Who’s interpretation is true?

[bbyrd009]

I'm not seeking approval!

you are seeking the approval of God, surely. The approval of men becomes muddled with that, which is why we want a king to fight our battles, i guess.

Do you believe God picks who goes to heaven or hell...

not in the manner that that implies, no. "All go to the same place." Trials and adversity end when we "rest," they do not begin. Understand I AM. This belief that you might know what happens to you after you die is a hallucination, contradicted in many places in Scripture. When someone tells you that they know where they are "going" after they die, and then they mention a "place," either heaven or hell, they are both saying the same thing, to me; "i haven't read much Scripture."

 

[GodsGrace]

you are seeking the approval of God, surely. The approval of men becomes muddled with that, which is why we want a king to fight our battles, i guess.

not in the manner that that implies, no. "All go to the same place." Trials and adversity end when we "rest," they do not begin. Understand I AM. This belief that you might know what happens to you after you die is a hallucination, contradicted in many places in Scripture. When someone tells you that they know where they are "going" after they die, and then they mention a "place," either heaven or hell, they are both saying the same thing, to me; "i haven't read much Scripture."

Jesus said we are judged and sepatated.
We don't know what hell will be but we know God will not be there.
Or you're not even sure of that?

 

[bbyrd009]

Or do believe we have a say in where we end up?

man, good Q. Did Meshak, Shadrak et al have a say in whether they went into the furnace or not? No. I love how the ones stoking the fire there are the ones who died, right? So, MS&A had no say, but they were prepared.

 

[GodsGrace]

you are seeking the approval of God, surely. The approval of men becomes muddled with that, which is why we want a king to fight our battles, i guess.

not in the manner that that implies, no. "All go to the same place." Trials and adversity end when we "rest," they do not begin. Understand I AM. This belief that you might know what happens to you after you die is a hallucination, contradicted in many places in Scripture. When someone tells you that they know where they are "going" after they die, and then they mention a "place," either heaven or hell, they are both saying the same thing, to me; "i haven't read much Scripture."

Not seeking approval from God anymore.
He has accepted me by now by His very own plan,,,or not.

 

[GodsGrace]

man, good Q. Did Meshak, Shadrak et al have a say in whether they went into the furnace or not? No. I love how the ones stoking the fire there are the ones who died, right? So, MS&A had no say, but they were prepared.

No no no.Youre not addressing the question.!
How come?

 

[bbyrd009]

Jesus said we are judged and sepatated.
We don't know what hell will be but we know God will not be there.
Or you're not even sure of that?

well, i would put it differently now. This "separation" is not literally accomplished imo, as that is not necessary, and likely impossible on the spiritual plane anyway, and we can witness a spiritual "gulf" between people right now, say between the proud and the humble for instance. We know that those "in hell" will seek a drop of water to cool their "tongue," right, and "the power of life and death is in the tongue."

Actually the full v is "The tongue has the power of life and death, and those who love it will eat its fruit."
Those who love what? "it?" What is "it?" I am not trying to be coy here, in not labelling "it," understand.

 

[GodsGrace]

well, i would put it differently now. This "separation" is not literally accomplished imo, as that is not necessary, and likely impossible on the spiritual plane anyway, and we can witness a spiritual "gulf" between people right now, say between the proud and the humble for instance. We know that those "in hell" will seek a drop of water to cool their "tongue," right, and "the power of life and death is in the tongue."

Actually the full v is "The tongue has the power of life and death, and those who love it will eat its fruit."
Those who love what? "it?" What is "it?" I am not trying to be coy here, in not labelling "it," understand.

Not familiar with...
Those who eat it's fruit...

Please post verse.
The tongue brings death because of the harm it could do.
For instance, it could ruin a reputation, a marriage, a friendship, etc.

 

[bbyrd009]

Not seeking approval from God anymore.
He has accepted me by now by His very own plan,,,or not.

hmm, i would challenge this, and i doubt that if some shortcoming were brought to your attention by Word you would fail to correct it tbh. Also, Truly I tell you, you will not finish going through the towns of Israel before the Son of Man returns, so i suggest that being on one plateau for long is a sign.

Why i'm being prompted here i don't know, but we are now discovering that simply not feeding geriatrics who have lost touch with reality brings them back really quickly. Ha i guess that prolly seems cruel; i don't think "starving" them is the point here tho.

 

[bbyrd009]

No no no.Youre not addressing the question.!
How come?

sorry, that Q was "Or do (you) believe we have a say in where we end up?" so please rephrase the question for me if you would.

 

[GodsGrace]

hmm, i would challenge this, and i doubt that if some shortcoming were brought to your attention by Word you would fail to correct it tbh. Also, Truly I tell you, you will not finish going through the towns of Israel before the Son of Man returns, so i suggest that being on one plateau for long is a sign.

Why i'm being prompted here i don't know, but we are now discovering that simply not feeding geriatrics who have lost touch with reality brings them back really quickly. Ha i guess that prolly seems cruel; i don't think "starving" them is the point here tho.

bb
We all have shortcomings.
I'm depending on Word to get me to heaven.
Not you?
What do you depend on ?

 

[bbyrd009]

Not familiar with...
Those who eat it's fruit...

Please post verse.

sorry Proverbs 18:21

 

[GodsGrace]

sorry, that Q was "Or do (you) believe we have a say in where we end up?" so please rephrase the question for me if you would.

Ok.
The thread is:. Who's interpretation is true?
Arminians believe in free will and their part in being able to choose their salvation.

Calvinists believe man does not have free will, God decides who goes to heaven or hell based on nothing.

So...how do we know who's right if both could post scripture?

 

[GodsGrace]

sorry Proverbs 18:21

Oh.
Easy.
You get what you dish out.
If you use the tongue for harm, that harm you cause will eventually damage you.

What say you?

 

[bbyrd009]

bb
We all have shortcomings.
I'm depending on Word to get me to heaven.
Not you?
What do you depend on ?

see that you have this conception, some conception, of this "heaven" that you will "go to" after you physically die, right? Yet we do not yet know what we will become, 1John3:2. i depend upon Word to keep me in the kingdom, yes, but that is for right now, not for after i am dead and resting, and also i am aware that furnaces are not out of the realm of possibility, despite our shared understanding that "God is not in hell," which ok i agree, but then God is the All Consuming Fire, right, and Christ was in the furnace with ME&A, so my bet is that we are misunderstanding out of fear, mostly, and these questions are moot, not even applicable to the reality.

 

[GodsGrace]

see that you have this conception, some conception, of this "heaven" that you will "go to" after you physically die, right? Yet we do not yet know what we will become, 1John3:2. i depend upon Word to keep me in the kingdom, yes, but that is for right now, not for after i am dead and resting, and also i am aware that furnaces are not out of the realm of possibility, despite our shared understanding that "God is not in hell," which ok i agree, but then God is the All Consuming Fire, right, and Christ was in the furnace with ME&A, so my bet is that we are misunderstanding out of fear, mostly, and these questions are moot, not even applicable to the reality.

But Jesus said He came to give us an abundant Life.
How could it be abundant if we don't even know what is going to happen to us??

1. Today you will be with me in paradise.
Whatever Paradise is, it's a good place.

2. To be absent from the body is to be present with the Lord....Paul.

Heaven is probably a dimension
We cannot know this for sure.

 

[bbyrd009]

Ok.
The thread is:. Who's interpretation is true?

yes, and if that Q was restated it would become more apparent how moot it is; something i have been avoiding, but "Who knows the truth?" is a decent analogue that might suffice, i guess. Whose interpretation of what is true? The law? The interpretation that prevails in court. The Word? The Word cannot be interpreted. So, like that.

 

[bbyrd009]

Arminians believe in free will and their part in being able to choose their salvation.

Calvinists believe man does not have free will, God decides who goes to heaven or hell based on nothing.

So...how do we know who's right if both could post scripture?

arg, look i know this answer is going to be frustrating lol, but my answer is "by reading other Scripture that assures us that no one knows, and those who say that they do, do not yet know the truth as they ought." Iow both perceptions may have some validity, although it seems to me that Calvinists need a new word for the difference between humans and animals if they reject "free will" as the difference. Based on nothing? I'd like to see that verse, lol.

 

[GodsGrace]

yes, and if that Q was restated it would become more apparent how moot it is; something i have been avoiding, but "Who knows the truth?" is a decent analogue that might suffice, i guess. Whose interpretation of what is true? The law? The interpretation that prevails in court. The Word? The Word cannot be interpreted. So, like that.

Well, this one is easy.
Calvinism cannot be correct.
It changes the character of God and turns Him into a monster who willingly sends the humans He created to hell...

We have to accept all scripture, not just the verses we like.
Also, Word would never d so cruel...
We CAN know who has the right interpretation, in most cases.

 

[GodsGrace]

arg, look i know this answer is going to be frustrating lol, but my answer is "by reading other Scripture that assures us that no one knows, and those who say that they do, do not yet know the truth as they ought." Iow both perceptions may have some validity, although it seems to me that Calvinists need a new word for the difference between humans and animals if they reject "free will" as the difference. Based on nothing? I'd like to see that verse, lol.

Based on nothing is mine.
But that is what they teach.
Re humans and animals...
Great point...
Instinct vs choice.
Humans a!ways have a choice.

 

[bbyrd009]

So...how do we know who's right if both could post scripture?

how do we know who is right if two lawyers can both quote the law? The solution is to not be under the law, not be in that situation iow. I don't refer to Calvin for my interpretations, nor this Armenia person; rather i am led as i read, and then i get labelled later, by other people. So i maybe get labelled "Armenian," despite the fact that Armenia and i would surely diverge in our beliefs at some point, pretty quickly i guess.