21st Century Christianity - A brief manifesto for our age.

[amigo de christo]

Neither will abandoning the message of the Bible in favor of your own version of Christianity

Exactly . too many pick and choose . But lambs hold onto every glorious word of the LORD . KNOWING WHO INSPIRED those words .
We is sticking to original first given first century truth . THE TRUTH that was first delivered by Christ
and later by the apostels in that bible . Folks who pick and choose do so unto their own destruction . Lambs simply EMBRACE TRUTH .

 

[2ndRateMind]

Dares to suggest that ethics are relevant? That you are a Cultural Marxist is seen, in part, by your failure to distinguish between ethics and politics.

If politics has no ethical dimension, it really is a sad undertaking. No more than the pursuit of power for power's sake, really.

Equity, the new buzz word Leftists are perverting. Being the good Communist and/or Cultural Marxist, just how are you advocating for "equitability?"

Read the thread.

IF it is deserved, people will be voluntarily willing to pay for it.

No they won't. Due to the the corruption of our societies by globalised capitalism, which you seem to accept and even support, they will only pay the absolute minimum they can get away with.

Best wishes, 2RM.

 

[atpollard]

Actually, I have a real world problem and opportunity to elevate someone out of poverty. Tyrone is a friend of mine that owns a Used Car Lot in Tampa. Tyrone's needs employees that can transport cars from one location to another, learn to detail cars, and (if interested) learn to sell cars. Tyrone came to America from Jamaica and has a soft spot for people that are struggling to get by. Tyrone wants to hire from the local community but cannot find employees that meet these two requirements:

1. They need to show up for work from 8 AM to 5 PM (with an hour for lunch).
2. They need to be sober (no drugs or alcohol).

Candidates will either show up some days, but not others, or they will get high during work hours. Tyrone cannot allow someone that is high to drive his cars. Tyrone cannot operate the business with an employee that is not there.

What "Bible Verse" or "Social Plan" will allow Tyrone to pay someone $15 per hour with no experience or skill required?
What "Bible Verse" or "Social Plan" will equitably distribute wealth so that a person can stay home and get high but not be poor?

I am not sure that this problem is because of Billionaires or greed.
I think this might be a personal moral failing issue of people that need a savior even more than they need money.

 

[amigo de christo]

Actually, I have a real world problem and opportunity to elevate someone out of poverty. Tyrone is a friend of mine that owns a Used Car Lot in Tampa. Tyrone's needs employees that can transport cars from one location to another, learn to detail cars, and (if interested) learn to sell cars. Tyrone came to America from Jamaica and has a soft spot for people that are struggling to get by. Tyrone wants to hire from the local community but cannot find employees that meet these two requirements:

1. They need to show up for work from 8 AM to 5 PM (with an hour for lunch).
2. They need to be sober (no drugs or alcohol).

Candidates will either show up some days, but not others, or they will get high during work hours. Tyrone cannot allow someone that is high to drive his cars. Tyrone cannot operate the business with an employee that is not there.

What "Bible Verse" or "Social Plan" will allow Tyrone to pay someone $15 per hour with no experience or skill required?
What "Bible Verse" or "Social Plan" will equitably distribute wealth so that a person can stay home and get high but not be poor?

I am not sure that this problem is because of Billionaires or greed.
I think this might be a personal moral failing issue of people that need a savior even more than they need money.

THIS WORLD IS IN DIRE NEED OF JESUS CHRIST . More and more they have abandoned HIM
and more and more things keep getting only worse .
THIS WORLD will soon learn exactly WHY it should have accepted CHRIST
and exactly what happens when GOD is removed from every fabric of society . IT CANNOT SURVIVE but has AN END .
Not a good end either .

 

[amigo de christo]

When the evil godless rule the earth shall groan and weep . Mark those words well
This world cannot and will not withstand the things that are to come upon it .
THE ANSWER IS , COME YE TO JESUS CHRIST and learn those bibles well OUR BELOVED CITY COMETH WITH THE KING
what a wonderful home awaits the lambs . BUT woe wail the world that rejected GOD and HIS CHRIST .
The VERYCHRIST who would have saved them , WILL ALSO DELIVER WRATH AGAINST THOSE WHO REJECTED HIM .
WE better MOUNT UP and start preaching CHRIST and all bibical sound doctrine whereby one shall grow .
Cause this world is running OUTTA TIME and that my friends is a fact . And a painful one to those who rejected CHRIST .

 

[2ndRateMind]

Exactly . too many pick and choose . But lambs hold onto every glorious word of the LORD . KNOWING WHO INSPIRED those words .
We is sticking to original first given first century truth . THE TRUTH that was first delivered by Christ
and later by the apostels in that bible . Folks who pick and choose do so unto their own destruction . Lambs simply EMBRACE TRUTH .

Oh dear.

Go away and read some theology, and maybe some philosophy, also. Then you might have something useful to contribute to the discussion. This inexpensive little paperback would be a good place to start. The writing style is accessible, but it contains a lot of distilled wisdom.

Best wishes, 2RM.

 

[amigo de christo]

No thanks to theologies gone wrong . THEY have corrupted far too many who went in their direction .
Stick to the bible my friends and let us CLING TO CHRIST .

 

[RLT63]

Oh dear.

Go away and read some theology, and maybe some philosophy, also. Then you might have something useful to contribute to the discussion. This inexpensive little paperback would be a good place to start. The writing style is accessible, but it contains a lot of distilled wisdom.

Best wishes, 2RM.

I recommend this book instead
https://www.amazon.com/Study-Bible-...ort/dp/0785220623/ref=sr_1_5?crid=22Z192LSBWA

 

[GEN2REV]

As for the 10 commandments, well, they leave a lot of sinful actions out. Like getting absurdly rich, when others need the money more.

No they cover that sin. You don't get that rich without stealing, lying and coveting.

That's the 8th, 9th & 10th Commandments.

And Jesus' abbreviated Command, to love thy neighbor as thy self, covers that as well. That's why Jesus basically says there will be no rich people in heaven. The qualities (or maybe the absence of quality) that it takes within someone to become that wealthy is abhorrent to the Holy Spirit. There is nothing Holy or Righteous in that level of greed and selfishness.

... while I would not claim to know absolute truth, I am, at least, closer to it than you are.

Oh, are you?

Meanwhile, I'm quite content to agree to disagree.

Agreed.

 

[2ndRateMind]

Actually, I have a real world problem and opportunity to elevate someone out of poverty. Tyrone is a friend of mine that owns a Used Car Lot in Tampa. Tyrone's needs employees that can transport cars from one location to another, learn to detail cars, and (if interested) learn to sell cars. Tyrone came to America from Jamaica and has a soft spot for people that are struggling to get by. Tyrone wants to hire from the local community but cannot find employees that meet these two requirements:

1. They need to show up for work from 8 AM to 5 PM (with an hour for lunch).
2. They need to be sober (no drugs or alcohol).

Candidates will either show up some days, but not others, or they will get high during work hours. Tyrone cannot allow someone that is high to drive his cars. Tyrone cannot operate the business with an employee that is not there.

What "Bible Verse" or "Social Plan" will allow Tyrone to pay someone $15 per hour with no experience or skill required?
What "Bible Verse" or "Social Plan" will equitably distribute wealth so that a person can stay home and get high but not be poor?

I am not sure that this problem is because of Billionaires or greed.
I think this might be a personal moral failing issue of people that need a savior even more than they need money.

You think the supply of drugs is not a greed issue?

But to be sure, the wretched addicts need both money and Jesus. But they also need, first off, an effective (government funded, since the whole of society benefits from having fewer addicts on the street) rehab facility.

None of this helps your friend Tyrone in the short term, of course. I hope he finds someone reliable soon. Maybe a school leaver?

Best wishes, 2RM

 

[Ronald David Bruno]

On another forum, I lamented that Christianity was being left behind, and as it is currently consituted, stood to collapse into irrelevance and obscurity, with none but a few dinosaur conservatives left muttering to each other in corners about how evil the world is.

You have it wrong! Don't you know that God is SOVEREIGN? Do you know what that means? He has a plan, is in control and EVERYTHING IS GOING ALONG PERFECTLY AS HE PLANNED. You struggle with this idea, thinking somehow man is messing up His plan and He must have to go back and re-figure it. "Oh my, look what the Church has become ... look what they have done now ... what shall I do?" Every Christian that was written in the Book of Life before the foundation of the World has been and/or will be saved exactly how He planned. Nobody was lost. What you don't realize is the God factors into His plan all our failures and imperfections, BASICALLY GOOD AND EVIL. And so the Church is moving along in good health. There are 2.7 billion believers. They aren't perfect, no one is. But look at the Seven Churches of Revelation in the first century. Only two did not receive rebuke. One was dead, another luke-warm, another had good doctrine but lacked brotherly love, etc. Problems them, problems now, but no worries.

The religion should be leading this progressive movement, not being reluctantly dragged, kicking and screaming all the way, by secular society, into the modern age.

Ahhhh ... the PROGRESSIVE, LIBERAL MOVEMENT, what a fraud that is, how evil. Global Warming ... oops, Climate Change is a disguise for Global Governance and the New World Order (socialism /Marxism). The Church should conform to this moverment you say? Satan and the Antichrist are leading this movement. We are about to experience the Great Tribulation - wake up.

 

[RLT63]

You think the supply of drugs is not a greed issue?

But to be sure, the wretched addicts need both money and Jesus. But they also need, first off, an effective (government funded, since the whole of society benefits from having fewer addicts on the street) rehab facility.

None of this helps your friend Tyrone in the short term, of course. I hope he finds someone reliable soon. Maybe a school leaver?

Best wishes, 2RM

Government funded rehab sounds great. Now if you get that, how do you make people go to rehab who do not want to?

 

[GEN2REV]

Government funded rehab sounds great. Now if you get that, how do you make people go to rehab who do not want to?

And a lotta Govt rehabs are handing out "Rehabilitation Drugs" like methadone that are as addictive, or more so, than the drugs they are supposed to be saving people from; which is just replacing one drug with another.

More money to the Govt at the cost of the make-ready addicts.

Yes, the Govt always solves all our problems handily.

 

[2ndRateMind]

No they cover that sin. You don't get that rich without stealing, lying and coveting.

And your evidence for this assertion is, what, exactly?

Apparently, there are at least 7,400,000 millionaires in the world who claim to be Christian. Not entirely sure how old this figure is, and it could well be that there are many more, by now. Whatever, you certainly don't need that sort of wealth to lead a happy, wholesome, healthy life. Jesus did try to explain that, but it seems some are hard of hearing when it comes to their bank balances.

Best wishes, 2RM

 

[Matthias]

Government funded rehab sounds great. Now if you get that, how do you make people go to rehab who do not want to?

My sister-in-law worked for a few years at just such a place. (I think it was called Passages.) Some where there voluntarily. Some were there because court ordered. It was a harrowing experience for her. And for most, if not all, of them.

 

[RLT63]

And your evidence for this assertion is, what, exactly?

Apparently, there are at least 7,400,000 millionaires in the world who claim to be Christian. Not entirely sure how old this figure is, and it could well be that there are many more, by now. Whatever, you certainly don't need that sort of wealth to lead a happy, wholesome, healthy life. Jesus did try to explain that, but it seems some are hard of hearing when it comes to their bank balances.

Best wishes, 2RM

Have you sold everything you own and given it to the poor? How about half, have you given half of what you own to the poor?

 

[2ndRateMind]

You have it wrong! Don't you know that God is SOVEREIGN? Do you know what that means? He has a plan, is in control and EVERYTHING IS GOING ALONG PERFECTLY AS HE PLANNED. You struggle with this idea, thinking somehow man is messing up His plan and He must have to go back and re-figure it. "Oh my, look what the Church has become ... look what they have done now ... what shall I do?" Every Christian that was written in the Book of Life before the foundation of the World has been and/or will be saved exactly how He planned. Nobody was lost. What you don't realize is the God factors into His plan all our failures and imperfections, BASICALLY GOOD AND EVIL. And so the Church is moving along in good health. There are 2.7 billion believers. They aren't perfect, no one is. But look at the Seven Churches of Revelation in the first century. Only two did not receive rebuke. One was dead, another luke-warm, another had good doctrine but lacked brotherly love, etc. Problems them, problems now, but no worries.

I am sure, as you are, that God has everything planned. But He accomplishes His plans through people. We all have to play our part, too. And it would help us all if we had a Church that was fit-for-purpose in the 21st century. Right now, it isn't.

Ahhhh ... the PROGRESSIVE, LIBERAL MOVEMENT, what a fraud that is, how evil. Global Warming ... oops, Climate Change is a disguise for Global Governance and the New World Order (socialism /Marxism). The Church should conform to this moverment you say? Satan and the Antichrist are leading this movement. We are about to experience the Great Tribulation - wake up.

This is all just complete rubbish, from start to finish. I suggest you quit reading conspiracy theories off the interweb, and find something useful to do. I recommend reading some quality, published material, that has been subjected to independant editorial criticism, such as the inexpensive paperback I recommended to amigo de christo, above. (post#86). It really is a good read.

Best wishes, 2RM.

 

[2ndRateMind]

The poor are not starving because the rich have wealth.

On the contrary, that is exactly why they are starving. At any given point in time, there is only so much wealth in the world. The more of it they hog, the less there is for everyone else.

Furthermore, there is the whole matter of unethical and even illegal business and political practices to compound the problem.

I'm not, incidentally, motivated by envy. I get by, quite contentedly, on somewhat less than I would have if all the world's wealth were distributed equally among all the world's people, man, woman, and child. (which pattern of distribution I do not advocate, but it does mean I am not taking up even part of anyone else's fair share). And still find I have enough money to buy the occasional book to read, and support my favourite charities.

What motivates me is the idea that we could have a better, safer, fairer world, if we only were enlightened enough to choose to make it so. And that, I think, would be a proper legacy to leave our children, and theirs.

Best wishes, 2RM.

 

[GEN2REV]

And your evidence for this assertion is, what, exactly?

Life experience?

I've done a little bit of everything in my lifetime and I saw firsthand what kind of person it takes to be good at sales, and to be a successful business person.

Some assertions don't really need to be proven.

There is almost nobody who gets significantly wealthy by being honest, sincere, fair, considerate and filled with Faith and love for God.

That's just a Truth, an absolute.

I'm guessing you're one of these new breeds who believes there are no absolutes; that everything is relative?

 

[2ndRateMind]

Have you sold everything you own and given it to the poor?

Don't be silly. What good would that do, except to increment the number of absolutely poor by one, and for me to become a burden on charities with better ways to spend their money, and more deserving people to support?

If all the world's wealth were equally distributed (which I do not recommend) we would all (man, woman and child) have a net worth of $33,000, and an annual income of $27,000. (from calculations based on numbers by Credit Suisse, pre covid).For the conventional nuclear family, the appropriate figure, therefore, is household wealth four times that. And provided one's wealth is around this sort of level, I think no one has a right to ask more of you than that.

But millionaires and billionaires are a different story altogether, I think. 'From those to whom much is given, much is expected'.

Best wishes, 2RM.