WHY IS THE CHURCH GOING OUT BACKWARD?

[Truther]

No - the Church teaches as Scripture does that Jesus is the Good Shepherd (John 10:11-18) - who appointed Peter to shepherd His flock in His earthly absence (John 21:15-19).

STUDY your Bible, sparky . . .

If Jesus is the good Shepherd, then was Peter the good Shepherd too?...

Kinda good shepherd?

Okay shepherd.

Bad shepherd?

Is the Pope the good Shepherd too?

If not, then what kind of shepherd is he compared to Jesus, the Good Shepherd?

 

[Truther]

I am not in danger of being duped.
I have said my piece according to the Lord God.

Glory to God,
Taken

Rather, just say it to your one and only Shepherd and you will hear His voice(directly from Him).

Why bring the voice of a stranger in the conversation?...


4 And when he putteth forth his own sheep, he goeth before them, and the sheep follow him: for they know his voice.

5 And a stranger will they not follow, but will flee from him: for they know not the voice of strangers...

 

[Enoch111]

If Jesus is the good Shepherd, then was Peter the good Shepherd too?...

You continue to confuse Christ the Good Shepherd with His under-shepherds. So before going any further, do some serious Bible study.

 

[Truther]

You continue to confuse Christ the Good Shepherd with His under-shepherds. So before going any further, do some serious Bible study.

No, you confuse what Christ said about being the ONLY Shepherd...

11 I am the good shepherd: the good shepherd giveth his life for the sheep.

14 I am the good shepherd, and know my sheep, and am known of mine.

16 And other sheep I have, which are not of this fold: them also I must bring, and they shall hear my voice; and there shall be one fold, and one shepherd.


Do you know any other good shepherds other than Jesus?

Are these good shepherds in addition to the ONE shepherd in verse 16?

 

[Enoch111]

Do you know any other good shepherds other than Jesus?

Do you know what the Bible teaches, and are you prepared to listen to the Word of God? Well listen closely and accept the truth:

ACTS 20: ELDERS ARE SHEPHERDS AND OVERSEERS
17 And from Miletus he sent to Ephesus, and called the elders of the church...
26 Wherefore I take you to record this day, that I am pure from the blood of all men.
27 For I have not shunned to declare unto you all the counsel of God.
28 Take heed therefore unto yourselves, and to all the flock, over the which the Holy Ghost hath made you overseers, to feed the church of God, which he hath purchased with his own blood.
29 For I know this, that after my departing shall grievous wolves enter in among you, not sparing the flock.
30 Also of your own selves shall men arise, speaking perverse things, to draw away disciples after them.
31 Therefore watch, and remember, that by the space of three years I ceased not to warn every one night and day with tears.

1 PETER 5: ELDERS ARE SHEPHERDS AND OVERSEERS
1The elders which are among you I exhort, who am also an elder, and a witness of the sufferings of Christ, and also a partaker of the glory that shall be revealed:
2 Feed the flock of God which is among you, taking the oversight thereof, not by constraint, but willingly; not for filthy lucre, but of a ready mind;
3 Neither as being lords over God's heritage, but being ensamples to the flock.
4 And when the Chief Shepherd shall appear, ye shall receive a crown of glory that fadeth not away.

1. If there is a "Chief Shepherd" then it follows that there are under-shepherds.
2. If there is a flock, then it follows that there are shepherds.
3. If there are shepherds, it follows that they are responsible to see that the sheep are fed and watered.
4. If there are shepherds, it follows that they are there to protect the sheep from wolves.

 

[Taken]

Rather, just say it to your one and only Shepherd and you will hear His voice(directly from Him).

Why bring the voice of a stranger in the conversation?...

WHY?
Because:
Men hear a voice to communicate.
Because:
Some men are Gifted with the Holy Spirit to Teach.
Because:
Any man hearing another man teach, preach, tend Christ's flock in any particular manner ARE men who "are supposed" to Scripturally Verify what they hear from men.

4 And when he putteth forth his own sheep, he goeth before them, and the sheep follow him: for they know his voice.

Yes I know his voice SPIRITUALLY, SUPERNATURALLY...but I do not Audibly or Naturally hear His Voice.

He has Appointed men to Audibly Naturally Speak on His Behalf, according to His Word, to men who Can Hear Naturally.

Not sure your purpose of carrying on about Christ's Servants...and if they being Acceptable to Christ Himself, why you are trying to supersede what Christ Himself revealed is what He established and Authorized.

Glory to God,
Taken

 

[BreadOfLife]

If Jesus is the good Shepherd, then was Peter the good Shepherd too?...
Kinda good shepherd?
Okay shepherd.
Bad shepherd?
Is the Pope the good Shepherd too?
If not, then what kind of shepherd is he compared to Jesus, the Good Shepherd?

What did Jesus ask Peter to do in John 21:15-19??

Take your time, Einstein . . .

 

[Truther]

What did Jesus ask Peter to do in John 21:15-19??

Take your time, Einstein . . .

Feed the sheep, not shepherd them.

 

[Truther]

Do you know what the Bible teaches, and are you prepared to listen to the Word of God? Well listen closely and accept the truth:

ACTS 20: ELDERS ARE SHEPHERDS AND OVERSEERS
17 And from Miletus he sent to Ephesus, and called the elders of the church...
26 Wherefore I take you to record this day, that I am pure from the blood of all men.
27 For I have not shunned to declare unto you all the counsel of God.
28 Take heed therefore unto yourselves, and to all the flock, over the which the Holy Ghost hath made you overseers, to feed the church of God, which he hath purchased with his own blood.
29 For I know this, that after my departing shall grievous wolves enter in among you, not sparing the flock.
30 Also of your own selves shall men arise, speaking perverse things, to draw away disciples after them.
31 Therefore watch, and remember, that by the space of three years I ceased not to warn every one night and day with tears.

1 PETER 5: ELDERS ARE SHEPHERDS AND OVERSEERS
1The elders which are among you I exhort, who am also an elder, and a witness of the sufferings of Christ, and also a partaker of the glory that shall be revealed:
2 Feed the flock of God which is among you, taking the oversight thereof, not by constraint, but willingly; not for filthy lucre, but of a ready mind;
3 Neither as being lords over God's heritage, but being ensamples to the flock.
4 And when the Chief Shepherd shall appear, ye shall receive a crown of glory that fadeth not away.

1. If there is a "Chief Shepherd" then it follows that there are under-shepherds.
2. If there is a flock, then it follows that there are shepherds.
3. If there are shepherds, it follows that they are responsible to see that the sheep are fed and watered.
4. If there are shepherds, it follows that they are there to protect the sheep from wolves.

You just debunked this....

16 And other sheep I have, which are not of this fold: them also I must bring, and they shall hear my voice; and there shall be one fold, and one shepherd.


Maybe next there will be multiple folds also?

 

[BreadOfLife]

Feed the sheep, not shepherd them.

WRONG.
THIS is hat Jesus asked Peter to do:

John 21:15 - “Feed my lambs.”
John 21:16 - “TEND my sheep.”
John 21:17 - “Feed my sheep.

He told him to Feed and TEND his sheep.
That's the definition of a "shepherd", Einstein.

 

[mjrhealth]

WRONG.
THIS is hat Jesus asked Peter to do:

John 21:15 - “Feed my lambs.”
John 21:16 - “TEND my sheep.”
John 21:17 - “Feed my sheep.

He told him to Feed and TEND his sheep.
That's the definition of a "shepherd", Einstein.

You are obviously not one...Jeus didnt say "kill them".

 

[BreadOfLife]

You are obviously not one...Jeus didnt say "kill them".

HUH??
I never claimed to be a shepherd - and I've never killed anyone . . .

 

[Truther]

WRONG.
THIS is hat Jesus asked Peter to do:

John 21:15 - “Feed my lambs.”
John 21:16 - “TEND my sheep.”
John 21:17 - “Feed my sheep.

He told him to Feed and TEND his sheep.
That's the definition of a "shepherd", Einstein.

The Shepherd has volunteer help to feed HIS sheep.

Not, the feed HELPERS' sheep.

I hope some farmer never hires you to feed his animals, lest you confiscate them as your animals.

 

[BreadOfLife]

The Shepherd has volunteer help to feed HIS sheep.
Not, the feed HELPERS' sheep.
I hope some farmer never hires you to feed his animals, lest you confiscate them as your animals.

A completely asinine understanding of Scripture.

A shepherd is a shepherd - and Peter's role described in John 21:15-19 is just that.

 

[Chris1964]

I go to church and I am an elder.

I have only one Shepherd, that is Jesus.

How many shepherds do you have, including Jesus?

So you have no pastor? A leaderless congregation? Sounds like an odd church. Definitely not n.t.

 

[Truther]

So you have no pastor? A leaderless congregation? Sounds like an odd church. Definitely not n.t.

No, there is a pastor(elder) but he is not Jesus the Shepherd.

 

[Truther]

A completely asinine understanding of Scripture.

A shepherd is a shepherd - and Peter's role described in John 21:15-19 is just that.

I see.

The ONE Shepherd per John 10 split of into thousands of shepherds to do His talking to the sheep for Him.

His sheep now hear THEIR voices.

That is goofy and unscriptural.

 

[BreadOfLife]

I see.
The ONE Shepherd per John 10 split of into thousands of shepherds to do His talking to the sheep for Him.
His sheep now hear THEIR voices.
That is goofy and unscriptural.

The only thing "goofy and unscriptural" is your denial of God's Word.

John 21:15 - “Feed my lambs.”
John 21:16 - “TEND my sheep.”
John 21:17 - “Feed my sheep.

Yup - the very DEFINITION of a "Shepherd", Einstein.

 

[ScottA]

I know that this is a very overarching heading/comment and many will say it is not because of this church and that church and that lot are doing a good job. But that as it may be, and I don't decry the fact, but if one is to be honest with themselves overall, the church is going out backward.

As I said elsewhere I was talking to a friend and he said that his church has no one under 55 years of age and only two teenagers who are children of members. The church of the same denomination in the next town has no one under 50 years of age.

Most of the churches in my area (45) do not have anyone under 40 years of age. In days gone by I cannot remember being part of any church that did not have teenagers in attendance.

To overcome this, I approached both ministers fraternals in both towns about uniting in evangelism projects. The first one said, "Go away, we are the ones paid to do things around here." The second one said, "We don't have time to do evangelism we are too busy running our churches."

The first one I think got upset because I asked them how many people had been saved in the last year amongst all their churches. The answer was three. My reply was "Doesn't that speak for itself."

"You naughty boy. How dare you suggest we are not perfect."

So, why are so many churches stuck in the mud and are controlled by the status quo especially as the NTC saw things like 3,000 getting saved at one meeting?

There must be reasons and answers so let's see what we can come up with. And can I ask that you think about this before adding your thoughts as I would rather not have off the cuff ideas that are shallow?

Most churches are "stuck in the mud" because they have not and do not "seek first the kingdom of God and His righteousness." Which is to say, they instead seek to apply the literal word of God to worldly matters, rather than understanding that the words are not literal in a worldly sense, but are spirit.

 

[mjrhealth]

All I can say is because "mens" religions and churches are not from God, and God wont be a part of that what is not of Him.