Why did God love and forgive David so?

[amadeus]

prolly a fax of it, ya, but imo this is a necessary step on the way to falling to the ground; at least for many believers who continue on the path. This might even be characterized by a believer who has had enough law and is no longer...satisfied by it, is waking up iow, and just getting a first look at the mountain, with still sleepy eyes (still perceiving the apparent, iow)
the first Q this one asks, in my experience, is "Well, but how do i get my first love back?" essentially, @VictoryinJesus
or "with the appearance of all of this, how might i possibly go forward?"

the answer being identify and rediscover the First Love, and then the appearances...will clarify as the apparitions, see. the appearances are not going to change any; the eye will. Iow why isn't your dog freaking out about World Events? Bc your dog is not in the world, you are, see. What i have maybe kinda been avoiding saying is that all that stuff you are currently worried for, your house, retirement, etc, you are going to lose all those on this path, ok, you cannot do both, you have to pick one i guess. And you are going to confess which one you have picked, every day of your life, you couldn't hide it if you tried, not even by communicating once removed, where your breath cannot be heard, like here, still comes through loud and clear lol

How many times will we be allowed to rediscover and take hold of our First Love?

If we quench the Spirit in us one time too many because a big truck just crushed us as we crossed the street...? This happened before we had a change to repent that last time we stepped out of the Spirit and then we are dead. No more chances. We are dead with no resurrection in sight. God gives us usually more than one chance to get things right again, but no one knows how many chances he will be allowed.

Most of the children of Israel were allowed ten rebellions before they lost the Promised Land [Numbers 14:22]. Moses was only allowed one [Numbers 20:12]. Those were only shadows of the reality. Moses was given more by God than the rest of the Israelites so more was required of him:

"But he that knew not, and did commit things worthy of stripes, shall be beaten with few stripes. For unto whomsoever much is given, of him shall be much required: and to whom men have committed much, of him they will ask the more." Luke 12:48

"Then came Peter to him, and said, Lord, how oft shall my brother sin against me, and I forgive him? till seven times?
Jesus saith unto him, I say not unto thee, Until seven times: but, Until seventy times seven." Matt 18:21-22

Well, I know that in my own life, God has forgiven me more than 490 times for messing up again. God is merciful and recognizes our frailty. But... as shown by the shadow example of the Israelites and Moses, there is a limit. Only God knows the limit, so we should count the cost before purposely stepping out of the Spirit to sin even though we have a definite intention to repent later. And if later never comes?

 

[amadeus]

i would put that diff, that the Scriptures reflect what the Spirit will do, but ya

No, I believe that the Holy Spirit is the blood of Jesus that we must drink in order to quicken his flesh [the dead carcass of scriptures] we have consumed. The scriptures made alive within us reflect what Jesus would do.

 

[Miss Hepburn]

....but how much can we do for the next guy who refuses to listen
and/or to open his heart to receive what God has given ...

Ha...now you know what God feels...how much can He do?

 

[bbyrd009]

Their efforts saved only themselves. Our surrender to God may save us, but how much can we do for the next guy who refuses to listen and/or to open his heart to receive what God has given us to share with others? Sometimes people are receptive but sometimes we have to leave shaking the dust off our feet as we go.

Codependency plays into this hugely; and we are very codependent now. I come from a family of Codependents, Capital C for us, and i note more Coda in churches than anywhere else; the two disciplines are made for each other. Most people do not really even have a definition of Coda, but Codas are all over...tv for instance, Sheldon Cooper, or the wife on The Goldman's, Goldberg's? The blond lady? Totally her schtick.

So, it's Judas all over again, manipulating Jesus into making a move, if that can be seen. If you really wanna do something for the next guy, forgive him, and lead by example. If you want a codependent relationship, get a dog or a minion. Bc ppl are not going to respond well to that, no ppl, ever. Codependency is counterfeit service, here-let-me-fluff-up-that-pillow-for-you, heelers instead of healers.

not saying that you are codependent necessarily, but there is a third choice to your "sometimes" up there, if you can find it.
Proclaimers of "Good News!" should encounter resistance about as often as Labrador puppies get kicked ok.
Granted you will drive Codependents nuts sometimes, bc that third rail that you run on that they just can't see or plan for is electric, tryna think of an example, the most pertinent one that comes to mind is see that the one who refuses to "open his heart" to receive what God has given you is perfectly within his rights, see, and are you looking to "share" or are you really looking for validation from that person, without realizing it?

Bc what i hear in that "share" is talking, right, sharing = talking now, and don't get me wrong, there is a situation in which that is completely accurate, ie when someone has asked, bam be ready to make a defense of your faith, but no defense is occurring when someone you are proselytizing asks why you believe ________, that is not what defending your faith is at all, see, defense is needed when you have been observed turning the other cheek, or giving a thief your shirt, something like that, and you are getting attacked etc for it.

Spongebob now has to defend his faith, see, not to the stranger at all, but to his little green one eyed "friend," if anyone.

The alt, the one we practice, produces all these defenders who are not even getting attacked, see, at least until they start yapping; the Good Samaritan "refuses to listen," too, right. So see how one might be shaking the dust off their feet to the huge relief of...the other parties affected, like when some Coda makes a thread to announce their departure, like that.

Codependency is just hell
codependent no more - Google Search

i was just going to post a link to the book, but there are some other aspects of Codependency illuminated in the search page, that we might need to talk about.

 

[bbyrd009]

@VictoryinJesus

The limit is always this "free will" that some people are so pleased to possess. That is what a person has to give up in order to please God. We hold our own reins, but we must repeatedly hand those reins over to Him if we are going to make it to the end with Him.

This is a prevalent pov, yes, and of course it is even described as "dying," bc that is what it is going to feel like, leaving the Holy of Holies to God, but imo there are countless avenues for one to express their Free Will in God; just zero avenues to express ego, which is of course what we want to do. We wanna do Big Things for Jesus, right, but of course you gotta kick out all the homeless ppl from the area first lol

 

[bbyrd009]

How many times will we be allowed to rediscover and take hold of our First Love?

what even is your "First Love?"

 

[bbyrd009]

Ha...now you know what God feels...how much can He do?

amen, God can make you a skin, but you still gotta put it on to feel right with God, Who has already forgiven you, skin or no skin, just like He did for Adam.

Dispensing Undeserved Forgiveness used to be at the heart of faith in God, not sure what happened to it?
How did any arguments to the contrary even develop, so that we have believers now willing to assert God's Need for us to have a Savior, and actually get likes for it?

Bc believing in Jesus will not get anyone forgiven, and neither will following Christ, right
if one is doing these things to attempt to get forgiveness, they have been deceived, badly deceived

 

[amadeus]

Ha...now you know what God feels...how much can He do?

God can really do much, but I believe that He wants people to come to Him primarily because they love Him rather than because He can give them goodies... First things first, but what should be first?

 

[Miss Hepburn]

God can really do much, but I believe that He wants people to come to Him primarily because they love Him rather than because He can give them goodies... First things first, but what should be first?

God can't make someone with free will love Him...was my point.
If that is what He wanted we would just be puppets.
Yet, He has done so much and still people will deny He exists or are mad at Him.

 

[amadeus]

Codependency plays into this hugely; and we are very codependent now. I come from a family of Codependents, Capital C for us, and i note more Coda in churches than anywhere else; the two disciplines are made for each other. Most people do not really even have a definition of Coda, but Codas are all over...tv for instance, Sheldon Cooper, or the wife on The Goldman's, Goldberg's? The blond lady? Totally her schtick.

So, it's Judas all over again, manipulating Jesus into making a move, if that can be seen. If you really wanna do something for the next guy, forgive him, and lead by example. If you want a codependent relationship, get a dog or a minion. Bc ppl are not going to respond well to that, no ppl, ever. Codependency is counterfeit service, here-let-me-fluff-up-that-pillow-for-you, heelers instead of healers.

Actually I don't recall having ever heard of this, codependency, before. As then I guess people may be into things without knowing what they are. Everything right there on the platter for you. Churches do come to mind especially, but I would guess there are others also involved. People like it when everything needed is provided. Do I have the right train of thought on this? There is an old song that comes to mind also:

People are still looking for this, but so many never even approach it for all their efforts. Looking in the wrong place!

As to pushing it or as it may be named, proselytizing, God does not ever force feed people with the right Way... Should we do it?

Even if I do have it, is it necessarily my job to force others to partake?

Jesus did have it, but people were often interested only in the carnal fishes and bread to fill their bellies rather than the best things that He was always offering.

If we push too hard even though we have a good message we may end up with Jesus on a cross...

 

[amadeus]

what even is your "First Love?"

"But seek ye first the kingdom of God, and his righteousness; and all these things shall be added unto you." Matt 6:33

 

[bbyrd009]

Actually I don't recall having ever heard of this, codependency, before. As then I guess people may be into things without knowing what they are. Everything right there on the platter for you. Churches do come to mind especially, but I would guess there are others also involved. People like it when everything needed is provided. Do I have the right train of thought on this?

ya, definitely, we are all professionals in the Hegelian Dialectic, see, even though no one knows what that means, and etc.

"People like it when everything needed is provided."
deserves its own thread lol, but ya, we seek Oracles, of course, and we seek for our needs to be provided, only we insist upon defining the needs, right. And there is also that guy who seeks to provide everything he needs, that will come to no better end, if he does not figure out what he really needs, huh

There is an old song that comes to mind also:



People are still looking for this, but so many never even approach it for all their efforts. Looking in the wrong place!

caught part of a Bing Special last night myself; amazing guy

If we push too hard even though we have a good message we may end up with Jesus on a cross...

that is the usual outcome i guess, ya

 

[aspen]

God can't make someone with free will love Him...was my point.
If that is what He wanted we would just be puppets.
Yet, He has done so much and still people will deny He exists or are mad at Him.

I dont see this playing out in the world.

Children do not have to hate their parents in order to be able to love them........mothers love their children unconditionally, as well. Neither are puppets.

Why do we need freewill or to know evil in order to choose love?

 

[bbyrd009]

"But seek ye first the kingdom of God, and his righteousness; and all these things shall be added unto you." Matt 6:33

nice; imo this could be rephrased to actually define your first love, which by definition existed before you started that "seeking," at least imo; or maybe only in a sense, dunno. Diff for everyone, i guess

 

[amadeus]

ya, definitely, we are all professionals in the Hegelian Dialectic, see, even though no one knows what that means, and etc.

"People like it when everything needed is provided."
deserves its own thread lol, but ya, we seek Oracles, of course, and we seek for our needs to be provided, only we insist upon defining the needs, right. And there is also that guy who seeks to provide everything he needs, that will come to no better end, if he does not figure out what he really needs, huh

Christians, or people who call themselves Christians, are often found in this place of not understanding what they really need. They quite frequently and perhaps always pray "amiss".

caught part of a Bing Special last night myself; amazing guy

I always loved Bing Crosby's talent as a singer. I remember the sadness I felt when he died and so few seemed to notice. Yet for decades he was a top entertainer. When he died I guess people had already shifted a long ways from his kind of entertainment. The only thing most younger people remember about him is "White Christmas" still the single best selling song of all time.

Amadeus said: If we push too hard even though we have a good message we may end up with Jesus on a cross...

that is the usual outcome i guess, ya

Death and/or Life!

 

[amadeus]

nice; imo this could be rephrased to actually define your first love, which by definition existed before you started that "seeking," at least imo; or maybe only in a sense, dunno. Diff for everyone, i guess

Making those things first is something that we should never stop doing. People too often simply don't understand the promise included in "and all these things shall be added unto you".

 

[Miss Hepburn]

I dont see this playing out in the world.
Children do not have to hate their parents in order to be able to love them........mothers love their children unconditionally, as well. Neither are puppets.

Why do we need freewill or to know evil in order to choose love?

This has gotten off track twice from my orig comment to something Amedeus said.
So what I was saying is being misunderstood.
If its all the same to you, rather than go back and piece together what i meant,
I'd like to drop it...it's a bit far from the orig thing I meant to say. Like I never said anything about evil and hate to be able love anyone, for example.
My apologies...long, (but good ) day for me.

 

[aspen]

This has gotten off track twice from my orig comment to something Amedeus said.
So what I was saying is being misunderstood.
If its all the same to you, rather than go back and piece together what i meant,
I'd like to drop it...it's a bit far from the orig thing I meant to say. Like I never said anything about evil and hate to be able love anyone, for example.
My apologies...long, (but good ) day for me.

Ok. Didnt mean to interrogate you.

 

[Miss Hepburn]

Ok. Didnt mean to interrogate you.

You're sweet. I think it's ok to ask most anything on a forum, tho.
Wait, I may interrogate you one day! ;]

 

[bbyrd009]

Why do we need freewill

bc that is how gods are made, to rule their domains

or to know evil in order to choose love?

why does sin cause grace to abound?