Can Priests Forgive Sin?

[Hobie]

Can Priests Forgive Sin?

The Catholic Church claims that its bishops and priests have inherited from the apostles the power to forgive penitent sinners. Please notice the following:

"Who has the power to forgive sin today?
"All bishops and priests of the Catholic Church can forgive sin." (A Catechism for Adults, p. 85).
"Christ conferred upon the Apostles the power to forgive sins: 'Whose sins you shall forgive, they are forgiven.' (John 20:23). St. Paul mirrors the faith of the Apostolic Church when he writes: 'God hath given to us the ministry of reconciliation' (II Cor. 5:18).
"As the inheritors of the power and authority of the Apostles, the bishops and priests of the Catholic Church exercises the ministry of reconciliation, forgiving penitent sinners in the name of Jesus Christ." (The Faith of Millions, pp. 71-72).
Catholic bishops and priests are claiming a power which the apostles did not possess or exercise. Jesus said to the apostles, "Receive the Holy Spirit; whose sins you shall forgive, they are forgiven them; and whose sins you shall retain, they are retained." (John 20:22-23). Thus, only by the possession of the Holy Spirit would the apostles have the authority to forgive and retain sins. As the Holy Spirit guided them in their preaching and writing, they delivered God's plan for forgiving and retaining sins (Luke 24:45-49; Acts 2:38). This alone was their "power to forgive sins" and how it was exercised.

On one occasion the Scribes and Pharisees reasoned in their hearts concerning Jesus, "Who is this man who speaks blasphemies? Who can forgive sins, but God only?" (Luke 5:21). Their error was in their failure to recognize that Jesus was God in the flesh. If Jesus was not God, they would have been correct in their accusation. God said through the prophet Isaiah, "I, even I, am he that blotteth out thy transgressions for mine own sake, and will not remember thy sins." (Isa. 43:25).

On another occasion the Jews said, "Not for a good work do we stone thee, but for blasphemy, and because thou, being a man, makest thyself God." (John 10:33). Jesus did not deny that it was blasphemous for a man to presume to forgive sins. If the Jews had been right in their premise (that Christ was only a man), they would have been correct in their conclusion. The Catholic priests literally assume the prerogatives of God when they presume to forgive sins.

If Catholic priests have the power to grant absolution from sin, why don't they also possess the power to perform miracles? Jesus said it was just as easy for Him to say, "Arise, and walk," as to say, "Thy sins are forgiven thee" (Luke 5:23). He added, "But that you man know that the Son of man has power on earth to forgive sins--he said to the paralytic--I say to thee, arise, take up thy pallet and go to thy house." (Luke 5:24). Why can't the Catholic priests do the same? Since they cannot, we must conclude they do not have authority to forgive sins.

Some Catholics in effort to evade the blasphemous claim of priests being able to forgive sin, say that the priests only ask God to forgive sin. The following quotes show beyond doubt that the Catholic Church most certainly does claim that its priests can forgive sin.

"In the institution of the sacrament our Lord did not say to His Apostles, 'Whose sins you shall ask to be absolved, shall be absolved,' but he instituted as the form of the sacrament, 'Whose sins you shall forgive, they are forgiven them.' These words show that the minister of the Sacrament of Penance does not pray for the absolution of the penitent, but pronounces the absolution as a judicial sentience, as one having judicial authority." (Catholic Dictionary, p. 5).
"Its minister purifies souls from sin by an act of absolution, and as the Council of Trent defined, this absolution is not a mere declaration of what has taken place as effect of other causes, but a real efficacious judicial sentence actually freeing the sinner from guilt." (Legislation on the Sacraments, p. 190).
"Unlike the authority given to the Priests of the Old Law, to declare the leper cleansed from his leprosy, the power with which the priests of the New Law are invested, is not simply to declare the sins forgiven, but, as the ministers of God, really to absolve from sins." (The Catechism of the Council of Trent, p. 175).
Again, Catholic bishops and priests are claiming a power which the apostles neither possessed nor employed. Actually, they are assuming an authority above that of the apostles. When Jesus said, "Receive the Holy Spirit; whose sins you shall forgive, they are forgiven them; and whose sins you shall retain, they are retained" (John 20:22-23), He was speaking to the apostles only. His words were not addressed to Catholic bishops and priests and there is no mention of successors. Furthermore, the power to forgive and retain sins was based upon the expression, "Receive the Holy Spirit." The Catholic writers always fail to quote this important part of our Lord's words, e.g., as in the above quote from the Catholic Dictionary. Only by possession of the Holy Spirit were the apostles able to forgive and retain sins. As the Holy Spirit guided them in their preaching and writing, they delivered the design of God for forgiving and retaining sins (Luke 24:45-49; Acts 2:38). This is how their authority to forgive sins was exercised. For instance, when Simon the sorcerer sinned (Acts 8:18-19), Peter did not say, "I absolve you," or "I forgive you;" instead, he merely revealed to him what he needed to do in order to be forgiven (Acts 8:22).

Language similar to that spoken to the apostles was addressed to Jeremiah the prophet. Jer. 1:9-10 says, "And the Lord said to me: Behold I have given my words in thy mouth: Lo, I have set thee this day over the nations, and over kingdoms, to root up, and to pull down, and to waste, and to destroy, and to build, and to plant." Jeremiah never literally rooted up, pulled down, destroyed, or planted nations and kingdoms. His mission was to declare to the nations the terms on which God would build up or destroy, reward or punish nations. Similarly, the apostles were given authority to declare the terms on which God would forgive and retain sins.

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Confession to priests?
We are taught in the New Testament to confess our sins to God and He will forgive and cleanse us from all iniquity. "If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just, and will forgive our sins and cleanse us from all unrighteousness." (1 John 1:9 Catholic RSV). Also, we are instructed that when we sin, Jesus Christ is our advocate with the Father and the propitiation for our sins (1 John 2:1-2). In Heb. 4:14-16, the writer teaches that Christians have full and complete access to God through Jesus Christ and may come boldly to the throne of grace and obtain mercy.

The New Testament teaches that one's confession should be as public as the sin, e.g., "And many of those who believed kept coming, and openly confessed their practices." (Acts 19:18). If the sin was against God only, it needs to be confessed only to God (1 John 1:9). If the sin was committed against one or a number of individuals, it should be confessed to God and to those who have been wronged. James 5:16 says, "Confess, therefore, your sins to one another, and pray for one another, that you may be saved." This means that Christians are to confess to each other and applies to sins committed against each other. It cannot mean that the Christian is to confess to the priest because it would require that the priest confess back to the Christian--"confess your sins to one another."

There is no command or example in the New Testament for Christians to confess sins to a priest to obtain absolution. The Testament gives instructions on every good work imposed upon children of God (2 Tim. 3:16-17; 2 Pet. 1:3), but it doesn't mention a single word regarding "auricular confession" or that which is done in the modern Catholic confessional. There is no allusion or indication, no command, example, or inference in the Scriptures regarding the confessional. In short, there is not the slightest hint concerning that which is done by Catholics today. When one believes or practices something in religion which is not in the written New Testament, all of the following divine principles immediately apply.

It is not a good work (2 Tim. 3:16-17).
It does not pertain to life and godliness (2 Pet. 1:3).
It causes one to not have God (2 John 9).
It is not authorized by Christ (Col. 3:17)....



Since there are no passages in the New Testament authorizing the Catholic confessional, it is a sinful practice. We emphasize again that we cannot go beyond the things that are written and be pleasing to God (1 Cor. 4:6; 2 John 9). When we add the traditions and doctrines of men, our worship becomes vain (Matt. 15:9; Col. 2:8). If we change, add to, delete from, or pervert the gospel of Christ, the curse of God rests upon us (Gal. 1:6-9; Rev. 22:18-19).

Correct me if I'm wrong.

Well, if you look almost everything they have brought in has been clear apostasy or from pagan origin, you cannot get a clearer picture of a antichrist entity than this...

 

[BarneyFife]

WRONG..

I laid out a rock-solid Biblical case for the Ministry of Reconciliation in podt #74.
Until you can address this - you're just bloeing hot air . . .

2 Corinthians 5
18Now all things are of God, who has reconciled us to Himself through Jesus Christ, and has given us the ministry of reconciliation, 19that is, that God was in Christ reconciling the world to Himself, not [d]imputing their trespasses to them, and has committed to us the WORD of reconciliation.


20Now then, we are ambassadors for Christ, as though God were pleading through us: we implore you on Christ’s behalf, be reconciled to God. 21For He made Him who knew no sin to be sin for us, that we might become the righteousness of God in Him.

There's no vicarious atonement here. There's no rock-solid Biblical case for practicing what Christ recognized as blasphemy when He asserted Himself as God, the Son, fully authorized to forgive sins on Earth in Luke 5:24.

Everyone can forgive sins against themselves; no one can forgive sins against God but God only.
.

 

[Big Boy Johnson]

Whose sins you forgive are forgiven them, and whose sins you retain are retained."

This does not mean that person doesn't have to get born again and walk with the Lord themselves and if we forgive them they just magically go to Heaven.

Everyone can forgive sins against themselves; no one can forgive sins against God but God only.

Not sure if Andy, Opie or Ain't Bee agree but this is true.

 

[Johann]

There's no vicarious atonement here.

You don't believe in the vicarious atonement?

 

[CadyandZoe]

(Jesus) said to them again, "Peace be with you. As the Father has sent me, so I send you."

And when he had said this, he breathed on them and said to them, "Receive the holy Spirit.

Whose sins you forgive are forgiven them, and whose sins you retain are retained."

Happy New Year!

Here, Jesus is giving his apostles the gift of supernatural "description," not the authority of "prescription."

description vs. prescription

Did Jesus give his apostles the authority to forgive sins? No. He gave them the ability to identify which sins were already forgiven. Notice how Jesus puts it.

Jesus said, "If you forgive the sins of any, their sins have been forgiven them; if you retain the sins of any, they have been retained.” The phrase "have been" indicates the present perfect of the verb "to be," meaning that whatever sins were forgiven in the past, they will continue to be forgiven in the present. And whatever sins were retained in the past will continue to be retained in the present.

In other words, the apostles are being given assurance that whatever sins they forgive, God has already forgiven them. And whatever sins they retain, God has already retained them.

Jesus is not giving the apostles the ability or right to speak according to their own judgment; he is giving them the ability and right to speak according to God's judgment. They were given the ability to speak for God as if God said it himself. If God has forgiven my sins, then the apostle will be able to tell me that. If God has not forgiven my sins, then the apostles will be able to tell me that also.

 

[Lizbeth]

Can Priests Forgive Sin?

The Catholic Church claims that its bishops and priests have inherited from the apostles the power to forgive penitent sinners. Please notice the following:

"Who has the power to forgive sin today?
"All bishops and priests of the Catholic Church can forgive sin." (A Catechism for Adults, p. 85).
.....
On one occasion the Scribes and Pharisees reasoned in their hearts concerning Jesus, "Who is this man who speaks blasphemies? Who can forgive sins, but God only?" (Luke 5:21). Their error was in their failure to recognize that Jesus was God in the flesh. If Jesus was not God, they would have been correct in their accusation. God said through the prophet Isaiah, "I, even I, am he that blotteth out thy transgressions for mine own sake, and will not remember thy sins." (Isa. 43:25).

On another occasion the Jews said, "Not for a good work do we stone thee, but for blasphemy, and because thou, being a man, makest thyself God." (John 10:33). Jesus did not deny that it was blasphemous for a man to presume to forgive sins. If the Jews had been right in their premise (that Christ was only a man), they would have been correct in their conclusion. The Catholic priests literally assume the prerogatives of God when they presume to forgive sins.

If Catholic priests have the power to grant absolution from sin, why don't they also possess the power to perform miracles? Jesus said it was just as easy for Him to say, "Arise, and walk," as to say, "Thy sins are forgiven thee" (Luke 5:23). He added, "But that you man know that the Son of man has power on earth to forgive sins--he said to the paralytic--I say to thee, arise, take up thy pallet and go to thy house." (Luke 5:24). Why can't the Catholic priests do the same? Since they cannot, we must conclude they do not have authority to forgive sins.

Some Catholics in effort to evade the blasphemous claim of priests being able to forgive sin, say that the priests only ask God to forgive sin. The following quotes show beyond doubt that the Catholic Church most certainly does claim that its priests can forgive sin.

"In the institution of the sacrament our Lord did not say to His Apostles, 'Whose sins you shall ask to be absolved, shall be absolved,' but he instituted as the form of the sacrament, 'Whose sins you shall forgive, they are forgiven them.' These words show that the minister of the Sacrament of Penance does not pray for the absolution of the penitent, but pronounces the absolution as a judicial sentience, as one having judicial authority." (Catholic Dictionary, p. 5).



Since there are no passages in the New Testament authorizing the Catholic confessional, it is a sinful practice. We emphasize again that we cannot go beyond the things that are written and be pleasing to God (1 Cor. 4:6; 2 John 9). When we add the traditions and doctrines of men, our worship becomes vain (Matt. 15:9; Col. 2:8). If we change, add to, delete from, or pervert the gospel of Christ, the curse of God rests upon us (Gal. 1:6-9; Rev. 22:18-19).

Correct me if I'm wrong.

(sorry, had to delete some of your post that I was quoting, a limit of 1000 characters to allow me to answer).

The simplicity of Christ on the matter of confessing our sins I believe is simply what the scripture says: "confess your faults one to another and pray one for another that ye may be healed". As believers in fellowship with other believers, we often do talk with those we trust about things we are struggling with and areas of our heart and life we want to change, and pray for each other accordingly. It kind of comes "naturally" to the believer, and that scripture on the matter encourages and approves what we already tend to want to do. It's not a Law and it's not something God intended to be turned into a religious ritual. The whole idea of a "confessional" and ritual confession is an example of being "corrupted from the simplicity that is in Christ." (2 Cor 11:3)

However, there's also this:...."where the Spirit of the Lord is there is liberty" - what I seem to have seen is that the more the Holy Spirit is allowed free reign, the more people tend to be open and real with one another. Where the Holy Spirit is lacking, religiosity rules instead and people feel more need for pretense, fearing that they will be judged by others.

I wonder if having the power to forgive sins is in a limited sense. I mean, I don't think anyone has power to forgive sins in the sense that someone can be saved on the basis of a human being forgiving their sins apart from them having faith in Christ. All believers are told to forgive and pray for those who hurt/offend us......that the one who did wrong not reap consequences in this life....they are loosed from the consequences of that sin.....because otherwise God may allow punishment to come to those who hurt us. I've seen it happen two or three times when I unfortunately neglected or forgot to pray for someone who caused me harm in some way, and that is how I learned this the hard way. In another sense I believe those in leadership in the church with spiritual authority have the power to withhold forgiveness as it were, in cases where someone is in gross sin and refusing to stop, and needing to be disciplined.....this is how they are handed and bound over to Satan. By withholding forgiveness in that sense and disfellowshipping that one, all for the purpose of needed discipline, at least for a time. Thus they will reap consequences in this life for the sin for their spiritual good.

1Co 5:5
hand this man over to Satan for the destruction of the flesh, so that his spirit may be saved on the day of the Lord.

1Ti 1:20
Among them are Hymenaeus and Alexander, whom I have handed over to Satan to be taught not to blaspheme.

 

[Hobie]

You don't believe in the vicarious atonement?

So how do you read this text..

Hebrews 10:26-27 KJV​

For if we sin wilfully after that we have received the knowledge of the truth, there remaineth no more sacrifice for sins, but a certain fearful looking for of judgment and fiery indignation, which shall devour the adversaries.

 

[BreadOfLife]

2 Corinthians 5
18Now all things are of God, who has reconciled us to Himself through Jesus Christ, and has given us the ministry of reconciliation, 19that is, that God was in Christ reconciling the world to Himself, not [d]imputing their trespasses to them, and has committed to us the WORD of reconciliation.


20Now then, we are ambassadors for Christ, as though God were pleading through us: we implore you on Christ’s behalf, be reconciled to God. 21For He made Him who knew no sin to be sin for us, that we might become the righteousness of God in Him.

There's no vicarious atonement here. There's no rock-solid Biblical case for practicing what Christ recognized as blasphemy when He asserted Himself as God, the Son, fully authorized to forgive sins on Earth in Luke 5:24.

WRONG.

The verses above make absolutely zero sense UNLESS you see that it is coming from somebody in Authority.

2 Cor. 5:18-20:
“And all this is from God, who has reconciled US to himself through Christ and given US the ministry of reconciliation, namely, God was reconciling the world to himself in Christ, not counting their trespasses against them and entrusting to US the message of reconciliation. So WE are ambassadors for Christ, as if God were appealing through US.
WE implore you on behalf of Christ, be reconciled to God.”

WHO is the “WE” that is imploring the readers to be reconciled to God?

Everyone can forgive sins against themselves; no one can forgive sins against God but God only.
.

Then, YOU have to explain the following:
John 20:21-23
(Jesus) said to them again, "Peace be with you. As the Father has sent ME, so I send YOU."
And when he had said this, he breathed on them and said to them, "Receive the holy Spirit. Whose sins YOU forgive are forgiven them, and whose sins YOU retain are retained."

What did the Father send the Son to do??
He sent Him to being about the FORGIVENESS of sins.
Jesus sent the Apostles to do the SAME.

Why did He say, "Whose sins YOU FORGIVE or retain"?
Because He gave them the power to do just that.

Unless you can prove this to be wrong - you don't have a Scriptural or doctrinal leg to stand on . . .

 

[BarneyFife]

The verses above make absolutely zero sense UNLESS you see that it is coming from somebody in Authority.

But no more authority than any non-apostolic writer of Scripture.

All Scripture is inspired by God and beneficial for teaching, for rebuke, for correction, for training in righteousness; (2 Timothy 3:16)

WHO is the “WE” that is imploring the readers to be reconciled to God?

Well, in verse 18, it appears to be anyone who's been reconciled to God.

Then, YOU have to explain the following:
John 20:21-23
(Jesus) said to them again, "Peace be with you. As the Father has sent ME, so I send YOU."
And when he had said this, he breathed on them and said to them, "Receive the holy Spirit. Whose sins YOU forgive are forgiven them, and whose sins YOU retain are retained."

I don't think I really do have to explain it, BOL, since many things in the Bible are just hard to understand, according to Peter, himself and, being by far one of the strongest of the few apparent pieces of evidence for the doctrine of apostolic succession as relates to the doctrine of ministry of reconciliation, I'm okay doubting that it's anywhere near as conclusive as you're insisting.

I could easily whip out one of the standard refutations, but they're usually no more convincing than what they're trying to disprove from an intellectual standpoint, so...

And I don't lose much sleep over the "Apostle/Sent" thing, either, since it's just another scriptural mountain made from an etymological molehill.

I know this must sound pretty obnoxious to the Catholic ear but I think that tends to be the nature of these discussions.

The errors that the Catholic church teaches are pretty difficult to water down in an honest exchange of viewpoints.

Alas, in trying not to push too hard, I've probably succeeded only in pushing harder than I intended.

.

 

[marks]

And I don't lose much sleep over the "Apostle/Sent" thing, either, since it's just another scriptural mountain made from an etymological molehill.

To me it's simple. Jesus told this to those men in that time, and there is never any place in Scripture that tells us this is passed along to anyone else. Only, some take it for themselves, then fiercely defend their right to do so.

But the fact is, Jesus sent them in the same way Jesus Himself had been sent. And He specified how He meant it. And it did not include this idea of succession of authority. Peter himself thought of himself as merely an elder, of whom there were many.

Much love!

 

[BarneyFife]

To me it's simple. Jesus told this to those men in that time, and there is never any place in Scripture that tells us this is passed along to anyone else. Only, some take it for themselves, then fiercely defend their right to do so.

But the fact is, Jesus sent them in the same way Jesus Himself had been sent. And He specified how He meant it. And it did not include this idea of succession of authority. Peter himself thought of himself as merely an elder, of whom there were many.

Much love!

Priesthood of all believers, Chum!

.

 

[marks]

Priesthood of all believers, Chum!

.

You can forgive sins?

Much love!

 

[BreadOfLife]

But no more authority than any non-apostolic writer of Scripture.

All Scripture is inspired by God and beneficial for teaching, for rebuke, for correction, for training in righteousness; (2 Timothy 3:16)




Well, in verse 18, it appears to be anyone who's been reconciled to God.



I don't think I really do have to explain it, BOL, since many things in the Bible are just hard to understand, according to Peter, himself and, being by far one of the strongest of the few apparent pieces of evidence for the doctrine of apostolic succession as relates to the doctrine of ministry of reconciliation, I'm okay doubting that it's anywhere near as conclusive as you're insisting.

I could easily whip out one of the standard refutations, but they're usually no more convincing than what they're trying to disprove from an intellectual standpoint, so...

And I don't lose much sleep over the "Apostle/Sent" thing, either, since it's just another scriptural mountain made from an etymological molehill.

I know this must sound pretty obnoxious to the Catholic ear but I think that tends to be the nature of these discussions.

That’s quite a confession.
You don’t come off as “obnoxious” as much as you do sad and hopeless.

If I was as unsure as YOU are of what I believed in about Christ and His Church – U woulkd porobably go through life as an agnostic . . .

The errors that the Catholic church teaches are pretty difficult to water down in an honest exchange of viewpoints.

Alas, in trying not to push too hard, I've probably succeeded only in pushing harder than I intended.

Funny how certain anti-Catholics are abiuyt the "errors" of the Church - yet they never seem to be able to articulate them . . .

 

[BarneyFife]

You can forgive sins?

Much love!

Of course not (it's like you don't know me at all - lol), but I can administer reconciliation by encouraging folks to repent and confess to God.

(And, of course, I can forgive, on my own behalf, anyone who's wronged me.)

.

 

[marks]

Of course not (it's like you don't know me at all - lol), but I can administer reconciliation by encouraging folks to repent and confess to God.

(And, of course, I can forgive, on my own behalf, anyone who's wronged me.)

.

OK, because Jesus gave His disciples that authority. Right?

John 20:21-23 KJV
21) Then said Jesus to them again, Peace be unto you: as my Father hath sent me, even so send I you.
22) And when he had said this, he breathed on them, and saith unto them, Receive ye the Holy Ghost:
23) Whose soever sins ye remit, they are remitted unto them; and whose soever sins ye retain, they are retained.

These are active voice verbs, and the forgiving or retaining is what the disciples themselves would do.

Much love!

 

[BarneyFife]

OK, because Jesus gave His disciples that authority. Right?

John 20:21-23 KJV
21) Then said Jesus to them again, Peace be unto you: as my Father hath sent me, even so send I you.
22) And when he had said this, he breathed on them, and saith unto them, Receive ye the Holy Ghost:
23) Whose soever sins ye remit, they are remitted unto them; and whose soever sins ye retain, they are retained.

These are active voice verbs, and the forgiving or retaining is what the disciples themselves would do.

Much love!

I'm not sure that you're not biting off more than I can chew here.

If I didn't know you better, this would look like a trap to me.

.

 

[BarneyFife]

That’s quite a confession.
You don’t come off as “obnoxious” as much as you do sad and hopeless.

If I was as unsure as YOU are of what I believed in about Christ and His Church – U woulkd porobably go through life as an agnostic . . .

That's kinda mean, isn't it, BOL?

Funny how certain anti-Catholics are abiuyt the "errors" of the Church - yet they never seem to be able to articulate them . . .

That's not much nicer, but what's so hard about:

"Christ didn't leave His divine authority to forgive sins to a few select, mortal men?"

And I'm not anti-Catholic, in the general sense—I'm a Pro-testant—"in favor of testing."

Call me what you like; I am what I believe.

.

 

[Ronald David Bruno]

Can Priests Forgive Sin?

The Catholic Church claims that its bishops and priests have inherited from the apostles the power to forgive penitent sinners. Please notice the following:

"Who has the power to forgive sin today?
"All bishops and priests of the Catholic Church can forgive sin." (A Catechism for Adults, p. 85).
"Christ conferred upon the Apostles the power to forgive sins: 'Whose sins you shall forgive, they are forgiven.' (John 20:23). St. Paul mirrors the faith of the Apostolic Church when he writes: 'God hath given to us the ministry of reconciliation' (II Cor. 5:18).
"As the inheritors of the power and authority of the Apostles, the bishops and priests of the Catholic Church exercises the ministry of reconciliation, forgiving penitent sinners in the name of Jesus Christ." (The Faith of Millions, pp. 71-72).
Catholic bishops and priests are claiming a power which the apostles did not possess or exercise. Jesus said to the apostles, "Receive the Holy Spirit; whose sins you shall forgive, they are forgiven them; and whose sins you shall retain, they are retained." (John 20:22-23). Thus, only by the possession of the Holy Spirit would the apostles have the authority to forgive and retain sins. As the Holy Spirit guided them in their preaching and writing, they delivered God's plan for forgiving and retaining sins (Luke 24:45-49; Acts 2:38). This alone was their "power to forgive sins" and how it was exercised.

On one occasion the Scribes and Pharisees reasoned in their hearts concerning Jesus, "Who is this man who speaks blasphemies? Who can forgive sins, but God only?" (Luke 5:21). Their error was in their failure to recognize that Jesus was God in the flesh. If Jesus was not God, they would have been correct in their accusation. God said through the prophet Isaiah, "I, even I, am he that blotteth out thy transgressions for mine own sake, and will not remember thy sins." (Isa. 43:25).

On another occasion the Jews said, "Not for a good work do we stone thee, but for blasphemy, and because thou, being a man, makest thyself God." (John 10:33). Jesus did not deny that it was blasphemous for a man to presume to forgive sins. If the Jews had been right in their premise (that Christ was only a man), they would have been correct in their conclusion. The Catholic priests literally assume the prerogatives of God when they presume to forgive sins.

If Catholic priests have the power to grant absolution from sin, why don't they also possess the power to perform miracles? Jesus said it was just as easy for Him to say, "Arise, and walk," as to say, "Thy sins are forgiven thee" (Luke 5:23). He added, "But that you man know that the Son of man has power on earth to forgive sins--he said to the paralytic--I say to thee, arise, take up thy pallet and go to thy house." (Luke 5:24). Why can't the Catholic priests do the same? Since they cannot, we must conclude they do not have authority to forgive sins.

Some Catholics in effort to evade the blasphemous claim of priests being able to forgive sin, say that the priests only ask God to forgive sin. The following quotes show beyond doubt that the Catholic Church most certainly does claim that its priests can forgive sin.

"In the institution of the sacrament our Lord did not say to His Apostles, 'Whose sins you shall ask to be absolved, shall be absolved,' but he instituted as the form of the sacrament, 'Whose sins you shall forgive, they are forgiven them.' These words show that the minister of the Sacrament of Penance does not pray for the absolution of the penitent, but pronounces the absolution as a judicial sentience, as one having judicial authority." (Catholic Dictionary, p. 5).
"Its minister purifies souls from sin by an act of absolution, and as the Council of Trent defined, this absolution is not a mere declaration of what has taken place as effect of other causes, but a real efficacious judicial sentence actually freeing the sinner from guilt." (Legislation on the Sacraments, p. 190).
"Unlike the authority given to the Priests of the Old Law, to declare the leper cleansed from his leprosy, the power with which the priests of the New Law are invested, is not simply to declare the sins forgiven, but, as the ministers of God, really to absolve from sins." (The Catechism of the Council of Trent, p. 175).
Again, Catholic bishops and priests are claiming a power which the apostles neither possessed nor employed. Actually, they are assuming an authority above that of the apostles. When Jesus said, "Receive the Holy Spirit; whose sins you shall forgive, they are forgiven them; and whose sins you shall retain, they are retained" (John 20:22-23), He was speaking to the apostles only. His words were not addressed to Catholic bishops and priests and there is no mention of successors. Furthermore, the power to forgive and retain sins was based upon the expression, "Receive the Holy Spirit." The Catholic writers always fail to quote this important part of our Lord's words, e.g., as in the above quote from the Catholic Dictionary. Only by possession of the Holy Spirit were the apostles able to forgive and retain sins. As the Holy Spirit guided them in their preaching and writing, they delivered the design of God for forgiving and retaining sins (Luke 24:45-49; Acts 2:38). This is how their authority to forgive sins was exercised. For instance, when Simon the sorcerer sinned (Acts 8:18-19), Peter did not say, "I absolve you," or "I forgive you;" instead, he merely revealed to him what he needed to do in order to be forgiven (Acts 8:22).

Language similar to that spoken to the apostles was addressed to Jeremiah the prophet. Jer. 1:9-10 says, "And the Lord said to me: Behold I have given my words in thy mouth: Lo, I have set thee this day over the nations, and over kingdoms, to root up, and to pull down, and to waste, and to destroy, and to build, and to plant." Jeremiah never literally rooted up, pulled down, destroyed, or planted nations and kingdoms. His mission was to declare to the nations the terms on which God would build up or destroy, reward or punish nations. Similarly, the apostles were given authority to declare the terms on which God would forgive and retain sins.

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Confession to priests?
We are taught in the New Testament to confess our sins to God and He will forgive and cleanse us from all iniquity. "If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just, and will forgive our sins and cleanse us from all unrighteousness." (1 John 1:9 Catholic RSV). Also, we are instructed that when we sin, Jesus Christ is our advocate with the Father and the propitiation for our sins (1 John 2:1-2). In Heb. 4:14-16, the writer teaches that Christians have full and complete access to God through Jesus Christ and may come boldly to the throne of grace and obtain mercy.

The New Testament teaches that one's confession should be as public as the sin, e.g., "And many of those who believed kept coming, and openly confessed their practices." (Acts 19:18). If the sin was against God only, it needs to be confessed only to God (1 John 1:9). If the sin was committed against one or a number of individuals, it should be confessed to God and to those who have been wronged. James 5:16 says, "Confess, therefore, your sins to one another, and pray for one another, that you may be saved." This means that Christians are to confess to each other and applies to sins committed against each other. It cannot mean that the Christian is to confess to the priest because it would require that the priest confess back to the Christian--"confess your sins to one another."

There is no command or example in the New Testament for Christians to confess sins to a priest to obtain absolution. The Testament gives instructions on every good work imposed upon children of God (2 Tim. 3:16-17; 2 Pet. 1:3), but it doesn't mention a single word regarding "auricular confession" or that which is done in the modern Catholic confessional. There is no allusion or indication, no command, example, or inference in the Scriptures regarding the confessional. In short, there is not the slightest hint concerning that which is done by Catholics today. When one believes or practices something in religion which is not in the written New Testament, all of the following divine principles immediately apply.

It is not a good work (2 Tim. 3:16-17).
It does not pertain to life and godliness (2 Pet. 1:3).
It causes one to not have God (2 John 9).
It is not authorized by Christ (Col. 3:17).
It cannot be done by faith (2 Cor. 5:7; Rom. 10:17).
It is going beyond what's written (1 Cor. 4:6).
It is not as the oracles of God (1 Pet. 4:11).
It is not according to the pattern (Heb. 8:5).
It does not pertain to the seed of the kingdom (Luke 8:11).
It is not of righteousness (Rom. 1:16-17; 10:1-3).
It is of "no such commandment" (Acts 15:24).
It is iniquity (Matt. 7:23).
It is of men (Matt. 15:9; Col. 2:8).
It is not of truth (John 4:24).
It is another gospel (Gal. 1:6-9)
It is adding to the Word of God (Rev. 22:18; Deut. 4:2).
The following quotes from Catholic sources show that the practice of auricular confession slowly and gradually developed.

Well, in a sense when a Pastor or Priest baptizes someone who confesses their sins and asks for forgiveness, he declares his sins forgiven (on behalf of God, who forgives them), dunks his head under water and baptizes them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit. We ask and we believe that our sins are forgiven, the priest confirms that, but we realize he isn't forgiving sins, he is just stating the truth - that God forgives those who come to Him and ask. Ask and you will receive. And then of course our future sins our already forgiven, so any pronouncement of that truth is just reiterating the fact, Your sins are forgiven.

 

[marks]

I'm not sure that you're not biting off more than I can chew here.

If I didn't know you better, this would look like a trap to me.

.

Not a trap. Just a challenge to believe exactly what is written and not more, and not less.

Much love!

 

[BarneyFife]

Well, in a sense when a Pastor or Priest baptizes someone who confesses their sins and asks for forgiveness, he declares his sins forgiven (on behalf of God, who forgives them), dunks his head under water and baptizes them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit. We ask and we believe that our sins are forgiven, the priest confirms that, but we realize he isn't forgiving sins, he is just stating the truth - that God forgives those who come to Him and ask. Ask and you will receive. And then of course our future sins our already forgiven, so any pronouncement of that truth is just reiterating the fact, Your sins are forgiven.

Well, of course, Ron, you must realize that this last part begs the question:

When exactly does this forgiveness of future sins take place?

And what are the implications of a once-and-done expiation on the growth and psyche of a believer that emphasizes such a thing?

I'd suggest that type A personalities fare far better on such an idea of atonement.

Sounds like eternal security to me, and it's failed both myself and my father miserably. And he is, in fact, a type A.

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