What Is "Predestination"? How Does It Shape Your Daily Life?

[Eternally Grateful]

How many sins does it take to deserve eternal torture?

1

James said if you keep the whole law and stumble on one point, Your guilty of all

PS. The penalty is separation from God. Don;t think of it is eternal torture. Think of it as eternal seperation

 

[Eternally Grateful]

You mentioned God being omniscient, didn't you, as if he can do anything?

Thats omnipotence.

Omnioscience means he knows everything.. Sorry if I confused you. Did not mean to

I'm wondering if omniscience has limits. Someone once asked, "Can God make a rock so heavy that he can't lift it?"

Again, Omni-science is all knowing.

 

[Bob Estey]

1

James said if you keep the whole law and stumble on one point, Your guilty of all

PS. The penalty is separation from God. Don;t think of it is eternal torture. Think of it as eternal seperation

1? If you were a judge and I was guilty of jay-walking, would the death sentence be just?

 

[Bob Estey]

Thats omnipotence.

Omnioscience means he knows everything.. Sorry if I confused you. Did not mean to

Again, Omni-science is all knowing.

 

[Eternally Grateful]

There's a difference between Spiritual death and eternal torture, I believe.

I believe it hurts God to see us sin. I don't think we can fault him for sins people commit, though. He gives us a free will, and we sin. The alternative is not to give us a free will. Would that work?

Only in part

I am born dead.

But if I die and remain dead, i will suffer the second death. Which is forever

If I am born again because of faith in Christ, Then I am saved from the eternal death

 

[Bob Estey]

Thats omnipotence.

Omnioscience means he knows everything.. Sorry if I confused you. Did not mean to

Again, Omni-science is all knowing.

Okay.

 

[Bob Estey]

Only in part

I am born dead.

But if I die and remain dead, i will suffer the second death. Which is forever

If I am born again because of faith in Christ, Then I am saved from the eternal death

Is God so technical as that?

 

[Eternally Grateful]

1? If you were a judge and I was guilty of jay-walking, would the death sentence be just?

It does not matter what I think

The wage of sin is death.

Does it matter if I have one death sentence or a million. Am I any less guilty or deserving of punishment?

 

[Eternally Grateful]

Is God so technical as that?

God is the perfect Judge,

If he said if you sin you will die.. He will carry out his justice,

If he does not, He is not a just God.

 

[Big Boy Johnson]

We (those who are saved) have been predestined to be conformed to his image.

Those who never get saved... were also predestined to be conformed to His Image since it's the Lord's will that all be saved and He has paid for all to be saved.

Sadly the majority of people are blinded by the devil because the choose to not believe so they are lost.

Limited atonement as taught by the calvinist people is fake doctrine not supported by scripture.

The issue we need to confirm is is God a God who keeps his promises

God promised that He created man in His Own Image... which resulted in man having free will and as such man is free to turn away from the Lord (backslide) after having gotten saved and if they do this they reap cirruption and are no longer in right standing with the Lord since they have taken off the new man and put the old man back on and are back walking after the flesh down the highway to hell.

These are all God's promises as well... that the OSAS crowd denies are God's promises since they must pick and choose only a select few scripture verses that support their pet doctrine and ignore or somehow explain away the rest of God's Word.

When dealing with the OSAS peoples it quickly becomes a matter of each camp claiming "my scripture verses can beat up your scripture verses" as they pit God's Word against God's Word which is how we know the enemy is behind their doctrine.

Would it not be senseless for God to tell us of how people will fall away and what the penalty is if it were impossible to do?

In order for the OSAS peoples to hold their position... they must explain away any verse you give them that does not agree with their doctrine. They cannot accept the whole counsel of God because doing so would mean they would have to admit their pet doctrine is not true.

These people were never saved, They thought their works saved them, which is why they use their works as a means to why God should let them in

There ya go... gotta explain away what the Lord says in His Word, as though Jesus doesn't know what He's talkin about

Did God contradict himself??

Can we sow to the flesh... and NOT reap corruption???

What the OSAS peoples won't tell you because they don't accept the validity of this is... God is NOT mocked... whatsoever a man sows, that shall He also reap he that soweth to his flesh shall of the flesh reap corruption; but he that soweth to the Spirit shall of the Spirit reap life everlasting. (Galatians 6:7-8)

They'll agree that when one is born again they did sow to the spirit and reaped life... but then they deny and ignore the rest of Galatians 6:7-8 claiming if one sows to the flesh (sins) they do not rep corruption.

In Gal 6:8, the word corruption is...

G5356
fthora from G5351; decay, i.e. ruin -- corruption, destroy, perish.

G5351
strengthened from phthio (to pine or waste); properly, to shrivel or wither, i.e. to spoil or to ruin, by moral influences, to deprave): -- corrupt (self), defile, destroy.

If one claims we DO reap corruption when we sin, then they are admitting they do not believe OSAS / Eternal security doctrine (and sadly many of their friends will forsake them!).... and if one claims we DO NOT reap what we sow, then according to Gal 6:7, that would be mocking God!

Adam and Eve were given eternal life by the Lord when He created them... but when they sinned against God they became corrupt and died spiritually and became separated from God. So Gal 6:7,8 is quite the quandary, quite the state of uncertainty and perplexity for the adherents of OSAS doctrine.

The OSAS peoples don't know that salvation is on God's terms and what Jesus did at the Cross of Calvary... does not eliminate or do away with seedtime and harvest. God is not mocked!

In Jesus' classic teaching on sowing and reaping, He said "Know ye not this parable? and how then will ye know all parables?" (Mark 4:13) speaking of seedtime and harvest

God created man in His Image, therefore just like God... mankind reaps what he sows and is responsible for the seeds he plants. If man does good, he'll receive good... if he does evil, he'll receive evil.

Romans 2:9-11
Tribulation and anguish, upon every soul of man that doeth evil, of the Jew first, and also of the Gentile;
But glory, honour, and peace, to every man that worketh good, to the Jew first, and also to the Gentile:
For there is no respect of persons with God.

Here's another one the OSAS peoples hate that refutes their pet doctrine...

Romans 8:13
For if ye live after the flesh, ye shall die: but if ye through the Spirit do mortify the deeds of the body, ye shall live.

 

[BlessedPeace]

If it were not the fact that Jesus paid that debt for us. and will save all who believe. I would agree with you.

But God does not force us to remain in unbelief.

Force us? I didn't state that. Created us,is what I said.

And,he also said,unless or until he calls those whom he chose to save,their names in the Lamb's Book of Life written before he created the world,which means pre-fall, we perish as fallen sinners created by God to have that damned sin nature.

Jesus paid the price,he came as the lamb slain before the world, which coincides with his Lambs Book, to fulfill that destiny of the Elect.

It all makes sense then when we scrutinize those who claim to be Christian yet don't act it.

They chose Jesus.
Yet, God did not actually let them.

And that's why their natural mind is dominant. Because Holy Spirit did not enter and change their consciousness as he does for the Elect.

 

[Big Boy Johnson]

created by God to have that damned sin nature.

God would have to be evil... to create anybody with a sinful nature.

That's one of satan's favorite lies that came out of gnosticism is that God created us to be sinners and we just cannot help but to sin everyday in thought word and deed...

Then if somebody molests their child they get all bent out of shape... apparently forgetting they believe the child molester just cannot help it because they believe God created them to molest children!

 

[Big Boy Johnson]

Yet, God did not actually let them.

Let me guess... God prevents and forbids some people from getting
born again... but YOU, He just happened to allow to get saved right?

If you truly believe this calvinist garbage... how do you know you are
one of the ones that he just gave thoughts that they were saved but
in the end He never did really pick you?

Calvinism teaches that this happens to some and one does not know
if they are saved or not until they find themselves either in Heaven or
hell after they croak

 

[GracePeace]

@Hazelelponi I should never have gotten off on tangents--the thread has completely lost its way. LOL

 

[Bob Estey]

It does not matter what I think

The wage of sin is death.

Does it matter if I have one death sentence or a million. Am I any less guilty or deserving of punishment?

We are called to make judgments. It DOES matter what you think.

 

[Bob Estey]

God is the perfect Judge,

If he said if you sin you will die.. He will carry out his justice,

If he does not, He is not a just God.

God is a perfect judge and he wants us to think.

 

[Hazelelponi]

@Hazelelponi I should never have gotten off on tangents--the thread has completely lost its way. LOL

I was definitely thinking the thread blew up on you today!

 

[GracePeace]

I was definitely thinking the thread blew up on you today!

Yeah, I will have to learn from this, and keep it in mind going forward--even if I want to get off on a tangent, I have to be better self controlled.

 

[Ritajanice]

And that's why their natural mind is dominant. Because Hy Spirit did not enter and change their consciousness as he does for the Elect.

Amen!!!...

 

[Hazelelponi]

Yeah, I will have to learn from this, and keep it in mind going forward--even if I want to get off on a tangent, I have to be better self controlled.

I'm seriously considering leaving this forum.

I was asked by a brother in the faith to come help someone since I'm a former Muslim but that's completed and honestly, the bashing of Christians is just crazy here and it's bothering me.

So I'm thinking of going back now... Just doing my thing again.