You are a heretic according to the entire Church and scripture. You are more of a Muslim or Jew than you are a Christian because of your Antichrist views of God.
Why John 6:37 is grossly misunderstood and misapplied
- Thread starter Enoch111
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So then what do you believe predestination is based on if not your foreseen faith?
You are not in Paul's company. He condemned the man of sin and John says you have his spirit.
Sure. The answer is simple: Nothing. This is one of the great mysteries of God that cannot be explained, and in my opinion we honestly have no right demanding an answer to from God. He is the Creator and Sustainer of all things, and is free to dispense grace however he sees fit. If I must give an answer, it would be that God predestines based on what will bring Him maximum glory, for that is the REAL goal of salvation; God's glory.
Ok, so now your answer.
Yes, it is based on foreknowledge of whether we will have faith; for nothing as the basis of foreknowledge is an invalid answer: foreknowledge has to be based on something or it has nothing to do with knowledge of anything; but rather would be a predetermined choice based on no knowledge whatsoever.
So now faith in Jesus is proclaimed to be self-righteousness by you...
This makes me agree wholeheartedly with the doctrine of Total Depravity...for this kind of depraved thinking would not exist without it being a reality.
You are a liar and your father is the devil, the accuser of the brethren.
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I'm sorry but this answer is not valid either. With this same logic, I could tell you that there is no possible way that God created the universe from nothing; nothing can come from nothing. And yet here we are. God is not like us in power and ability, nor in the sense of choices and decisions; there is nothing that spurns Him to do anything other than His good pleasure and glory.
Also, I will ask again;
So, if you believe that we are saved because we attain a foreseen faith, that we are saved because we do something, then you must believe in works righteousness.
Is this what you believe? Works righteousness?
this is exactly my point, and is the complete opposite of saying that God chooses based on foreseen faith. I did know this, and this was my very point; that predestination cannot be based on foreseen faith, otherwise it is of works, which these verses clearly state against. So either your logic was wrong or these verses are. I have to go with the verses.
The obvious answer is that faith comes by hearing and hearing by the word of the Lord...
A preacher is therefore indispensable according to Romans 10.
A preacher is therefore indispensable according to Romans 10.
Faith is more of a reaction if you do not want to consider it to be a choice that we make.
The same heat that melts the butter hardens the clay.
Does the clay make a choice to be hardened; and does the butter make a choice to melt?
We don't know; but it should be clear that the butter melts because it is butter and the clay hardens because it is clay.
The same heat that melts the butter hardens the clay.
Does the clay make a choice to be hardened; and does the butter make a choice to melt?
We don't know; but it should be clear that the butter melts because it is butter and the clay hardens because it is clay.
We do know, and the answer is no, no the clay does not make the choice to be hardened while the butter chooses to melt. This more than anything you've said illustrates what I am trying to say; no amount of choice or reaction can make the clay melt, or the butter harden; it is beyond their power, just as choosing saving faith is beyond the power of our deprived wills.
And regarding you definition of faith as a reaction; the question is a reaction to what?
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