What benefit does it produce to make Jesus God

[Blue Dragonfly's]

Whaoh...not so fast....true and evidential science is absolutely backed up by the Bible....who created what science studies?

It is evident that the creative "days" were not 24 hour periods. The Hebrew word for "day" (yôm) can also mean a period of unspecified length. What is time to a timeless Creator? Each day could have been thousands or even millions of years long. He was not constrained by the rotation of our small planet.

Its taken us over 4,000 years to even begin to understand genetics, so imagine what we can learn about life and the natural world in another 4,000 years!

What is NOT backed up by the Bible is theoretical science....which is based on assumption, conjecture and supposition....you know, those things that some people want to use to make the Bible say things that it doesn't....

Nope, not correct. What does Genesis 1:1 say?
"In the beginning God created the heavens and the earth." It is clear that "the heavens" here means the Universe, which would include our solar system...our sun as well as all the other planets orbiting it, in the Milky Way galaxy of which we are but a small speck....And then there are the billions of other galaxies that we now know exist, thanks to science and technology.

We know that it wasn't the spiritual heavens because the Bible says that the angels were observing God's creation with great interest, and when it was complete they all shouted for joy. (Job 38:4-7)

What does it say next? "And the earth was a formless and desolate emptiness, and darkness was over the surface of the deep, and the Spirit of God was hovering over the surface of the waters. 3 Then God said, “Let there be light”; and there was light."

Where did this "light" come from? A newly created sun? No!
Job 38:4, 9...Job was asked....
"Where were you when I laid the foundation of the earth?
Tell Me, if you have understanding. . . . .When I made a cloud its garment,
And thick darkness its swaddling bands".

If the sun was already in existence, and the earth was in darkness because of cloud layers, then removing some of the clouds layers would allow the light to penetrate to the earth's surface....enough for plants to photosynthesize....and day and night to be distinguished. But still the sun, moon and stars were not yet visible.

Vs 14-16.... "Then God said, “Let there be lights in the expanse of the heavens to separate the day from the night, and they shall serve as signs and for seasons, and for days and years; 15 and they shall serve as lights in the expanse of the heavens to give light on the earth”; and it was so. 16 God made the two great lights, the greater light to govern the day, and the lesser light to govern the night; He made the stars also."

Again, since the heavenly bodies were already in existence, removing more of the cloud layers made them clearly visible from the earth's surface.

If the earth was without form and void, how could waters exist for darkness to be on the face of the deep?
Deep what?

 

[BeyondET]

And, if you're a Liberal, you can get pregnant.
Let those little tads surprise ya.

Lends a whole different visual to the word, woman doesn't it.

Can Men Get Pregnant? Outcomes for Transgender and Cisgender Men


Dem witness tells House committee men can get pregnant, have abortions

Yea not sure why it has exploded like it has, I don't quite know why intersex defects happens are they getting more prevalent because of Mc Donald's or something else. I've read there are all kinds of different mixing going on some probably mental issues others physical defects, I don't think it's God plan for humans to Born with both genitals.

 

[BeyondET]

If the earth was without form and void, how could waters exist for darkness to be on the face of the deep?
Deep what?

Hydrogen and Oxygen atoms is water.

 

[Johann]

It means I am now or I'm the one that counts now.

Incorrect.
Before Abraham was (prin Abraam genesthai). Usual idiom with prin in positive sentence with infinitive (second aorist middle of ginomai) and the accusative of general reference, “before coming as to Abraham,” “before Abraham came into existence or was born.”
I am (egō eimi). Undoubtedly here Jesus claims eternal existence with the absolute phrase used of God. The contrast between genesthai (entrance into existence of Abraham) and eimi (timeless being) is complete. See the same contrast between en in Joh_1:1 and egeneto in Joh_1:14. See the contrast also in Psa_90:2 between God (ei, art) and the mountains (genēthēnai). See the same use of eimi in Joh_6:20; Joh_9:9; Joh_8:24, Joh_8:28; Joh_18:6.

 

[Johann]

I say in LOVE preach CHRIST to them all . cause no other path or religoin can save .

..and yet all other paths of religion are on this forum.

 

[Enoch111]

If the earth was without form and void, how could waters exist for darkness to be on the face of the deep? Deep what?

What else other than deep oceans. The globe of the earth was encased in water to begin with. So why do you have a problem with this? "Void" means devoid of living creatures.

 

[BeyondET]

What else other than deep oceans. The globe of the earth was encased in water to begin with. So why do you have a problem with this? "Void" means devoid of living creatures.

Not even close, all the oceans are but a puddle on the surface of earth. Earth is 8000 miles wide, average ocean depth is 3 miles.

 

[RLT63]

God says thanks for the info..... and sorry 'bout that.

Okay you explain what was holding the earth in place before day 4, how there was evening and morning with no sun and how light from distant stars was seen immediately.

 

[Brakelite]

The same gravitational force that kept it in place from the beginning.


Yes...a miracle of creation...not an act of magic. We know that it is earth's rotation that creates day and night. And did you notice something else that shows it wasn't a 24 hour day?
"There was evening and morning".....how long is it between evening and morning here on earth? That is only 12 earth hours. But Peter tells us that with God, 'a thousand years seems like just one day'. (2 Peter 3:8)


This was the result of God using his spirit to accomplish his will. So, of course it was a miracle. But the Mary was not without sin. The child in her womb was sinless because of how he was created. The Bible does not teach that Mary (a descendant of Adam) was sinless however....nor does it teach that Mary was ever virgin.....you will find many of the titles and attributes of Mary are borrowed from ancient mother goddess worship. They are certainly not biblical. And many pre-date Christianity by centuries.

Do you see the similarity?

Something else they have in common....the nimbus (halo)
which is not mentioned at all in scripture but evident in these ancient statues.

These are a relic of sun worship. Nothing whatever to do with Christianity.

Lucifer was around a long time before creation. When he rebelled, was cast to the earth, he knew what God was like, and likely had a very good grasp of God intentions... After all, he was there when God's promised Adam and Eve a Savior/Messiah, and every Jewish woman hope it would be her to be the mother.
It doesn't take too much to imagine Satan's devious mind thinking... I'm going to confuse the issue. I'm going to counterfeit the real Godhead in every pagan religion in the planet. That way, when God reveals Himself as a Father/Son unity, everyone will think, aaah, just another pagan counterfeit.
The irony is that every Christian in the planet believes that Jesus is the Son of God. The gospels proclaim it. The apostles proclaimed it. The many letters by the apostles proclaimed it. John wrote his gospel and his letters to specifically prove it. Jesus is absolutely the Son of God, sent from heaven to become a man and die for mankind in order to save man from sin. John didn't bother trying to prove a trinity. Nor did he try to prove Jesus'divinity. All He had to prove was His Sonship, based on prophecy, Jesus' own declarations regarding His identity, and the testimony of the other apostles. Job done. One would have to all manner of spiritual and scriptural gymnastics to prove that a perfect God begets other than God begotten.

 

[Aunty Jane]

If the earth was without form and void, how could waters exist for darkness to be on the face of the deep?
Deep what?

Water. The earth was covered in water because it says that God's spirit was hovering over the waters......God parted the waters so that dry land appeared. God also made a division between the waters that were on the earth and waters that were above the earth's atmosphere.
Peter said that God used the water canopy above the earth to flood it in Noah's day. (2 Peter 3:5-6)

 

[Johann]

Okay you explain what was holding the earth in place before day 4, how there was evening and morning with no sun and how light from distant stars was seen immediately.

As you may notice, now the PARASHAS BERESHIS, Genesis narrative is under attack.

 

[RLT63]

As you may notice, now the PARASHAS BERESHIS, Genesis narrative is under attack.

I'm not attacking it I say creation was a miracle and science can't explain it

 

[RLT63]

..and yet all other paths of religion are on this forum.

Someone told me welcome to Cultianity board

 

[Johann]

Someone told me welcome to Cultianity board

1Jn 4:1 Beloved, believe not every spirit, but try the spirits whether they are of God: because many false prophets are gone out into the world.

believe not. or, stop believing. This construction forbids the continuation of an action already going on (see Wuest). 1Jn_2:18, *Deu_13:1-5, 1Ki_22:22, +**Pro_14:15; +*Pro_18:17, *Jer_5:31; *Jer_29:8; *Jer_29:9, *Mat_7:15; *Mat_7:16; *Mat_24:4; *Mat_24:5, +*Mar_4:24; Mar_13:5-6, Rom_16:18, +*2Th_2:2 note. 1Ti_4:1, Heb_13:9, 2Pe_2:1.

try. or, test, prove. Gr. dokimazō (S# G1381, Rom_2:18). By the Word of God (CB). Present tense, active voice, imperative mood, second person, plural verb. Thus all Christians (reflected in the plural number of the verb) are to be continually testing in response to this command the truthfulness of spiritual claims made by others to see if they are in accordance with the Bible. LNT notes, The Apostle has here issued two imperatives: you must not believe every spirit, but you must test the spirits. These inspired commandments are not optional for the Christian, they must be carried out. It is of interest that John does not say test the prophets, but test the spirits—the real source of the prophet’s message. Note that a false prophet is inspired by the spirit of the antichrist (1Jn_4:3), the spirit of deception (1Jn_4:6). In 1Ti_4:1-3 Paul shows that demons will use men to teach in the church (LNT, fn q). 1Jn_4:6, Lev_13:34, Deu_13:1-3; *Deu_18:21; *Deu_18:22, 1Ki_22:22, Job_34:4, +*Pro_18:17, **Isa_8:20, Luk_12:56-57, +*Act_17:11, Rom_1:28 g. Rom_12:2 g. Rom_16:19, 1Co_2:15; 1Co_10:15; 1Co_11:13; 1Co_11:28; 1Co_12:3 note, 1Co_12:10; **1Co_14:29, 1Co_16:3, 2Co_8:8; 2Co_8:22; 2Co_10:18; 2Co_13:5, Gal_1:6-9; Gal_6:4, +*Eph_4:14; Eph_5:6; Eph_5:10, *Php_1:10; Php_4:8, Col_2:4; Col_2:18, +**1Th_5:21, 1Ti_3:10; +*1Ti_4:1, 1Pe_1:7, *Rev_2:2.

I don't apologize for scripture references, since I don't assume anymore.

Shalom to you and family

 

[Johann]

I'm not attacking it I say creation was a miracle and science can't explain it

Not saying you are attacking it brother.

 

[RLT63]

Lucifer was around a long time before creation. When he rebelled, was cast to the earth, he knew what God was like, and likely had a very good grasp of God intentions... After all, he was there when God's promised Adam and Eve a Savior/Messiah, and every Jewish woman hope it would be her to be the mother.
It doesn't take too much to imagine Satan's devious mind thinking... I'm going to confuse the issue. I'm going to counterfeit the real Godhead in every pagan religion in the planet. That way, when God reveals Himself as a Father/Son unity, everyone will think, aaah, just another pagan counterfeit.
The irony is that every Christian in the planet believes that Jesus is the Son of God. The gospels proclaim it. The apostles proclaimed it. The many letters by the apostles proclaimed it. John wrote his gospel and his letters to specifically prove it. Jesus is absolutely the Son of God, sent from heaven to become a man and die for mankind in order to save man from sin. John didn't bother trying to prove a trinity. Nor did he try to prove Jesus'divinity. All He had to prove was His Sonship, based on prophecy, Jesus' own declarations regarding His identity, and the testimony of the other apostles. Job done. One would have to all manner of spiritual and scriptural gymnastics to prove that a perfect God begets other than God begotten.

The Bible declares the virgin birth. No Mary was not sinless but she was a virgin until after Jesus was born. Your other information comes from Alexander Hislop's book The Two Babylons. Much of the book has been debunked. There was another book based on Hislop's called Babylon Mystery Religion but the author took it out of print and wrote another book refuting the first one because he said Hislop's sources were bogus. The Two Babylons - Wikipedia

 

[Lizbeth]

I can't get anyone to answer this honest question. All I get back is because the Bible says so. But there must be a reason for it. What is it? Here I will give you a reason why he had to be a man.

Romans says a man (Adam) caused sin to enter into the world, and also that a man would have to redeem it from sin. Romans 5:15 says “For if many died through one man’s trespass, much more have the grace of God and the free gift by the grace of that one man Jesus Christ abounded for many.” The Bible specifically says that a man must do it. The book of Corinthians makes the same point Romans does when it says “For since by a man came death, by a man also came the resurrection of the dead” (1 Corinthians 15:21).

Now it's your turn. Anyone?

But that's not all the bible says about Jesus, is it. He was a man and son of man, but not just a man. There are lots of scrips alluding to Who He is. If our faith were in any other man that would be idolatry. Why is it not idolatry to have our faith in Christ Jesus?

The answer to the OP question is...salvation.

 

[RLT63]

Whaoh...not so fast....true and evidential science is absolutely backed up by the Bible....who created what science studies?

It is evident that the creative "days" were not 24 hour periods. The Hebrew word for "day" (yôm) can also mean a period of unspecified length. What is time to a timeless Creator? Each day could have been thousands or even millions of years long. He was not constrained by the rotation of our small planet.

Its taken us over 4,000 years to even begin to understand genetics, so imagine what we can learn about life and the natural world in another 4,000 years!

What is NOT backed up by the Bible is theoretical science....which is based on assumption, conjecture and supposition....you know, those things that some people want to use to make the Bible say things that it doesn't....

Nope, not correct. What does Genesis 1:1 say?
"In the beginning God created the heavens and the earth." It is clear that "the heavens" here means the Universe, which would include our solar system...our sun as well as all the other planets orbiting it, in the Milky Way galaxy of which we are but a small speck....And then there are the billions of other galaxies that we now know exist, thanks to science and technology.

We know that it wasn't the spiritual heavens because the Bible says that the angels were observing God's creation with great interest, and when it was complete they all shouted for joy. (Job 38:4-7)

What does it say next? "And the earth was a formless and desolate emptiness, and darkness was over the surface of the deep, and the Spirit of God was hovering over the surface of the waters. 3 Then God said, “Let there be light”; and there was light."

Where did this "light" come from? A newly created sun? No!
Job 38:4, 9...Job was asked....
"Where were you when I laid the foundation of the earth?
Tell Me, if you have understanding. . . . .When I made a cloud its garment,
And thick darkness its swaddling bands".

If the sun was already in existence, and the earth was in darkness because of cloud layers, then removing some of the clouds layers would allow the light to penetrate to the earth's surface....enough for plants to photosynthesize....and day and night to be distinguished. But still the sun, moon and stars were not yet visible.

Vs 14-16.... "Then God said, “Let there be lights in the expanse of the heavens to separate the day from the night, and they shall serve as signs and for seasons, and for days and years; 15 and they shall serve as lights in the expanse of the heavens to give light on the earth”; and it was so. 16 God made the two great lights, the greater light to govern the day, and the lesser light to govern the night; He made the stars also."

Again, since the heavenly bodies were already in existence, removing more of the cloud layers made them clearly visible from the earth's surface.

Maybe. The day age theory is just one explanation of many that try to explain the creation.

 

[RLT63]

The same gravitational force that kept it in place from the beginning.


Yes...a miracle of creation...not an act of magic. We know that it is earth's rotation that creates day and night. And did you notice something else that shows it wasn't a 24 hour day?
"There was evening and morning".....how long is it between evening and morning here on earth? That is only 12 earth hours. But Peter tells us that with God, 'a thousand years seems like just one day'. (2 Peter 3:8)


This was the result of God using his spirit to accomplish his will. So, of course it was a miracle. But the Mary was not without sin. The child in her womb was sinless because of how he was created. The Bible does not teach that Mary (a descendant of Adam) was sinless however....nor does it teach that Mary was ever virgin.....you will find many of the titles and attributes of Mary are borrowed from ancient mother goddess worship. They are certainly not biblical. And many pre-date Christianity by centuries.

Do you see the similarity?

Something else they have in common....the nimbus (halo)
which is not mentioned at all in scripture but evident in these ancient statues.

These are a relic of sun worship. Nothing whatever to do with Christianity.

See Luke 1. Mary was a virgin, she didn't KNOW a man in the Biblical sense and she remained a virgin until after Jesus was born. She was not sinless and we shouldn't pray to her but the conception of Jesus was immaculate and a virgin had a child as was foretold in the scriptures

 

[amigo de christo]

Tell me-- what is a greater miracle? For an old barren woman like Sarai (Abraham's wife) or Elizabeth (Zechariah's wife) to become pregnant, or for a young girl to become pregnant? Young girls (even virgins) get pregnant seemingly by smiling while old woman who are well beyond child-bearing and no longer ovulating some would say-- cannot ever get pregnant. So miracles notwithstanding the former is a greater miracle than the latter example. But God specializes in miracles. Nothing is outside of His capability if it is within His will, so I will stipulate that much. Could he miraculously make a virgin pregnant without the participation of a man? I suppose He could, but that's not how biology works. God doesn't violate His own laws of nature. So to think otherwise is actually selling Him short. It's saying He could not do something other than what you believe He must have done based upon your own limited understanding of scripture, of human history and foremost-- of biology.

If you'd like to start a separate thread on the subject I'd be happy to chime in. To do so here might take the discussion far afield, but there actually is good evidence and solid logic that can be examined and employed to what otherwise is a bit of a conundrum. A mystery and a puzzle.

Both sarai and elizabeth were given a miracle of GOD in their old age . And both women had earthly fathers of their children .
Mary , Had no earthly father of Christ . The greater miracle by far is the Word became flesh .
As for biology and the sciences of men My advice is TRUST IN GOD who simply SPOKE the worlds into existance .
He SPOKE . God created all that is , Its not too difficult to beleive that HE could
have the WORD to become flesh with no earthen father at all involved . My advice is flee them sciences
and learn to trust as does a child IN GOD . if it is written in the bible , BELIEVE IT .
Its rather odd that many who profess to be christain have no problem believing in theories and scientific facts and fictions
YET when it cometh to the BOOK GOD inspired they sure seem to have a hard time trusting and believing in THE BOOK
and the TRUTH written therein . We cannot trust in men over GOD , so stop relying on science over the truth in the BIBLE .
Simply BELIEVE as a child in the miracle virgin birth of CHRIST , And that HE paid the price of our sins
and that HE died and ROSE again . Too many folks are trusting too much in science and its costing them to LOSE faith
in GOD and the things that were written in the bible for our learning .