WAKE UP!!! Church pastors we are living in the days of the very near rapture!

[David in NJ]

Where is the tribulation in the book of Daniel?

The OT Prophets declare pre-trib rapture as completely false.

So, let's look at the Book of Daniel to SEE.

Therefore at that time certain Chaldeans came forward and accused the Jews. They spoke and said to King Nebuchadnezzar, “O king, live forever! You, O king, have made a decree that everyone who hears the sound of the horn, flute, harp, lyre, and psaltery, in symphony with all kinds of music, shall fall down and worship the gold image; and whoever does not fall down and worship shall be cast into the midst of a burning fiery furnace. There are certain Jews whom you have set over the affairs of the province of Babylon: Shadrach, Meshach, and Abed-Nego; these men, O king, have not paid due regard to you. They do not serve your gods or worship the gold image which you have set up.”

Shadrach, Meshach, and Abed-Nego answered and said to the king, “O Nebuchadnezzar, we have no need to answer you in this matter. 17If that is the case, our God whom we serve is able to deliver us from the burning fiery furnace, and He will deliver us from your hand, O king.
18But if not, let it be known to you, O king, that we do not serve your gods, nor will we worship the gold image which you have set up.”

LIKEWISE = Daniel was thrown into the Lions Den.

These are just two of OT Prophetic view of Matt ch24 and Revelation

 

[marks]

Lying signs and wonders does mean a false christ/god can create a false rapture. Denial only makes it the more possible.

How so?

That doesn't seem right to me. False Rapture? What is that?

Much love!

 

[marks]

The OT Prophets declare pre-trib rapture as completely false.

So, let's look at the Book of Daniel to SEE.

Therefore at that time certain Chaldeans came forward and accused the Jews. They spoke and said to King Nebuchadnezzar, “O king, live forever! You, O king, have made a decree that everyone who hears the sound of the horn, flute, harp, lyre, and psaltery, in symphony with all kinds of music, shall fall down and worship the gold image; and whoever does not fall down and worship shall be cast into the midst of a burning fiery furnace. There are certain Jews whom you have set over the affairs of the province of Babylon: Shadrach, Meshach, and Abed-Nego; these men, O king, have not paid due regard to you. They do not serve your gods or worship the gold image which you have set up.”

Shadrach, Meshach, and Abed-Nego answered and said to the king, “O Nebuchadnezzar, we have no need to answer you in this matter. 17If that is the case, our God whom we serve is able to deliver us from the burning fiery furnace, and He will deliver us from your hand, O king.
18But if not, let it be known to you, O king, that we do not serve your gods, nor will we worship the gold image which you have set up.”

LIKEWISE = Daniel was thrown into the Lions Den.

These are just two of OT Prophetic view of Matt ch24 and Revelation

I don't see anything in the OT one way or another regarding the rapture of the church.

In this example, it shows the children of Israel being tested to worship a statue upon pain of death, and that's exactly what will happen in the 70th week.

Much love!

 

[David in NJ]

It won't be fake. All the stars will come to earth as God's angels. Satan will deceive people into thinking all the angels are aliens, because the entertainment industry has been conditioning people since 1948.

Instead of body snatchers, the angels will be removing souls out of Adam's dead corruptible flesh. God's angels have always appeared as men. Not aliens taking over human bodies.

Jesus comes to the Mount of Olives at the 6th Seal. He brings all the angels from the firmament with Him. These verses are not symbolic:

"The enemy that sowed them is the devil; the harvest is the end of the world; and the reapers are the angels."

"And he shall send his angels with a great sound of a trumpet, and they shall gather together his elect from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other."

"And then shall he send his angels, and shall gather together his elect from the four winds, from the uttermost part of the earth to the uttermost part of heaven."

"When the Son of man shall come in his glory, and all the holy angels with him, then shall he sit upon the throne of his glory:"

When it says all, it means all.

"And the stars of heaven fell unto the earth, even as a fig tree casteth her untimely figs, when she is shaken of a mighty wind."

This is symbolism for the angels coming to earth at the Second Coming.

The angels round up the entire church at this event to meet the Lord in the air, but then all the angels come to earth with Jesus, and the church remains in Paradise. No where in these verses do the saints come yet. They have to wait until all the harvest is gathered, up until the battle of Armageddon which is the last harvest of the dead with the mark of the beast.

"And white robes were given unto every one of them; and it was said unto them, that they should rest yet for a little season, until their fellowservants also and their brethren, that should be killed as they were, should be fulfilled."

All the harvest of the Trumpets and Thunders has to happen after the Church is glorified. The AoD has to happen after the Thunders, not before the 5th and 6th Seal. Revelation is the correct chronological order of this final harvest. The angels are on earth during the Trumpets and Thunders before the 7th Trumpet even sounds. It is in the midst of the days of the 7th Trumpet that the third woe happens. Satan may get to set up the AoD then, but certainly not prior to the 7th Trumpet.

You said: "No where in these verses do the saints come yet."

Your statement is completely contrary to Scripture = 1 Thess , 2 Thess , Revelation

 

[David in NJ]

I don't see anything in the OT one way or another regarding the rapture of the church.

In this example, it shows the children of Israel being tested to worship a statue upon pain of death, and that's exactly what will happen in the 70th week.

Much love!

CORRECT = there is no pre-trib rapture = ZERO

You cannot say : " i don't see anything one way or the other"
That is not how God wrote the Truth = Scripture never lies = It builds Truth upon Truth.

God's FACT check= Daniel and his 3 Brothers in the Faith suffered Tribulation unto Death during BABYLON/STATUE/ANTICHRIST
They went thru great tribulation = Death for Faith = God delivered them from the MIDST of Tribulation = Revelation 7:9-13

There is no greater tribulation then being put to death for your Faith in Christ = the Ultimate Sacrifice

Furthermore = Daniel chapter 7 is a prelude to Revelation chs 12&13

He shall speak pompous words against the Most High, Shall persecute the saints of the Most High,
And shall intend to change times and law. Then the saints shall be given into his hand For a time and times and half a time.

 

[marks]

CORRECT = there is no pre-trib rapture = ZERO

That's not what I said.

There is nothing one way or the other in the OT concerning this:

1 Thessalonians 4:15-17 KJV
15) For this we say unto you by the word of the Lord, that we which are alive and remain unto the coming of the Lord shall not prevent them which are asleep.
16) For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first:
17) Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord.

Much love!

 

[marks]

There is no greater tribulation then being put to death for your Faith in Christ = the Ultimate Sacrifice

And yet not everyone dies for their faith. My mother, a child of God, died of cancer in bed. My sister also. My sister, I watched her, she was actually peaceful.

Much love!

 

[David in NJ]

That's not what I said.

There is nothing one way or the other in the OT concerning this:

1 Thessalonians 4:15-17 KJV
15) For this we say unto you by the word of the Lord, that we which are alive and remain unto the coming of the Lord shall not prevent them which are asleep.
16) For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first:
17) Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord.

Much love!

YES there is.

KEY = OT Prophetic View is "a little here - a little there" = Truth upon Truth Beginning in Genesis.

Genesis has the Whole Story.

 

[marks]

YES there is.

KEY = OT Prophetic View is "a little here - a little there" = Truth upon Truth Beginning in Genesis.

Genesis has the Whole Story.

No there isn't. The church was a mystery - musterion - revealed by Paul, which by definition means that no, there is not. This is only revealed in the NT, in Paul's letters.

Much love!

 

[David in NJ]

And yet not everyone dies for their faith. My mother, a child of God, died of cancer in bed. My sister also. My sister, I watched her, she was actually peaceful.

Much love!

Not sure of the point you are making here in comparison........since we all must die. one way or the other

EXCEPT when you must SUFFER for Righteousness unto Death for the Faith = Big Difference.

Natural Death versus Being Put to Death = "Then they will deliver you over to be persecuted and killed, and you will be hated by all nations because of My name."

SEE the Difference?

 

[David in NJ]

No there isn't. The church was a mystery - musterion - revealed by Paul, which by definition means that no, there is not. This is only revealed in the NT, in Paul's letters.

Much love!

Wrong Again

the Church is the Assembly/Congregation = look it up

This is that Moses, which said unto the children of Israel, A prophet shall the Lord your God raise up unto you of your brethren, like unto me; him shall ye hear. This is he, that was in the church in the wilderness with the angel which spake to him in the mount Sinai, and with our fathers: who received the lively oracles to give unto us: - Acts ch7

"For indeed the gospel was preached to us as well as to them;" hebrews ch4

All of you, assemble yourselves, and hear! = Sacred Called Out Assembly = Church
Who among them has declared these things?
The Lord loves him;
He shall do His pleasure on Babylon,
And His arm shall be against the Chaldeans.
15I, even I, have spoken;
Yes, I have called him,
I have brought him, and his way will prosper.

16“Come near to Me, hear this:
I have not spoken in secret from the beginning;
From the time that it was, I was there.
And now the Lord God and His Spirit
[c]Have sent Me.”

 

[marks]

Not sure of the point you are making here in comparison........since we all must die. one way or the other

My point here is that not every Christian will be martyred.

Some people argue that there is no "pre-trib" rapture because Christians will suffer tribulation. Of course it's true that Christians will suffer tribulation, but not neccesarily THAT tribulation.

And not all will die, but we will all be changed.

Much love!

 

[marks]

Wrong Again

That's not wrong, actually, you need to come to understand the meaning of the Greek word Musterion.

Much love!

 

[marks]

God's FACT check= Daniel and his 3 Brothers in the Faith suffered Tribulation unto Death during BABYLON/STATUE/ANTICHRIST
They went thru great tribulation = Death for Faith = God delivered them from the MIDST of Tribulation = Revelation 7:9-13

Many endure tribulations, and many suffer horrible deaths, each in their own time.

Much love!

 

[David in NJ]

My point here is that not every Christian will be martyred.

Some people argue that there is no "pre-trib" rapture because Christians will suffer tribulation. Of course it's true that Christians will suffer tribulation, but not neccesarily THAT tribulation.

And not all will die, but we will all be changed.

Much love!

How in God's Name can you even say this in the CLEAR LIGHT of SCRIPTURE???

When He opened the fifth seal, I saw under the altar the souls of those who had been slain for the word of God and for the testimony which they held. 10And they cried with a loud voice, saying, “How long, O Lord, holy and true, until You judge and avenge our blood on those who dwell on the earth?” 11Then a white robe was given to each of them; and it was said to them that they should rest a little while longer, until both the number of their fellow servants and their brethren, who would be killed as they were, was completed.

And a third angel followed them, calling out in a loud voice, “If anyone worships the beast and its image, and receives its mark on his forehead or on his hand, 10he too will drink the wine of God’s anger, poured undiluted into the cup of His wrath. And he will be tormented in fire and sulfur in the presence of the holy angels and of the Lamb. 11And the smoke of their torment rises forever and ever. Day and night there is no rest for those who worship the beast and its image, or for anyone who receives the mark of its name.”

12Here is a call for the perseverance of the saints who keep the commandments of God and the faith of Jesus.

13And I heard a voice from heaven telling me to write, “Blessed are the dead—those who die in the Lord from this moment on.”

 

[marks]

This is that Moses, which said unto the children of Israel, A prophet shall the Lord your God raise up unto you of your brethren, like unto me; him shall ye hear. This is he, that was in the church in the wilderness with the angel which spake to him in the mount Sinai, and with our fathers: who received the lively oracles to give unto us: - Acts ch7

This is not the same thing.

Those of Israel having been called out (ekklesia) of Egypt where not the born again body of Christ, what we now know as "the church".

Much love!

 

[marks]

"For indeed the gospel was preached to us as well as to them;" hebrews ch4

And they did not mingle the preaching with faith . . .

Much love!

 

[David in NJ]

My point here is that not every Christian will be martyred.

Some people argue that there is no "pre-trib" rapture because Christians will suffer tribulation. Of course it's true that Christians will suffer tribulation, but not neccesarily THAT tribulation.

And not all will die, but we will all be changed.

Much love!

The Mystery is How God brought it about = HOW HE brought together in ONE Body = Jew & Gentile

It is ALL in the OT

HELLO - WAKE UP Call to Brother Marks = Where did the Apostle Paul reveal the mystery from??? = OT Prophets and OT Saints Lives.

 

[marks]

How in God's Name can you even say this in the CLEAR LIGHT of SCRIPTURE???

Reread what I've written and give it some thought . . .

Much love!

 

[marks]

Where did the Apostle Paul reveal the mystery from???

The Holy Spirit.

Much love!