Who is the Little Horn of Daniel?

[CoreIssue]

Compare the four beasts and statute of Daniel.

Head - lion with wings - Babylon - Nebuchadnezzar
Chest and two arms - bear - Medo-Persia
Belly - Leopard - Greece - Alexander the great
hips and legs - terrifying beast - Rome

Toes - what Rome collapsed into and will recombine as the kingdom of the AC.

 

[Enoch111]

You need to be careful of what you accuse people of, lest you shown your ignorance.

I've been trying to tell Bobby Jo the same thing. She fully believes she is an expert on Bible prophecy.

 

[Davy]

... Scripture and History.

NO, you CAN'T COUNT: The EIGHTH "was and is not". So you have Seven figurative MOUNTAINS and Seven literal KINGS, -- and an eighth "PAPER king".

Perhaps the "experts" in this forum would do as well if they examined each of an elephant's different aspects!
BJ

Apparently you don't understand that metaphor of "was, and is not, and yet is" from Rev.17:8.

Rev 17:8-14
8 The beast that thou sawest was, and is not; and shall ascend out of the bottomless pit, and go into perdition: and they that dwell on the earth shall wonder, whose names were not written in the book of life from the foundation of the world, when they behold the beast that was, and is not, and yet is.

Has any... flesh beast king ascended out of the bottomless pit of hell? No. That's the place it's referring to. And it's referring to a king, not a kingdom. The bottomless pit is Satan's home in the heavenly dimension. He has already been judged and sentenced to perdition. No flesh man to date has already been judged and sentenced, so you should realize that when you see a Bible reference pointing to his and his angel's destruction in the future lake of fire.

Satan was a beast king of old, when he first rebelled against God, before the foundation of this world. His position as beast king "was", "and is not" because God destroyed Satan's rebellion of old. Then Satan as "that old serpent" shows up in God's Garden as the Tempter to tempt Adam and Eve. Since the subject of Rev.17 is 'when' the Babylon Harlot sits a queen with the final beast kingdom established at the end, Satan as that old beast will be the "and yet is". That time is still yet to come for that.


9 And here is the mind which hath wisdom. The seven heads are seven mountains, on which the woman sitteth.

There are not 8 mountains involved here, so these are NOT kings. These are regions upon the earth which the harlot will rule over.


10 And there are seven kings: five are fallen, and one is, and the other is not yet come; and when he cometh, he must continue a short space.

These 7 kings are a separate subject from the mountains. Westcott & Hort got their interpretation from a different set of Greek texts, and then some of their readings have been suspect. It's a problem of later modern Bible translations. Just because something says, "New and Improved" on it does not always mean it is.

Five of the 7 kings have already fallen. That means they ain't... coming back from the dead. They are history. The one John said that is, the 6th, was Domitian in Apostle John's days, a Roman emperor. The 7th was not yet come in John's day. And that 7th beast king is still... yet to come in our day, as he will be the final Antichrist to appear in Jerusalem just prior to Christ's return, as Apostle Paul showed in 2 Thess.2.


11 And the beast that was, and is not, even he is the eighth, and is of the seven, and goeth into perdition.

The phrase, "and is of the seven", is pointing to that 8th beast being of all... the previous beasts. There's no way that can point to some flesh man. It can only point to an entity that has been involved in the lives of all... seven of those beast kings. That makes it simple, as it leaves Satan himself as being that one who "is of the seven" beast kings.

And even he will be the 8th beast king. Since the 7th beast king is still yet to come in our day, it means the 7th one is for the very end of this world. So the 8th one must... be for Satan's final role of Rev.20 when he will draw the rebellious nations with him to go up against the "camp of the saints", and God then destroys him and them.


12 And the ten horns which thou sawest are ten kings, which have received no kingdom as yet; but receive power as kings one hour with the beast.
13 These have one mind, and shall give their power and strength unto the beast.
14 These shall make war with the Lamb, and the Lamb shall overcome them: for he is Lord of lords, and King of kings: and they that are with him are called, and chosen, and faithful.
KJV

Those are the ten horns of Daniel 7. They are the ten horns of Rev.13. They are ten kings that only come to power when the 7th beast king (Satan) comes to power at the end of this present world.

 

[Bobby Jo]

You are obviously confused.
...
The ram with two horns and he goat was a different vision Daniel had in Daniel 8.

You have no clue. Daniel 2,7,8,& 11 and Rev. 12, 13, &17 all coincide just as a blue print offers multiple sheets with multiple views FOR THE SAME PRODUCT.

As already suggested, the elephant is like a "rope", NO it's like a "wall", etc. Bible prophecy is so easy, but is made so hard. Perhaps if you complied with the 2:45 Intelligent Design sequence 4,3,5,2,1, you'd have a starting point, and you could work your way around the elephant. -- Or you can make arbitrary assertions ...


I'm pretty close to just ignoring you. -- It's just throwing pearls ...
BJ

 

[Davy]

Yeah, you just throw out what doesn't match your "theology", -- and then everything works.


Great "theology",
BJ

You're bearing false witness now.

I threw nothing out. I well realized that there are FIVE pieces to the beast statue image Neb dreamed in Dan.2, with feet made of part iron and part clay, supporting all the previous statue parts. And I recognized that in Daniel 7, he was given another vision of the final beast kingdom being a 4th beast with ten horns.

 

[Davy]

....
I'm pretty close to just ignoring you. -- It's just throwing pearls ...
BJ

Be my guest, as if you really thought yourself to be somebody important!

 

[Bobby Jo]

I've been trying to tell Bobby Jo the same thing. She fully believes she is an expert on Bible prophecy.

I'm a Male.

Perhaps the confusing point is because I hear from GOD like Adam, but you're used to hearing from men like Eve was subjugated to. It happens.


BJ

 

[Davy]

You have no clue. Daniel 2,7,8,& 11 and Rev. 12, 13, &17 all coincide just as a blue print offers multiple sheets with multiple views FOR THE SAME PRODUCT.

BJ

Strange that you left out Daniel 9 there. Daniel 9 & Daniel 11 are hard linked involving the end of sacrifices again in Jerusalem and the placing of the "abomination of desolation" Jesus warned of. That suggests to me that you dump any view of the last "one week" of Dan.9:27 being for the end of days.

 

[Davy]

I'm a Male.

Perhaps the confusing point is because I hear from GOD like Adam, but you're used to hearing from men like Eve was subjugated to. It happens.

BJ

Irrelevant and ignorant.

 

[Bobby Jo]

You're bearing false witness now.

I threw nothing out. I well realized that there are FIVE pieces to the beast statue image Neb dreamed in Dan.2, with feet made of part iron and part clay, supporting all the previous statue parts. And I recognized that in Daniel 7, he was given another vision of the final beast kingdom being a 4th beast with ten horns.

FIVE ≠ FOUR

Abbott and Costello were able to mathematically PROVE that 7 x 13 = 28, using addition, multiplication, and division. And it works. But you haven't proved your apparent premise that FIVE DOES EQUAL FOUR!



So either incorporate the 2:45 sequence into you Chapter 7 theology, or go home.
Bj

 

[Bobby Jo]

Strange that you left out Daniel 9 ...

Not strange at all. But it IS strange that you would associate Daniel's prophecies to the nations with Jeremiah's prophecy to the Jews.


BJ

 

[Bobby Jo]

Irrelevant and ignorant.

Thank you Davy. For a girl, you seem to really try to understand Scripture, and hope your husband can help you along your path.


BJ -- a Male

 

[Davy]

Not strange at all. But it IS strange that you would associate Daniel's prophecies to the nations with Jeremiah's prophecy to the Jews.

BJ

And you had the gall to accuse me of just dumping Scripture!

You really don't understand as much of God's Word as you try to let on, but only play act like you do...

Jer 1:4-5
4 Then the word of the LORD came unto me, saying,

5 Before I formed thee in the belly I knew thee; and before thou camest forth out of the womb I sanctified thee, and I ordained thee a prophet unto the nations.
KJV

Jer 1:10
10 See, I have this day set thee over the nations and over the kingdoms, to root out, and to pull down, and to destroy, and to throw down, to build, and to plant.
KJV

 

[Bobby Jo]

... play act like you do...

Blah, blah, blah, -- let me know when you incorporate 2:45 with Chapter 7.

There we go, -- IGNORED...
BJ

 

[Enoch111]

I'm a Male.

1. The only Bobby Jos I know of are girls/women. Sorry for the assumption.

2. Anyhow, it is good to know that we have a *prophet* among us -- BJ.

3. From what we know Adam hid from God after he was caught in his disobedience.

4. Eve was NOT subjugated. She was merely stupid for chatting with the Serpent. Then she subjugated Adam.

 

[Bobby Jo]

... it is good to know that we have a *prophet* among us -- BJ. ...

Acts 7:51 You stiff-necked and uncircumcised in heart and ears, you do always resist the Holy Spirit: as your fathers did, so do you.​

Let me know when you've discovered that Darius is the LAST Babylonian King, (Ref. Dan. 6:28). Until then, go your own way.

BJ

 

[quietthinker]

The only problem is that a system cannot be a man, or a king, or a ruler.

how do arrive at that idea?

 

[Enoch111]

how do arrive at that idea?

Easy. Is your Prime Minister your system of government, or is here there because your system allows him to be there? He could probably be removed tomorrow with a Motion or Vote of No Confidence, but the system would remain.

"In the Australian Parliament, a motion of no-confidence requires a majority of the members present in the House of Representatives to agree to it...Specific motions of no confidence or censure motions against the Prime Minister, ministers, the Leader of the Opposition, Senators and leaders of political parties have been moved and have been successful on some occasions...

Wikipedia

 

[quietthinker]

Easy. Is your Prime Minister your system of government, or is here there because your system allows him to be there? He could probably be removed tomorrow with a Motion or Vote of No Confidence, but the system would remain.

"In the Australian Parliament, a motion of no-confidence requires a majority of the members present in the House of Representatives to agree to it...Specific motions of no confidence or censure motions against the Prime Minister, ministers, the Leader of the Opposition, Senators and leaders of political parties have been moved and have been successful on some occasions...

Wikipedia

yes, the system would remain and another man elected. I don't see that as problematic when it comes to our subject of the man of sin, the Roman Catholic system

 

[brakelite]

@Enoch111 Daniel, in response to Nebuchadnezzars dream, and in giving him the interpretation as the angel explained, said to the king...thou art the head of gold. Yet no-one is claiming that the head of gold, nor the lion with wings in Daniel 7, must be the individual king, Nebuchadnezzar, because common sense demands that the head of gold and the beast, be an empire or kingdom that has seen a parade of leaders, in some cases such as Rome, a very long parade. Even more so with the little horn. Its time span demands a long parade of rulers. How so? Aside from the day/years principle used by Protestant exegetists in times past, the simple fact that the little horn grew from the head of pagan Rome, which kingdom ceased as an iron kingdom in the 5th century, and continued all the way down through mankind's history until the future judgement, demands a succession of rulers over the one kingdom...the clay/iron mix that is a representative of the church/state union so typical of Papal Rome since the time of the break up of the empire, and the 'falling away into apostasy' and the rise of the little horn that Paul warned of after the empire was removed. It is no coincidence that the early church fathers all fully expected the little horn to arise when the empire collapsed.