With So Many Denominations...

[amadeus]

are you meaning nehushtan to refer to the Bible in this post?

If a person, [or people], does [do] with the Bible what the children of Israel did with the serpent of brass about 700 years after it was made by Moses, then, yes!

 

[amadeus]

I see this more as having received righteousness from Christ, and then thinking that I can add something to it.

Much love!

It may be related to this verse:

"And let us not be weary in well doing: for in due season we shall reap, if we faint not." Gal 6:9

 

[marks]

It may be related to this verse:

"And let us not be weary in well doing: for in due season we shall reap, if we faint not." Gal 6:9

Reaping the harvest!

Sowing in the morning, sowing seeds of kindness . . .

Much love!

 

[Brakelite]

I'm all ears.

Well, nobody's perfect.

 

[Marymog]

Update: I'm afraid I haven't made myself very clear. My intentions were to provoke critical/analytical thought harnessed by Scripture--not to solicit personal suggestions per se (not that I couldn't use some, of course). With all of the bright hearts and minds I've encountered so far, in the end we all go away with some useful knowledge.
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With all the many Christian denominations and sects out there, how can one know which one is closest to teaching the truth about Jesus and the Gospel, especially if they all claim to be arriving at truth through basically the same method?

Hi,

You asked: How can one know which one is closest to teaching the truth?

My answer: By going to the writings of the ones who lived closest to the time the Teacher of that truth lived.

The writings of Clement of Rome, Ignatius of Antioch and Polycarp should be held in high regard since they were students of the Apostles!

God bless, Historical Mary

 

[BarneyFife]

Hi,

You asked: How can one know which one is closest to teaching the truth?

My answer: By going to the writings of the ones who lived closest to the time the Teacher of that truth lived.

The writings of Clement of Rome, Ignatius of Antioch and Polycarp should be held in high regard since they were students of the Apostles!

God bless, Historical Mary

Thanks for participating!

 

[Brakelite]

Hi,

You asked: How can one know which one is closest to teaching the truth?

My answer: By going to the writings of the ones who lived closest to the time the Teacher of that truth lived.

The writings of Clement of Rome, Ignatius of Antioch and Polycarp should be held in high regard since they were students of the Apostles!

God bless, Historical Mary

Mmm. But not the apostles themselves?

 

[Enoch111]

This inner man, I want to understand what you mean. This is the person who is born in this body of flesh, in our physical birth? The person we are inside at birth?

Quite the opposite. The inner man is the new creature in Christ who is born of the Spirit and therefore walks in the Spirit.

What you are referring to is "the old man" (the old Adamic nature, called "the flesh").

 

[BarneyFife]

Quite the opposite. The inner man is the new creature in Christ who is born of the Spirit and therefore walks in the Spirit.

What you are referring to is "the old man" (the old Adamic nature, called "the flesh").

I don't think the inner and outer man are related to the old and new man.

 

[Enoch111]

I don't think the inner and outer man are related to the old and new man.

Well you need to go by Scripture, not your thinking. And here is what the Bible has to say: That he would grant you, according to the riches of his glory, to be strengthened with might by his Spirit in the inner man; (Eph 3:16)

This clearly shows that the inner man is the new man created in Christ Jesus, hence he needs to be strengthened by the indwelling Holy Spirit. The inner man is another term for the quickened spirit of the believer, who is not only regenerated to have a new nature, but has a new spirit indwelt by the Holy Spirit.

 

[Marymog]

Mmm. But not the apostles themselves?

Do you interpret the words of the Apostles to come to your Truth or do you rely on others Interpretation

I am simply answering the following question in the OP submitted by @BarnyFife:

With all the many Christian denominations and sects out there, how can one know which one is closest to teaching the truth about Jesus and the Gospel, especially if they all claim to be arriving at truth through basically the same method?

Is it not true that All Christian denominations believe they have gone to “the Apostles themselves” and they believe THEY are “closest to teaching the truth about Jesus and the Gospel”

Some Christians accept interpretation of Scripture from men of the 16th century. I accept the interpretation of the men who were students of the Apostles. Soooo who’s interpretation do you accept?


Barnny5 also said: I woke up one day when I was 23 years old and realized that I just believed what my family believed about God. A, B, C, 1, 2, 3--right down the line.

I don’t think there is anything wrong with that. Unless you think that your family (parents) didn’t teach you the Truth?


Mary

 

[Brakelite]

Do you interpret the words of the Apostles to come to your Truth or do you rely on others Interpretation

The Bible and the writings of scripture aren't all that difficult to understand. If people go off into tangents and strange teachings it isn't the fault of scripture. You say you would rather rely on the explanations of the church fathers than on scripture itself. Why?

 

[CadyandZoe]

With all the many Christian denominations and sects out there, how can one know which one is closest to teaching the truth about Jesus and the Gospel, especially if they all claim to be arriving at truth through basically the same method?

Suppose we have four paintings, one original and three copies. The only way one can know which of the copies is closest to the original is to place them side-by-side and compare them. Therefore, if one wants to know which denominational dogma is closest to the teachings of Jesus, one needs to first understand the teachings of Jesus. That is, one first needs to study the bible and come to an independent understanding of what Jesus taught. Then compare the original to the copies.

a) Who, honestly, actually does that? We're all influenced by teachers to some degree, and we're affected by our environment, experiences, upbringing and, most hopefully, the Holy Spirit, Himself. And doesn't the Bible Itself even suggest that at least some or most of us have to be taught?; and

Find a humble teacher. One who exhibits intellectual integrity. One that will say, "I don't know" when he or she doesn't know. One who will challenge you to study the passage yourself and draw your own conclusions and be prepared to dialog with teacher when it appears that the teacher made a mistake.

b) If we're cautioned not to forsake the assembling of ourselves together, especially near the end of time (and if we aren't close now I don't even want to imagine what "close" looks like), is it really God's will that we should have no place to go on a regular basis to meet and worship with others who believe as we do?

It is God's will that we meet together, whether openly or in secret.

I've noticed that when people fiercely protect a doctrine, it's usually one that seems to have (seemingly) conflicting evidence even from the Bible alone.

Being wrong, or realizing that I made a mistake makes me very uncomfortable. Independent study is very scary, and it takes a bit of courage. Relying on experts is comforting and it feels "safe." Since our beliefs have existential implications (beliefs that pertain to our very existence) challenges to our belief's feel like threats to our safety, well-being or even our very existence. This, I believe, explains the intensity of the reaction.

 

[Marymog]

The Bible and the writings of scripture aren't all that difficult to understand. If people go off into tangents and strange teachings it isn't the fault of scripture. You say you would rather rely on the explanations of the church fathers than on scripture itself. Why?

Hi,

According to your answer I believe you are saying that you rely on yourself to properly interpret Scripture. Soooo let me see if I have your theory correct.

You believe that Scripture is not “that difficult to understand”? If Your theory were correct then why did Peter say about Pauls letters: His letters contain some things that are hard to understand, which ignorant and unstable people distort, as they do the other Scriptures, to their own destruction? Pauls letters were difficult to understand for the Christians who walked and talked with the Apostles. Why are Pauls letters (or any part of Scripture) not difficult for YOU to understand 2,000 years later?

Who decides what a “strange teaching” is?

To answer your question: I would rather rely on the explanations of the Apostolic Fathers because they were students of the Apostles. Who’s explanations do you rely on?

Curious Mary

 

[Marymog]

Suppose we have four paintings, one original and three copies. The only way one can know which of the copies is closest to the original is to place them side-by-side and compare them. Therefore, if one wants to know which denominational dogma is closest to the teachings of Jesus, one needs to first understand the teachings of Jesus. That is, one first needs to study the bible and come to an independent understanding of what Jesus taught. Then compare the original to the copies.

Hi,

We have the writings of the The Apostolic Fathers who were students of the Apostles. We also have the writings Wycliffe, Luther and Calvin. Using your analogy, that makes 4 paintings!! They all studied scripture; or were students of the men who wrote Scripture in the case of the Apostolic Fathers.

Which painting should I cherish the most? Which of those men’s “dogma is closest to the teachings of Jesus”?

Mary

 

[Brakelite]

According to your answer I believe you are saying that you rely on yourself to properly interpret Scripture.

No, God forbid.
KJV John 14
17 Even the Spirit of truth; whom the world cannot receive, because it seeth him not, neither knoweth him: but ye know him; for he dwelleth with you, and shall be in you.
KJV John 17
17 Sanctify them through thy truth: thy word is truth.
20 Neither pray I for these alone, but for them also which shall believe on me through their word;

Jesus is here praying that the holy Spirit Will lead His people into truth through His word. You think His Father answered that prayer in the affirmative or negative?

which ignorant and unstable people distort,

Pauls letters were difficult to understand for the Christians who walked and talked with the Apostles.

Are you suggesting I'm ignorant and unstable? Surely not. It was only difficult for the ignorant and unstable. Peter didn't say anything about Paul's letters being difficult for anyone who had the Spirit of God leading and guiding their hearts and minds. Do we not have the mind of Christ?

 

[CadyandZoe]

Hi,

We have the writings of the The Apostolic Fathers who were students of the Apostles. We also have the writings Wycliffe, Luther and Calvin. Using your analogy, that makes 4 paintings!! They all studied scripture; or were students of the men who wrote Scripture in the case of the Apostolic Fathers.

Which painting should I cherish the most? Which of those men’s “dogma is closest to the teachings of Jesus”?

Mary

I honestly don't know Mary. I wish I could help you but unfortunately, I guess, I never looked at those other paintings. Perhaps you might be better able to answer that question?

 

[Marymog]

No, God forbid.
KJV John 14
17 Even the Spirit of truth; whom the world cannot receive, because it seeth him not, neither knoweth him: but ye know him; for he dwelleth with you, and shall be in you.
KJV John 17
17 Sanctify them through thy truth: thy word is truth.
20 Neither pray I for these alone, but for them also which shall believe on me through their word;

Jesus is here praying that the holy Spirit Will lead His people into truth through His word. You think His Father answered that prayer in the affirmative or negative?


Are you suggesting I'm ignorant and unstable? Surely not. It was only difficult for the ignorant and unstable. Peter didn't say anything about Paul's letters being difficult for anyone who had the Spirit of God leading and guiding their hearts and minds. Do we not have the mind of Christ?

Uggg....Your answer makes no sense. Soooo do you believe that the Holy Spirit has guided YOU to the “truth through His word” and the people that disagree with you (like the Apostolic Fathers) were NOT guided to the truth through His word?

I am not suggesting that YOU are “ignorant and unstable”. I am suggesting that someone is ignorant and unstable. When your interpretation is different than another mans interpretation how do we determine which interpretation is ignorant and unstable? Which one of you has “the Spirit of God leading and guiding their hearts and minds.” From your answer it seems you believe that YOU have the Spirit of God guiding YOU!!

You do know that in the verses you quoted Jesus was speaking to his Apostles ONLY? It was meant for them ONLY!! How can we know if YOU or LUTHER or CALVIN or the Apostolic Fathers or any other teacher/preacher was being guided by the Holy Spirit when all your “truths” are different and all of you BELIEVE you are being guided by the Spirit? What a conundrum.....

 

[Nancy]

Well, nobody's perfect.

 

[Marymog]

I honestly don't know Mary. I wish I could help you but unfortunately, I guess, I never looked at those other paintings. Perhaps you might be better able to answer that question?

I cherish the interpretations of the men who were students of the Apostles not the teachings of men who came 1500 years later.