Timtofly
Well-Known Member
Matthew 25 represents Israel living today. Many are sheep and many are goats. This is not the church who literally accepted Salvation by grace through faith.In Revelation 11:18, John differentiates between those who are judged/condemned and those who are rewarded. It is unbelievers who will be judged. The word means to be condemned in that verse. In contrast to "your servants the prophets and your people who revere your name" who will be rewarded at that time.
We agree that Jesus will return at the last trumpet and that the seventh trumpet is the same as the last trumpet, right? Well, Matthew 25:31-46 shows both the saved and unsaved being judged at His return. So, you should allow scripture to interpret scripture for you and realize that Revelation 11:18 is referring to the same ones as the "goats" described in Matthew 25:31-46 who are condemned to "everlasting fire prepared for the devil and his angels". The dead being judged in Revelation 11:18 are the same dead being judged in Revelation 20:11-15.
This is Jesus as Prince after the Second Coming sitting on His throne during the Trumpets. The angels are gathering all of Israel out of all Nations. You cannot see this because you deny they will rule with Christ on earth forever. On this current earth for 1,000 years. Then on the New Earth. The church is in Paradise for the next 1,000 years, and comes down as the New Jerusalem in the NHNE.
The church is not separated like sheep and goats. The church meets as a whole group, from all time in the air at the Second Coming. At that point they are forever with Adonai, the Lord God.
The judgment seat of Christ is not a sheep/goat judgment. It is a rewards judgment. It will happen at the 7th Trumpet celebration week. But the Second Coming, the 6th Seal has to happen first. The church is raptured, glorified, and settled in Paradise.
Then Jesus sets up his glorious throne in Jerusalem to separate the sheep from the goats. In between the 6th and 7th Trumpets, 7 Thunders sound. This is the wheat and tares harvest where all the rest of humanity at that time are separated as wheat from tares. This may or may not happen in a day. Depends on how many souls are left after the church leaves. If there is a revival and billions turn to Christ before the 6th Seal, more will be raptured than left behind. Of course idealist tend to not be as hopeful as optimist.
It certainly does not happen in an instant. Matthew 25 is not a metaphor for the rapture. The sheep and goats part is not a parable. Israel is just separated into two groups. One are designated as sheep to live forever on earth. The other are goats who spend forever in the LOF. This is not a one day process. One of the Trumpets effects people for 5 months. You cannot put that into a "blink of an eye" rapture, where people are separated like sheep and goats. The rapture removes the church. Then Jesus deals with His people, the house of Jacob. This is called the time of Jacob's trouble. This would be the time that is most troublesome, because souls are being harvest out of Adam's flesh and blood.
Not with bodies. That's something you're making up. It's only their souls that are in heaven, which is why John only sees the souls of the dead in Christ in passages like Rev 6:9-11 and Rev 20:4.
Now who is being literal in a highly figurative book?
The souls under the alter is the whole body of the church covered by the Atonement of the Lamb. The 5th Seal is the entire church being glorified including those on the earth, because it happens at the same time in mid air.
John is not telling us their literal status. He is telling us their spiritual status covered by the Atonement not literal bodiless souls under an alter. Those people are currently walking around in permanent incorruptible physical bodies enjoying Paradise. They are not physically crying out in pain or anguish. That is a spiritual metaphor of how those in Paradise view the situation on earth. The putting on of white robes is the same figurative use of putting on immortality by Paul. Both Paul and John were describing the putting on of the spirit. It is not a body of flesh. It is a body of light. Putting on the spirit is over the physical body.
Jesus showed us on the mount of Transfiguration. When his body glowed like a star, the sun, a bright light, ie a white robe, but of bright light. A spirit from God comes to one on earth inward. But when we get our spirit it will be an outward putting on of the spirit. Moses received some part of that, and they had to cover his face it was so bright. Moses and Elijah appeared also on the mount, but we are not told if they were that way or not. They may be as the two witnesses of the OT. We were given no confirmation. Many only see the 5th Seal as literal, but it is figurative of much more than what you claim as literal. One has to get the literal point from other Scriptures.
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