Where does the Bible say...

[Marymog]

Here's a question. Why would the Apostles abandon Sabbath day after Jesus ascended? They were told by Jesus, if you love me keep my commands.
Where in the Bible do we read the Apostles keep Sabbath after Jesus ascended?
Two book examples should suffice. Acts 2 and Acts 13.
When did the Christian church switch the Sabbath from Saturday to Sunday?

Hi WS,

You are asking the wrong question. The question is Why DID the apostles abandon Sabbath day after Jesus ascended?

Did you even read the article you mentioned in your post???? By the end of the first century, Sunday worship was the norm. We can assume the change caused some friction, for in Colossians 2:16 Paul admonishes, "Therefore do no let anyone judge you by what you eat or drink, or with regard to a religious festival, a New Moon celebration or a Sabbath day."

Show me in Scripture where Jesus commanded them to continue Saturday Sabbath and I will join your denomination TODAY!

I see in Acts where they went to the Synagogue to try and convert the Jews by preaching to them about Jesus! What a brilliant idea on their part!! Go where you know they are going to be on Saturday!!

I also see in Scripture where they gathered on the Lords Day and were instructed to have charitable gifts/money ready on Sunday for Paul when he arrived.

Mary

 

[theefaith]

My leader is God.
As I said before, I do not follow any teachings of John Knoxx.
Here's a question. Why would the Apostles abandon Sabbath day after Jesus ascended? They were told by Jesus, if you love me keep my commands.
Where in the Bible do we read the Apostles keep Sabbath after Jesus ascended?
Two book examples should suffice. Acts 2 and Acts 13.
When did the Christian church switch the Sabbath from Saturday to Sunday?

Do you? Interesting in that the new testament books, save for those attributed to Saul, were all anonymous. The earliest book is,P. Oxy. 3523(also referred to as P90). What we'd call the Gospel of John. The second oldest is P. Oxy. 4404 (also referred to as P104) , the Gospel of Matthew.

The Didache was allegedly written in 1st century but was rejected by the church as not an inspired text. Which is why it was not added to the Canon. As all else after this entry pertains to the Didache, I have omitted it to save room.


Rambles on? LOL Actually it is relevant to the topic at hand when we're referring to what the RCC changed about the actual teachings of Christ, his Apostles, and the practices of the early church. Which was largely comprised of converted Jews.
As Gentiles became more populace in the faith the Sabbath day came to be practiced on Sunday rather than the original Saturday date.

However, as many know, there are Christians who still hold to the original Sabbath day. And for doing this they're very often chastised by those who do not.

we have a new covenant and a new creation and a new Passover

 

[theefaith]

Where did you get that 'authority' from that you are speaking about, that "Christ established on Peter, the apostles, and their successors"?

the Bible as I quoted a thousand times
Matt 28:18 all authority is Christ’s
Matt 16:18 thou art Oerter
Jn 20:21-23 as the father sent me
Same power mission and authority

 

[theefaith]

Christ is the king but He ascended

Peter names to govern the king in the absence of the king, IS 22
And as Joseph held the keys and administered the kingdom under pharaoh

 

[Marymog]

However, as many know, there are Christians who still hold to the original Sabbath day. And for doing this they're very often chastised by those who do not.

Hi WS,

The Church has mass every day of the week in the churches were there are enough priest, enough of population etc to support daily mass so that we can receive our "daily bread" (Matthew 6:11). This practice, in effect, makes everyday the Lords Day for The Church. However, Scripture and historical Christian writings make it clear that Sunday is the Lords Day and the reason why. You are trying to convince me that the Christians who walked and talked with the Apostles and closest to the lives of the Apostles were wrong when they practiced Sunday worship and that your 16th century teaching is valid. You will never convince me kiddo.....

When one is wrong.....they should be chastised. But at least they worship Him?

 

[theefaith]

Hi WS,

The Church has mass every day of the week in the churches were there are enough priest, enough of population etc to support daily mass so that we can receive our "daily bread" (Matthew 6:11). This practice, in effect, makes everyday the Lords Day for The Church. However, Scripture and historical Christian writings make it clear that Sunday is the Lords Day and the reason why. You are trying to convince me that the Christians who walked and talked with the Apostles and closest to the lives of the Apostles were wrong when they practiced Sunday worship and that your 16th century teaching is valid. You will never convince me kiddo.....

When one is wrong.....they should be chastised. But at least they worship Him?

there is no true worship without the mass
Adoration
Reparation
Thanksgiving
And petitions

Jesus rose from the dead to life on Sunday that makes it the Lord’s day the new covenant sabbath new creation all things have passed away “behold” I make all things new”

 

[Marymog]

At least you acknowledge the RCC changed Sabbath day from Saturday unto Sunday.

Good morning WS,

Not true. I didn't acknowledge that the Roman Catholic Church changed Sabbath day from Saturday to Sunday. The Church was not even in Rome when Jesus rose from the dead on Sunday and all the Christians started practicing the Lords Day as their day of worship or 'new Sabbath' if you will. Go back to post #278 kiddo. I acknowledged that my Church and one of its first Bishops, Ignatius, (a student of an Apostle) no longer observed the Sabbath. You and John Knox think that Ignatius was wrong and that you are right.....You reject 1st century teaching from a Bishop who walked and talked with an Apostles but accept the 16th century teaching of a confused man......Simply Fascinating!!!

I think we have beat this horse to death......You can have the last word....Thank you for your time....God Bless!!

 

[Marymog]

Well, lets see. Jesus was a Jew who honored the Sabbath..

Yup, that's what good Jews did....they honored the Sabbath. Not breaking news kiddo!!!

 

[Marymog]

John 15:10 If you keep my commandments, you shall abide in my love; even as I have kept my Father's commandments, and abide in his love.

Edited = missing word.

Hi WS,

Show me in Scripture where Jesus repeated the "Keep holy the Sabbath" commandment!!!

He talks about the other 9 but NEVER that one!! The one commandment you are defending He never defends!!!! Think about it!!!

Do the research and find out for yourself. Stop reading letters from 16th century men like John Knox and read letters from 1st century men. Information tends to reach people if they seek it on their own out of a desire to know. Whereas having no respect for someone who tells you these 2,000 year old truths will lead to dismissal of the relevant and true information under discussion.

Keeping it real....Mary

 

[CadyandZoe]

The Sabbath is Saturday. Worship is everyday.

 

[Marymog]

Ok. Thank you. I do hope you will further explain yourself and belief, since you seem to think I know nothing of "Catholic" doctrine by implication. This is now your opportunity to teach. I am listening...............Thank you for taking the time to address these. If you truly think I do not understand "Catholic" doctrine, then please take this as an opportunity to teach and correct. Thank you......

Wow....what a bad start to this conversation with either a lie by you or a mistake by you? Since you repeated it twice I'm leaning towards a lie. I didn't say that you "know nothing of Catholic doctrine".

Here is what I said:

"Since you grew up Catholic you already know what The Church teaches on the matter:"

Keeping it real...Mary

PS...I look forward to a correction/apology by you.

edited

 

[Marymog]

Ok. Thank you. I do hope you will further explain yourself and belief, since you seem to think I know nothing of "Catholic" doctrine by implication. This is now your opportunity to teach. I am listening.

Since you, as a "Catholic" "don't "know"" (sic) where you are going when you die, or for that matter, where others go when they die, then, how can you, as a "Catholic" possibly pray 'to' those whom you, as a "Catholic", accept as being in "Catholic" "Heaven"? You "know" they are there?

How can you, as a "Catholic", pray "for" anyone whom you might "think" is in "Catholic" "purgatory", when all of them just might be in "Catholic" "hell" (which then prayers are unavailing even accord to "Catholic" standards), or those whom you, as a "Catholic", accept as being in "Catholic" "Heaven", might actually still be in "Catholic" "purgatory", yes? You "know" they are not there?

If "Catholic" "purgatory" actually exists (I don't believe that it does based upon Scripture (KJB), but let's assume a minute), and there are actual "souls" therein, How do you, as a "Catholic", know when to cease praying "for" such "souls", when if they are 'released' and enter "Catholic" "Heaven", what would such prayers do for them, and how would you "know" if they are released?

In matters of the "Catholic" doctrine of "the communion of the saints", can a living "Catholic" pray "to" a "soul" in "Catholic" "purgatory", and if not, why not? What is the difference, between praying "to" a "soul" in "Catholic" "Heaven", and "Catholic" "purgatory"? Surely, some "souls" in "Catholic" "purgatory" are closer to the "Beatific vision" than yourself, as a "Catholic" on earth, and would therefore, have some "merit" to share, yes? Again, if not, why not? Does the "merit", only get tabulated, once the "soul" enters "Catholic" "Heaven", and then becomes available?

Thank you for taking the time to address these. If you truly think I do not understand "Catholic" doctrine, then please take this as an opportunity to teach and correct. Thank you. Feel free to use "Catholic" scripture in your replies.

Hmmmmm.....Why all the quotations????? It is very "weird"!!!! But I "digress".....

Why did you have to clarify that "KJB" is "Scripture"?? That's really "weird"!!

The Jews pray for the dead. Did God mislead the Jews just like he is, "according to you", mislead"ing" The Church? Did the birth/death of Christ change praying for souls? If so "show" me in "scripture" where the birth/death of Christ "changed" it.

Why are you "against" praying for souls? Does that mean "you" will not pray for my soul???

Mary

 

[Marymog]

Revelation 1:10 (though "Saturday" is a misidentification, with "Sabbath" being the correct, and Bible, word). This was covered previously.

That is earlier than all the other extra-scriptural sources cited thus far on "the Lord's day".

Oh goodness......Who taught you that????

 

[theefaith]

Good morning WS,

Not true. I didn't acknowledge that the Roman Catholic Church changed Sabbath day from Saturday to Sunday. The Church was not even in Rome when Jesus rose from the dead on Sunday and all the Christians started practicing the Lords Day as their day of worship or 'new Sabbath' if you will. Go back to post #278 kiddo. I acknowledged that my Church and one of its first Bishops, Ignatius, (a student of an Apostle) no longer observed the Sabbath. You and John Knox think that Ignatius was wrong and that you are right.....You reject 1st century teaching from a Bishop who walked and talked with an Apostles but accept the 16th century teaching of a confused man......Simply Fascinating!!!

I think we have beat this horse to death......You can have the last word....Thank you for your time....God Bless!!

not only confused man but a condemned heretic

if the church changed the sabbath she has authority to do so
Matt 16:18 18:18
Whatsoever! Includes the sabbath

 

[Marymog]

Ok, at least we know which sides we are on. Thank you for being clear.

Yup, I am on the side of the 1st century Christians who walked and talked with the Apostles and you are on the side of the 16th century Christians who walked and talked with the Reformers. Clear enough?

 

[Marymog]

Oh, I agree with that, with all I am. Good example. Rightly said. Yet, if I might add a thought? In Acts 15, the Council of Jerusalem, there were four things given:

[1] much disputing by the Apostles and elders who were gathered together to discuss the questions/issues at hand (Acts 15:6-7)

[2] Testimony of Peter (Acts 15:7-11), as connected with actual confirmed (multiple testimonies, Acts 10 & 11) miracles with conversion/repentance (Holy Ghost) In other words, to settle the matter, it was not a decision of men that simply agreed, but that the Holy Ghost deciding for them before hand, and they simply followed the direction of the Person/Being that was sent in the place of Christ Jesus (Acts 2:1-4,33, Psalms 133:1-3; Revelation 5:6; &c). In other words, Peter simply had to agree, "Amen",with what God, was already doing. It is written that Peter said, "God ... put no difference between us (Jews) and them (Gentiles) ..." God is always the originator of Good, the First Mover, the First Cause. Man's part is to simply "Amen" (second) God.

[3] Testimony of Paul & Barnabas (Acts 15:12), as connected with actual confirmed miracles in association with conversion/repentance (Holy Ghost) The same goes for Paul and Barnabas' experience, when it is written that it was said, "... miracles and wonders God had wrought ...". Again, we see God as being the original and primary 'actor' (one who is doing something, acts, which is the real title of the book of Acts, the "Acts of God" through men).

[4] James, giving opinion (Acts 15:13-21), based up citing OT scripture (Amos, &c), as foundation or basis, as inspired of the Holy Ghost.​

A decision could not be solidified, until first it was established that it was "God" which chose, that it was "God" that testified, that it was "God" who already promised as found in God's word. The gathering at Jerusalem, was actually, and merely to study the matter, and to "Amen" what God was already doing (even when they hadn't fully understood up to that point). They had to understand what God was doing first, then they could follow after. In other words, they needed to understand what the "Head" (Jesus Christ) was doing, and the direction He wanted the "body" to go. The Head, in Heaven, was communicating to the body, on earth, by the Holy Ghost, what to do, and how to do it.

Thanks....That's a good summary.

Soooooooo who do you trust today, in the year 2020, to "understand what God was doing" so that they then "could follow after"?

I trust The Church? Who do you believe is 'communicating to the body on earth via the Holy Ghost' in the year 2020?

Curious Mary

 

[Marymog]

The Sabbath is Saturday. Worship is everyday.

The Lords Day is Sunday. Worship Him everyday!

 

[theefaith]

Yup, I am on the side of the 1st century Christians who walked and talked with the Apostles and you are on the side of the 16th century Christians who walked and talked with the Reformers. Clear enough?

by what authority did the so called reformers (for instead of reforming the church which is impossible, they abandoned her and her founder Jesus Christ) do what they did? Which one was a successor to an apostle? With apostolic authority?

 

[ReChoired]

Thanks....That's a good summary.

Soooooooo who do you trust today, in the year 2020, to "understand what God was doing" so that they then "could follow after"?

I trust The Church? Who do you believe is 'communicating to the body on earth via the Holy Ghost' in the year 2020?

Curious Mary

I trust in the LORD God (JEHOVAH Elohiym), God our Father in Heaven, and our Head, Jesus Christ, who works through His body on earth, including through the gifts given to that body (see prophecy, spirit of prophecy) by the Holy Ghost (sealed by signs and wonders, testified by multiple witnesses). That body is the Seventh-day Adventist movement, which clings to the word of God and the testimony of Jesus Christ, having the faith of Jesus, and keep His commandments.

This might help others:

https://archive.org/download/amazing-facts-pocket-book-joe-crews-library-of-sermons-21-the-search-for-the-true-church/Amazing Facts - Pocket Book - Joe Crews - Library Of Sermons 21 - The Search For The True Church.pdf

Your question and sentence "I trust The Church? Who do you believe is 'communicating to the body on earth via the Holy Ghost' in the year 2020?", implies a two fold division, that of "the Church" and then "the body".

 

[ReChoired]

Yup, I am on the side of the 1st century Christians who walked and talked with the Apostles and you are on the side of the 16th century Christians who walked and talked with the Reformers. Clear enough?

Actually, the Seventh-day Adventist faith goes all the way back to Adam, and up into Heaven before that, and does not merely stop off in the 1st century AD.

Adam, was a Seventh-day Adventist. So was Abel, Seth, Enoch, Methuselah, Noah, Shem, Abraham, Job, Isaac, Jacob, Joseph, Moses, Joshua, ... Samuel, David, Solomon, Isaiah, Jeremiah, Ezekiel, Daniel, Malachi ... James, Peter, John, Paul ...

The Reformation begun well before the 16th century, with even the Morning Star, Wycliffe himself (Daniel 11), and others before him and after him, Huss, Jerome, Patrick of Ireland, and so many others. It also existed outside of Roman Catholicism, with the Paulicians, Albigensi, Passagini, Vaudois, Valdensi, Sabbatini, Insabbati, &c. whom Luther and others met with, who were never Roman Catholic.

Our name and roots bear who we are, belonging unto the Alpha and Omega, the Beginning and the Ending, the First and the Last, the Author and Finisher, and all inbetween, we claim as our heritage. We claim Adam, and Abel, Seth and Enoch, Noah and Job and Abraham, Isaac and Jacob (Israel), Joseph and Moses, Joshua and Samuel, David and Solomon, Isaiah, Jeremiah, Ezekiel and Daniel and all the others, unto John the Baptist, Jesus, Peter, James, John, Jude and Paul, those of the way, the Vaudois, Waldenses, the Passagini, Insabbati, Sabbatini, Albigensi, etc., Wycliffe, Huss, Luther, Calvin, Knox, Zwingli, Melanchthon,Tyndale, Patrick of Ireland, Jerome, Rogers, Wishart, Wesley, Gill and so many others.

Ours is the oldest religion, stemming from God Himself in Heaven above.

Read - Truth Triumphant - https://archive.org/download/doctrine-bible-benjamin-g-wilkinson-truth-triumphant/Doctrine - Bible - Benjamin G Wilkinson - Truth Triumphant.pdf

Read - The Great Controversy - https://archive.org/download/sda-ellen-g-white-the-great-controversy-1911_202005/SDA - Ellen G White - The Great Controversy 1911.pdf

The least you could do, is read the entirety of those two works, even as I have read countless materials of Catholicism (bulls, encyclicals, briefs, letters, etc), and also going all the way back into the 'ecf', 'Syrian', "eastern' etc materials, and others, Augustine, Origen, Aquinas, and many other names.

See for yourself (start at this point and keep reading) - Martin Luther and William Tyndale on the State of the Dead.

I was kicked out of CAF (again, 30th time? 35th time? idk, lost count a long time ago, thank God they are closing soon) for posting:

Conditionalists & Annihilationists In ECF, Eastern & Syriac, Catholic, Protestant & Churches In General - What in the

They could not answer me, and decided to be rid of me, even deleting a part of what I wrote.

Yes, you are clear. I pray that I am as well.