Our generation will not die before the rapture and the return of Jesus to earth. PTL

[Timtofly]

The only Lamb referenced is lost humanity's cry against the Lamb. But Jesus isn't doing anything in the passage to gather His Church or whatever the thread was about.
Yes there is one use of the word Lamb... but it is not in reference to the Rapture.
Where does Paul say "at the Second Coming, the church is caught up". (specific timing and rapture reference needed)
John said angels come to earth and that symbolised the Church leaving the earth? How does that work? Those 2 things are not related.
And be careful of symbolism (Rev 22:18+19).
Did John lie about what he saw?
Did Jesus lie to John by what He showed John?
Did the Angels lie to John by what they said?
Or are you interpreting Johns vision by adding or subtracting symbolism into his writings?

The church is glorified and that is symbolized by robes of white.

Obviously you must have a whole different scenario of the Second Coming from Jesus, John, and Paul.

 

[L.A.M.B.]

Sounds like a "foolish virgin" to me.
I thought we were to be watchful not to be caught unawares.
Are you prepared for your children to turn you over to the authorities for your faith?
Are you prepared for your neighbours to kill you for your faith?
Are you prepared for your pastor to turn you over to the mob?

I'm not asking if you have a basement full of food and water, but where your mental/emotional state is and what you are prepared to endure.
Are you prepared to starve to death without attacking your neighbour who will not share their supplies?
Are you willing to give your loved ones over to the mob to be ripped to death before your eyes?
Have you even thought that these things might be what is possible in your future?

Amen.
I feel so sad for these foolish wishers who KEEP THEIR OWN EYES SHUT TO .....NOT SEE.

Once when young in the faith, I was taught this blarney. Studying and praying and digging deep in the Word reveals God's truth.

Why does this generation think it is so special to escape?

They treat God like a fool, NOT caring that it is his will and his plan happening. !

Selfishesness will be their fall !

 

[David Boyer]

The church is glorified and that is symbolized by robes of white.

Obviously you must have a whole different scenario of the Second Coming from Jesus, John, and Paul.

I'm not the one altering the text of Revelation to fit my ideas.

Trust that Revelation is true.
Look around the world and see if the world is matching up with Revelation.
Then you can make some sort of guesses/predictions about the world because if the world matches Revelation then maybe the world will continue to match Revelation.
Older prophecies can add to Revelation, but can never alter Revelation. Rev 22:18-19
When it comes to which book is the primary source... go with the one COMMANDED by Jesus Christ. Rev 1:19

 

[No Pre-TB]

If I may, @David Boyer, it may be Pre-TB believers here may feel defensive because of your questions. Now, I agree with the idea that Christ taught the church we ought to spiritually prepare for all types of tribulation.
Expecting to be removed beforehand is quite the opposite of what He and Paul taught.

I wonder, without bickering if possible, what the OP thinks are the 3 best verses that prove the OPs idea of escaping tribulation or at least verses detailing when we are raptured in Revelation. I’d feel hard pressed to mention just 1 single verse for her/him.

Job 14:12
So man lieth down, and riseth not: till the heavens be no more, they shall not awake, nor be raised out of their sleep.

How does man rise at the rapture if the heavens haven’t been removed yet according to a Pre-TB timeline? The OP doesn’t need to answer, but scripture shouldn’t conflict with scripture. This should be a shiny red flag causing people to look into it. Or Acts 3:21
How does Christ leave heaven when nothing is restored yet according to Pre-TB? Scripture cannot invalidate other scripture. Im concerned about my brothers and sisters in the Lord, I don’t want them to not see scripture that speaks truth.

 

[L.A.M.B.]

We can have the TRUTH of the Word expounded and exposed but it is up to the individual to receive it at the Spirit's moving in them.

Many do not want the truth but rather a tickling lie to lullaby their sleepiness further.

The Word tells us to AWAKE, BE SOBER AND VIGILANT, to submit ourselves unto God, follow HIS VOICE , commands & will, not deviating off this path.

Yet we see so many wanting the easy way full of flowery words and platitudes that cause no alarm nor fear. EASY!

FEAR GOD!

Do not fear the one who can ONLY KILL THE BODY !

FEAR GOD!

God alone has the POWER TO DESTROY BOTH BODY AND SOUL in the LOF for all eternity !

Do these that hold to an unsound doctrine believe it will become true if they keep repeating it as a mantra ?

Rapture us, rapture us, rapture us ; SOUNDS LIKE,
Crucify him, crucify him, crucify him
at Jesus's mock trial !

 

[Ronald David Bruno]

This is Not a Drill
By Hal Lindsey

Critics of end-time Bible prophecy often say exactly what the Bible said they would say. 2 Peter 3:3-4 (NASB) says, “In the last days mockers will come with their mocking, following after their own lusts, and saying, ‘Where is the promise of His coming? For ever since the fathers fell asleep, all continues just as it was from the beginning of creation.’”

Wars and rumors of war? Nothing new there, they say. Famines? They were worse in the past. Plagues and pandemics? We had a bad one for a couple of years, but the world has had worse. Lawlessness? Humanity has always had its crooks and creeps. Deception? People started lying right after they started talking. So, what’s new? What’s different?

Those samples of end-time signs all come from the words of Jesus in Matthew 24. There are lots of others, but let’s look briefly at these and see what makes them different today.

Wars and rumors of war. — Before each of the first two World Wars, everyone saw the terrible possibilities. But almost no one really thought it would happen. They thought cooler heads would prevail. But cool heads did not prevail. Pride prevailed. Greed prevailed. Hate prevailed.

It’s happening again, but this time with the added threat of nuclear weapons. As before, no one believes it will really happen. But the signs are there. War threatens every part of the earth, especially Europe. In Ukraine, Russian arrogance has been shattered. Their president, Vladimir Putin, is as proud and as careless with human life as Hitler or Mussolini. And right now, he’s like a wounded animal… with nukes.

That is just one factor that has turned planet earth into a tinderbox. Another would be severe shortages, especially of oil. This is a classic and historic cause of war. And we’re on the verge of shortages not seen since the last World War.

Famine. — This summer, UN Secretary-General Antonio Guterres said that present food shortages could trigger a global “catastrophe.” The soaring cost of fertilizer, the war in Ukraine, drought, and many other issues, have placed earth on the brink of major famines — maybe sooner than you think and in places you never thought famine was possible.

Pandemics and plagues. — The Covid pandemic still rages, and others threaten. Technology has made our generation more vulnerability to disease, not less. Several biological threats lurk on the fringes of civilization right now — many of them manmade. Also, superbugs are still on the rise, and we have no known solution to the crises they threaten.

There are other kinds of plagues as well. For instance, computer viruses carry the threat of cutting off essential water, electricity, food, and health care to entire regions.

Lawlessness. — Still another kind of pandemic was recently pointed out by scientists at the University of California San Diego School of Medicine. They reported that 18% of Californians — one in six — experienced physical or sexual violence in the past year. That doesn’t include theft or vandalism or fraud or any number of other crimes. This number only reflects violent crime, and it’s getting worse. Principal investigator Anita Raj said, “Californians are experiencing violence at epidemic proportions.” California is just one example. The epidemic of lawlessness knows no regional or national boundaries. It is global in scope.

Deception. — Fake news is not new. But it has never before been possible on the scale we see today. A global media outlet is built into every new phone. This explosion of media means opportunities for mass deception like no one even dreamed of before this century.

These are just a few of the signs Jesus pointed out in Matthew 24. And that’s just one chapter of the Bible. What’s unique about today is that all the hundreds of biblical end-time signs are converging and intensifying. The 1918 flu killed a higher percentage of people than Covid-19, but the modern nation of Israel did not exist then. Geopolitical alliances predicted in the Bible were not forming at every turn. Satanism was not exploding in popularity and influence. The 1918 pandemic was not accompanied by a rise of technology perfectly fitted to Antichrist and the mark of the beast.

The signs are all coming together right now. Keep your eyes on Jesus. Take care of your business, but do not let the cares of this world distract you from Him. Look up. Maranatha! Jesus is coming soon!

When I first became Christian in 1991, I used to visit a church near me, Tetelestai, in Torrance, Ca., Hal Lindsey's Church. Being a new Christian, not knowing about anything, I was impressed by his teachings. He recognized that this was the generation that would experience the Second Coming and wrote a book, "The Late Great Planet Earth" and so I read it. That sort of set me off on my eschtological journey. My church that I attended regularly was more of an evangelical church, which had a well rounded focus on the Good News with teaching, equipping and sending us out. I preferred my Pastor Zac Nazarian over Hal anyday. Zac never tou hed Revelation, thought their were too many views, and didn't concern himself about the unknown future, but more about the present. He said it would all pan out and left it at that. I was okay with that and so sought outside teaching for End Time studies.
Hal Lindsey was at the time, a top scholar in this field. He understood a lot, just not the timing, which many got wrong, thinking one generation was 40 years. Chuck Missler was another one I used to listen to. Sometimes he would be a guest at Chuck Smiths Cavalry Chapel. He had similar views but taught about Astrophysics and Creation. "The Divine Watchmaker" was one of his books. He'd delve into the complexity of life from the micro-cosmos to the macro- cosmos - fascinating stuff.
But when 1988 came and went many of these prophecy buffs were confused, disillusioned that the GT didn't come. They were wrong - about 40 years off.
Psalm 90:10 tells us a generation is 70-80 years and that is about the average lifespan now. So if this is the generation spoken about, it should be over within the next 6 years. I think the Four Horses and their riders are out of the barn already.

 

[No Pre-TB]

Psalm 90:10 tells us a generation is 70-80 years and that is about the average lifespan now. So if this is the generation spoken about, it should be over within the next 6 years. I think the Four Horses and their riders are out of the barn already.

Hello Ronald. As you noted, past “teachers” of eschatology got it wrong. The spirit did not give them that info. It was the itching ears and fables of men that lead them to wherever they wandered. Hal Lindsey said:

A generation in the Bible is something like forty years. If this is a correct deduction, then within forty years or so of 1948, all these things could take place.

Chuck Smith said,
I believe that the generation of 1948 is the last generation. Since a generation of judgment is forty years and the Tribulation period lasts seven years, I believe the Lord could come back for His Church any time before the Tribulation starts, which would mean any time before 1981 (1948 + 40 – 7 = 1981).

Both of them were wrong. The Psalm’s verse is about man’s lifespan and not a generation. Using it for the return of Christ or tribulation will also prove as a failure. The context of that passage is when we get to 70-80 years, we’re so fragile, old and weak that we fade away. At that time in our life, why would we wish for an extension? For another 20 years or whatever man wants? It’s has absolutely nothing to do with Israel. That would be eisegesis.

 

[L.A.M.B.]

This is not the time for ignorance to continue...........

To those FOLLOWING the teachings, doctrines and BALDERDASH of men, WAKE UP !

There is no rapture, only Christ second coming .( Know the bible and the origins of your belief)

We have no set time for Jesus's return, the Word he left, was in fact that none knew except God when that was to be.

Instead of living in fantasy of some glorious non existent event, get wise and get your extra oil. The night is long and dark before the groom comes.

Our petty little trials and trying of our patience is nothing, nothing!

Wait until your family member turns you in to the powers that be as a spy believer or follower. Wait until you're told to denounce the God of heaven or see your family horrendously tortured in front of you,crying to you for help.

You are not anymore worthy to escape the horror of the great tribulation against the saints than those of the first century believers.

 

[marks]

You are not anymore worthy to escape the horror of the great tribulation against the saints than those of the first century believers

Tribulation is promised to all, not just in the first century, and not just at the end of the age. But even so not all are appointed for the same things.

Much love!

 

[No Pre-TB]

There is no rapture,

Is there a harpazo? Or, is there a time when the living are seized like valuable treasure before a fire so that the treasure isn’t destroyed?

edit: a simple yes or no will suffice

 

[L.A.M.B.]

Whom do you see in Johns vision in the Revelation of Christ ? @No Pre-TB

 

[ScottA]

Tribulation is promised to all, not just in the first century, and not just at the end of the age. But even so not all are appointed for the same things.

Much love!

That is an interesting point, one that should be considered.

While it is true that "not all are appointed for the same things", it is also true that all are appointed equally by their lot. Meaning that God has not been unfair in His distribution of tribulations--but values each differently than we might. Which is not unlike our service or being a part of a body of many members...where even the seemingly lesser parts are of equal value to the whole, by God.

In this same way, it might be considered a curse to have lived in one time or another...but also a blessing. The US Civil War is a good example. Many fought and died and lives were seemingly destroyed--certainly by our own way of thinking. And we may still not honor those who took part, when perhaps we should--as it was a world war on a stage against slavery, a war that was won for the cause of all humanity like no other in history. I should think many have likewise served the cause of good without honor, even those born into the wrong side without their choosing, but likewise to suffer. The examples down through the ages are perhaps countless--but not to God who works all things together for good for those who love Him according to His purpose.

 

[marks]

While it is true that "not all are appointed for the same things", it is also true that all are appointed equally by their lot. Meaning that God has not been unfair in His distribution of tribulations--but values each differently than we might. Which is not unlike our service or being a part of a body of many members...where even the seemingly lesser parts are of equal value to the whole, by God.

Likewise, a very important thing to know!

We receive from our Father what is good in His eyes, not ours.

Much love!

 

[marks]

In this same way, it might be considered a curse to have lived in one time or another...but also a blessing. The US Civil War is a good example. Many fought and died and lives were seemingly destroyed--certainly by our own way of thinking. And we may still not honor those who took part, when perhaps we should--as it was a world war on a stage against slavery, a war that was won for the cause of all humanity like no other in history. I should think many have likewise served the cause of good without honor, even those born into the wrong side without their choosing, but likewise to suffer. The examples down through the ages are perhaps countless--but not to God who works all things together for good for those who love Him according to His purpose.

My wife and I have kind of run through this conversation. We look at what is happening now, and wonder that there could have been a better time to be alive.

I was born in 61. Had I been born 10 years earlier, I'd been in Vietnam. Had I been born 10 years before that, I'd have been in Korea. Had I been born 10 years before that, I'd have been in WWII. Had I been born 10 years before that, the Great Depression. 10 years before that, WWI. Or maybe not, who knows, but there doesn't seem to have been a better time that didn't have it's own challenges.

And yes, all these things have worked good in the lives of God's people. We don't know what is good for us, but the answer of faith is, this is for my best!

Solomon wrote the foolishness of asking why things were better in times past. I think the foolishness of that question is in our assumption that things are worse today. It's a lack of trust.

Much love!

 

[marks]

We can have the TRUTH of the Word expounded and exposed but it is up to the individual to receive it at the Spirit's moving in them.

Many do not want the truth but rather a tickling lie to lullaby their sleepiness further.

The Word tells us to AWAKE, BE SOBER AND VIGILANT, to submit ourselves unto God, follow HIS VOICE , commands & will, not deviating off this path.

Yet we see so many wanting the easy way full of flowery words and platitudes that cause no alarm nor fear. EASY!

FEAR GOD!

Do not fear the one who can ONLY KILL THE BODY !

FEAR GOD!

God alone has the POWER TO DESTROY BOTH BODY AND SOUL in the LOF for all eternity !

Do these that hold to an unsound doctrine believe it will become true if they keep repeating it as a mantra ?

Rapture us, rapture us, rapture us ; SOUNDS LIKE,
Crucify him, crucify him, crucify him
at Jesus's mock trial !

I think there will be a pre-trib rapture, but your other words, they don't describe me.

Much love!

 

[dev553344]

Our generation will not die before the rapture and the return of Jesus to earth. PT
Jesus named all the signs we will see just before His return
In Matthew 24 Matthew 24: 32 “Now learn the parable from the fig tree: as soon as its branch has become tender and sprouts its leaves, you know that summer is near; 33 so you too, when you see all these things, recognize that He is near, right at the door. 34 Truly I say to you, this generation will not pass away until all these things take place. Don't be left behind!

I've felt that Christ will return soon. But I've been wrong before so I'm really not sure.

 

[ScottA]

My wife and I have kind of run through this conversation. We look at what is happening now, and wonder that there could have been a better time to be alive.

I was born in 61. Had I been born 10 years earlier, I'd been in Vietnam. Had I been born 10 years before that, I'd have been in Korea. Had I been born 10 years before that, I'd have been in WWII. Had I been born 10 years before that, the Great Depression. 10 years before that, WWI. Or maybe not, who knows, but there doesn't seem to have been a better time that didn't have it's own challenges.

And yes, all these things have worked good in the lives of God's people. We don't know what is good for us, but the answer of faith is, this is for my best!

Solomon wrote the foolishness of asking why things were better in times past. I think the foolishness of that question is in our assumption that things are worse today. It's a lack of trust.

Much love!

Awesome! (Young man )

In my own considerations, I find it no coincidence that being born in '53, I waited for the Viet Nam war draft wondering what would become of me...and then the month before my birthday--they cancelled the draft!

None of us are in control of such things--but God is.

 

[L.A.M.B.]

I think there will be a pre-trib rapture, but your other words, they don't describe me.

Much love!

That is ok, ppl are free to believe as they choose.

I'm not sure about the rest of your post.

We agree on much but have points of disagreement as well. The only ones I really stand against are the fanciful babies of 50 yrs and the out right men followers.

Still each of us are in the hands of a just and merciful God.

 

[marks]

Awesome! (Young man )

In my own considerations, I find it no coincidence that being born in '53, I waited for the Viet Nam war draft wondering what would become of me...and then the month before my birthday--they cancelled the draft!

None of us are in control of such things--but God is.

Wow! Talk about feeling in the crosshairs!

When I was 16 or 17 or so, I wasn't liking what I saw in my life, and went to the army recruiter's office. I ended up spending 3 or 4 afternoons with this fellow, a couple of hours at a time. We got to know each other a little bit. They had a 2 year active/2 year reserve, a vary favorable program! And no current war. I was interested. It looked like a way out.

But he told me that final meeting, the army was not for me. He said, some people fit into that structure, but he didn't think I would. In retrospect, I believe he was right.

Imagine that! An army recruiter with an healthy teen in his office ready to sign! And he turned me down! God is very much in control!!

Much love!

 

[marks]

That is ok, ppl are free to believe as they choose.

I'm not sure about the rest of your post.

We agree on much but have points of disagreement as well. The only ones I really stand against are the fanciful babies of 50 yrs and the out right men followers.

Still each of us are in the hands of a just and merciful God.

I think we agree on the important parts, trusting Him, serving Him, denying ourselves.

Its just that, to those who think pre-trib puts you to sleep, I'm here to say it most certainly does not.

Much love!