Why do the self taught preach an incomplete gospel?

[charity]

I realise that is the popular method to respond to the call of the Father, but what you've bore witness to here will not result in receiving the Spirit of Christ.

At best what you wrote is just an extended definition of repentance, which is just turning from our way to His way in our mind. Now is when the real act of Faith, the covenant, the contract with God is made by a Continually surrendered life.

Without that fulfillment of pisteuo, we have yet to begin our walk with Christ. Still at the beginning, with the Father awaiting a correct response.

'That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus,
and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised Him from the dead,
thou shalt be saved.
With the heart man believeth unto righteousness;
and with the mouth confession is made unto salvation'
(Romans 10:9-10)

Hello @Faither,

Heart belief in the Lord Jesus Christ is what brings life through His name (John 20:31). The surrendering of heart and life is all part of the Holy Spirit's work in the life of the believer once faith has entered.

The covenant was made with the Lord Jesus Christ, before the world began. It is not made with you or I, thankfully, for then our salvation would not be sure, for we would surely have broken it, sinful creatures that we are. No! It was made with Christ. Praise God!

'Who hath saved us, and called us with an holy calling,
not according to our works,
but according to His own purpose and grace,
which was given us in Christ Jesus
before the world began,'
(2 Tim 1:9)

'In hope of eternal life,
which God, that cannot lie,
promised before the world began; ... '
(Titus 1:2)

* We are His workmanship. Praise His Holy Name!

In Christ Jesus
our risen and glorified
Saviour, Lord and Head.
Chris

 

[Enoch111]

But to justify an unteachable attitude by saying all Bible Colleges are corrupt is something quite different.

That is not an *unteachable attitude*. It is the Holy Spirit who is the divine Teacher of Christians, and as long as you are prepared to be taught by the Spirit of God and reject all man-made notions, you are not unteachable.

Do you know where this idea of theological degrees came from? The Scholasticism of the Catholic Church, which was not rejected by the Reformers, and even adopted by evangelicals and fundamentalists. The assumption is that a theological degree equips a person to minister the Word of God. Well we know that that is total nonsense. There is more heresy and apostasy generated by those who come out of seminaries than not.

 

[Paul Christensen]

That is not an *unteachable attitude*. It is the Holy Spirit who is the divine Teacher of Christians, and as long as you are prepared to be taught by the Spirit of God and reject all man-made notions, you are not unteachable.

Do you know where this idea of theological degrees came from? The Scholasticism of the Catholic Church, which was not rejected by the Reformers, and even adopted by evangelicals and fundamentalists. The assumption is that a theological degree equips a person to minister the Word of God. Well we know that that is total nonsense. There is more heresy and apostasy generated by those who come out of seminaries than not.

It is not the degree in theology or divinity that poses the problem, it is what is being taught in most seminaries. The invasion of liberalism and Evolution into most prominent seminaries is producing clerics who go into churches and teach what they have learned. We have seen on this forum how many members don't believe in the literal text of the Bible.

I was fortunate that I did my degree through a conservative, evangelistic Bible College that certainly did not hold with liberalism or evolution at all, but held to the true gospel of Christ. But having the degree doesn't make me a better person or even closer to God. It just gave me training just like anyone else who receives professional training for the occupation they decide. I don't think I would want to fly with an airline pilot who believed that his training organisation was unreliable and decided to teach himself to fly.

 

[XRose]

I was waiting to see if there was anyone who legitimately wanted to know, or just respond unkindly.
Christ commands us ," wherever this gospel is preached, tell what this woman did." That pretty much is never done.
Christ provided His gift of Grace by the finished work on Calvary. We respond to that Grace" by Faith" , by wasting our lives on Him! Just like the woman did.

I'm glad you got that off your chest.

 

[XRose]

Pisteuo or the application of Faith towards the living God is defined in the Vines Greek dictionary as " a personal surrender to Him and a life inspired by such surrender." That is not my opinion.

With that said, I could share my understanding and experience of how that definition is fulfilled in the NT salvation process .

Is that what your asking?

Go on - give us the beneift of your wisdom and special insights.

 

[XRose]

The definition of believe is " to Believe?" Lol that's genius!

Go believe then, you've been warned!

your sneering at being corrected over your pretentiousness is rather unChristian.
obsessing over trivialities may earn brownie points but doesn't help preach the gospel.
And 1 Timothy 2:14 says: Of these things put them in remembrance, charging them before the Lord that they strive not about words to no profit, but to the subverting of the hearers.

 

[XRose]

I agree. The Spirit of Christ, what your referring to was received in a different way through a different person just prior to hearing this teacher.

The fact that I was having a text book born again experience and this teacher was teaching what I was experiencing, after I had experienced it, is the reason I learned the deeper things of Gods ways and His word for the last 33 years by him.
This is why a correct application of Faith is required.

It doesn't take 33 years? The woman with the perfume - Mary - learned all the faith she needed in just a day.

 

[XRose]

Agreed. A command is maybe a little over the top, but a suggestion wouldn't be enough. The important part of this is that Christ made a point to elevate what this woman did on par or as the same importance as His work on the Cross.

I'm not saying that what she did in any way fulfill the perfect sacrifice that only Christ can do. But what she did was an example of a surrendered life, a surrendered life wasted on Christ. He elevated her act of Faith to the same importance as His work on the Cross. Christ work on the cross provided Grace to the world, we receive it individually by Faith and faithing, starting by a surrendered life.

We need to make sure we are not standing with Judas who said " why this waste"? Discerned, he is saying this has no importance other than it's value, when Jesus saw a fulfillment of pisteuo. This is why He said " wherever this gospel is preached, tell what this woman did." The perfect example of Faith applied!

" Believing" is a part of her fulfilling pisteuo or saving Faith, but if she would have " only" believed in the things He was saying, ( God's word ) it would have not availed the response she received from Jesus.

You worship that Mary the way the Catholics worship the Ishtar they have been brainwashed to believe is the Mary who bore Jesus.
Tediously obsessing over a trivialities is akin to complaining about the mote in another's eye and ignoring the beam in your own.
Move on and stop gloating over being the possessor of the gem of the woman with the perfume.

 

[XRose]

I was a high school dropout and left school without any qualifications. But when I became a Christian,"

All a new Christian needs is a KJV or NKJV Study Bible and the gifts of wisdom and discernment given by holy spirit.
These two things beat the philosophical and evolutionist claptrap and ecumenist Satanisms offered by most Bible colleges.

 

[Enoch111]

It just gave me training just like anyone else who receives professional training for the occupation they decide.

It is the job of the elders within the churches to train believers in how to study the Word of God, using all legitimate Bible tools.

And the things that thou hast heard of me among many witnesses, the same commit thou to faithful men, who shall be able to teach others also. (2 Tim 2:2)

And the servant of the Lord must not strive; but be gentle unto all men, apt to teach, patient...(2 Tim 2:24)

This is NOT the job of seminaries, and the issue of professionalism is BOGUS. Ministry of the Word is a calling, not a career or a profession (as is commonly held). And academic degrees are not required.

 

[XRose]

I realize that is the popular method to respond to the call of the Father, but what you've bore witness to here will not result in recieving the Spirit of Christ.

Without that fulfillment of pisteuo, we have yet to begin our walk with Christ. Still at the beginning, with the Father awaiting a correct response.

Nonsense! You cling to your pisteuo talisman like a Catholic clings to a rosary.
My KJV Bible says 'Peter rose up and said:
Men and brethren, ye know how that a good while ago God made choice among us, that the Gentiles by my mouth should hear the word of the gospel, and believe.
8 And God, which knoweth the hearts, bare them witness, giving them the Holy Ghost, even as he did unto us;
9 And put no difference between us and them, purifying their hearts by faith.
10 Now therefore why tempt ye God, to put a yoke upon the neck of the disciples, which neither our fathers nor we were able to bear?
11 But we believe that through the grace of the Lord Jesus Christ we shall be saved, even as they.
12 Then all the multitude kept silence, and gave audience to Barnabas and Paul, declaring what miracles and wonders God had wrought among the Gentiles by them.

13 And after they had held their peace, James answered, saying, Men and brethren, hearken unto me:

14 Simeon hath declared how God at the first did visit the Gentiles, to take out of them a people for his name.

15 And to this agree the words of the prophets; as it is written,

16 After this I will return, and will build again the tabernacle of David, which is fallen down; and I will build again the ruins thereof, and I will set it up:

17 That the residue of men might seek after the Lord, and all the Gentiles, upon whom my name is called, saith the Lord, who doeth all these things.

18 Known unto God are all his works from the beginning of the world.

19 Wherefore my sentence is, that we trouble not them, which from among the Gentiles are turned to God:

20 But that we write unto them, that they abstain from pollutions of idols, and from fornication, and from things strangled, and from blood.

21 For Moses of old time hath in every city them that preach him, being read in the synagogues every sabbath day.

22 Then pleased it the apostles and elders with the whole church, to send chosen men of their own company to Antioch with Paul and Barnabas; namely, Judas surnamed Barsabas and Silas, chief men among the brethren:

23 And they wrote letters by them after this manner; The apostles and elders and brethren send greeting unto the brethren which are of the Gentiles in Antioch and Syria and Cilicia.

24 Forasmuch as we have heard, that certain which went out from us have troubled you with words, subverting your souls, saying, Ye must be circumcised, and keep the law: to whom we gave no such commandment:

25 It seemed good unto us, being assembled with one accord, to send chosen men unto you with our beloved Barnabas and Paul,

26 Men that have hazarded their lives for the name of our Lord Jesus Christ.

27 We have sent therefore Judas and Silas, who shall also tell you the same things by mouth.

28 For it seemed good to the Holy Ghost, and to us, to lay upon you no greater burden than these necessary things;

29 That ye abstain from meats offered to idols, and from blood, and from things strangled, and from fornication: from which if ye keep yourselves, ye shall do well. Fare ye well.'

If v14 is correct then GOD is happy with the Gentiles who believed and it is not for you to condemn any who do not have your imaginary superior high calling .

Now wrap your pisteuo up in a palm leaf and put it away and become a real Christian and one day you will find your pisteuo has been turned to dust by moths.

 

[XRose]

Ministry of the Word is a calling, not a career or a profession (as is commonly held). And academic degrees are not required.

Jesus chose humble fishermen and a tax collector to preach the real Gospel while all the highly trained priests Jesus met and dealt with were so totally lacking in insight and scripture that they could not equate him with the messiah! Then compounded their errors and sentenced themselves to eternal obliteration by lying and demanding he be killed!

 

[Enoch111]

Jesus chose humble fishermen and a tax collector to preach the real Gospel while all the highly trained priests Jesus met and dealt with were so totally lacking in insight and scripture that they could not equate him with the messiah!

That is correct. Had Christians remained faithful to Scriptures, gifted elders within the churches would be teaching other men to minister, who would be teaching others to minister.

The Catholic Church introduced a bogus human priesthood as well as Scholasticism, which undermined the NT pattern. The Reformers failed to reject this totally.

"Scholasticism is not so much a philosophy or a theology as a method of learning, as it places a strong emphasis on dialectical reasoning to extend knowledge by inference and to resolve contradictions. Scholastic thought is also known for rigorous conceptual analysis and the careful drawing of distinctions. In the classroom and in writing, it often takes the form of explicit disputation; a topic drawn from the tradition is broached in the form of a question, opponents' responses are given, a counterproposal is argued and opponents' arguments rebutted. Because of its emphasis on rigorous dialectical method, scholasticism was eventually applied to many other fields of study...

...Some of the main figures [note these are all Catholics] of scholasticism include Anselm of Canterbury (the "father of scholasticism"), Peter Abelard, Alexander of Hales, Albertus Magnus, Duns Scotus, William of Ockham, Bonaventure, and Thomas Aquinas. Aquinas's masterwork Summa Theologica (1265–1274) is considered to be the pinnacle of scholastic, medieval, and Christian philosophy...

Quoted from Wikipedia

 

[Paul Christensen]

It is the job of the elders within the churches to train believers in how to study the Word of God, using all legitimate Bible tools.

And the things that thou hast heard of me among many witnesses, the same commit thou to faithful men, who shall be able to teach others also. (2 Tim 2:2)

And the servant of the Lord must not strive; but be gentle unto all men, apt to teach, patient...(2 Tim 2:24)

This is NOT the job of seminaries, and the issue of professionalism is BOGUS. Ministry of the Word is a calling, not a career or a profession (as is commonly held). And academic degrees are not required.

It's interesting how people switch their logical brains off when they become involved in church issues. The reason why training of the clergy came into being was because of the serious invasion of heresy into the church, and it was important to have ministers trained in sound Biblical doctrine.

Your view would work if there is a supply of appropriately trained and experienced elders who are able to teach others, but in smaller churches where there are none who are able to train younger ones coming up into ministry, where is that sound doctrinal training going to come from?

The problem is not that good training can be done in suitable educational facilities with trained teachers in sound doctrine, to provide the disciplined study and recognised qualifications that are needed for good, sound, ministers of the gospel. The problem is that many of the theological seminaries and other training facilities have been corrupted by non-Biblical liberal and evolution teaching, producing ministers who are in turn teaching others a false gospel. The number of conservative, reformed, evangelical ministry training facilities is very few and are declining and one has to be very careful when choosing a seminary if he wants to have sound, Biblical, doctrinal training.

The reality is, that those seminaries that are teaching non-Biblical, liberal, evolution-based material to ministers, is actually destroying the church and putting Christianity, as we know it, at risk. If it continues, in around two generations time, we may not have an organised church because the oldies will have all died out, and there will be no younger ones to take their place.

It is interesting that the atheists know that more clearly than many church leaders know themselves!

 

[XRose]

quote: 'If it continues, in around two generations time, we may not have an organised church'?
Do you really think we have two generation - 80 years - left in this system of things?
quote: 'because of the serious invasion of heresy into the church, and it was important to have ministers trained in sound Biblical doctrine.'
I think you really mean 'the lack of heresy... important to have ministers trained in unsound doctrine.'

today's big religions are either openly pagan, ecumenists or evolutionists. none are open to any suggestion they need to change back to offering real Bible truths.

You fall on your own sword by not knowing scripture.

 

[XRose]

I just wrote this on another thread: 'While the pagans, non-Christians, atheists and agnostics worry about COVID, sickness, money, food and shelter a Christian can rely on The Lord's Prayer: Give us this day...?'
Has anyone ever heard a minister. pastor, preacher speak on the Lord's Prayer and how it should offer comfort in difficult times?

 

[Huperetes]

I guess my question is why do the so called "gifted teachers" raise up ministries in their own name(yes..their name is on it) and make merchandise of God's people? A doctrine that Jesus hates is called "the doctrine of the Nicolatians" It comes from the roots "Nicol" to conquer and "laity" the people. Jesus hates when men exalt themselves over other men. Jesus told us very clearly how authority would work in His kingdom:

Mt 20:25-27 But Jesus called them unto him, and said, Ye know that the princes of the Gentiles exercise dominion over them, and they that are great exercise authority upon them.But it shall not be so among you: but whosoever will be great among you, let him be your minister;And whosoever will be chief among you, let him be your servant:

Mt 23:8-12
But be not ye called Rabbi(teacher): for one is your Master, even Christ; and all ye are brethren. And call no man your father upon the earth: for one is your Father, which is in heaven.Neither be ye called masters: for one is your Master, even Christ.But he that is greatest among you shall be your servant.And whosoever shall exalt himself shall be abased; and he that shall humble himself shall be exalted.

If an assembly is not functioning like above who are they following?

 

[XRose]

I have a reply letter to me from Archbishop of York - UK's highest Anglican for northern UK telling me I'm wrong for following Bible Creation and suggesting I should start reading evolution!
I have reply letter from head of city Anglican church threatening to report me to police for telling him that his inviting Muslims to worship 'allah' in his church was contrary to Bible teaching.
Other Anglican church members tellme they believe themselves evolved fom monkeys.

 

[charity]

I have a reply letter to me from Archbishop of York - UK's highest Anglican for northern UK telling me I'm wrong for following Bible Creation and suggesting I should start reading evolution!
I have reply letter from head of city Anglican church threatening to report me to police for telling him that his inviting Muslims to worship 'allah' in his church was contrary to Bible teaching.
Other Anglican church members tellme they believe themselves evolved fom monkeys.

Hello @XRose,

Sadly, why am I not surprised!!

In Christ Jesus
Chris

 

[Dcopymope]

I have a reply letter to me from Archbishop of York - UK's highest Anglican for northern UK telling me I'm wrong for following Bible Creation and suggesting I should start reading evolution!
I have reply letter from head of city Anglican church threatening to report me to police for telling him that his inviting Muslims to worship 'allah' in his church was contrary to Bible teaching.
Other Anglican church members tellme they believe themselves evolved fom monkeys.

Well now you know who your real enemies are, they exposed themselves. Your friends may be close to you, but your enemies will always be even closer. Best believe these will be the same creatures calling for our heads in the last days for not believing the lies of "the beast" and worshiping his "image".