WHY IS THE CHURCH GOING OUT BACKWARD?

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Pearl

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I don't the Church is going out backwards or any other way.

While there are still Christians, i.e. followers of Jesus, there is a Church. Granted that some branches of the church seem to be failing but that is probably because they are not listening to the Holy Spirit and allowing Him to lead them forwards.

In my town there are at least two growing churches that are filled with mixed age groups where the older people are outnumbered by younger ones.
 
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Nancy

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I don't the Church is going out backwards or any other way.

While there are still Christians, i.e. followers of Jesus, there is a Church. Granted that some branches of the church seem to be failing but that is probably because they are not listening to the Holy Spirit and allowing Him to lead them forwards.

In my town there are at least two growing churches that are filled with mixed age groups where the older people are outnumbered by younger ones.

Same here Pat. My Church has 4 locations and there are more of the younger folks there than the older. Although we have all ages, the young are by far the majority.
In my last Church, it was the opposite.

And, you hit the nail on the head...the ones not allowing the Holy Spirit to lead are dying out.
xo
 
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Bobby Jo

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... not allowing the Holy Spirit to lead are dying out.
xo

... I agree, but think it's more than that. I believe that the HIRELING manages what we hear, how we hear it, and who we hear if from, to prevent anyone raising a question and causing "confusion" which might jeopardize the HIRELING's business model.

So where Scripture calls for us to seek and receive from GOD, the HIRELING wants to seek and receive from him/her. And so we're not equipping ourselves, but instead becoming pew-potatoes. And then when the persecution comes, even the "strongest" of us will be like Peter in the courtyard and deny Jesus.

Bobby Jo
 
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Bobby Jo

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The Bible speaks of the Church at____, and the Church at _______. So, are you saying that there is not One Church? Or can we have many Churches that are part of a greater singular Church Body?
How does that factor into your 'agenda'?

I'm not sure why you're asking me a question for which I've offered no opinion. Did you intend this for another?

Bobby Jo
 

Nancy

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... I agree, but think it's more than that. I believe that the HIRELING manages what we hear, how we hear it, and who we hear if from, to prevent anyone raising a question and causing "confusion" which might jeopardize the HIRELING's business model.

So where Scripture calls for us to seek and receive from GOD, the HIRELING wants to seek and receive from him/her. And so we're not equipping ourselves, but instead becoming pew-potatoes. And then when the persecution comes, even the "strongest" of us will be like Peter in the courtyard and deny Jesus.

Bobby Jo

I do understand what you are saying and it is very true. Yet, will you put every pastor, every Church in a box? There are some wonderful Church's still, far and few between but...if someone is looking for a good bible teaching Church, they need to pray and search where in their local bodies they can become a part of it.
Yes, mainline evangelical Christianity has moved very far from what the Apostles taught...they are afraid to, don't want to "offend" someone and "oh gee, can't do that because our coffers will dwindle (biting nails)" they do not depend on God blessing a Church but people and their money, sad.
 
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BreadOfLife

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16 And other sheep I have, which are not of this fold: them also I must bring, and they shall hear my voice; and there shall be one
fold, and one shepherd.
YES, IT DOES.
Actually, Jesus make Peter a Shepherd in John 21:15-19 . . .
When they had finished breakfast, Jesus said to Simon Peter, “Simon, son of John, do you love me more than these?” He said to him, “Yes, Lord; you know that I love you.” He said to him, “Feed my lambs.” He said to him a second time, “Simon, son of John, do you love me?” He said to him, “Yes, Lord; you know that I love you.” He said to him, “Tend my sheep.” He said to him the third time, “Simon, son of John, do you love me?” Peter was grieved because he said to him the third time, “Do you love me?” and he said to him, “Lord, you know everything; you know that I love you.” Jesus said to him, “Feed my sheep.
Truly, truly, I say to you, when you were young, you used to dress yourself and walk wherever you wanted, but when you are old, you will stretch out your hands, and another will dress you and carry you where you do not want to go.” (This he said to show by what kind of death he was to glorify God.) And after saying this he said to him, “Follow me.”


I thought you said there was only ONE . . .
 

Bobby Jo

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I do understand what you are saying and it is very true. Yet, will you put every pastor, every Church in a box? ...

Hi Nancy,

Yes and no. Yes, because the cemeteries (sometimes spelled seminaries) train their students to run the church like a business, do ALL the preaching, and control everything that's taught to prevent confusion.

And No, because some people actually have a calling where they work to strengthen the body by exercising their giftings, which may include running the services like an open discussion classroom, much like when Jesus was handed the Book of Isaiah. -- But I haven't seen any using this model.

With Best Regards,
Bobby Jo
 
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Nancy

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Hi Nancy,

Yes and no. Yes, because the cemeteries (sometimes spelled seminaries) train their students to run the church like a business, do ALL the preaching, and control everything that's taught to prevent confusion.

And No, because some people actually have a calling where they work to strengthen the body by exercising their giftings, which may include running the services like an open discussion classroom, much like when Jesus was handed the Book of Isaiah. -- But I haven't seen any using this model.

With Best Regards,
Bobby Jo

I do absolutely love my small group, above and beyond Sunday services!!! We talk about a ton of things but, of course, we do have cards made up with scripture verses from the sermon and questions for our small groups to go over but...that is over in like 5 minutes! The best part is gathering in His name to discuss our thoughts, questions and concerns. We pray and eat together so...I will continue to go to services, not just because of the small groups but I have a sister and a niece who are now going with me and are still on the bottle (MILK!! lol)
 

Truther

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Actually, Jesus make Peter a Shepherd in John 21:15-19 . . .
When they had finished breakfast, Jesus said to Simon Peter, “Simon, son of John, do you love me more than these?” He said to him, “Yes, Lord; you know that I love you.” He said to him, “Feed my lambs.” He said to him a second time, “Simon, son of John, do you love me?” He said to him, “Yes, Lord; you know that I love you.” He said to him, “Tend my sheep.” He said to him the third time, “Simon, son of John, do you love me?” Peter was grieved because he said to him the third time, “Do you love me?” and he said to him, “Lord, you know everything; you know that I love you.” Jesus said to him, “Feed my sheep.
Truly, truly, I say to you, when you were young, you used to dress yourself and walk wherever you wanted, but when you are old, you will stretch out your hands, and another will dress you and carry you where you do not want to go.” (This he said to show by what kind of death he was to glorify God.) And after saying this he said to him, “Follow me.”


I thought you said there was only ONE . . .
I see.
The RCC teaches that Jesus relinquished his position as the ONE Shepherd(John 10) to His volunteer help, designated to feed His sheep.
 

Truther

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In some cases yes...but that is not what Jesus taught.

Glory to God,
Taken
Jesus taught 1(one) Shepherd.
"The Lord is my Shepherd"
Is the Lord your shepherd or one of them?
 

Truther

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...because they don't believe the Lord is their Shepherd, but MAN is their shepherd, and they put man before God.

A prominent pastor in my area stood up a couple in service, then told the man that he was the head of his wife, then the pastor said that he (pastor) was the head of the husband, the Christ was the head of the pastor.

My jaw dropped, but this is the common idea of the sub-shepherd syndrome in churches today.
 

BreadOfLife

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I see.
The RCC teaches that Jesus relinquished his position as the ONE Shepherd(John 10) to His volunteer help, designated to feed His sheep.
No - the Church teaches as Scripture does that Jesus is the Good Shepherd (John 10:11-18) - who appointed Peter to shepherd His flock in His earthly absence (John 21:15-19).

STUDY your Bible, sparky . . .
 

Taken

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Jesus taught 1(one) Shepherd.
"The Lord is my Shepherd"
Is the Lord your shepherd or one of them?

The Lord IS MY Shepherd.
Yet I do not undermine men the Lord has authorized men to Work (face to face) with men, on behalf of the Lord...(who is presently Not (face to face) with men).

The Lord Sent and sends men to tend the Lords sheep/flock.
(You can call them agents, shepherds, Servants, or whatever you want)...they are men, acting (face to face with men) in Christ's Stead on behalf of the Lord...who is currently NOT, face to face with men.

It does NOT undermine or change the FACT;
the Lord IS the "Appointed" Shepherd OF God.
And men ARE the "Appointed" shepherds OF Christ Jesus.

Glory to God,
Taken
 
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Chris1964

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...because they don't believe the Lord is their Shepherd, but MAN is their shepherd, and they put man before God.

A prominent pastor in my area stood up a couple in service, then told the man that he was the head of his wife, then the pastor said that he (pastor) was the head of the husband, the Christ was the head of the pastor.

My jaw dropped, but this is the common idea of the sub-shepherd syndrome in churches today.
You didn't click the link. It goes to an earlier post where i had addressed something previously. Anyway, do you go to church at all? Or do you stay home an let Jesus do the shepherding? I'd like to know how that works if thats the case. But if you do go to church what is the name of the guy that gives the sermon or homily? And don't say pastor because pastor means shepherd in the greek. So what does this person do and what are they called?
 

Truther

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You didn't click the link. It goes to an earlier post where i had addressed something previously. Anyway, do you go to church at all? Or do you stay home an let Jesus do the shepherding? I'd like to know how that works if thats the case. But if you do go to church what is the name of the guy that gives the sermon or homily? And don't say pastor because pastor means shepherd in the greek. So what does this person do and what are they called?
I go to church and I am an elder.

I have only one Shepherd, that is Jesus.

How many shepherds do you have, including Jesus?
 

Truther

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The Lord IS MY Shepherd.
Yet I do not undermine men the Lord has authorized men to Work (face to face) with men, on behalf of the Lord...(who is presently Not (face to face) with men).

The Lord Sent and sends men to tend the Lords sheep/flock.
(You can call them agents, shepherds, Servants, or whatever you want)...they are men, acting (face to face with men) in Christ's Stead on behalf of the Lord...who is currently NOT, face to face with men.

It does NOT undermine or change the FACT;
the Lord IS the "Appointed" Shepherd OF God.
And men ARE the "Appointed" shepherds OF Christ Jesus.

Glory to God,
Taken
The Lord is your Shepherd and men are your fellow laborers.

Don't ever put a man as a liaison "shepherd"to your Lord.

His sheep hear HIS voice, and not the voice of a stranger.

Learn to hear His voice, then you will never be duped.
 

Taken

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The Lord is your Shepherd and men are your fellow laborers.

Don't ever put a man as a liaison "shepherd"to your Lord.

His sheep hear HIS voice, and not the voice of a stranger.

Learn to hear His voice, then you will never be duped.

I am not in danger of being duped.
I have said my piece according to the Lord God.

Glory to God,
Taken