The first horseman of the Apocalypse

[Stumpmaster]

Why are you calling them hypothetical? They're future headlines. Except that it's maybe the Pope, maybe Israel or maybe Israel's false Messiah who performs miracles causing millions to flock to receive his mark. What ever the case may be, it's the false prophet doing the miracles.

I have to think such headlines are hypothetical for mainstream media because I doubt they will be allowed to publish the truth.

BTW, P.O.P.E. = President Of Planet Earth, in nature if not in name.

 

[Zao is life]

I have to think such headlines are hypothetical for mainstream media because I doubt they will be allowed to publish the truth.

BTW, P.O.P.E. = President Of Planet Earth, in nature if not in name.

Well he still has competition a.t.m. Someone is going to come out on top. Someone who will have to subdue the protest of 3 of the ten. Many take that to mean he destroys them or takes them out of the way, but I don't believe it does. It simply means he will need to subdue 3 of them, "show them whose boss" in order to rise above them all.

 

[Zao is life]

working - maybe later tonight or next day - peace

What you quoted was said toTimtoFly not to you (just in case you replied because you thought it was you).

 

[David in NJ]

To Fullness of the Gentiles
I like everything you have said except the difference between the Seal Judgements of the Four Horseman and the crown GIVEN to the first Rider - To me this is clear evidence it is not the Lord Jesus Christ.

#1.) Christ is not contained by the Seal - the Seal signifies what is contained in it is UNDER the authority of God/Christ.
#2.) The rider has no name - this again shows us it is not the Lord Jesus
#3.) Crown was GIVEN to the rider with no name - again, this shows many antichrist receive their authority
#4.) The Bow is not the Gospel - The SWORD of the Spirit is the Gospel - ALWAYS referred to as a SWORD -out of His mouth.
#5.) These are Judgements upon and against the world - this clearly not the Gospel to Save men
#6.) These four horses/riders each have there own distinct purpose - NONE of which is GOOD.
#7.) Wearing a White and having a Crown - many antichrist - just as out Lord has told us and 1John 2:18
#8.) Our Lord has a Crown and a Sickle to Reap - Crown was not given to Him, He has a Sickle not a Bow - Christ is not the 1st Horseman

***** This is MOST IMPORTANT ***** If you miss this you miss EVERYTHING *****

The Four Horses are sent to EARTH for Judgement -
The Lord Jesus Christ will NOT and CANNOT return to Earth until His Second Coming -
change this and you corrupt Scripture and commit a horrible sin - Rev 22:18-19

So when they came together, they asked Him, “Lord, will You at this time restore the kingdom to Israel?”
Jesus replied, “It is not for you to know times or seasons that the Father has fixed by His own authority." Acts 1:7

Jesus said “But of that day and hour no one knows, not even the angels of heaven, but My Father only. Matt 24:36

By this clear Scripture and Authoritative word from the Lord - I, and everyone can say:
It is IMPOSSIBLE for the First Horseman to be our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ.

 

[Zao is life]

To Fullness of the Gentiles
I like everything you have said except the difference between the Seal Judgements of the Four Horseman and the crown GIVEN to the first Rider - To me this is clear evidence it is not the Lord Jesus Christ.

#1.) Christ is not contained by the Seal - the Seal signifies what is contained in it is UNDER the authority of God/Christ.
#2.) The rider has no name - this again shows us it is not the Lord Jesus
#3.) Crown was GIVEN to the rider with no name - again, this shows many antichrist receive their authority
#4.) The Bow is not the Gospel - The SWORD of the Spirit is the Gospel - ALWAYS referred to as a SWORD -out of His mouth.
#5.) These are Judgements upon and against the world - this clearly not the Gospel to Save men
#6.) These four horses/riders each have there own distinct purpose - NONE of which is GOOD.
#7.) Wearing a White and having a Crown - many antichrist - just as out Lord has told us and 1John 2:18
#8.) Our Lord has a Crown and a Sickle to Reap - Crown was not given to Him, He has a Sickle not a Bow - Christ is not the 1st Horseman

***** This is MOST IMPORTANT ***** If you miss this you miss EVERYTHING *****

The Four Horses are sent to EARTH for Judgement -
The Lord Jesus Christ will NOT and CANNOT return to Earth until His Second Coming -
change this and you corrupt Scripture and commit a horrible sin - Rev 22:18-19

So when they came together, they asked Him, “Lord, will You at this time restore the kingdom to Israel?”
Jesus replied, “It is not for you to know times or seasons that the Father has fixed by His own authority." Acts 1:7

Jesus said “But of that day and hour no one knows, not even the angels of heaven, but My Father only. Matt 24:36

By this clear Scripture and Authoritative word from the Lord - I, and everyone can say:
It is IMPOSSIBLE for the First Horseman to be our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ.

OK. I agree with this: The Lord Jesus Christ will NOT and CANNOT return to Earth until His Second Coming - but He has never needed to be on earth to be the power behind the spread of the gospel. His Holy Spirit is in the world.

But I disagree with your description of the seals & their purpose. In my understanding of it the seals are nothing more and nothing less than mere visual representations of the entities we are told about which are written about in the scroll, and the events that take place, which are likewise written about in the scroll. The seals are not judgments that are sent, because the scenes of the final 3.5-year "play" ("reality show") and their actors are mentioned in the scroll only. Seals are only seals, not the scenes themselves nor the actors themselves, nor the judgments themselves. The scenes that are contained in the scroll that are read to us once the seals of the scroll have been opened, are the judgments.

@David in NJ

#2.) The rider has no name - this again shows us it is not the Lord Jesus
Neither does either of the two witnesses.
#3.) Crown was GIVEN to the rider with no name - again, this shows many antichrist receive their authority
Power is GIVEN to the two witnesses.

The seal opens our understanding to what's written on the scroll about the two witnesses. They receive their power from Christ.

 

[marks]

the virtual reality bubble

You've pretty much turned me off from any further discussion with you.

Much love!

 

[David in NJ]

OK. I agree with this: The Lord Jesus Christ will NOT and CANNOT return to Earth until His Second Coming - but He has never needed to be on earth to be the power behind the spread of the gospel. His Holy Spirit is in the world.

But I disagree with your description of the seals & their purpose. In my understanding of it the seals are nothing more and nothing less than mere visual representations of the entities we are told about which are written about in the scroll, and the events that take place, which are likewise written about in the scroll. The seals are not judgments that are sent, because the scenes of the final 3.5-year "play" ("reality show") and their actors are mentioned in the scroll only. Seals are only seals, not the scenes themselves nor the actors themselves, nor the judgments themselves. The scenes that are contained in the scroll that are read to us once the seals of the scroll have been opened, are the judgments.

i am in deep distress as i received a phone call informing me of the death of a friend - please forgive me - unable right now

 

[Zao is life]

i am in deep distress as i received a phone call informing me of the death of a friend - please forgive me - unable right now

I'm praying for you brother.

 

[Zao is life]

You've pretty much turned me off from any further discussion with you.

Much love!

Much Love!

 

[Truth7t7]

Hello brother. Good to see you back!

I can only ask you to look at it a different way:

Think first about what the seals are: The seals need to be loosed in order to see the contents in the scroll. The final seal needs to be opened before the scroll can be read to us. Christ was the only one found worthy to loose the scroll's seals because He was slain (Revelation 5:1-5).

Chapters 7-22 of the Revelation is the contents of the scroll being read to us - the scroll that can only be read to us once the last of the 7 seals is opened. Therefore the scroll being read to us must be understood in the light of the visions John saw when each seal was opened.. In other words, The seals are about (a) opening the scroll; and (b) opening the understanding of the one who hears the words of the prophecy which is written on the scroll.

With the exception of chapter 12, all the contents of the scroll (chapters 7-19) are the prophecy concerning the final 3.5 years of the Age and the return of Christ, and it must and can only be understood in the light of the visions seen in each seal. It's important to note what we are told in the scroll about the events taking place during this final 3.5 years, without leaving anything out of our mind.

In this regard it's also important to note that the chapter divisions in the New Testament and the Revelation were only added in the year AD 1227, and there are some parts of some chapters in the Revelation which should be included in the previous chapter: For example, Revelation 19:1-4 belong in chapter 18 with the destruction of Babylon the Great.

Likewise Revelation 14:1-5 belongs with Revelation 13:11-18. In fact the entire chapter (Revelation 14) should begin with Revelation 13:11, because Revelation 14:1-5 is speaking about those who have the seal of God who did not worship the beast or its image (as is also mentioned in Revelation 13:6).

It's very important to note that two of the three things we are told about in Revelation 14 as coming before the harvest is gathered, are the following:

And I saw another angel flying in mid-heaven, having the everlasting gospel to preach to those dwelling on the earth, even to every nation and kindred and tongue and people, saying with a great voice, Fear God and give glory to Him! For the hour of His judgment has come. And worship Him who made the heaven and the earth, and the sea, and the fountains of waters.

And a third angel followed them, saying with a great voice, If anyone worships the beast and its image, and receives a mark in his forehead or in his hand, he also will drink of the wine of the anger of God, having been mixed undiluted in the cup of His wrath. And he will be tormented by fire and brimstone before the holy angels, and in the presence of the Lamb.11 And the smoke of their torment goes up forever and ever. And they have no rest day or night, those who worship the beast and its image, and whoever receives the mark of its name. Here is the patience of the saints. Here are the ones who keep the commandments of God and the faith of Jesus.

Revelation 11
3 And I will give power to My two witnesses, and they will prophesy a thousand, two hundred and sixty days, clothed in sackcloth.

7 And when they complete their testimony, the beast coming up out of the abyss will make war against them and will overcome them and kill them.

In other words, among other things THE SCROLL TELLS US THAT THE GOSPEL WILL BE GOING OUT IN POWER DURING THE FINAL 3.5 YEARS OF THE AGE



Please also see what comes below the heading "NOT AN ACTUAL PERSON" in my reply.

Why do you ignore Revelation 14:14? In Revelation 14:14 Jesus is crowned with a stéphanos (a crown of victory and honour which was given to Him by God). It’s important to note that in this passage His appearance is in the form of the Son of man (who, as we know, has been given a name above all names).

But in Revelation 19:19 Christ is crowned with MANY diádēma. In this passage He is returning as King of (all) kings and Lord of (all) Lords (see Revelation 19:16).

Note: Jesus has been given a name above all names. As the victorious son of Man He is given the stéphanos He's wearing in Revelation 14:14, but as King of (all) kings and Lord of (all) Lords the MANY diádēma belong to Him.

Therefore your argument about the stéphanos crown being given to the rider on the first horse does not hold. Not only does it not hold in that instance, but it does not hold because the crowns on each of the following are also stéphanos:

Revelation 12:1 (crown of 12 stars on the woman's head);
Revelation 2:10 & 3:11 (the crowns of the saints);
Revelation 4:4 & 10 (the crowns of the 24 elders).
Revelation 14:14 (Christ).

Your protest regarding the fact that the rider of the white horse is given a gold stéphanos crown also does not hold , because the gold crown corresponds to the theme in the Revelation, and Jesus is crowned with stéphanos of gold in Revelation 14:14, and gold is only used in the following:

Rev.1:13 & 20 & 2:1 (golden lamp-stands, golden band around the breast of the Son of man);
Rev.3:18 (gold tried in the fire);
Rev.4:4 (golden crowns of the 24 elders in heaven);
Rev.5:18 (golden vials full of incense, which are the prayers of the saints);
Rev. 8:3 & 9:13 (golden censer, golden altar);
Rev. 14:14 (golden crown of the Son of man);
Rev.15:6 (golden bands around the angels' chests);
Rev.15:7 (golden bowls of God's wrath);
Rev.21:15 (golden reed to measure the holy city, new Jerusalem);
Rev. 21:18 (the New Jerusalem is a city of pure gold);
Rev.21:21 (the New Jerusalem's street is of pure gold).

"I counsel you to buy from Me gold tried in the fire, so that you may be rich; and white clothing, so that you may be clothed, and so that the shame of your nakedness does not appear. And anoint your eyes with eye salve, so that you may see." (Revelation 3:18) (Gold is a metal which must be smelted in great heat in order to purify it).

The only exception is the crowns worn by the locusts that are something like stéphanos and similar to gold (fake crowns and fools gold):

"Now the locusts looked like horses equipped for battle. On their heads were something like crowns (stéphanos) similar to gold, and their faces looked like men's faces." (Revelation 9:7)

NOT AN ACTUAL PERSON

Then there is also this assumption that you seem to be making that the rider represents an actual person. It does not. The horses are not literal horses. The seals are symbolizing the events written on the scroll, and the riders of the horses represent either the powers behind those events (as in the first and second horsemen), or the cause of the events being described in the seal (as in the third and fourth seals).

Remember that among other things, the scroll tells us of the gospel going out during the final 3.5 years of the Age. The seals open the scroll, and the visions seen in the seals open our understanding to the events that are written on the scroll.

Since the scroll tells us that the gospel will be going out during the final 3.5 years, to me there's no reason whatsoever to assume that the white horse going forth conquering and to conquer does not represent the gospel and the activities of the two witnesses (or at least the activities of saints).

Jesus' head and hair appear white like wool (Rev 1:14).
The stone with a saint's name written on it is a white stone (Rev 2:17).
The white raiment of the saints (Rev.3:5 & 18; 6:11; 7:9, 13 & 14).
The white clothing of the 24 elders (Rev 4:4).
The white clothing of angels (Rev 15:6).
The white raiment of the bride of Christ (Rev 19:8).
The Great White Throne (Rev 20:11).
Christ seated on a white cloud (Rev 14:14).
Christ returns on a white horse, leading His armies (Rev 19:11).
Christ's armies are riding white horses (Rev 19:14).
The first horseman of the Apocalypse is riding a white horse (Revelation 6:2).

THE FIRST TWO HORSEMEN ARE OPPOSING FORCES

I think that maybe? the biggest problem with the view you express, is that you seem to see the second horse as something that follows the first, like events which follow naturally the one after the other. But I do not believe this is the case. The first two horses represent two opposing forces in the last 3.5 years of the Age: The gospel, and the beast/Antichrist.

@David in NJ I edited regarding the chapter divisions (this is the last edit).

I pretty much agree with your lengthy post except in two areas

1. You suggest the book of Revelation is in Chronological order it's not, it seen in "Parallel" teachings of same events

Example: The final judgement is seen in Revelation 11:18 & Revelation 20:11-15

2. You suggest the (Two Witnesses) of Revelation 11 represent a symbolic allegory of the gospel being preached, I Disagree

They will be literal prophets returned, bringing literal plagues as seen in Revelation 16:1-11, Revelation 11:6 in a literal world, having literal bodies that die, and lay in a literal street in Jerusalem, and they are literally raised as a literal world watches

 

[Truth7t7]

The Lamb has opened the seven seals and disclosed relevant factors that right now are contributing to the reality of life. The follow-through from the Divine Order disclosed by the Lamb's opening of the scroll lies ahead. . .

Dragonsville

Rev 13:4-10 So they worshiped the dragon who gave authority to the beast; and they worshiped the beast, saying, "Who is like the beast? Who is able to make war with him?" (5) And he was given a mouth speaking great things and blasphemies, and he was given authority to continue for forty-two months. (6) Then he opened his mouth in blasphemy against God, to blaspheme His name, His tabernacle, and those who dwell in heaven. (7) It was granted to him to make war with the saints and to overcome them. And authority was given him over every tribe, tongue, and nation. (8) All who dwell on the earth will worship him, whose names have not been written in the Book of Life of the Lamb slain from the foundation of the world. (9) If anyone has an ear, let him hear. (10) He who leads into captivity shall go into captivity; he who kills with the sword must be killed with the sword. Here is the patience and the faith of the saints.

I disagree that the seals have been opened and are a present reality, this represents future events unfulfilled

 

[Zao is life]

I pretty much agree with your lengthy post except in two areas

1. You suggest the book of Revelation is in Chronological order it's not, it seen in "Parallel" teachings of same events

Example: The final judgement is seen in Revelation 11:18 & Revelation 20:11-15

2. You suggest the (Two Witnesses) of Revelation 11 represent a symbolic allegory of the gospel being preached "wrong"

They will be literal prophets returned, bringing literal plagues as seen in Revelation 16:1-11, Revelation 11:6 in a literal world, having literal bodies that die, and lay in a literal street in Jerusalem, and they are literally raised as a literal world watches

Thank you for that.

---------------------------------------------------------------​

As far as the two witnesses are concerned, I don't suggest (and never suggested in my lengthy post) that the Two Witnesses "represent a symbolic allegory of the gospel being preached". I never suggested that at all.

What I suggested was that the first seal does exactly the above. The seals open the scroll, in which one part speaks of the Two Witnesses.

------------------------------------------------------------------​

I deliberately never gave any suggestion as to the identity of the Two Witnesses. Why? Because although I lean toward identifying them exactly as you did in your post above, others have other ideas about who the Two Witnesses are (some say they represent the church or churches), and the Revelation has not explicitly told us who they are, or explicitly named them. I have not been given, and I know that I will not be given exclusive knowledge about that from an extra-Biblical source, until the Two Witnesses themselves are revealed, so even though I "think" that you are right about the Two Witnesses, I don't "know" if you're right.

Whereas you believe that the millennium should be interpreted allegorically, the passage regarding the Two Witnesses should be interpreted literally. That's OK. I won't debate Revelation 20 with you all over again. We've both been there, done that, and got the t-shirt. In any case, a number of the New Testament passages you repeatedly quote in support of a symbolic thousand years, are indeed problematic for a literal interpretation of the millennium, if taken out of context of all New Testament passages and Revelation, because there are also passages in the New Testament which are problematic for the allegorical/symbolic interpretation of the millennium. This is exactly why the debate in Christian circles about it is so endless and goes around in circles.

Thanks for your reply.

 

[Zao is life]

I disagree that the seals have been opened and are a present reality, this represents future events unfulfilled

I understood what he meant though. He's basically saying the time is at hand.

Only the Lord's faithful remnant know when all the seals have been opened - because the seals open the understanding of the saints to what is written in the scroll. That's what seals are for, to seal up the (understanding of) the things that are written in the scroll. The seals are the Apocalypse, the Revelation of the things written in the scroll. The Lord's faithful remnant will understand all that is written in the scroll when the time is at hand.

 

[Truth7t7]

I understood what he meant though. He's basically saying the time is at hand.

Only the Lord's faithful remnant know when all the seals have been opened - because the seals open the understanding of the saints to what is written in the scroll. That's what seals are for, to seal up the (understanding of) the things that are written in the scroll. The seals are the Apocalypse, the Revelation of the things written in the scroll. The Lord's faithful remnant will understand all that is written in the scroll when the time is at hand.

I believe scripture clearly teaches the seals and vials are "parallel teachings" of the same events, that will be brought upon this earth by the future (Two Witnesses) Revelation 11:4 "All Plagues"

You will note in Revelation 11:2-3 the witnesses will be given power for 1260 days, as the fulfilling of the gentiles takes place in Jerusalem for 42 months

You will closely note (The Beast) is given this same time of 42 months as seen in Revelation 13:5 and is the same "Parallel" time frame of 3.5 years of the (Two Witnesses), not chronologically totaling 7 years as dispensationalism falsely teaches

You will closely note that the (Two Witnesses) will be present on earth to the final hours and last day of the final judgement as seen in Revelation 11:7-18

You will closely note (The Same Hour) they are raised to heaven the great earthquake in the second woe, and the third woe comes quickly in the 7th trump (The End)

You will closely note Revelation 11:18 is the final judgement (The End)

 

[David in NJ]

I'm praying for you brother.

thank you very much

 

[Zao is life]

I believe scripture clearly teaches the seals and vials are "parallel teachings" of the same events, that will be brought upon this earth by the future (Two Witnesses) Revelation 11:4 "All Plagues"

You will note in Revelation 11:2-3 the witnesses will be given power for 1260 days, as the fulfilling of the gentiles takes place in Jerusalem for 42 months

You will closely note (The Beast) is given this same time of 42 months as seen in Revelation 13:5 and is the same "Parallel" time frame of 3.5 years of the (Two Witnesses), not chronologically totaling 7 years as dispensationalism falsely teaches

You will closely note that the (Two Witnesses) will be present on earth to the final hours and last day of the final judgement as seen in Revelation 11:7-18

You will closely note (The Same Hour) they are raised to heaven the great earthquake in the second woe, and the third woe comes quickly in the 7th trump (The End)

You will closely note Revelation 11:18 is the final judgement (The End)

Oh yes, there's something really important that I need to tell you, which I keep forgetting to tell you about (because you have made it plain that you are unaware of this). So I hope you're going to closely note this:

Not all Premillennialists are Dispensationalists.

Most Amils: The Revelation is a series of parallel visions regarding the same things, until the end of chapter 20. Chapters 21-22 follow chronologically after that.
Many Premils: The Revelation is a series of parallel visions regarding the same things, until the end of chapter 19. Chapters 20-22 follow chronologically after that.

Therefore:

I believe scripture clearly teaches that each seal, when opened, opens (the understanding of) the events described until the end of chapter 19.

Therefore each seal parallels the events described until the end of chapter 19, but the seals are not the events themselves, some of which are events that will be brought upon this earth by the future (Two Witnesses) Revelation 11:4 "All (manner of) Plagues". The rest of the events describe the actions of the beast and the tribulation being experienced by the people in the world.

I believe the trumpets and vials parallel one another, and the rest of the chapters until the end of chapter 19 give different details about the same things.

I believe that the two witnesses will be given power by God for 1260 days, the same period during which the beast is given power by the dragon.

This same time of 42 months as seen in Revelation 13:5 and is the same "Parallel" time frame of 3.5 years of the (Two Witnesses).

I don't know or care who believes it's chronological and totals 7 years, because I'm not interested in the fanciful imaginations of men.

I'm glad that you have closely noted that the (Two Witnesses) will be present on earth to the final hours and last day of the final judgement coming at the close of this Age, as seen in Revelation 11:7-18 (because this is true).

I'm glad that you have closely noted that in the same hour they are raised to heaven, the great earthquake in the second woe, and the third woe comes quickly in the 7th trump (the end of the Age).

You will closely note Revelation 11:18 is the final judgement of this world at the end of this Age.

I've seen all the above (probably long, long before you ever did), but I'm glad you've seen it (albeit only in part) too.

The part that you haven't mentioned (conspicuously left out) is the season to follow: The full corn in the ear (Mark 4:28):

"For the earth brings forth fruit of herself; first (prōton) the blade, then (eîta) the ear, after that (eîta) the full corn in the ear. (Mark 4:28).

"For as in Adam all die, even so in Christ shall all be made alive. But every man in his own order: Christ the first-fruits (aparchḗ); afterward (épeita) they that are Christ's at his coming. Then (eîta, afterward) comes the end, when he shall have delivered up the kingdom to God, even the Father; when he shall have put down all rule and all authority and power. For he must reign, till he has put all enemies under his feet. The last enemy that shall be destroyed is death." (1 Corinthians 15:22-26)

You will have (or should have) closely noted that what follows is the beginning of the thousand year reign with Christ of those who had been beheaded by the beast for their testimony to Christ and their refusal to worship the beast and his image.

You will have (or should have) closely noted that these who had been beheaded have now had part in the first resurrection of those who are Christ's at his coming, and the second death has no power over them.

You will have (or should have) closely noted that in 1 Corinthians 15:24 Paul says the same thing, using the Greek word εἶτα eîta, which denotes afterward, in the next stage in each season of development:

"For the earth brings forth fruit of herself; first (prōton) the blade, then (eîta) the ear, after that (eîta) the full corn in the ear. (Mark 4:28).

"For as in Adam all die, even so in Christ shall all be made alive. But every man in his own order: Christ the first-fruits (aparchḗ); afterward (épeita) they that are Christ's at his coming. Then (eîta, afterward) comes the end, when he shall have delivered up the kingdom to God, even the Father; when he shall have put down all rule and all authority and power. For he must reign, till he has put all enemies under his feet. The last enemy that shall be destroyed is death." (1 Corinthians 15:22-26)

You will have (or should have) closely noted that Satan is bound for a thousand years, and after (épeita) this the second death comes at the close of the one-thousand year period.

 

[Truth7t7]

Most Amils: The Revelation is a series of parallel visions regarding the same things, until the end of chapter 20. Chapters 21-22 follow chronologically after that.
Many Premils: The Revelation is a series of parallel visions regarding the same things, until the end of chapter 19. Chapters 20-22 follow chronologically after that.

Therefore:

I believe scripture clearly teaches that each seal, when opened, opens (the understanding of) the events described until the end of chapter 19.

Therefore each seal parallels the events described until the end of chapter 19, but the seals are not the events themselves, some of which are events that will be brought upon this earth by the future (Two Witnesses) Revelation 11:4 "All (manner of) Plagues". The rest of the events describe the actions of the beast and the tribulation being experienced by the people in the world.

I believe the trumpets and vials parallel one another, and the rest of the chapters until the end of chapter 19 give different details about the same things.

I believe that Revelation the two witnesses will be given power by God for 1260 days, the same period during which the beast is given power by the dragon.

This same time of 42 months as seen in Revelation 13:5 and is the same "Parallel" time frame of 3.5 years of the (Two Witnesses).

I don't know or care who believes it's chronological and totals 7 years, because I'm not interested in the fanciful imaginations of men.

I'm glad that you have closely noted that the (Two Witnesses) will be present on earth to the final hours and last day of the final judgement coming at the close of this Age, as seen in Revelation 11:7-18 (because this is true).

I'm glad that you have closely noted that in the same hour they are raised to heaven, the great earthquake in the second woe, and the third woe comes quickly in the 7th trump (the end of the Age).

You will closely note Revelation 11:18 is the final judgement of this world at the end of this Age.

I've seen all the above (probably long, long before you ever did), but I'm glad you've seen it (albeit only in part) too.

The part that you haven't mentioned (conspicuously left out) is the season to follow: The full corn in the ear (Mark 4:28):

"For the earth brings forth fruit of herself; first (prōton) the blade, then (eîta) the ear, after that (eîta) the full corn in the ear. (Mark 4:28).

"For as in Adam all die, even so in Christ shall all be made alive. But every man in his own order: Christ the first-fruits (aparchḗ); afterward (épeita) they that are Christ's at his coming. Then (eîta, afterward) comes the end, when he shall have delivered up the kingdom to God, even the Father; when he shall have put down all rule and all authority and power. For he must reign, till he has put all enemies under his feet. The last enemy that shall be destroyed is death." (1 Corinthians 15:22-26)

You will have (or should have) closely noted that what follows is the beginning of the thousand year reign with Christ of those who had been beheaded by the beast for their testimony to Christ and their refusal to worship the beast and his image.

You will have (or should have) closely noted that these who had been beheaded have now had part in the first resurrection of those who are Christ's at his coming, and the second death has no power over them.

You will have (or should have) closely noted that in 1 Corinthians 15:24 Paul says the same thing, using the Greek word εἶτα eîta, which denotes afterward, in the next stage in each season of development:

"For the earth brings forth fruit of herself; first (prōton) the blade, then (eîta) the ear, after that (eîta) the full corn in the ear. (Mark 4:28).

"For as in Adam all die, even so in Christ shall all be made alive. But every man in his own order: Christ the first-fruits (aparchḗ); afterward (épeita) they that are Christ's at his coming. Then (eîta, afterward) comes the end, when he shall have delivered up the kingdom to God, even the Father; when he shall have put down all rule and all authority and power. For he must reign, till he has put all enemies under his feet. The last enemy that shall be destroyed is death." (1 Corinthians 15:22-26)

You will have (or should have) closely noted that Satan is bound for a thousand years after (épeita) this the second death comes at the close of the one-thousand year period.

In your first paragraph you state chapters 21-22 are chronological, then in you second paragraph you state chapters 20-21-22 are chronological, Big Smiles!

You aren't gonna drag the claims of a literal Millennial Kingdom into the picture, because it dosent exist, good try

Chapter 11, 16, 19, 20 are parallel teachings of the same event in the second coming final judgement

 

[Truth7t7]

Oh yes, there's something really important that I need to tell you, which I keep forgetting to tell you about (because you have made it plain that you are unaware of this). So I hope you're going to closely note this:

Not all Premillennialists are Dispensationalists.

Most Amils: The Revelation is a series of parallel visions regarding the same things, until the end of chapter 20. Chapters 21-22 follow chronologically after that.
Many Premils: The Revelation is a series of parallel visions regarding the same things, until the end of chapter 19. Chapters 20-22 follow chronologically after that.

Therefore:

I believe scripture clearly teaches that each seal, when opened, opens (the understanding of) the events described until the end of chapter 19.

Therefore each seal parallels the events described until the end of chapter 19, but the seals are not the events themselves, some of which are events that will be brought upon this earth by the future (Two Witnesses) Revelation 11:4 "All (manner of) Plagues". The rest of the events describe the actions of the beast and the tribulation being experienced by the people in the world.

I believe the trumpets and vials parallel one another, and the rest of the chapters until the end of chapter 19 give different details about the same things.

I believe that Revelation the two witnesses will be given power by God for 1260 days, the same period during which the beast is given power by the dragon.

This same time of 42 months as seen in Revelation 13:5 and is the same "Parallel" time frame of 3.5 years of the (Two Witnesses).

I don't know or care who believes it's chronological and totals 7 years, because I'm not interested in the fanciful imaginations of men.

I'm glad that you have closely noted that the (Two Witnesses) will be present on earth to the final hours and last day of the final judgement coming at the close of this Age, as seen in Revelation 11:7-18 (because this is true).

I'm glad that you have closely noted that in the same hour they are raised to heaven, the great earthquake in the second woe, and the third woe comes quickly in the 7th trump (the end of the Age).

You will closely note Revelation 11:18 is the final judgement of this world at the end of this Age.

I've seen all the above (probably long, long before you ever did), but I'm glad you've seen it (albeit only in part) too.

The part that you haven't mentioned (conspicuously left out) is the season to follow: The full corn in the ear (Mark 4:28):

"For the earth brings forth fruit of herself; first (prōton) the blade, then (eîta) the ear, after that (eîta) the full corn in the ear. (Mark 4:28).

"For as in Adam all die, even so in Christ shall all be made alive. But every man in his own order: Christ the first-fruits (aparchḗ); afterward (épeita) they that are Christ's at his coming. Then (eîta, afterward) comes the end, when he shall have delivered up the kingdom to God, even the Father; when he shall have put down all rule and all authority and power. For he must reign, till he has put all enemies under his feet. The last enemy that shall be destroyed is death." (1 Corinthians 15:22-26)

You will have (or should have) closely noted that what follows is the beginning of the thousand year reign with Christ of those who had been beheaded by the beast for their testimony to Christ and their refusal to worship the beast and his image.

You will have (or should have) closely noted that these who had been beheaded have now had part in the first resurrection of those who are Christ's at his coming, and the second death has no power over them.

You will have (or should have) closely noted that in 1 Corinthians 15:24 Paul says the same thing, using the Greek word εἶτα eîta, which denotes afterward, in the next stage in each season of development:

"For the earth brings forth fruit of herself; first (prōton) the blade, then (eîta) the ear, after that (eîta) the full corn in the ear. (Mark 4:28).

"For as in Adam all die, even so in Christ shall all be made alive. But every man in his own order: Christ the first-fruits (aparchḗ); afterward (épeita) they that are Christ's at his coming. Then (eîta, afterward) comes the end, when he shall have delivered up the kingdom to God, even the Father; when he shall have put down all rule and all authority and power. For he must reign, till he has put all enemies under his feet. The last enemy that shall be destroyed is death." (1 Corinthians 15:22-26)

You will have (or should have) closely noted that Satan is bound for a thousand years after (épeita) this the second death comes at the close of the one-thousand year period.

Is what you missed is, it's not the end of the "Age" but end of the "World", and there will be no Millennial Kingdom on this earth as you claim and desire

At the 7th and final trump, it's (The End) not time for your Hope's for a Millennium on this earth

 

[Zao is life]

In your first paragraph you state chapters 21-22 are chronological, then in you second paragraph you state chapters 20-21-22 are chronological, Big Smiles!

I know I had to go back and correct my typos.

 

[Zao is life]

Is what you missed is, it's not the end of the "Age" but end of the "World", and there will be no Millennial Kingdom on this earth as you claim and desire

At the 7th and final trump, it's (The End) not time for your Hope's for a Millennium on this earth

Sure. Let it be according as He has willed. If you be correct, then it will be according as He has willed. If you are wrong, then it will be according as He has willed.