A FEW QUICK COMMENTS ON FULFILLMENT ESCHATOLOGY

[WPM]

It’s a point of reference; in saying and seek Jesus having fulfilled and accomplished all things; and now today people become children of God through faith and looking towards Christ and now can live in relationship and fellowship with the Father and the son, looking forward to being with them in the kingdom, because faith God is pleased and those who seek him are rewarded.

Everyone is able to have relationship with God through Christ and the choice is to eat from the tree of knowledge of Good and evil, or to eat from the tree of life as you walk in this world. @WPM.

Where does Scripture mention "Age of fulfilment"? It seems like you are inventing terms to support this invented age.

 

[MatthewG]

You are not addressing the issues presented. This seems to be how you engage. This is only way your theology is sustained. What i am saying is: all the ugly consequences of the Fall that existed before the cross and which marked the old covenant era are still blighting mankind. All the descriptions and depictions pertaining to corruption that mark that age pertain to us today. You have no answer to that. The same devil that lied then is lying now. From Adam to the second coming is "this age." The age to come is liberated from all the bondage of corruption.

Sin continue today, sickness continue today, hospitals continue today, pain continue today, sorrow continue today, death continue today, funerals continue today, crying continue today, the curse continue today, we still not living in an "evil age" today, people still marry today, people still procreate, incorruption abounds. Look around you. To deny this is deny reality. That sums up Full Preterism.

Dude of course human beings are evil, man. The creation is still fallen but in Christ all have been reconciled to the Father, with their sins paid for. Now whether or not a person is saved to the kingdom or not is up to God to judge, and it’s up to the person to seek.

The things you mentions here

“Then I saw a new heaven and a new earth; for the first heaven and the first earth had passed away, and the sea was no more. And I saw the holy city, new Jerusalem, coming down out of heaven from God, prepared as a bride adorned for her husband; and I heard a loud voice from the throne saying, “Behold, the dwelling of God is with men. He will dwell with them, and they shall be his people, and God himself will be with them; he will wipe away every tear from their eyes, and death shall be no more, neither shall there be mourning nor crying nor pain any more, for the former things have passed away.””
‭‭Revelation‬ ‭21‬:‭1‬-‭4‬ ‭RSV‬‬

Revelation 21:1-4 Then I saw a new heaven and a new earth; for the first heaven and the first earth had passed away, and the sea was no more. And I saw the holy city, new Jerusalem, coming down out of heaven from God, | Revised Standard Version (RSV

Then I saw a new heaven and a new earth; for the first heaven and the first earth had passed away, and the sea was no more. And I saw the holy city, new Jerusalem, coming down out of heaven from God,

bible.com

These are all spiritually principles to learn; God dwells with men and women now by the holy spirt of God given by Christ, and one day we will get to be up there with him.

There is no more brazen sea, and there is no more temple that remains; the first heaven and the first earth have passed away is a reference to the Jewish nation and its divorcement for killing the son of God, in my opinion.

The new Jerusalem is not of earth but of heaven, and that is here believers go from here to there, and Jesus said they would eat with Abraham, issac and Jacob.

Jesus kingdom also was never of this world so my expectations rely on the spiritual guidance and wisdom in consider the biblical context as best I can.

 

[MatthewG]

Where does Scripture mention "Age of fulfilment"? It seems like you are inventing terms to support this invented age.

I told you already. Jesus having fulfilled everything and rapped up the prior Jewish age - which now become the age of fulfillment where all things that involved them are done and over, white throne judgment, hell cast out the dead, the second death (which is conquered over by Jesus in my opinion who has the keys to death and hades), overcoming sin, overcoming the beast, false prophet, the devil, and his angels, and doing away with hell and the devil forever and ever. And that now leaves people with the choice to seek out God in faith and learn and grow spiritually now in this life, if they so desire. It is all about loving God and others and teaching of the Gospels and the letters to help get a good understanding along with studies. Ultimately it’s about faith, love and hope.

 

[David in NJ]

Dude of course human beings are evil, man. The creation is still fallen but in Christ all have been reconciled to the Father, with their sins paid for. Now whether or not a person is saved to the kingdom or not is up to God to judge, and it’s up to the person to seek.

The things you mentions here

“Then I saw a new heaven and a new earth; for the first heaven and the first earth had passed away, and the sea was no more. And I saw the holy city, new Jerusalem, coming down out of heaven from God, prepared as a bride adorned for her husband; and I heard a loud voice from the throne saying, “Behold, the dwelling of God is with men. He will dwell with them, and they shall be his people, and God himself will be with them; he will wipe away every tear from their eyes, and death shall be no more, neither shall there be mourning nor crying nor pain any more, for the former things have passed away.””
‭‭Revelation‬ ‭21‬:‭1‬-‭4‬ ‭RSV‬‬

Revelation 21:1-4 Then I saw a new heaven and a new earth; for the first heaven and the first earth had passed away, and the sea was no more. And I saw the holy city, new Jerusalem, coming down out of heaven from God, | Revised Standard Version (RSV

Then I saw a new heaven and a new earth; for the first heaven and the first earth had passed away, and the sea was no more. And I saw the holy city, new Jerusalem, coming down out of heaven from God,

bible.com

These are all spiritually principles to learn; God dwells with men and women now by the holy spirt of God given by Christ, and one day we will get to be up there with him.

There is no more brazen sea, and there is no more temple that remains; the first heaven and the first earth have passed away is a reference to the Jewish nation and its divorcement for killing the son of God, in my opinion.

The new Jerusalem is not of earth but of heaven, and that is here believers go from here to there, and Jesus said they would eat with Abraham, issac and Jacob.

Jesus kingdom also was never of this world so my expectations rely on the spiritual guidance and wisdom in consider the biblical context as best I can.

SEE - this is where you have believed a lie for Revelation chapter 21 has not been fulfilled = not even close!!!

God and Heavenly Jerusalem will NOT come down to this present Age where satan is still ruling over a world of darkness.

FIRST - the KING of kings must Return and destroy the kings of this earth = Revelation ch19 and Zechariah ch14 and Matthew ch24

Then I saw heaven standing open, and there before me was a white horse. And its rider is called Faithful and True. With righteousness He judges and wages war. He has eyes like blazing fire, and many royal crowns on His head. He has a name written on Him that only He Himself knows. He is dressed in a robe dipped in blood,c and His name is The Word of God.

The armies of heaven, dressed in fine linen, white and pure, follow Him on white horses. And from His mouth proceeds a sharp sword with which to strike down the nations, and He will rule them with an iron scepter. He treads the winepress of the fury of the wrath of God the Almighty. And He has a name written on His robe and on His thigh:

KING OF KINGS AND LORD OF LORDS.
Defeat of the Beast and False Prophet

Then I saw an angel standing in the sun, and he cried out in a loud voice to all the birds flying overhead, “Come, gather together for the great supper of God, so that you may eat the flesh of kings and commanders and mighty men, of horses and riders, of everyone slave and free, small and great.”

Then I saw the beast and the kings of the earth with their armies assembled to wage war against the One seated on the horse, and against His army. But the beast was captured along with the false prophet, who on its behalf had performed signs deceiving those who had the mark of the beast and worshiped its image. Both the beast and the false prophet were thrown alive into the fiery lake of burning sulfur. And the rest were killed with the sword that proceeded from the mouth of the One seated on the horse.

 

[MatthewG]

SEE - this is where you have believed a lie for Revelation chapter 21 has not been fulfilled = not even close!!!

God and Heavenly Jerusalem will NOT come down to this present Age where satan is still ruling over a world of darkness.

FIRST - the KING of kings must Return and destroy the kings of this earth = Revelation ch19 and Zechariah ch14 and Matthew ch24

Then I saw heaven standing open, and there before me was a white horse. And its rider is called Faithful and True. With righteousness He judges and wages war. He has eyes like blazing fire, and many royal crowns on His head. He has a name written on Him that only He Himself knows. He is dressed in a robe dipped in blood,c and His name is The Word of God.

The armies of heaven, dressed in fine linen, white and pure, follow Him on white horses. And from His mouth proceeds a sharp sword with which to strike down the nations, and He will rule them with an iron scepter. He treads the winepress of the fury of the wrath of God the Almighty. And He has a name written on His robe and on His thigh:

KING OF KINGS AND LORD OF LORDS.
Defeat of the Beast and False Prophet

Then I saw an angel standing in the sun, and he cried out in a loud voice to all the birds flying overhead, “Come, gather together for the great supper of God, so that you may eat the flesh of kings and commanders and mighty men, of horses and riders, of everyone slave and free, small and great.”

Then I saw the beast and the kings of the earth with their armies assembled to wage war against the One seated on the horse, and against His army. But the beast was captured along with the false prophet, who on its behalf had performed signs deceiving those who had the mark of the beast and worshiped its image. Both the beast and the false prophet were thrown alive into the fiery lake of burning sulfur. And the rest were killed with the sword that proceeded from the mouth of the One seated on the horse.

I would like you to know I believe that Revelation 21-22 are pictures and types for us to learn from. They are completely different from all the previous chapters.

People assume I believe all revelation has happened I do from chapters 1 - 20. @David in NJ

 

[David in NJ]

I would like you to know I believe that Revelation 21-22 are pictures and types for us to learn from. They are completely different from all the previous chapters.

Revelation chapters 19, 20 and 21 are LITERAL Truth that has yet to come and yet to be fulfilled.

Psalm 37 , Matthew ch24 , Zechariah ch14 , 2 Thessalonians ch2 , Jude , James ch5 and 1 John all bear witness against the lie you currently are entrapped in.

You can escape the lie of 'preterism' by embracing the Truth and listening to the Faithful Witnesses as forementioned herein.

 

[MatthewG]

Now people are the temples of God so idk, @David in NJ. Jesus’s said the kingdom of God is within you, and believers were always look for the heavenly Jerusalem.

To me it the kingdom of heaven reside in our heart the hope to be able to go to a place where God lives and resides and that is what is being shown i those first couple of verses.

 

[MatthewG]

Revelation chapters 19, 20 and 21 are LITERAL Truth that has yet to come and yet to be fulfilled.

Psalm 37 , Matthew ch24 , Zechariah ch14 , 2 Thessalonians ch2 , Jude , James ch5 and 1 John all bear witness against the lie you currently are entrapped in.

You can escape the lie of 'preterism' by embracing the Truth and listening to the Faithful Witnesses as forementioned herein.

you see I see them as pictures. Revelation 21 and 22 are pictures to me.

 

[MatthewG]

Have you ever seen them as pictures?
Or what is it you see them as?

I don’t see it being a place literally on earth, some suggest other wise. I believe it can reside in our heart, metaphorically.

 

[David in NJ]

you see I see them as pictures. Revelation 21 and 22 are pictures to me.

When i read Scripture i also SEE Pictures of Truth = Most are Literal and some are spiritual.

Example of BOTH = John ch1
The next day John saw Jesus coming toward him, and said, “Behold! The Lamb of God who takes away the sin of the world! This is He of whom I said, ‘After me comes a Man who is preferred before me, for He was before me.’
I did not know Him; but that He should be revealed to Israel, therefore I came baptizing with water.”

 

[MatthewG]

When i read Scripture i also SEE Pictures of Truth = Most are Literal and some are spiritual.

Example of BOTH = John ch1
The next day John saw Jesus coming toward him, and said, “Behold! The Lamb of God who takes away the sin of the world! This is He of whom I said, ‘After me comes a Man who is preferred before me, for He was before me.’
I did not know Him; but that He should be revealed to Israel, therefore I came baptizing with water.”

Cool man. Good to talk to you.

 

[David in NJ]

Now people are the temples of God so idk, @David in NJ. Jesus’s said the kingdom of God is within you, and believers were always look for the heavenly Jerusalem.

To me it the kingdom of heaven reside in our heart the hope to be able to go to a place where God lives and resides and that is what is being shown i those first couple of verses.

Of course we are the Temple of the Living God: 1 Cor 6:19
Or do you not know that your body is the temple of the Holy Spirit who is in you, whom you have from God, and you are not your own?

Now LOOK and SEE = If anyone defiles the temple of God, God will destroy him. For the temple of God is holy, which temple you are.

LOOK and SEE = Revelation ch13
Then the beast was permitted to wage war against the saints and to conquer them, and it was given authority over every tribe and people and tongue and nation. And all who dwell on the earth will worship the beast—all whose names have not been written from the foundation of the world in the Book of Life belonging to the Lamb who was slain.

 

[MatthewG]

Of course we are the Temple of the Living God: 1 Cor 6:19
Or do you not know that your body is the temple of the Holy Spirit who is in you, whom you have from God, and you are not your own?

Now LOOK and SEE = If anyone defiles the temple of God, God will destroy him. For the temple of God is holy, which temple you are.

LOOK and SEE = Revelation ch13
Then the beast was permitted to wage war against the saints and to conquer them, and it was given authority over every tribe and people and tongue and nation. And all who dwell on the earth will worship the beast—all whose names have not been written from the foundation of the world in the Book of Life belonging to the Lamb who was slain.

God will give people straight to their own desires my man. And if evil is done surely vengeance will be had, by the LORD.

Idk why you pointed to revelation 13, that has to a lot with Rome, and Jerusalem.

 

[WPM]

I told you already. Jesus having fulfilled everything and rapped up the prior Jewish age - which now become the age of fulfillment where all things that involved them are done and over, white throne judgment, hell cast out the dead, the second death (which is conquered over by Jesus in my opinion who has the keys to death and hades), overcoming sin, overcoming the beast, false prophet, the devil, and his angels, and doing away with hell and the devil forever and ever. And that now leaves people with the choice to seek out God in faith and learn and grow spiritually now in this life, if they so desire. It is all about loving God and others and teaching of the Gospels and the letters to help get a good understanding along with studies. Ultimately it’s about faith, love and hope.

Can you give me a biblical quote to this "Jewish age"? Also, when is judgment day where thee Bible says that the living and the dead will stand before Christ? This is the day that He puts the sheep on his right hand and the goats on his left hand? Is this another imaginary event like the rest that you spiritualize away?

 

[amigo de christo]

God will give people straight to their own desires my man. And if evil is done surely vengeance will be had, by the LORD.

Idk why you pointed to revelation 13, that has to a lot with Rome, and Jerusalem.

Revelation applies to the reader , to the church . BLESSED are those who read it and listen to it .
It aint for some long ago generation . ITS FOR US TODAY to learn and take heed unto it .

 

[MatthewG]

Can you give me a "biblical quote to this "Jewish age"? Also, when is judgment day where thee Bible says that the living and the dead will stand before Christ? This is the day that He puts the sheep on his right hand and the goats on his left hand? Is this another imaginary event like the rest that you spiritualize away?

You know I believe 40 years is a generation, and it took a good minute to Jesus to arrive on the scene 400 years later after who was it Malachi? The age consisted of the law, priesthoods, sacrifices, when Jesus came he would put and end to that age by fulfilling what was promised in the Old Testament and establishing a new heavenly administration rather than the former earthly administration by the Law; which became fulfilled by Jesus and his abolished that term and it now allows all people to become children of God through faith in the Gospel of Christ which is the power of God unto salvation.

The four disciples who privately asked Jesus when will be the end of the age? The age of what? The age of the earthly administration which came by and through Moses; replaced by Jesus. What does the end of the age mean? It was fulfilled in coming to an end at the divorcement of Jerusalem upon the return of Christ as he was promised to be seen, by those watching and waiting, and looking.

 

[amigo de christo]

The very letters of even the apostel apply STILL to the church today .
HOLY doctrine in that bible applies to the lambs of today as much as the lambs of when it was first recorded .
Add not too nor take from the lovely words inspired by the LORD .

 

[MatthewG]

Revelation applies to the reader , to the church . BLESSED are those who read it and listen to it .
It aint for some long ago generation . ITS FOR US TODAY to learn and take heed unto it .

Thank you amigo, no doubt there are some lessons to be learned from the letter that was written to a very real audience once upon a time, for sure. These people went through worse that Americans may get persecuted, these people were straight up killed for the gospel of Christ.

 

[MatthewG]

The very letters of even the apostel apply STILL to the church today .
HOLY doctrine in that bible applies to the lambs of today as much as the lambs of when it was first recorded .
Add not too nor take from the lovely words inspired by the LORD .

You can not lie and forget to say that the letters in that time written by the Apostles are during a real time and culture and community and fellowship, and those apostles have a lot to say those real life people, and much can be learned in learning what they had ended up going through even losing their lives for Christ. May the spirit of Guide people to rightly divide the word of truth.

 

[WPM]

You know I believe 40 years is a generation, and it took a good minute to Jesus to arrive on the scene 400 years later after who was it Malachi? The age consisted of the law, priesthoods, sacrifices, when Jesus came he would put and end to that age by fulfilling what was promised in the Old Testament and establishing a new heavenly administration rather than the former earthly administration by the Law; which became fulfilled by Jesus and his abolished that term and it now allows all people to become children of God through faith in the Gospel of Christ which is the power of God unto salvation.

The four disciples who privately asked Jesus when will be the end of the age? The age of what? The age of the earthly administration which came by and through Moses; replaced by Jesus. What does the end of the age mean? It was fulfilled in coming to an end at the divorcement of Jerusalem upon the return of Christ as he was promised to be seen, by those watching and waiting, and looking.

When is judgment day where thee Bible says that the living and the dead will stand before Christ? This is the day that He puts the sheep on his right hand and the goats on his left hand?