    If the heart isn't pumping blood, after birth, the child is technically and clinically dead, because all of the cells in it's organs and brain never recieved oxygenated blood, to feed its fleshly organs in order to be alive, nor its breathing ability to become conscious as a living soul.

    But, if you continue assuming as you do, that God GAVE man a living soul, then you are going to have to say that He did the SAME for all animal life, that breathes AIR!

    And if so, then God being Eternally a Spirit, according to your belief system, animals also were given by God, a living soul that is eternal.
    Since you do conclude that is so for man, there is no way out of it, by you saying that animals don't, because it says in Genesis 7[22] All in whose nostrils was the breath of life, of all that was in the dry land, died.
    > And it also says the same for man in
    Genesis 2[7] And the LORD God formed man of the dust of the ground, and breathed into his nostrils the breath of life; and man became a living soul.

    So, which is the truth of our physical reality?
    All, being both animals and man, were given an eternal living soul, or is it rather everything that I've said, of all recieving nothing of a soul, except to simply breathe Oxygen?
     
  5. Earburner

    Earburner Well-Known Member

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    A body can pump blood by the heart all day long, but if their is NO OXYGEN in the blood, that body shall remain a DEAD soul!!

    You DO know the truth,...Oxygen is the BREATH of life!! You are just fighting hard against it, for fear of accepting it, because it will up end all of your "religious" indoctrination.
     
  6. Taken

    Taken Well-Known Member

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    Simple...
    1) twice you were expressly told in elementary fashion...
    Receiving Gods Breath is receiving Life from God...NOT receiving Gods Spirit...

    2) you obviously cannot comprehend a blunt statement, evidenced by your complete twisting of what I said.

    3) ^ false.

    Inhaled air is by volume 78.08% nitrogen, (20.95% oxygen ) and small amounts of other gasses including argon, carbon dio

    4)
    1kings 17:
    [17] And it came to pass after these things, that the son of the woman, the mistress of the house, fell sick; and his sickness was so sore, that there was no breath left in him.
    [18] And she said unto Elijah, What have I to do with thee, O thou man of God? art thou come unto me to call my sin to remembrance, and to slay my son?
    [19] And he said unto her, Give me thy son. And he took him out of her bosom, and carried him up into a loft, where he abode, and laid him upon his own bed.
    [20] And he cried unto the LORD, and said, O LORD my God, hast thou also brought evil upon the widow with whom I sojourn, by slaying her son?
    [21] And he stretched himself upon the child three times, and cried unto the LORD, and said, O LORD my God, I pray thee, let this child's soul come into him again.
    [22] And the LORD heard the voice of Elijah; and the soul of the child came into him again, and he revived.
    ^ approved of God DENIED of Earburner.

    5) ^ Earburner, not present, but from a distance of some 5,000 years later...knows the Scripture is false!

    Already did.

    Uh huh, already said that.

    Animals do not Sin.

    Irrelevant point...I said no such thing!

    Are you completely unaware...people AND animals ON DRY LAND ALL DIED...
    People and Animals in the Ark DID NOT DIE?

    TRUTH? You are incapable of receiving Spiritual truths, and faulty on your natural truths.

    Breathing only oxygen...that you insist revived a boy...would kill a person.

    Glory to God,
    Taken
     
  7. Taken

    Taken Well-Known Member

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    Yet again you reveal you do not comprehend what is saide to you.

    What are you speaking about NO OXYGEN?

    Clearly and specifically I mentioned the Earth's Elements sustaining a person.

    FYI:
    Oxygen is found all around us. It is one of the most important ELEMENTS on planet Earth. Oxygen makes up around 21% of the Earth's atmosphere and 50% of the mass of the Earth's crust.

    Yes.

    No.

    I have chosen to accept the Truth of my God.

    You however have rejected the Truth of God, and proved your common knowledge is a fail.

    Nah...I am not in fear.

    Glory to God,
    Taken
     
  8. quietthinker

    quietthinker Well-Known Member

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    The dead just and unjust are dead, or asleep using scriptural language, they are nowhere in literal terms, their person does not exist as anything anywhere....their bodies have gone back to the earth from which it was taken and the life force or the spirit back to God who gave it...there is no conscious entity in any form.....they are awaiting one of the two resurrections for their reward.

    The first resurrection will occur when Jesus returns and calls all his people from all ages from the grave. They will rise with glorified bodies to meet their Lord in the air and return to heaven with him. All traces of diminishment are left in the grave. There will however be a resurrection of certain wicked like those who where involved in his crucifixion. These will be raised as they went into the grave....old, diseased, sinful with the same antagonistic attitude towards God they died with.
    The living wicked will freak out and die from the brightness of his coming.

    For the next 1000 years the earth will be desolate (uninhabitable with no humans)....a ruined unrecognisable mess. It will be the confine of Lucifer and his angles with no one to temp but to reflect on the ruin his way of doing things has caused. All the wicked (humans) will be dead.
    The righteous will be in heaven with Jesus for that 1000 year period (millennium)....they will be busy. (more to say about this)

    After the thousand years the the New Jerusalem shinning brighter than the Sun will come down from heaven with Jesus and all his people and settle on the Earth in a place prepared by God.
    The wicked dead will be resurrected, an innumerable throng from all ages... this is the second resurrection. Satan will be animated and persuade them that it was by his power they have been brought to life.
    Satan will convince the resurrected wicked that this jewel (The New Jerusalem) can be gotten by arguing it is their right to have and they have the overwhelming numbers to take it. They will attempt to take it by force but God will intervene and send fire from heaven. This fire will destroy all sin and sinners, Satan and his angels included and will purify the earth from all its works...'the elements will melt with fervent heat'.....this is the lake of fire

    Sin and sinners eradicated and God will recreate the earth in breathtaking splendour. It will be given to all God's people (Israel) as their inheritance. No more will sin raise its ugly head.

    The closing chapters of Revelation lay this out.

    The expression 'The Kingdom of God' refers to the principle with which God governs the Universe. This principle is willingly embraced and embedded in all his resurrected people....it is the principle which Jesus witnessed to in his sojourn here....the principle of truth

    There is more detail to this story.....this is a short form.
     
    Last edited: Feb 14, 2020
  9. quietthinker

    quietthinker Well-Known Member

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    1. All God's people pre and post the resurrection will receive their reward at their respective resurrection.
    2. It is clear from scripture that at least Elijah, Enoch, and Moses are in a glorified state in heaven. Who knows, perhaps there are others, for example those resurrected when Jesus rose, however, as far as I understand the scripture is silent on this.
     
    Last edited: Feb 14, 2020
  10. Earburner

    Earburner Well-Known Member

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    First off, the "heart" that pumps our oxygenated blood doesn't think one iota, nor does it have any intentions.
    Secondly, our carnal mind is our fleshly brain, and for sure, if that does not get any oxygenated blood, there will be no thoughts or intentions at all, because it will shut down and die, both consciously and subconsciously! And you know (should know) that soon after that, the other internal organs will also shut down, and then the whole body dies altogether.
    Therefore, in their LAST inhale/exhale of oxygen/carbon dioxide (the breath of life, as per Mose's limited understanding) it will be the END of living, for that living soul, of which is the SAME for ALL animals that BREATHE AIR.

    Surely you DO KNOW this, but you are in denial, trying to hang onto your pet false doctrines.
     
  11. Earburner

    Earburner Well-Known Member

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    1. I agree 100%
    2. As the scripture I posted, NO MAN ascended into Heaven before Jesus. However, it could be that Enoch and Elijah were one of the "many saints" that arose from their graves, and seen by many, AFTER Jesus was resurrected. Prior to that, no one ascended into Heaven, including Enoch and Elijah.

    Either Jesus' words about that are authoritive, or they are not! If not, then all of His words are questionable. I prefer to believe that His comment about that is truthful, and applies to Enoch and Elijah also.
     
  12. Earburner

    Earburner Well-Known Member

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    From the KJV, can you provide the scriptures that say "the second resurrection" ?
     
  13. Bible_Gazer

    Bible_Gazer Active Member

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    John 6:47-50
    47 Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that believeth on me hath everlasting life.
    48 I am that bread of life.
    49 Your fathers did eat manna in the wilderness, and are dead.
    50 This is the bread which cometh down from heaven, that a man may eat thereof, and not die.

    Two different conditions here
    1. OT saints died that ate manna
    2. Jesus the new bread, now if someone would eat of it they would not die

    If Enoch or Elijah or Moses is in heaven, why would it be hard to believe that other people made it,
    isn't that what its about. Jesus came to abolish death for the soul.
    Somebody is going to get a new body from heaven not from the Earth. 2Cor.5:1-2

    Judgment starts at church or when we first here the gospel.

    Was Ananias, with Sapphira his wife, sold a possession, and lied and died. They were believers.
    Were they not judged then by God to put his wrath on them ? To me that is final.



     
  14. Taken

    Taken Well-Known Member

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    For some, (like you) that is true; it's called a hardened heart...


    I have already stated, the elements of the Earth sustain the Blood LIFE of the body...

    Already stated BLOOD LIFE of the Body SHALL DIE.

    Surely I know what I have already stated:

    The Body IS: out of the Earth.
    The Body IS: out of the same ELEMENTS as the Earth.
    The LIFE of the Body IS: it's BLOOD.
    The LIFE of the Body IS: sustained BY the ELEMENTS of the Earth.

    Pretending you are telling me News about Oxygen and a body breathing...is not news.
    Ogygen IS an Element of the Earth!

    The POINT you missed...is: an independent body iS NOT brought into its OWN state of Living...simply because a Body is Formed.
    Bringing a Body into a state OF Living IS CALLED "QUICKENING".

    "Spiritual Quickening", IS PRECISELY God Himself bringing A Body, into a Living state.
    It is precisely God giving, the Thing, (in this case, the Body), LIFE from God, in this case, that Life IS a soul.

    The living soul does not maintain the Body's Life...the living Soul brings the body, and its life, blood, into a living state.

    The elements of the Earth, (were designed to) maintain the body's Life. (Oxygen, hydrogen, plants, minerals...etc. etc, to keep the Body in a Living state).

    (Which BTW, man's intervention, is daily corrupting), And causing millions of Body's a prolonged Diseased BODILY DEATH.)

    Regardless, all LIFE of a body Shall DIE.

    Gods Life NEVER Dies...nor does Gods Life remain in a DEAD rotting corpse.

    God Is the God OF the Living, all bodies shall die, and all living souls shall depart the dying body.

    If you accepted the Lords Offer that He keep your soul with Him, after your BODILY DEATH...then He Will.

    If you passed on His Offer, Then He has prepared a waiting place for your living soul, Separated from and Without God.

    If you are ignorant of these facts...(Which you are not, because you have been told) or reject to believe the facts...your expectation can be, separation of your living soul, from your dead body, and separation of your living soul from God, in the place God has prepared, for living souls, departed out of dying body's, that are Not With Him.

    You appear to be in jeopardy...by your own admission you fail to have thoughts in your Heart...which is precisely the place where a man's QUICKENEN spirit IS, and Gods Spirit dwells, feeding The man, Gods Understanding!

    Uh oh!

    Glory to God,
    Taken
     
  15. Taken

    Taken Well-Known Member

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    Fiction, symbolic, now? LOL.
     
  16. Earburner

    Earburner Well-Known Member

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    In all of your replies, to the segments you chose to extract out of my context, I will reply in general.
    1. My emphasis on Oxygen was necessary to make it clear that ALL of our organs, tissue etc. require Oxygen to continue living. Any other gases of the "air" we breathe, is understood to be present, but alone by themselves DO NOT sustain life, thus my focus on only Oxygen, the breath of life.

    2. Of course all of the earths elements are required to enable our flesh, organs etc. to be nourished, but to keep them alive, and in an active function of replenishing and replacement of dieing and dead cells, with new cells, Oxygen, the breath of life, is required.

    3. It is apparent that you firmly believe that both man and animal, who breathe Oxygenated "air", the breath of life, were given by God an Eternal living soul. Therefore according to your understanding, everything that died, that once had the breath of life, Oxygenated "air", are still alive somewhere, in some form of eternal existence.

    I however, no longer believe in that vague and false, religious viewpoint. Does that mean that I oppose God and the scriptures? Not in the least bit!!

    In fact, by learning more clearly about our mutual destiny of physical life and physical death, the scriptures are now a 1000 times more enhanced to me, and now provide a much clearer understanding than ever before, of what has really been done by God, through Christ for our Eternal salvation.

    Therefore, I have become more enlightened by His Spirit, in "His [own] thoughts and ways" about His own words, and not what any "religious institution" shall conjure up and feed me. Isaiah 55:8-9, John 13:16.

    You would do well to review and learn the depth of truth that is known today, of what exactly the breath of life really is, that Moses was so very lacking in trying to describe!
    Here is a site that will get you started!
    | CK-12 Foundation
     
  17. Taken

    Taken Well-Known Member

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    No,
    You should have understood, since I made it Expressly Clear; and provided validating Scripture...
    "The Breath of Life", IS Life from out of God, Given Into a Body.

    Gen 2:
    [7]...the LORD God ... breathed into ..."his nostrils" the breath of life;

    You may believe Gods Breath is Oxygen...
    But I have no reason to make that assumption.

    No. That is your understanding, not mine.

    You speak FOR me, what I did not claim, repeatedly say that is your belief, then say that is no longer your belief...

    You are having a hard enough time trying to explain your own understanding....you would do well to not try and explain what I believe and understand...
     
  18. quietthinker

    quietthinker Well-Known Member

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    The term 'the second resurrection' is not used, it is however referenced by the context.


    John 5:28-29
    Do not marvel at this, for an hour is coming when all who are in the tombs will hear his voice and come out, those who have done good to the resurrection of life, and those who have done evil to the resurrection of judgment.

    Daniel 12:2
    And many of those who sleep in the dust of the earth shall awake, some to everlasting life, and some to shame and everlasting contempt.

    Revelation 20:1-15
    Then I saw an angel coming down from heaven, holding in his hand the key to the bottomless pit and a great chain. And he seized the dragon, that ancient serpent, who is the devil and Satan, and bound him for a thousand years, and threw him into the pit, and shut it and sealed it over him, so that he might not deceive the nations any longer, until the thousand years were ended. After that he must be released for a little while. Then I saw thrones, and seated on them were those to whom the authority to judge was committed. Also I saw the souls of those who had been beheaded for the testimony of Jesus and for the word of God, and those who had not worshiped the beast or its image and had not received its mark on their foreheads or their hands. They came to life and reigned with Christ for a thousand years. The rest of the dead did not come to life until the thousand years were ended. This is the first resurrection. Blessed and holy is the one who shares in the first resurrection! Over such the second death has no power, but they will be priests of God and of Christ, and they will reign with him for a thousand years.
     
  19. Earburner

    Earburner Well-Known Member

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    So then, according to your belief, God did give man a living soul, except that a living soul is not eternal in existence in any way.
    Am I now saying it correctly?
     
  20. Earburner

    Earburner Well-Known Member

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    Thank you for your reply QT. I will respond to it very soon! :)
     
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